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2nd String
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How close are the Browns to being a playoff contender?
Order of Need:
1.) Stability at the Head Coach position, and a Head Coach that can take us to the playoffs and knows how to best use the talent we have (Richardson, Weeden, Gordon, Little, Cameron and the O-Line) I think these guys are the future of this organization, provided that they continue to develop.
2.) Keep Dick Jauron as the Defensive Coordinator. Not sure about him as a Head Coach however.
3.) Pass Rushing - Havoc Wrecking LB in the draft. I like Jackson and Michael-James as two of our starting LB's. I think Fort and Robertson are keepers.
4.) Cornerback to play opposite of Haden. I like Skrine, Wade, and Bademosi. Brown isn't horrible, but he is seriously aging, and I'd like to keep him around for experience.
5.) Free Safety - Young and Hagg are average and still serviecable. Not sure about Gipson.
6.) Another DE opposite of Sheard. Rucker has been decent, IMO.
7.) Keep our DT's!!! Rubin, Taylor, Winn and Hughes are keepers!
8.) Regardless if we draft a new QB, we need a career backup that is willing to mentor, not push for the starting job.
9.) A serviceable WR with experience. The same as above.
10.) New Fullback.
That's my list of 10 Things the Browns can do to become a playoff contender.
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Does anyone in here realize that Weeden had the best QB rating of any QB facing the Steelers in the last 5 games?
Sheesh.
As you know, while not a believer in Weeden, I'm also not one that's ready to scrap him yet. But one can't begin to support Weeden by saying "he had the best rating against the Steelers in the last 5 games."
There is so much left out of that sentence, primarily the 3 passes the Steelers dropped. Then there's the fact that none of those other 5 teams had the "Charlie Batch Factor." If that's Rottenburger out there, we're probably trailing in that game, so the Browns don't have the opportunity to run the ball 30 times to eat clock, and Weeden has to drop back and throw the entire fourth quarter which is where the Steelers feast on QB's.
It IS the Steelers, so it would be highly unfair to bury him and the running game, but the mistakes can't be simply whisked away into the ether just because the Steelers dropped those poor passes. Just because it didn't make it to the stat sheet doesn't mean it didn't happen, and we all saw those 3 passes which should have been picked.
Quantifying Weeden's viability by hand-picking partially-relevant microcosmic stats isn't going to sway anyone's opinion. The only way that's going to happen is if Weeden goes out there and puts on a truly good performance. Oakland is the 9th worst passing defense in the league. That will be his chance to make a statement, especially since his receivers have turned the tables on him in the last few games by bailing him out.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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The problem as I see it is will Shurmur really be willing to turn Weeden loose. I think (and this is all IMHO) that on a few 1st downs and 2nd downs Weeden was looking deep but for whatever reason didnt throw the ball deep.
That tells me Shurmur was at times calling plays to go long. Sadly on some of those plays the Steelers were sending blitz's and other times Weeden checked down.
Im hoping I'm right about Shurmur looking deep because against Oakland I think we can beat them over the top as well as run it.
The Browns seem to get timid in the Red Zone a bit to much for my tastes and hopefully that will stop now that we have a signiture win.
If you need 3 years to be a winner you got here 2 years to early. Get it done Browns.
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I know the popular theory right now is that Shurmur is hand-cuffing Weeden. I'm not buying it. People latched on to that one singular comment where Shurmur didn't want Weeden throwing INT's, so it becomes easy to blame that for instilling a mindset of checking the ball down and being tentative.
I would say the body of work so far this year has shown that Weeden has had receivers running deeper routes, and that while Weeden has been looking at them, he's been just too quick to dump it down to the shorter guy. Furthermore, just looking at the last game, Weeden made some decisions on intermediate throws that weren't very good. He definitely had no business throwing that deep ball early in the game against the Steelers, and that ball absolutely should have been picked. That was just an idiotic decision. The throws on the outs which should have been picked indicated that while he was willing to go downfield with the throw, his mind didn't correctly inform him that he shouldn't have made the throws.
Shurmur and Weeden have their own crosses to carry right now.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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j/c
I like Weeden...I think he is the QB of the next few years...but I think watching a couple of games from the sideline would do him a world of good right now.
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Quote:
j/c
I like Weeden...I think he is the QB of the next few years...but I think watching a couple of games from the sideline would do him a world of good right now.
I have to ask why? We are coming into a very weak team and off a very strong victory against a hated rival. This is the time that you build his confidence not bench him IMHO.
As I mentioned to Toad I think Shurmur is actually opening up things again (all IMHO) and although against the #1 defense in the league he (shurmur) tightened up in the red zone getting there is extreamly hard to do and you have to get pts there.
Now is the time for Weeden to shine not ride the pine.
If you need 3 years to be a winner you got here 2 years to early. Get it done Browns.
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Legend
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Imagine this defense with a ferocious pass rusher to add to what we already have. Man ... teams would hate to play us .... and opposing QBs would constantly be worried about being buried in the turf on any given play .... especially bad down/distance situations. Imagine this defense with a guy who even approached the same neighborhood as a JJ Watt.  That would be a flat out scary defense.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
Re-post from the gameday threads trying to stop the craziness and make some sense 
Does anyone in here realize that Weeden had the best QB rating of any QB facing the Steelers in the last 5 games? and that he was the 1st QB to throw a TD on them since week 6 or 7 (he was 1 out of 1 in throws into the endzone)...and those include Eli, Flacco and RG 3 (last throwing TD on Steelers)
Since you brought stats into this... 
Weeden's QBR (ESPN stat designed to measure actual clutch performance) of 13.4 this Sunday is the lowest QBR a QB has posted all year in a win (174 games total). Weeden's QBR for the season is 21.8... 11 points below Mark Sanchez (who New York fans are begging to bench) and only above John Skelton, the backup Cardinals QB benched for a 3rd string, 6th round rookie due to "ineffectiveness". He's 22nd in times sacked yet has thrown the 3rd most INTs with the 3rd worst comp % and 4th worst YPA.
We all want a franchise QB in Cleveland but I have absolutely no idea why some are still lying to themselves that Weeden is the guy. He's gotten worse as the season has gone on just like DA did when everyone was chugging the Kool Aid in 2007. We faced Charlie Batch and a PIT defense without Woodley and Polamalu and despite that, Weeden spotted them a TD and we won by less than a score.
Many are slowly starting to come around to the truth on Weeden - he's been miserable this year. He still has the rest of the season to improve obviously... but it's looking worse and worse every week.
We're... we're good?
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Quote:
Quote:
j/c
I like Weeden...I think he is the QB of the next few years...but I think watching a couple of games from the sideline would do him a world of good right now.
I have to ask why? We are coming into a very weak team and off a very strong victory against a hated rival. This is the time that you build his confidence not bench him IMHO.
As I mentioned to Toad I think Shurmur is actually opening up things again (all IMHO) and although against the #1 defense in the league he (shurmur) tightened up in the red zone getting there is extreamly hard to do and you have to get pts there.
Now is the time for Weeden to shine not ride the pine.
He has been too inconsistent these last two games...he appears overwhelmed...even his long ball has gotten squirrelly...now a shot to the head. He is playing with little-to-no confidence.
He needs to get back to where he was after the Eagles game. I don't see him being able to effectively "play his way through it" right now...and I believed that BEFORE the shot to the head. I think he is a mess right now.
I think he needs to watch and learn a little bit...moreso than going out and feasting on a bad Oakland team.
The concussion thing is the perfect excuse for him to sit and watch for a game without creating some BS controversy. I actually think watching a game will HELP him get back to regaining his progress from earlier this year.
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I don't know what the criteria they use is ..... but we had 5 second half drives. 2 of those drives had 2 holding penalties on them. That's each, for a total of 4. One also had a hold on the punt return. So we lost 30 yards on that one before second down every rolled around. We faced a 3rd and 23, and a 3rd and 27 in those 2 drives.
The other 2 drives wound up with a 3rd and 7 after we had a 2nd and 5 and lost 2 on a run ....... and a 3rd and 4. Weeden threw 2 incomplete passes to end those 2 drives. Those were the only 2 passes he missed in the 2nd half. I should also add that the 3rd and 4 play was the one where Weeden got absolutely crushed, and knocked out of the game.
We ran a lot in the 2nd half ... and outside of the 15 yards TD, very little to show for it. (and Weeden passed us down to the 15 with 2-2 passing for 21 yards on that TD drive)
I am curious as to what the ESPN rating was for Flacco the week before when he went 20-32 for 164 yards and no TD? How about when the Steelers held Eli Manning to 10-24 for 125 yards and an INT?
Matt Cassel, not the greatest QB, but an experienced guy, went 11-26 for 154 yards with an INT.
You have to go back 5 games to find the last TD pass against the Steelers before Weeden's yesterday. RG3 went 16-34 for 177 yards, with a TD. That might be OK .... but it's not his normal game.
In the 3 games following the Steelers game, RG3 went 57-82 for 69.5%, 726 yards, 8.85 yards/play, 8 TD and 1 INT. The Steelers held a very good QB to minimal production. They have a damn good defense.
Last edited by YTownBrownsFan; 11/26/12 04:05 PM.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Legend
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Quote:
QBR (ESPN stat designed to measure actual clutch performance)
QBR (ESPN stat designed to give BSPN sole ownership of a QB metric, so people have to come to them to find out what it is for a player, thus increasing NFL related traffic on their sites)
Fixed it for you.
It's a BS "measurement"made up by BSPN and pushed by them at every turn because they are marketing it. If they tell you often enough that it is relevant, people buy into it.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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... not only that, but it is rife with subjective determinations and not really a true measure of anything that's tangible. It is a complete misnomer to call QBR a "statistic" at all. It is, however, a clever marketing device for a sports broadcasting giant. 
[color:"white"]"Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
-- Mark Twain [/color]
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Quote:
Quote:
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j/c
I like Weeden...I think he is the QB of the next few years...but I think watching a couple of games from the sideline would do him a world of good right now.
I have to ask why? We are coming into a very weak team and off a very strong victory against a hated rival. This is the time that you build his confidence not bench him IMHO.
As I mentioned to Toad I think Shurmur is actually opening up things again (all IMHO) and although against the #1 defense in the league he (shurmur) tightened up in the red zone getting there is extreamly hard to do and you have to get pts there.
Now is the time for Weeden to shine not ride the pine.
He has been too inconsistent these last two games...he appears overwhelmed...even his long ball has gotten squirrelly...now a shot to the head. He is playing with little-to-no confidence.
He needs to get back to where he was after the Eagles game. I don't see him being able to effectively "play his way through it" right now...and I believed that BEFORE the shot to the head. I think he is a mess right now.
I think he needs to watch and learn a little bit...moreso than going out and feasting on a bad Oakland team.
The concussion thing is the perfect excuse for him to sit and watch for a game without creating some BS controversy. I actually think watching a game will HELP him get back to regaining his progress from earlier this year.
Again this is just strange to me. Against Dallas he marched the team down to the 1 yd and we couldnt punch it in running it and he was asked to throw us a TD on 4th down on a fade.
Next chance he got he made a perfect toss on 1st down into the endzone scoring the go ahead TD with 1:07 left on the clock. Most other times that is a win.
Against the Steelers he suffered a tipped pass pick 6 and was down 7-0 just over 1 minute in and then got us 13 pts before a crazy end to the half (much like in the Philly game) gave Pittsburgh the lead.
Then he went, what I think 8-8 at one point against the # 1 defense in the league and marched us down into the red zone and totally helped us secure a win. Im not taking anything away form the defense at all they won this game but darn Weeden isnt this cowering in the corner player that needs to sit down and relearn how to play you all make him out to be.
We are 3-3 last 6 should have been 4-2 and you want the Rookie QB to sit because it will help him learn? Sorry Im not buying. He doesnt need an excuse to sit hes doing fine for a rookie, it's people need to make an excuse to sit him that is the problem and no matter how they want to spin it I feel its an agenda.
Our beloved Kosar did about as well his first year too. He had Mack and Byner and a 21-3 lead against miami but we lost because he couldnt throw the ball yet.
How did that work out?
If you need 3 years to be a winner you got here 2 years to early. Get it done Browns.
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I understand that not everyone will think as I do on this subject. That's ok.
I just think he's a mess mentally right now...and he is wildly inconsistent as a result. There is no shame in a rookie hitting that point.
Even veteran players frequently comment on how sitting out a game gave them a new perspective on things.
I think he is right there on needing a break.
Sit one game...after a concussion no less...then back at it at home against the Chiefs.
FWIW: People CAN be critical of Weeden and yet have no agenda.
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Quote:
I understand that not everyone will think as I do on this subject. That's ok.
I just think he's a mess mentally right now...and he is wildly inconsistent as a result. There is no shame in a rookie hitting that point.
Even veteran players frequently comment on how sitting out a game gave them a new perspective on things.
I think he is right there on needing a break.
Sit one game...after a concussion no less...then back at it at home against the Chiefs.
FWIW: People CAN be critical of Weeden and yet have no agenda.
I have no problem with people being critical of Weeden what so ever. This isnt baseball with 162 games or Basketball with 82 games where a rest does a player good this is Football with only 16 games I cant think of a single player that after a huge victory said sitting would really help me out.
Also I just dont see this messed up head stuff I keep reading about. I think its more precieved then actual. That of course is why I mentioned how he's done late in games like the Dallas game and I could include the Indy game when Gordon dropped a sure TD.
That is not a kid messed up IMHO. He didnt call 2 straight runs in the red zone that went now where. He did have a huge 1st down toss late but a holding call negated it even Shurmur was about to pull his hair out after that one.
I personally think Weeden is fine and this should be the exact time he should be playing if hes cleared to play. He's getting some Mojo and so are his recievers and the Defense is really bringing it.
Old saying if its not broke dont fix it.  3-3 should have been 4-2 with all the rookies isnt broke not by a long shot.
If you need 3 years to be a winner you got here 2 years to early. Get it done Browns.
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I understand what you are saying and I hope you are correct.
I'm not saying that he will be ruined without a break...so it's all good.
I would like to see Shurmur call plays more-frequently that are of the variety of being to Weeden's strengths...you know...confidence builders...even if they don't result in a big play.
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Quote:
QBR (ESPN stat designed to give BSPN sole ownership of a QB metric, so people have to come to them to find out what it is for a player, thus increasing NFL related traffic on their sites)
Fixed it for you.
It's a BS "measurement"made up by BSPN and pushed by them at every turn because they are marketing it. If they tell you often enough that it is relevant, people buy into it.
For a "BS measurement", it sure is a good indicator of wins. Since 2008, the team with the higher QBR for the game has an 86% win percentage. For comparison's sake, forcing a +2 turnover diff is an 83% win. Thus, when Weeden is ranked 33rd in the league in QBR (and yes there are still 32 teams in the league)... I think it's certainly worth raising an eyebrow over. It really does amaze me how hard some fans try every year to put lipstick on a pig.
We're... we're good?
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Yeah I know, 13 INTs? That's horrible..
I mean compared to Andrew Luck who has.. uh... 13 INTs...
Or maybe Matt Ryan and his uh... 13 INTs...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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plus, it was made by Trent Dilfer, who put in a *0.6 modifier for all Cleveland Browns QBs because he clearly still has an axe to grind.
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well, when you put in a bunch of statistical tools to weigh it towards the winning side, you can make statistics pretty much look how you want them too. i'm actually surprised it is not higher.
old school QBrating isn't a great tool either BTW.
#gmstrong
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According to QBR, Luck and Griffin are Top 5 QBs... (Higher than Rodgers, Brees, and E. Manning) And Sanchez, Cassel, Kolb, and Gabbert are better than Weeden... 
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Quote:
Quote:
QBR (ESPN stat designed to give BSPN sole ownership of a QB metric, so people have to come to them to find out what it is for a player, thus increasing NFL related traffic on their sites)
Fixed it for you.
It's a BS "measurement"made up by BSPN and pushed by them at every turn because they are marketing it. If they tell you often enough that it is relevant, people buy into it.
For a "BS measurement", it sure is a good indicator of wins. Since 2008, the team with the higher QBR for the game has an 86% win percentage. For comparison's sake, forcing a +2 turnover diff is an 83% win. Thus, when Weeden is ranked 33rd in the league in QBR (and yes there are still 32 teams in the league)... I think it's certainly worth raising an eyebrow over. It really does amaze me how hard some fans try every year to put lipstick on a pig.
LMAO... ok, I had to check it out to see how they come up with this "rating". OMG, you CANNOT seriously be referencing this thing at all, ever. Really.
http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/6833215/explaining-statistics-total-quarterback-rating
This is the most horrifically subjective pile of crap, EVER. The original QB Rating wasn't great, but this thing is a freaking JOKE.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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According to QBR, Luck and Griffin are Top 5 QBs... (Higher than Rodgers, Brees, and E. Manning)
And Sanchez, Cassel, Kolb, and Gabbert are better than Weeden...
and here is the kicker on that last part. it's because Weeden has been involved in close games.
Weeden struggling in the 4th quarter of a close game is weighed more harshly than those others struggling in the 4th quarter of getting blown out.
#gmstrong
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According to QBR, Luck and Griffin are Top 5 QBs... (Higher than Rodgers, Brees, and E. Manning)
And Sanchez, Cassel, Kolb, and Gabbert are better than Weeden...
and here is the kicker on that last part. it's because Weeden has been involved in close games.
Weeden struggling in the 4th quarter of a close game is weighed more harshly than those others struggling in the 4th quarter of getting blown out.
LOL so if you are trying to tie or win a game at the end and dont get it done and lose or take the lead and lose -500 but if you are not in the game and complete a few meaningless passes to score down 21 then you get +500
Colt should have been great at those scores. 
If you need 3 years to be a winner you got here 2 years to early. Get it done Browns.
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Colt had a 40.1 last year.
So basically he had Gabberts 2012 season last year...
Too bad we didn't have a Henne last year...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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no, that is not how it works.
when you are getting blown out, your stats are basically meaningless no matter if you are doing well or doing poorly. they barely register at all in QBR.
however, if you are in a tight game, then the 4th quarter stats are the biggest portion of the rating.
#gmstrong
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any stat which does not paint the guy you like in the best light will be called a meaningless stat.. any stat that does will be quoted verbatim...
The old QB rating system is a decent enough stat over a long period of time but it has a lot of holes when used on the per game or shorter term basis specifically because it can't take situations into account. If you have the ball on your own 30 with 5 seconds to go in the half and you dump it off to the RB who runs for 30 yards through the prevent defense you get credit for a 30 yard completion like it meant something... or my favorite, you run the ball all the way down the field, get to the 2 yard line and fake it into the middle and dump it to the TE standing all alone in the corner of the endzone and the QB is 1 for 1 with a TD.... or the end of half hail mary interception that counts the same as an INT returned 85 yards for a TD in the 4th quarter when you are trying to take the lead...
yebat' Putin
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All Pro
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I think a lot of the reason Weeden has regressed is only natural for young QB's, it's that these NFL teams have some film on him now. Just look at Cam Newton this year or Dalton. They both have supposedly regressed. Keeping this in mind, this means they will have more film on Weeden next year.
I honestly dont believe Weeden's our answer for QB. I wasnt thrilled with the pick, but up until now I have tried to give him the rookie pass. He's way too inaccurate, horrible on timing, got better with his footwork but still bad, doesnt go thru progressions, not a good leader (havnt heard any of his teammates step up and say anything that sticks out about him being a leader in the lockerroom or huddle), and I just dont like his deer in headlights look he has half the time. He looks lost not eager. For him to be our QB for the long haul, I think he has way to far to go... with mechanics, knowledge, leadership, accuracy, and decision making. I kind of would like to see McCoy get a shot this year.
And YOUNGSTOWN..... stop comparing Weeden this year and Colt last year stats. Then talk about the impact all the rookies have done this year. You CANNOT compare the two. If you want comparison Weeden has 3 wins, Colt had 4 with out all the new rookies. #Food4Thought
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not a good leader (havnt heard any of his teammates step up and say anything that sticks out about him being a leader in the lockerroom or huddle), and I just dont like his deer in headlights look he has half the time. He looks lost not eager.
OMG... THIS is what is wrong with our fan base, and is a prime example of why no front office should EVER listen to the fans on anything.
So, you state as fact that he's not a good leader - because you don't recall anyone coming out and saying he is?
That's just priceless. Seriously.
And you feel that he is lost because of what you THINK is going on with him in little cut shots you see of him on TV? Hmmm... ok.
That, again, is priceless. Seriously.
Dear Lord - please start the zombie apocalypse tomorrow and end humanity - we deserve it.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 218
2nd String
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2nd String
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 218 |
IMO, this team hasn't been too far off since Week 5.
We are three plays from having a 6 game winning streak.
Indy: Gordon catches that pass, we win.
Baltimore: If defense actually holds on, we win. Trying to remember one single play that actually changed the end result?
Dallas: If the pass Interference penalties would have never happened, it would have stopped Dallas from kicking the FG, we win.
So over the last 6 weeks, we've come a long way, especially in the "leading" at somepoint during the game. Now Shurmur needs to fix the red zone offense and we wouldn't be talking about this.
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 5,620 Likes: 89
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Jan 2007
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IMO, this team hasn't been too far off since Week 5.
We are three plays from having a 6 game winning streak.
Indy: Gordon catches that pass, we win.
Baltimore: If defense actually holds on, we win. Trying to remember one single play that actually changed the end result?
Dallas: If the pass Interference penalties would have never happened, it would have stopped Dallas from kicking the FG, we win.
So over the last 6 weeks, we've come a long way, especially in the "leading" at somepoint during the game. Now Shurmur needs to fix the red zone offense and we wouldn't be talking about this.
We hold on to that INT, we win week 1 as well
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399 Likes: 280
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399 Likes: 280 |
I don't disagree with your premise but.... Quote:
Indy: Gordon catches that pass, we win.
It gives us a 3 point lead with over 6 minutes left... that's hardly a "game over" catch.
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Baltimore: If defense actually holds on, we win. Trying to remember one single play that actually changed the end result?
When 5 trips to the red zone results in 5 field goals, it's not the defenses fault. The biggest play in that game, iirc is the 4th qtr TD pass to Gordon that was brought back because Obi was lined up wrong that ended up as a FG...
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Dallas: If the pass Interference penalties would have never happened, it would have stopped Dallas from kicking the FG, we win.
If the PI penalties had not happened, we would have given up 500 yards passing because a lot of them would have resulted in big plays because we couldn't cover anybody. These were not ticky tack penalties, in most cases we were molesting WRs down field because they were about to make a huge play and we were out of position...
Not to mention, in each of these games we MADE SOME PLAYS.. in the Dallas game we turned it over in the 4th qtr inside our own 30 then forced them to turn it over again without points...
Almost every game, every team that loses can look at one or two plays because more than half of the games in the NFL end up within one score. You don't think Charger fans don't look at the Browns game and point to one or two plays? Heck we pushed the steelers around for 58 minutes (I'll give them the 2 minutes before the half) and they were still 1 play away from winning that game
So while we may be 3 plays away from a 6 game winning streak, we are 2 plays away from being 1-10.
This was, and still is, the source of my frustration with the Steelers win, for which I have been blasted... one or two plays happen, sometimes for you, sometimes against you... so when you beat up a team as bad as we beat up Pittsburgh on Sunday and you leave the game close enough to where one of those plays could lose it for you... then if it happens, you have only yourself to blame... it's not that one play that lost it for you, it's all of the plays you failed to make that made that one play so important.
yebat' Putin
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 218
2nd String
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2nd String
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 218 |
Your absolutely right, it goes both ways, and even changing one play does not guarantee a final end result.
But when is the last time we can honestly look at this many games and say, "Wow, just one play in each of those games and we'd be in the playoffs".
My argument is we are getting to that point were we are just a play or two from being on the winning side of these games.
Could you guys say that about the previous years?
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 989
All Pro
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All Pro
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 989 |
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OMG... THIS is what is wrong with our fan base, and is a prime example of why no front office should EVER listen to the fans on anything.
So, you state as fact that he's not a good leader - because you don't recall anyone coming out and saying he is?
That's just priceless. Seriously.
Have you heard of any instances? Ive heard stuff about Luck, RG3, Russell, Tannehill. but not Weeden. But out of all of what I said... if thats the only thing u disagree with then o well... stop trolling
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,163 Likes: 845
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,163 Likes: 845 |
I'm trolling? lol!
Why would any rational adult need to hear about instances of someone praising his leadership abilities in order for him to be considered to have any?
So, if people aren't constantly telling others how good of a job you're doing at work, then you completely suck at what you do, right?
I'd say that you suck at your job, because NOBODY has ever said to me otherwise.
It is you, sir, who I believe is trolling... because I cannot believe any rational mind would come to the conclusions you have for the reasons you've stated.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,447 Likes: 16
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,447 Likes: 16 |
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399 Likes: 280
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399 Likes: 280 |
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Why would any rational adult....
You should have stopped right there. 
yebat' Putin
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,388 Likes: 886
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,388 Likes: 886 |
Quote:
Quote:
OMG... THIS is what is wrong with our fan base, and is a prime example of why no front office should EVER listen to the fans on anything.
So, you state as fact that he's not a good leader - because you don't recall anyone coming out and saying he is?
That's just priceless. Seriously.
Have you heard of any instances? Ive heard stuff about Luck, RG3, Russell, Tannehill. but not Weeden. But out of all of what I said... if thats the only thing u disagree with then o well... stop trolling
I know you may not be informed of this, but it's pretty hard for the board maker to be a troll...........
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
#gmstrong
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
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I know you may not be informed of this, but it's pretty hard for the board maker to be a troll...........
Where's the damned Ref's at when you need'em.
We have a troll trolling around here named Purpl and nobody is doing squat about it...
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,833
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,833 |
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You somehow forgot FS
That's by far our biggest need imho
I would agree with that to a point.
Would you wait until the 3rd round to get one?
What safety in the draft is worthy of a 1st round pick in the range the Browns will select?
Can we coax a FS from Free agency?
Sheldon Brown is going to be retiring soon and his replacement needs to be found. Do you go CB early ? 
Otherwise our first selection needsa to be RDE or a great LB.
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum How are close are the Browns to
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