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Thanks.  Just seemed low to me and I saw an opportunity for a joke.
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Quote:
If it was possible someday would have thought of it and done it by now.
Is saving one roster spot really worth the potential disaster of having your kicker/punter go down during a game? Think about how many things that affects:
Field goals
PATs
Punts
Kickoffs
Onside Kicks
Not worth it. At all.
Dallas had Danny White doing both QB and P duties in the 1980s and he did both jobs more than adequately well despite the possibility of injury. I dare say that at the time, playing QB was a riskier proposition than the wussified version that we see today.
But I digress.
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Oh Tom Tupa....
And do you remember Randall Cunningham punting from time to time?
I'd be interesting to see a starting QB who knew what they were doing line up to punt on the other side of the 50. You'd force the opponent to go into a preventative defense...it'd have all kinds of good ramifications.
For instance Roethlisberger can punt and has done so a few times. They should do it more often IMO.
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Oh Tom Tupa....
Yeah... how soon we forget Tom Tupa!
Thanks!
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And do you remember Randall Cunningham punting from time to time?
I do. And Elway did some pooch punting on occasion too. He punted at least one time each year from 1987 to 1991, including 3 punts in 1988!
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I'd be interesting to see a starting QB who knew what they were doing line up to punt on the other side of the 50. You'd force the opponent to go into a preventative defense...it'd have all kinds of good ramifications.
For instance Roethlisberger can punt and has done so a few times. They should do it more often IMO.
It's true that Roethlisberger has punted a few times too.
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edit: sorry, had Doug Flutie as the last to punt, you showed that Ben does it ~1per season.
Doug Flutie was the last I could find that completed a kick during a game (XPT free kick in 2005)
Last edited by no_logo_required; 02/13/13 07:41 PM.
#gmstrong
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I would say the the specialization of the kicker and punter positions has changed quite a bit since the 80's.
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Quote:
Quote:
Oh Tom Tupa....
Yeah... how soon we forget Tom Tupa!
Thanks!
of course not... I talked to him today actually. He's a good dude. We've never really talked football but one of these days I'm going to pick his brain a little bit about if he wishes teams would have utilized his unique skillset more. I'm thinking what Chip Kelly does with 4th downs/fake punts and that kind of thing.
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I would say the the specialization of the kicker and punter positions has changed quite a bit since the 80's.
It's not like anything groundbreaking has changed. If you have a guy who has multiple skill sets you might as well try to find a way to use them. Coaches like Belichick will do that kind of stuff.. like line up Hernandez in the backfield or have Welker kick an extra point in preseason in case of emergence, or have 2 and 3 way players like Troy Brown and Mike Vrabel. I'm sure he could make useful a hybrid punter/kicker or punter/QB. It's not like everything has to be locked into a specific role, though after having to deal with Shurmur I won't blame anyone for thinking that way.
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Oh Tom Tupa....
Yeah... how soon we forget Tom Tupa!
Thanks!
of course not... I talked to him today actually. He's a good dude. We've never really talked football but one of these days I'm going to pick his brain a little bit about if he wishes teams would have utilized his unique skillset more. I'm thinking what Chip Kelly does with 4th downs/fake punts and that kind of thing.
You should ask him if he wants to come back to the Browns for those 2-pt. conversion attempts. 
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Good idea... and while we're at it, maybe we will start going for 2 when down 2 in the 4th quarter 
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Two lesser named guys that I am interested in:
Brad Jones, inside linebacker from the Packers
Greg Toler, cornerback from the Cardinals
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jc
Ooooops:
per roto:
ESPN's Chris Mortensen reported on NFL Live Wednesday that the trade market for Alex Smith is "limited," and there is "not a large buzz" about Smith among quarterback-needy teams.
Specifically, Smith going to the Browns is a "long shot," per Mortensen. The Jets can't afford his contract, the Cardinals are the 49ers' division opponent, and the Chiefs might explore Nick Foles or Geno Smith first. Anyone who's kept tabs on Smith the past two years won't be surprised. Smith was available in 2012 free agency, and only the 49ers and Dolphins showed much interest in him -- both after missing out on other quarterbacks. Smith's physical skill set is just borderline starting-caliber, and he was benched this past season. The 49ers won't get more than a mid- to late-round pick on the trade market.
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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Quote:
jc
Ooooops:
per roto:
ESPN's Chris Mortensen reported on NFL Live Wednesday that the trade market for Alex Smith is "limited," and there is "not a large buzz" about Smith among quarterback-needy teams.
Specifically, Smith going to the Browns is a "long shot," per Mortensen. The Jets can't afford his contract, the Cardinals are the 49ers' division opponent, and the Chiefs might explore Nick Foles or Geno Smith first. Anyone who's kept tabs on Smith the past two years won't be surprised. Smith was available in 2012 free agency, and only the 49ers and Dolphins showed much interest in him -- both after missing out on other quarterbacks. Smith's physical skill set is just borderline starting-caliber, and he was benched this past season. The 49ers won't get more than a mid- to late-round pick on the trade market.
Awesome.
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Smith was available in 2012 free agency, and only the 49ers and Dolphins showed much interest in him -- both after failing horribly to sign Peyton Manning.
That sounds better.
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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I remember all of th heavy breathing over Matt Flynn as well, by both fans and NFL talking heads.
Now this year some of the nitwits in network positions think that Flynn could get cut and struggle to find a job.
He should latch on as a backup somewhere if Seattle cuts him. He might be even closer to league minimum on his next deal ....... but I do think that he'll get one.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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All Pro
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Along with Cassell and Kolb in the past few years.
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Wait, so Alex Smith isn't a winner? Or is a winner, but just not a good QB?
I'm confused.
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if nothing else, GB would welcome Flynn back with open arms.
and, the fact he lost out to Wilson as starting QB looks a heck of alot better now than it did back in August. heck, the only reason Seattle would cut him is because of his cap number. if he's willing to renegotiate, I'd bet they'd be happy to keep him.
most likely landing spots are WCO teams. i'd think that KC would be happy to get him if Alex Smith isn't cut. Arians might not mind him in AZ for his system as well (as a Kelly Holcomb style guy for him).
#gmstrong
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Flynn signed a 3 year/$26 million deal with $10 million guaranteed. He only made $4 million in 2012. That means that there is a total of $19 million due in the final 2 years, or $6 million if he is released.
I see no way that Seattle even thinks about keeping him, and no way he stays given that he has no shot at starting.
I think that he is released, then tries to find a starting job somewhere ..... like he did last year. I doubt that anyone takes a shot with him as a starter, then he goes back to backup duty somewhere.
The Packers might want him back, but does he go back knowing that he'll almost never see the field, or does he hope that someone is desperate enough to make him their starter?
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
I doubt that anyone takes a shot with him as a starter
i wouldn't be so sure about that one. if SF plays hardball with Alex Smith, then Flynn is the best QB on the market (or at worst equal with Moore). if SF cuts Alex Smith, then he's still 2nd in line (and cheaper).
i have yet to hear anyone enamored with the QBs in this draft class, so I wouldn't be surprised to see a JAX, KC, or another team decide that they would prefer to spend small FA $$$ on him rather than spend a high draft pick on a non-impressive draftee QB.
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i wouldn't be so sure about that one. if SF plays hardball with Alex Smith, then Flynn is the best QB on the market (or at worst equal with Moore).
I agree, I think the way Wilson played really helped Flynn out... when it was first announced that Wilson beat him out for the job a lot of people looked at that as a big negative on Flynn more than positive on Wilson but then the way Wilson played, may have eased some minds that were down on Flynn.
yebat' Putin
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Seattle basically saved Flynn from being unsigned except as a backup.
I see nothing that makes him any more than that this coming year.
It's like Smith. People are peeing their pants over him, but San Francisco was willing to let him play the market last year, and they took him back only when he couldn;t find a home anywhere else.
Is he an appreciably better QB this off-season than last? I don't think so. Why would any team go gaga for him this year when almost everyone passed on him last year?
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
Seattle basically saved Flynn from being unsigned except as a backup.
then Denver saved Peyton from a similar fate
Matt Flynn was announced with Seattle March 18th last year
Peyton Manning was announced with Denver Marth 19th last year
#gmstrong
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Quote:
Quote:
Seattle basically saved Flynn from being unsigned except as a backup.
then Denver saved Peyton from a similar fate
Matt Flynn was announced with Seattle March 18th last year
Peyton Manning was announced with Denver Marth 19th last year
And?
Manning wanted Denver. Every other visit was elementary my dear Watson.
What's your point?
Seattle and Carrol blew it with Flynn. Dumb dumb DUMB move. Thank you Heckert.
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my point was that Flynn signed early in the FA process. so, there is no way of knowing if another team would have signed him as a potential starter if Seattle didn't. Quote:
Seattle and Carrol blew it with Flynn
how on Earth do we know that? we know he was beat out by Russell Wilson. we know that Wilson had a fantastic rookie season and is now the franchise-QB for Seattle. we don't know what Flynn would have done as a starter.
also, Seattle sure didn't know that Wilson would drop to the 3rd round. signing Flynn was prudent.
#gmstrong
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Quote:
my point was that Flynn signed early in the FA process. so, there is no way of knowing if another team would have signed him as a potential starter if Seattle didn't.
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Seattle and Carrol blew it with Flynn
how on Earth do we know that? we know he was beat out by Russell Wilson. we know that Wilson had a fantastic rookie season and is now the franchise-QB for Seattle. we don't know what Flynn would have done as a starter.
also, Seattle sure didn't know that Wilson would drop to the 3rd round. signing Flynn was prudent.
Wilson went exactly where he should have IMO. And don't think for a minute that he's still going to be successful in Seattle in as little as 2 years. He's SHORT. And that's a QB KILLER. You guys are fascinated with these QB's that can break the pocket and take off. That's a KILLER in the NFL. Just watch what happens to Wilson and RGIII and Kaepernick in the coming years. Griffin and Kaep are STICKS. They won't withstand the pounding. Take away the threat to run and you're looking at a LESS THAN AVERAGE QB.
Flynn? No we don't know but the damn background of a solid game in GB means zilch. My god we saw it ourselves with Holcomb. And that's virtually the EXACT same damn thing.
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You're only as good as your last game in the NFL. What has Flynn ever done?
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Quote:
Wilson went exactly where he should have IMO.
he went where he was projected. pretty sure if we re-drafted today he would go much, much higher. actually, I am nearly 100% confident he would have been the #3 overall selection and our trade-up would have cost us much more than it did.
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And don't think for a minute that he's still going to be successful in Seattle in as little as 2 years.
well, regardless of what he MIGHT be in 2 years, he was extremely successful in his rookie year. 64% 7.9YPA 26TDs 10INTs
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He's SHORT. And that's a QB KILLER.
and yet it's Brandon Weeden who struggles with batted passes. mobility in the pocket is needed for shorter QBs. Wilson has mobility in the pocket (not talking about his running here). Drew Brees the obvious example (1 inch taller than Wilson).
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You guys are fascinated with these QB's that can break the pocket and take off. That's a KILLER in the NFL. Just watch what happens to Wilson and RGIII and Kaepernick in the coming years. Griffin and Kaep are STICKS. They won't withstand the pounding.
who you calling "you guys"?
i don't want a QB who relies on breaking the pocket to take off. i do prefer QBs who are mobile and can run when necessary. Wilson is a good passer (see statistics above). If you want a running QB who cannot throw as an example, then see Tim Tebow.
also, Wilson had 393PA with 94 rushes. About 50% or so of his rushes were designed QB runs. So, he ran on ~10% of his drop-backs. Also, overall he ran ~6 times per game. Weeden ran ~2 times per game, so Wilson ran a whole 4 times per game more than Weeden.
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Take away the threat to run and you're looking at a LESS THAN AVERAGE QB.
if you ignore his stellar comp% TD:INT ratio and YPA he is a less than average QB. pretty sure you cannot just ignore those things.
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Flynn? No we don't know but the damn background of a solid game in GB means zilch. My god we saw it ourselves with Holcomb. And that's virtually the EXACT same damn thing.
so, since we don't know it means he's terrible? look, I don't think Flynn is a good fit for Norv/Chud. I do think he could be a better stop-gap measure in a WCO than anything else out there right now. And, I dislike the QBs in this class, so if I was a team like KC, I would prefer to get Flynn than waste a high round pick on a middling QB prospect.
#gmstrong
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Quote:
You're only as good as your last game in the NFL. What has Flynn ever done?
Thrown for 6 TDs and set passing records in Green Bay (Home of Bart Starr, Bret Favre, Aaron Rodgers)
Just saying...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Quote:
Quote:
You're only as good as your last game in the NFL. What has Flynn ever done?
Thrown for 6 TDs and set passing records in Green Bay (Home of Bart Starr, Bret Favre, Aaron Rodgers)
Just saying...
no, Matt Flynn was last seen on the field kneeling down in a 42-13 Seattle beat-down of the eventual NFC Champion 49ers.
(nevermind that he didn't throw a pass in that game  )
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Quote:
Quote:
Seattle basically saved Flynn from being unsigned except as a backup.
then Denver saved Peyton from a similar fate
Matt Flynn was announced with Seattle March 18th last year
Peyton Manning was announced with Denver Marth 19th last year
There was talk about teams wanting to talk to Flynn, only almost every team denied it. Same thing with Smith ..... Oh, he could go here, or he could go there ...... only he wound up right where he started, because no one thought he was worth signing.
In the NFL, QBs are the single most precious commodities there are. Great QBs are almost impossible to find. Really good QBs are extremely hard to find. Hell, even good QBs are hard to find. They are almost impossible to find in free agency, because teams don't let good to great QBs go unless there are extenuating circumstances. (like both Brees and Manning with injuries that no one was certain they could return from, and their old teams already had their replacements in place)
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I think we would of been better off (last year) signing Flynn.
Gives us an extra draft pick, and a QB who's shown better talent in the WCO than Colt.
I'm not saying our record would of been any better, but I don't think it would of been worse either...
I want no part of him now obviously..
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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and yet it's Brandon Weeden who struggles with batted passes
In college Weeden was in the gun probably 99% of the time and the other 1 % was on a 7 step drop. The quick 3 step drop gives guys problems. Bernie sucked at it and thats why he used to get a head start lol.
Weeden often didnt get enough depth on those drops and thats one of the reasons why the passes were batted down. Another was the fact that he wasn't quick enough with his reads and followed the receiver. This just let the D follow his eyes and they knew when to time their jump.
Last edited by Mourgrym; 02/14/13 08:06 PM.
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I remember all of th heavy breathing over Matt Flynn as well, by both fans and NFL talking heads.
More like heavy petting.
![[Linked Image from pic18.picturetrail.com]](http://pic18.picturetrail.com/VOL905/3216203/6567769/349897772.jpg) "The Browns' defense is kicking mucho dupa."
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Alex Smith could be a cap casualty in San Francisco. He probably won't even draw any trade interest at all. In the free agency market, it'll get more consideration.
With Justin Blackmon in Jacksonville, do you think we could swing their 2nd rounder from them for Weeden and would you take it if it was offered? Keep in mind, Jacksonville has the first pick in the 2nd round.
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With Justin Blackmon in Jacksonville, do you think we could swing their 2nd rounder from them for Weeden and would you take it if it was offered? Keep in mind, Jacksonville has the first pick in the 2nd round.
We should do that trade for sure and then use that pick to trade for Aaron Rodgers.
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And don't think for a minute that he's still going to be successful in Seattle in as little as 2 years. He's SHORT. And that's a QB KILLER.
Nobody knows what he'll do. And as for short being a QB killer, tell it to Drew Brees (6-0). Tell it to Russell Wilson (5-11), RG3 (6-2), Tony Romo (6-2). Being short isn't the problem with being a QB. Being intelligent is the primary requirement is the key component. Tony Romo is only 6'-2" and while he hasn't had huge success in the playoffs, he's been a very good QB.
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Griffin and Kaep are STICKS. They won't withstand the pounding. Take away the threat to run and you're looking at a LESS THAN AVERAGE QB.
Kaepernick isn't a stick. He's 230 pounds!
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Yeah, Kaepernick is definitely built like a football player.
He's taller than RG3, but he's also about 20 or so pounds heavier as well.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
Griffin and Kaep are STICKS. They won't withstand the pounding. Take away the threat to run and you're looking at a LESS THAN AVERAGE QB.
Good point except for the fact that Kaepernick is the same height and 10 pounds heavier than Weeden and about the exact same weight as Andrew Luck and 5 pounds heavier than Tom Brady... and he has a very strong arm and a real nice delivery of the ball... Take away the run from both of them and you are still looking at very good young QBs...
Oh and somebody else pointed out that Kaep rushed about 6 times a game and Weeden 2 times a game.. Andrew Luck rushed about 4 times a game...
yebat' Putin
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I see nothing that makes him any more than that this coming year.
It's like Smith. People are peeing their pants over him, but San Francisco was willing to let him play the market last year, and they took him back only when he couldn;t find a home anywhere else.
Is he an appreciably better QB this off-season than last? I don't think so. Why would any team go gaga for him this year when almost everyone passed on him last year?
Yeah, they only signed him to a 3 year 24 million dollar contract. He will only counted 9.25 mil against their cap last year.
They must really think the guy sucked!
You are trying to rest your laurels with what one writers opinion of the situation is here. We'll see how it pans out.
I'd be willing to bet that Smith ends up making 7-10 mil somewhere this coming season as an NFL starting QB. He ranks well above many NFL starter right now as much as people would like to pretend he doesn't.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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