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That's the point. No one has said about bringing anyone in. They've only said Weeden will compete for the job.
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j/c
All the issue with age, what about Staubach?
Here's a guy who was a 27 year old rookie that only started 14 games in his first four years and didn't start a full season until he was 31.
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j/c
All the issue with age, what about Staubach?
Here's a guy who was a 27 year old rookie that only started 14 games in his first four years and didn't start a full season until he was 31.
or Gannon (34yo in his first truly successful starting stint)
or Warner (28yo when he took over as StL starter)
The problem isn't that it cannot happen. The problem is that the window is tighter on it happening. I fully agree that we need to bring in a QB to push Weeden and also serve as our emergency exit should Weeden regress. That doesn't mean we are giving up on him though.
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That's the point. No one has said about bringing anyone in. They've only said Weeden will compete for the job.
I am going by anarchy's blurb from Haslam.....
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Cleveland Browns owner Jimmy Haslam said today that his team will not only bring in a new quarterback this offseason, but whomever they sign will compete with Brandon Weeden for the starting job.
That states they will "bring someone in and sign them".
Which my response is, you can't bring someone in who is already here.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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As others have said, that statement by Haslam is inaccurate.
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jc...
Which teams out there are developing guys who were 22/23-year-old rookies for four or five years?
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As others have said, that statement by Haslam is inaccurate.
People can speculate all they will about McCoy. But in the end, everyone willing to be open and honest knows McCoy lacks the arm strength for the vertical game.
Lewis may be someone that can be considered, but I don't feel this regime has seen anything from any of our current QB's that has them enamored.
There will be someone brought in from the outside. Be that the draft or the FA market. As much as has been bantered about on this subject, I don't really see the point as being all that debatable.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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The point I am making is we have him and his age doesn't impact one thing. Either he can get it done or he can't.
Exactly, it would be different if there was a chance that a really good alternative might be available at #6 but that isn't going to happen.. so Weeden is really going to benefit from this being a very weak year for QBs.. It costs us nothing to give him another year to see what kind of strides he can make...
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Serious question.
I think everyone can agree that QBs can play effectively into their late 30s.
Who was the last Browns QB to start 7 seasons in a row?
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Generation Y guesses Bernie?
Politicians are puppets, y'all. Let's get Geppetto!
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Otto Graham, I would guess.
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nope. I think Sipe was six and a half years or something like that. Have to go back a long time, if ever. That was why (as I said many times) my issue with the Weeden pick wasn't his age, but his scheme fit. I'm optimistic he will improve this year.
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Bernie Kosar - he just didn't play all the games in 4 of those 7 years.
Sipe - started 8 years in a row, but partial seasons in 3 of them.
So, the only QB in Browns history to start and play 7 years in a row was Otto Graham who did so for 8 seasons (missing only 2 games). Would be 10, but his first 2 seasons, he wasn't always the starter.
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Bottom line being 7 years is not an unreasonable amount of time for a first round pick to be a starter on your team.
If he's good.
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Quote:
j/c
All the issue with age, what about Staubach?
Here's a guy who was a 27 year old rookie that only started 14 games in his first four years and didn't start a full season until he was 31.
Please don't compare Weeden to Staubach
#GMSTRONG
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Bottom line being 7 years is not an unreasonable amount of time for a first round pick to be a starter on your team.
If he's good.
yes, exactly.
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24-31 is a lot easier than 30-37
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24-31 is a lot easier than 30-37
alot easier for what?
to stay healthy? yeah, definitely and must worry about diminishing skills
to get better on the field? i don't know though I see this raised.
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Bottom line being 7 years is not an unreasonable amount of time for a first round pick to be a starter on your team.
If he's good.
Maybe the bottom line is, what have we won using this 7 year max at QB model? Nothing.
Montana 11, Aikman 12, Marino 10, P. Manning 13, Brady 12 and counting, Fouts 14, Bradshaw 13, E. Manning 8 and counting, Simms 12, Roethlisberger 9 and counting, Elway 16, Favre 16....
So if you want to use the "7 years is great" model because that's the best the Browns have ever been able to do, then lets go with it... of course almost all of the guys on that other list of 10+ years have championships, most of them multiple championships.... 13 of your last 17 super bowl QBs are on that list...
the fact that Bernie and Brian Sipe, who were both pretty good but not elite, are the best QB play we've had since Otto Graham doesn't mean that's the model to follow.
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Of the Super Bowl-winning QBs you listed, all but Peyton Manning and John Elway won it in seven or fewer seasons. Eli Manning, Montana, Aikman, Brady, Roethlisberger and Bradshaw won two within their first seven seasons.
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Quote:
Serious question.
I think everyone can agree that QBs can play effectively into their late 30s.
Who was the last Browns QB to start 7 seasons in a row?
QBs definitely can play effectively into their mid-late 30s, but it's usually the best quarterbacks who even get a chance. For every Kurt Warner, Peyton Manning, and Brett Favre there are dozens of guys who are out of the league for good or are/were struggling to hold onto a job or even roster spot period like Chad Pennington, Donovan McNabb, Carson Palmer, Matt Hasselbeck, Drew Bledsoe, Jason Campbell, Marc Bulger, maybe even Philip Rivers soon. That's just a short list I could come up with off the top of my head but a lot of them were regressing pretty badly in their early-mid 30s.
The part that bothers me about the Weeden pick is that I can't help but think it was a short sighted pick that was more about helping the previous regime keep their jobs than it was for the long-term best interest of the Cleveland Browns. If this team was a playoff caliber team last year and Weeden put us over the hump for 5+ years, great pick. 5 win team and new regime that now has a 1st round soon to be 30 year old developmental QB, not so great.
I hope the new offense is just what he needs and can develop into a plus QB for 5-7 or more years. If we look back in a few years thinking it was a 'panicked disaster' and complete waste of a 1st round pick due to extreme selfishness by the former regime, that is going to be a tough pill to swallow.
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Try making a list like that for RBs
It's common double standard around here to bash Weeden for "only" having 7-8years at best, yet we invested a much higher pick (and some mid rounders) on TRich that will have 7-8 years at best. Where's the outcry for that? I don't see any...the age thing is and was a resentment filled excuse to just bash on a guy that many decided day 1 they didn't like
Hypocrisy and double standard at their best....
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the age thing is and was a resentment filled excuse to just bash on a guy that many decided day 1 they didn't like
Wrong. If Weeden was 24 (almost) no one would have a problem with the pick.
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If only having 7-8 years is a "big problem" with pick no22, then why is 7-8 years for pickS no 4, 118, 139 and 211 ok or even great?
Whoever argues that way is either being dumb or hypocritical...and there are both on here with regards to Weeden-Trich
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Quote:
If only having 7-8 years is a "big problem" with pick no22, then why is 7-8 years for pickS no 4, 118, 139 and 211 ok or even great?
Whoever argues that way is either being dumb or hypocritical...and there are both on here with regards to Weeden-Trich
I think the difference is that a lot of people like tough/physical runners and thus love TRich the player, as I do, even if the long term value isn't really there. It's one thing if you're a playoff team in desperate need of a starting RB, quite a bit different when you know the team is going to be sold and yet encourage a trade up to 3 to take a RB anyway. Browns fans should be furious at Mike Holmgren for putting his guys above the long term future of the Browns, but I realize that's not a very popular opinion around here. oh well.
You could actually make the same case about Josh Gordon. The big difference is that he was the most impressive rookie receiver in the league last year and looks well worth an early second round pick.
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j/c
this argument has got me down. not because of Weeden either.
no, because I keep thinking "when was the last time the Browns didn't need to go 2-3 QBs deep on the depth chart during a season"
Thaddeus Lewis now gets to put "Starting NFL QB" on his resume. Colt McCoy got to start as a rookie after he did little other than scout-team duty. Guys like Luke McCown and Bruce Gradkowski have thrown starts in for our team (among many others).
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Quote:
If only having 7-8 years is a "big problem" with pick no22, then why is 7-8 years for pickS no 4, 118, 139 and 211 ok or even great?
Whoever argues that way is either being dumb or hypocritical...and there are both on here with regards to Weeden-Trich
I think the only "dumb" thing is trying to compare a 29-year old rookie QB to a 21-year old rookie RB.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Quote:
Quote:
If only having 7-8 years is a "big problem" with pick no22, then why is 7-8 years for pickS no 4, 118, 139 and 211 ok or even great?
Whoever argues that way is either being dumb or hypocritical...and there are both on here with regards to Weeden-Trich
I think the only "dumb" thing is trying to compare a 29-year old rookie QB to a 21-year old rookie RB.
pretty much...
a good RB lasts 7-8 years a good QB lasts 10-15 years. Every position has a longevity attached to it.
I don't know why people fight so hard to make pyrite just as valuable as gold.
Peyton Manning was always gold. He was the safest pick in his draft class. He was the equivalent to Andrew Luck in last years draft.
Weeden is Pyrite and would be similar to Brian Griese.
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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Quote:
Quote:
j/c
All the issue with age, what about Staubach?
Here's a guy who was a 27 year old rookie that only started 14 games in his first four years and didn't start a full season until he was 31.
Please don't compare Weeden to Staubach
It's not a unfair comparison....age is the issue here. I didn't read anybody comparing him to Roger in so far as ability.
All that was said was there are examples of players getting a late shot and making the most of it.
Recently, Warner...some others, Theisman, and Moon.
Weeden passes my 2-3 game test.....he looks the part....now we need to take it 8 more games. Just 8 more games. See if he hasn't improved. I am not talking about like it was Couch when it was apparent he sucked after 25-30 games and we were still dorking around with the guy seasons later.
I like the idea of cutting bait and moving on. You might not have a full read, and in some cases as noted, you can make mistakes, but one can usually tell about a quarterback 25 or so games in to the career.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Did thou conjur the name Couch? 
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I'd love Tim couch on this team.
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Did thou conjur the name Couch?
LOL....for old times sake I guess.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Quote:
If only having 7-8 years is a "big problem" with pick no22, then why is 7-8 years for pickS no 4, 118, 139 and 211 ok or even great?
Whoever argues that way is either being dumb or hypocritical...and there are both on here with regards to Weeden-Trich
I was upset about giving up the additional picks for Richardson. I could understand the selection of Richardson because the Browns were in need of a RB also. Hardesty proved that he couldn't stay healthy. Personally, I wanted to trade back and take OL and then the RB with Doug Martin and Stephen Hill.
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I'd love Tim couch on this team.
Give me young Tim Couch on a team with this OL and these offensive weapons? Yeah, I think I'd take that too.
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Did thou conjur the name Couch?
LOL....for old times sake I guess.
I call your Tim Couch.
And raise you Kelly Holcomb, who was the better QB all along.
Message Board exploding in 3....2....1
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All Pro
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Comparing mannings rookie year to Weeden's is laughable.
One... Your holding back the reigns hoping he will throw a few less ints.
The other... your dangling the stick and a carrot trying to get him to move.
You can post stats all day, but in the end they dont mean a thing really.
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With Barkley unable to throw , I suspect we will see Lombardi go full court press for Ryan Mallett. He and Belli have the strong ties to get it done and the Pats have but 5 picks this year.
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With Barkley unable to throw , I suspect we will see Lombardi go full court press for Ryan Mallett. He and Belli have the strong ties to get it done and the Pats have but 5 picks this year.
I still say it's Moore or DA.
And Weeden, having a leg up on both from 1 year with these guys will beat either of them out.
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With Barkley unable to throw , I suspect we will see Lombardi go full court press for Ryan Mallett. He and Belli have the strong ties to get it done and the Pats have but 5 picks this year.
I wonder what it will cost? I wouldn't take Mallet for our #1. I am sure the Pats want more than a 4th rounder and maybe some other low level pick.
I don't want to send off future #1 picks. I say draft our own Mallett. This draft is full of them. Bray is a guy I like.
Maybe we do need a franchise QB, but you can't just make make them materialize out of thin air. They have to be there
I liked Mallett when in school. He does have skills, but he wasn't worth a top first round pick then and I don't see this grand body of work since that makes me think he is worth it now.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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With Barkley unable to throw , I suspect we will see Lombardi go full court press for Ryan Mallett. He and Belli have the strong ties to get it done and the Pats have but 5 picks this year.
I still say it's Moore or DA.
And Weeden, having a leg up on both from 1 year with these guys will beat either of them out.
I believe that Moore or DA are the most likely candidates at this time as well.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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