DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns make Lombardi G.M., Farmer assistant G.M.

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So, I ask again [not you, mac---I gave up on appealing to your logic long ago and will now go back to ignoring you] that we please keep our discussions to football and stop w/the Regime Wars that poisoned the other board. In case you haven't noticed, there is a lot more "football talk" on this board than on our old board. That is a good thing. Let's not bring the board down w/our agendas, and yes, I am including myself in that group. Thanks for your consideration.

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Changed? He would have traded up into the 1st and drafted Henne when he was a journalist and he bashed good drafts and aplauded bad ones as recent as the 2012 draft...it's all there black on white, written by the man himself.

What makes ANYONE think this guy has become a better talent evaluator all of a sudden?

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What makes ANYONE think this guy has become a better talent evaluator all of a sudden?

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. Every board needs posters that bring intensity and provoke thoughtful responses. It is not necessary, nor desireable, that posters always agree with each other for how else can you initiate stimulating conversation? Opposite points of view often provide food for thought and that is a good thing...

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Don't get me started..I'm tired this morning..WHO said he's changed?? I said this draft will show whether he has or not..

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I think it will take at least two years to even remotely gauge how good or bad a pick is....

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I think it will take at least two years to even remotely gauge how good or bad a pick is....

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Memphis: It is a generally accepted rule-of-thumb that it takes 3 years to gauge the success of any particular draft. Some picks (obviously) blossom earlier than others...

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I am so freaking sick of you guys LOOKING for trouble.

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I know you were posting to 32...but it was my quote about being lied to.

I'm sure you know I post from the heart. My agenda only is about my Browns not regime.

I did fee that way..n I thought it was a disrespect to our fans. We love our Browns so much that we know n want to know as much as possible. To portray Lombardi as a answer to a search that regarding him started 10 days before. When we saw celebrating of his hire 2 months prior. But I'm embracing Banner n Lombardi cause they are working well together (SO FAR) n I like THE PLAN as it enfolds.

I don't think anyone Liked Mangini more than I did...how many PM's did I make to you telling you that I know you would love him as a Coach.

I still give him credit for the STARTING point cause it was under Mangini we started to get TOUGH on the LOS n beat up teams! This carried onto the following 2 years after he left. I embraced Holmgren which in hind sight he was not the LEADER I thought he was but I think his Gold Star was hiring Heckert (the best GM we ever had).

Still on that I didn't make up my mind till the morning - I called him on that as a "LIE" as well. And went on to embrace his PLAN. Which more than likely I will do if not already with the new guys...But a Lie is a Lie. To all before n all after...COME ON PEOPLE we are not dumb ass fans! We know whats going on! Man UP! Don't make up stuff.

But I don't see any mass HATE on this franchise. Actually I see most taking my path and that is as THE PLAN enfolds we are liking what we see.

I've said it before - You fear what you do not know. All we knew was Banner was going to be our Supreme Leader our Emperor with total control. Somebody who did not have a football background...EVER. It was scary. We all knew Lombardi would not be the decision maker. The more I learned about Lombardi was he was an INFO gatherer of no equal - very hard worker. But he has always seemed to need that Dictator. BB, AL Davis n now Banner. But the good news so far is Banner actually seems to be pretty spot on. Banner NEEDS Lombardi. Maybe the LIE was perpetrated not on us Fans but the NFL cause there is a Rooney Rule for GM as well as HC???

I really don't see these guys - bashing our FO - but as long as they don't go and ruin threads as they expound their opinion which they are allowed to have...which I backed your right to an opinion as well as Upbeat the last 2-3 years on the other board.

But those were my words cause it was how I felt at the time. No need to go a few rounds over it. It is what it is.

Oh on the Lombardi reported theory on not being swayed on opinion regarding players. Although Heckert was not a Press conference every other day kind of guy...He would come out of his Cave n speak to the press. Keep in mind after the draft I was pleased to hear him speak n when asked Why did you pass this guy he was the BPA. He would state? I had no clue he was valued that high - On our board we had Schwartz or Taylor or Hughes higher than x, y or z. So Heckert who I revere in his prowess conducted evaluation on the same plane....Not to be influenced by the media...but I don't think Heckert did it with Fear of the media. This again tells me Lombardi is pretty Insecure n needs that Strong person backing him. Heckert yes disappeared FA draft period maybe a visit out of the cave after most FA moves were made n pre draft but never did any detail about the draft n then went into his cave again. It would be nice if Lombardi could come out n tell us something of what he is doing without spilling the beans. I wish he didn't fear the media. But then he is who he is.

If you note I almost always state things as Banner/Lombardi...noting them as a team - of late I think I have gotten lazy typing n just put BANNER cause he has the power.

So far as a TEAM...Banner is impressing me as the TOTALITARIAN but he needs his LOMBARDI as his INFO guy...almost like MONEY BALL...you had Beane (Banner) but he needed his INFO guy to make the right moves.

JMHO - so far so good

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So we can finally say the Larry Asante pick didn't work out?

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What makes ANYONE think this guy has become a better talent evaluator all of a sudden?

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Don't get me started..I'm tired this morning..WHO said he's changed?? I said this draft will show whether he has or not..

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he may as well bat for the cycle and draft a punter in the first round.

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Uh I think U should been on this old board about 6-10 years ago.. intensity and volatile are nice words compared to the no holds barred and Hell in a Cell matches that regularly took place.

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Actually, I miss those.



And all the while the board was strictly moderated. When's the last time you heard the term "Nazi Refs"?

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Why do you always seem so intent on distorting things with facts Saint!??



But I keep forgetting he's not really a GM. He's just "the info. guy" for Banner that gets the title of GM and the paycheck to go with it.

Like that makes ANY sense!

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I have read plenty of reports that praise Banner. You keep acting like most, if not all, the articles are negative. That is simply not true.

Banner has a very good reputation and he actually was a team president before, unlike The Big Show--who you so dearly loved.

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I have read plenty of reports that praise Banner. You keep acting like most, if not all, the articles are negative. That is simply not true.

Banner has a very good reputation and he actually was a team president before, unlike The Big Show--who you so dearly loved.

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I have read plenty of reports that praise Banner. You keep acting like most, if not all, the articles are negative. That is simply not true.

Banner has a very good reputation and he actually was a team president before, unlike The Big Show--who you so dearly loved.

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I have read plenty of reports that praise Banner. You keep acting like most, if not all, the articles are negative. That is simply not true.

Banner has a very good reputation and he actually was a team president before, unlike The Big Show--who you so dearly loved.

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I think we need proof of the good articles.

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IMO, he is doing a good job so far with his FA picks. People need to give these guys a chance.

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Oh, and Memphis.......care to show me where you have posted the positive Banner articles. You act like you are neutral, but you are another one who rips them every chance you get. Like when you said that trying out a kicker deserved it's own thread. LMAO. A tryout!

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What are you talking about?

I never said I posted positive Banner articles but READ them- and commented about them. And considering Banner has been in the fold since Haslem bought the team and fans subsequently looking up tons info on him, there has been much discussion on the good and the bad. But you choose to focus on the bad, for whatever reason. Perhaps you simply love conflict. Also, I've been on this message board for a couple of weeks, while posting on the prior message board and unfortunately most of my good/bad points are gone- perhaps convenient for you to say I've never had any. That's fine. This is only a message board. But in an effort to jog your memory on my position with the new FO, specifically Banner, I offer the following:

- I love his business approach
- I love his coaching hires
- l love his business side hires
- I think he'll change the fan and game day experience for the better
- I think he make upgrades to Berea.
- I appreciate his candidness to the media


- I hate the Lombardi hire as the Director of Player Personnel, and not the GM. I think it lends itself to Banner opinion of himself with personnel.
- I hate the Lombardi hire based on his past failures.
- I don't like that Banner thinks he competent in personnel matters
- I'm concerned he'll have too much power and final say in personnel choices. I think the roundtable plea is a just a PR thing. All these guys have egos and Banner will have the final say regardless.
- I'm concerned about his chip on his shoulder after getting the boot in Philly may cause emotional decisions down the road.

There are probably more, but that's it for now.

Regarding the kicker tryout... I didn't see where I said it deserved it's own thread, but for the record I am ok with it. This is a message board about Browns' activity and if someone wants to post about an internet sensation coming to Berea to possibly take over for a 14-year vet Pro Bowler who everybody loved, THEN FINE BY ME!!!

Geez, having a conversation with you is like going through the stations of the cross.
I think I'll on pass on future dialogue.

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Geez, having a conversation with you is like going through the stations of the cross.

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Best line of the day......

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...I think I'll on pass on future dialogue.

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just like Lombardi is now...Banner is the man.

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Won't get into this Tit for Tat discussion of Pro or Con on the new FO. But I'm confused about one thing. For all These Years...I thought Reid was THE MAN.

We see articles Positive about the Business end but None on Personnel regarding Banner Is that Possible because That simply wasn't his responsibility in Philly? I mean until Banner came here I never heard about him in discussion. And keep in mind we hired Heckert n there was a lot of Talk about Him coming here from Philly n plenty of Discussion...NOT ONCE - did I read Banner had the final say...ALL EVERY SINGLE ONE was that Heckert did not have the final say IT WAS REID.

Now that Banner is here...all of a sudden ALL THE BAD PICKS were His...

Sometimes You guys are Funny - Not picking you out Django...just your quote there to lead into my thought process. You have been rather minimal in this. I am calling out all the others who have strongly stated these negatives about Banner to please address about this NEW FOUND INFO that just popped up NOW n not during all those discussions regarding HECKERT when it was SAID BY ALL REID had the final Say.

I am confused all of a sudden we became Smart???

JMHO n now I am confused

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PHOENIX - Joe Banner regards himself as a fix-it man. A problem-solver.

The guy you call when everything goes to hell. The guy you call when the pipes are leaking and the heat's not working and the toilets are backing up and the bank is sending you a stream of foreclosure notices.

"My strength is in building something, putting something together," the former Eagles president and new Browns chief executive officer said in an interview at the NFL owners' meetings.

"If you were in business, I'd be the guy that you'd bring in to bring something back that was headed in the wrong direction, as opposed to somebody who would continue to operate something that was doing reasonably well.



"That's just what I do better. I recognize that. I think Jeff [Lurie] recognized that. So it was the right time to move on."

Banner stepped down as the Eagles president last June. Less than 2 months later, the Browns' new owner, Jimmy Haslam III, hired him to help fix his hapless franchise, which has had only two winning seasons and made only one playoff appearance in 14 years of expansion existence.

The reason for Banner's exit from the NovaCare Complex depends on whom you ask.

Lurie said at the time that it was all part of a 2-year executive succession plan that was fully endorsed by Banner. Said his friend of 40-plus years was looking for "one more challenge."

Others, including me, believe a bigger reason for his departure was that he lost a power struggle to then head coach and executive vice president of football operations Andy Reid, who would eventually lose a power struggle to a 4-12 record.

Banner said he basically became expendable.

"We had been planning for a while for the promotions of Don [Smolenski] and Howie [Roseman]," he said. "Jeff and I knew they were really good, and that at some point, we would get to the point where there wasn't room for everybody. And that was the reality. That was what happened."

With the Browns, Banner has the complete power he didn't have with the Eagles. Haslam owns the the team, but Banner runs it for him. Everyone reports to him.

"In Philadelphia, Andy reported to Jeff even though we worked really closely together," he said. "It's a fairly significant difference.

"We have a team of people that work together just like we did in Philly and try to collaborate and drive consensus. But the fact that both the head coach [Rob Chudzinski] and general manager [Mike Lombardi] report to me, obviously, is different."

While Banner's role in personnel decisions with the Eagles always was a popular topic of debate, the fact of the matter was that Reid had the final call.

But as the team's chief contract negotiator and salary-cap manager, Banner often was able to influence personnel decisions. Case in point: the 2011 contract stalemate with wide receiver DeSean Jackson.

Banner didn't want to re-sign Jackson, at least not for the money Jackson and his agent, Drew Rosenhaus, thought he was worth.

The immature Jackson let his contract problems influence his play in 2011 and became a locker- room cancer. He caught only four touchdown passes and the Eagles, who went into the season with Super Bowl aspirations, finished 8-8 and didn't even make the playoffs.

Shortly after the season, Roseman replaced Banner as the team's main contract negotiator. He brought a kinder, gentler approach to the negotiating table, re-signing Jackson and All-Pro running back LeSean McCoy, another Rosenhaus client, and signing offensive tackle Todd Herremans and defensive end Trent Coles to extensions.

In fairness to Banner, it should be pointed out that the reason the Eagles were able to sign those players last year, and the reason they went into free agency this year with $40 million in salary-cap space, was because of Banner.

He predicted 2 years ago after the NFL signed its new collective bargaining agreement and extended its television contracts, that the cap would stay flat through at least 2014, and go up only slightly in '15. He structured many of the team's player contracts with that in mind.

In Cleveland, Banner has been hands-on with respect to the Browns' offseason personnel decisions. It is thought that one of the main reasons he hired Lombardi, who once worked for the Eagles and had been working for NFL Network for the last 5 years, was because he won't object to Banner's involvement in personnel matters.

"I'm re-energized," Banner told the Daily News. "It's exciting. It's a big challenge. It's, obviously, totally different than what I was doing at the end in Philly, where we kind of had established things and set things up."

Banner and Lurie appear to have kissed and made up after exchanging some verbal punches earlier this year.

In January, Lurie publicly accused Banner of besmirching Roseman's good name after a report that several Eagles head-coaching candidates, including the guy they eventually hired, Chip Kelly, didn't want to work with Roseman.

The report, by CBS Sports' Jason La Canfora, quoted an unnamed source as saying Roseman was "drunk with power."

Subsequent media stories suggested Banner was La Canfora's source.

"If there are league sources that are really based in Cleveland, that's not right," Lurie said after hiring Kelly. "We see through it all."

Banner responded by suggesting that Lurie might want to find himself a good libel lawyer. "Any implication that I had anything to do with [La Canfora's] story is completely false, outrageous and borders on libel."

But that was then and this is now. Now, Banner said he and Lurie have talked things out and are buds again.

"It's good," he said. "I spent some time talking with him the other day. I was with him after he played golf. We were commiserating about how he played.

"[Our relationship] is different [now]. We were together for 18 to 19 years. Now we talk occasionally, text occasionally. So it's different, but it's friendly.

"We've been friends for 44 years. We've been too close for too long to let a moment like that change the long history that we have."

Banner acknowledged that he wouldn't even be in the NFL today if not for Lurie, who brought his childhood friend to the Eagles with him in 1994 when he bought the team from Norman Braman.

"I'll always be incredibly appreciative of him," Banner said.

Banner said Lurie's hearty recommendation of him to Haslam last summer was instrumental in the latter's decision to hire him as the Browns' CEO.

"If Jeff hadn't given the recommendation he did to Jimmy, I wouldn't be running the Cleveland Browns," he said. "Jimmy said he probably wouldn't have felt comfortable partnering with me if Jeff hadn't said the things to him that he said.

"I understand what people are speculating, [about the relationship between Banner and Lurie]. But the reality is we've been way too close for too long. I'll never not be appreciative of the opportunity Jeff gave me."

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from what i read banner was not the complete power freak that some like to think he was. i just found this interesting.
now let the spinning begin.........

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