DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum All Offseason Moves So Far

I’m keeping this players related and not scheme/coach changes. To be honest I half made this thread to generate discussion and half made it remind me of all the changes that have been made. I think this also gave me some perspective on the eve before the draft what the needs are and could be depending on tradedowns or even trading players.
QB:
Returning: Brandon Weeden, Thaddeous Lewis
New: Jason Campbell- Signed via FA
Gone: Colt McCoy- Traded with a sixth-round pick in exchange for the Niners' fifth- and seventh-round selections, Josh Johnson

Thoughts: For Brandon this is put up or get replaced year, which could occur much earlier than most would think. I think it depends on combination of how Campbell looks and how well is Weeden playing. The good news is that the offense that is being installed seems to him quite a bit better than Shurmur’s WCO. If you look at his stats while in the shotgun there is a noticeable improvement than when in any other formation. With this position being such a question mark is hard to expect big things for the Browns in 2013. I will say the front office did an impressive job of getting something for Colt considering they just wanted to cut him.

I think the Browns will draft a QB in the draft. My guess is rounds 3 or 4 but I would not rule out a QB in round 1. I think the drafted QB replaces Thad, as he was a pet project of Shurmur. So I envision the Browns starting the season with 1) Weeden 2) Campbell 3) Drafted Qb

RB:
Returning: Trent Richardson, Monatrio Hardesty, Chris Ogbonnaya
New: Dion Lewis via trade Emannauel Acho
Thoughts: If there is a scenario where Richardson does not receive the lion share of the carries out of this group then something went truly terribly wrong for the Browns. I cannot say Richardson had a disappointing rookie season mainly because of all the injuries he suffered. Hopefully with a full season to recover from broken ribs, what a tough SOB to play with those, and the knee surgery Browns fans won’t have to argue whether the former #3 overall pick was a disappointment or not.

Since there is talent at the position therefore I doubt the Browns draft a RB. I don’t think the Browns carry 4 RBs, and I think Lewis has more talent and skill and can be a better 3rd down back than Ogbonnaya.

WR:
Returning: Josh Gordon, Greg Little, Travis Benjamin, Josh Cooper, Jordan Norwood, Carlton Mitchell (Signed to a future contract)
New: David Nelson via FA
Gone: Josh Cribbs , Mohamed Massaquoi,
Thoughts: Josh Gordon was worth the 2nd round selection that Heckert used on him, sure it hurts not having one but I highly doubt Gordon would have made to the 2nd round in this draft. Gordon has the raw attributes to be a #1 WR, it will be on the Browns coaching staff to mold him into one. Little played excellent down the stretch and looked like a future #2 WR/possession WR, it seemed that Little success was tied to his concentration. Nelson is an interesting addition as he played well before he was injured. I know he is a bigger WR so I wonder if they envision him as possible #2 with Little moving into the slot or some other combination. Benjamin has speed but it remains to be seen if he can do anything with it.

I know the Browns have been linked to Tavon Austin, however, the only scenario I see that as a possibility is a trade down. I do think some UDFA will be signed to help supplement the position.

TE
Returning: Jordan Cameron, Dan Gronkowski (future Contract)
New: Kellen Davis, Gary Barnidge, via FA
Gone: Benjamin Watson, Alex Smith
Thoughts: This position seems to have the most turnover. Jordan Cameron had a ton of athletic talent and now will be focus of the offense. From what I kind find out Kellen Davis has stonehands and Barnidge was seen more as a blocking TE while he was a panther with Chud. This area is defiantly a question mark.

I could see the Browns adding Tyler Eifert with a tradedown or Zach Ertz if he falls to the 3rd round.

Fullback
Returning: Owen Marecic, Brad Smelly
New: N/A
Thoughts: Owen Marecic has disappointed since he was drafted to replace Smith. Brad Smelly maybe a TE or fullback or truthfully maybe neither. I expected the Browns to sign a big blocking fullback to help emphasize the running game.

I could see the Browns adding a UDFA.

Offensive Line
Returning: Joe Thomas, John Greco, Jason Pinkston, Alex Mack, Shawn Lauvao, Mitchell Schwartz, Ryan Miller, Oniel Cousins, Jarrod Shaw
New: Dominic Alford via FA
Thoughts: Probably the strength of the team. Joe Thomas is a hall of famer, Alex Mack is an all pro center, and Mitchell Swartz was an outstanding rookie RT. I thought the line played much better after Greco was inserted into the starting lineup. I would hope to see given a chance to start again. The guards are the weakest part of the line but overall this is an area of strength.

I would be extremely disheartened if the Browns draft a guard in the top 10. I don’t care how good the guard is, it’s far too simplistic to draft best player available without a consideration of what your team needs. A combination of best player available and team needs should be taken into consideration. I would rather the Browns draft Geno Smith than a guard in the top 10.


Defensive Line
Returning: Phil Taylor, Ahtyba Rubin, Billy Winn, John Hughes, Brian Sanford, Ishmaa'ily Kitchen,
New: Desmond Bryant via FA, Kendrick Adams (Future Contract)
Gone: Frostee Rucker, Jaqua Parker
Thoughts: Rucker was a waste of a contract Parker, while old, did contribute and earned his money. This is an area of strength as well for the Browns. From the reports it seems Taylor would be the Nose with Bryant and Rubin flanking Taylor as DEs. It also seems the Browns have a bunch of depth with Winn and Hughes who should keep the big three well rested.

There is a rumor the Browns are interested in Star Lotulelei. The only way I see this happening is if the Browns trade Rubin, which I highly doubt. I can see drafting a developmental guy but with all the weaknesses on the team I think it would be a waste to use the first rounder of the defensive line considering all the other resources already used to address this area.

Linebackers
Returning: Jabaal Sheard, D’Qwell Jackson, Tank Carder, L.J. Fort, James-Michael Johnson, Adrian Moten, Craig Robertson, Rickey Elmore & Marcus Benard via Future Contract
New: Paul “Freddy” Kruger & Quentin Groves via FA, Ryan Rau via wavier claim
Gone: Chris Gocong, Kaluka Maiava
Thoughts: A large amount of turnover at this position. There are a ton of question marks here. Can Kruger succeed with a big contract and would without Suggs opposite of him? Can Sheard make the transition from 4-3 DE to 3-4 OLB? Will Jackson disappear like he did during the Crennel/Mangini 3-4?

With the all the question marks it easy to see why the Browns would draft an OLB in the first round. I like Dion Jordan for his versatility and Jones for his attack. There is a report the Browns a Dee Milliner or Barkevious Mingo or bust, which would be strange to leak to the media just before the draft. I would really like to see the Browns draft an OLB to create a Nickel that would look like this:
LB: Jordan or Jones or Ansah/Jackson
D-Line: Sheard-Taylor-Bryant- Kruger
Which would put a lot of pass rushers on the field for Horton to scheme with. With all the talent that is available in this draft at OLB it would be a position could probably even address with a tradedown.

Secondary
Returning: Joe Haden, T.J. Ward, Johnson Bademosi, Tashaun Gibson, Eric Hagg, Buster Skrine, Trevin Wade
New: Kevin Barnes, Chris Owens via FA
Gone: Sheldon Brown, Ray Ventrone
Thoughts: On appear this appears to be a weak unit. I haven’t seen Kevin Barnes or Chris Owens play so I don’t know if they have the talent to be a #2 corner. I think Skrine could be an adequate Nickel corner but would be overwhelmed if forced to cover #2 WRs man to man. Ward is good as long as he is healthy which is a big if. Haden is probably a top 5-8 corner in the NFL. FS appears to be up for grabs as well as the #2 corner position.

It makes sense for the Browns to add Dee Milliner or Xavier Rhodes to pair with Joe Haden to fill that #2 corner position. From the way Horton’s defense played while with the Cardinals the corners are put islands fairly regularly and most cover well. I think the 1st round pick of the Browns has to be a Corner or OLB.

Special Teams:
Returning: Chris Yount
New: Brandon Bogotay, Shayne Graham, Spencer Lanning, Jake Schum
Gone: Phil Dawson, Reggie Hodges

It was sad to see Dawson go but he deserves the chance to title chase. Hodges seemed to lose it after he was injured but that was one heck of a run against the Saints. I miss Pontriband as much as the next guy but so far Yount has replaced him and done an admirable job.

I wouldn’t mind seeing the Browns draft Brad Wing in 6th round or so. I watched him in LSU games and he was a fantastic punter. I think he will be drafted in the 4th or 5th round though. I think Graham could do an adequate job. Probably some UDFA will be brought in.

Sorry for the wall of text but I wanted to look at the moves the Browns have made so far in a consolidated form.

Resources:
http://espn.go.com/nfl/team/transactions/_/name/cle/cleveland-browns
http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/team/roster.html
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2013/03/breaking_down_the_cleveland_br_1.html

nice work-- and you gave credit to our resources- that never happens around here

Is that Carlton Mitchell the same guy from a couple of years ago- ???

I look at the secondary and just shake my head, it is so undermanned. I just don't understand how we did not sign a starting DB in the FA market. There were alot of options....

If you really want to see this board go into pandemonium, check back here on Friday night if we don't draft a CB/S in the first 3 rounds.

Good job,, But I don't think Marcus Benard is on the team anymore and another LB that is gone is the guy that came here from New Orleans.. Dang, why can't I remember his name.....

Fujita came from New Orleans.

Marcus Benard actually went to the Patriots this off-season,

Nice work...got to run so no in depth post. Carlton Mitchell n possibly others. All I know is the Browns Web site keeps a pretty up to date ROSTER - No Mitchell there I doubt he is on our team.


http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/team/roster.html

If its not on there I don't think they are Browns. JMHO

There were reports that we signed him to a futures contract in January.

Yeah, here it is:

http://espn.go.com/nfl/team/transactions/_/name/cle/cleveland-browns


January 8, 2013 Signed WR Carlton Mitchell to a reserve/future contract.
January 6, 2013 Signed LB Ricky Elmore and LB Marcus Benard to reserve/future contracts.
January 4, 2013 Signed DL Kendrick Adams, TE Dan Gronkowski and DB Kent Richardson to reserve/future contracts.


I forgot that we signed Benard to a futures deal too, I thought that he signed with the pats for some reason.

Well, he is listed as a member of the Patriots with an active contract for 2013 on Spotrac.

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/new-england-patriots/marcus-benard/

He's also listed as on the roster on the Patriots official page.

http://www.patriots.com/team/roster.html

Wow... very nice write-up. Thorough and well-reasoned.

This may be my one and only chance to be a 'detail nazi,' so I'll take my shot here:
Marecic replaced Lawrence Vickers. Terelle Smith was the player whom Vickers replaced.

(I'm only bringing this up because I was so steamed at the Vickers departure....)

Nice piece, Loki

Good work!

From my point of view you have aptly shown how major investments were made to this point on our D at both the LB'er position as well as the DL. When you transition as we are, those kind of moves are necessary. I applaud the signings that were made in that regard.

So where is the weakest link on our D? That question has a very obvious answer. It's within the secondary. Now I do like the idea of a more attacking style of defense but two huge questions are the fly in the ointment.

1. Verse has done a pretty good job of outlining all of the different looks, formations and various blitzing packages that come with such a hybrid 3-4 Horton runs. But at the same time, it's a very complicated D to learn to run.

2. We have a lot of guys that have never been in a defense that even resembles anything close to this and how some of our current roster will transition to this new D are big question marks.

With those two questions looming, it's my contention that although this D is something I look forward to seeing once it is a finished product, it could easily be two to three years down the road before it is what could be considered a finished product.

That being said, I don't feel we will be successful for a while at being a consistant force at getting regular pressure on opposing QB's right away. I think over the next couple of years we will see roster changes while players we currently have that do not transition well to the new D are replaced. Only at that time will we see a top flight D as it pertains to an attacking style of D that does get the constant pressure we all wish to see.

That's why I feel going the route of an OLB in the first round will not produce a player that will make an immediate impact in the eventual results we're looking for. It's my contention that a CB would be the more advantageous route to go in the short term until we see exactly what our needs really are in the front seven. If Sheard does make the transition well to OLB, then we really don't need to address that position for now.

Much like you, I feel there were an unusual amount of what I would consider possible #2 CB's on the FA market and they went at reasonable value compared to the past and was confused as to why we didn't sign one of them.

The signing of Nelson is also a signing I like under the condition he manages to stay healthy. I've seen the kid play healthy and very much like what I saw! I feel the fact we didn't go after a guy like Wallace is at least some indication this FO feels there's a chance we may be okay at the position moving forward with Little and Gordon.

At QB? It's anybody's guess at this point as to what our FO sees there. While not a lot was gained in the trade to San Fran, at least something was and I never imagined even that was possible. So my hat is off to this FO for making that happen. We replaced a guy who didn't have enough arm for this system for a guy who fits the system much better that is even more experienced than the guy we traded away. To me that's a win/win for the Browns.

However, in the past it's been widely reported that Lombardi has zero faith in Weeden. So for all any of us really know, our first round pick may be devoted to a QB even though I do see that as unlikely, the possibility does exist.

I agree with you strongly about the G position. We do need at least one better run blocking G. And much like you, I would never draft a G unless it would be very late in the first round and even then, that would still hurt. I've seen very few G's in any draft I would invest that high of a draft pick on.

In regards to our roster, I like what this FO has done so far in their signings. While some I feel won't do much for us such as the TE and RB signings, every team needs competition and every team does such signings so I see no reason to fault that.

I think we are better off and have had a much better FA signing period than in years past.

j/c

Well either way you want to slice it, this is probably one of the most active free agencies and offseason subjects (Haslam, Banner, complete overhaul from owner down, etc) and so forth in a long time - it'll be one to remember...

I am just going to keep my mouth shut on replying to this until I see the product on the field. I am not eating anymore crow. There is hope though, we finally have a credible offensive coordinator, and a relentless defensive coordinator that has some weapons, and likely will have more after the draft, to load up and fire away with.

Good post Pit....I pretty much agree.


As with anything, I guess it can't all be done at once. At some point you have to balance, counterbalance, pick and choose.


I pretty much see the O with all the parts except a guard and a question at QB. The question at QB will be largely answered by game 6-7. I don't draft a QB this year. I let it play out with Weeden, Campbell, and Lewis.

Weeden made some strides last year, and we all would expect him to continue to make strides. If he does, we have a guy we can work with. If not, we have a middle of the road starter in Campbell and he can bridge the gap to the next QB hope we bring in. With the questions we have at the position, we are in pretty good shape. We have a 2nd year guy with some upside and a vet who is proven to be decent most weeks and young enough to fill the void for a few seasons if it takes that.


We lost out on our top corner target.....it happens, so we brought in a few guys with talent but little experience.

We also have the draft. The good thing about this draft is there are solid options at the corner position. We can get one by staying put or even moving back a few slots.


My hope is this is a defensive draft. I would like to see one offensive player drafted...a guard in round 3 or 4....other than that, go D all the way unless we elect to select a kicker at some point.


If we like a kicker, go for it, but I would carry 2 this year. You know as well as I do the first miss is going to create a hell storm....people forget Dawson missed some kicks in his career. Our new vet can handle the pressure of the boo's, maybe a new star in the making can't.


Remember when Cockroft was drafted? He and Groza were on the team at the same time for a season. That was done for a reason, and we have the same reason today.

Sometimes you have to break the news slowly to fans. Imagine had we cut Groza, put in Cockroft and let the fans boo him off the field with every miss? Don might have had a 1-2 year career rather than being as good as it gets.


I do agree, it helped that he was a punter as well. That was the bridge.

In retrospect.....maybe Steve Cox was the bridge, then Cockroft....at any rate, I think you understand the point.

Quote:

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I pretty much see the O with all the parts except a guard and a question at QB. The question at QB will be largely answered by game 6-7. I don't draft a QB this year. I let it play out with Weeden, Campbell, and Lewis.

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My thoughts, exactly.

Quote:

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My hope is this is a defensive draft. I would like to see one offensive player drafted...a guard in round 3 or 4....other than that, go D all the way unless we elect to select a kicker at some point.

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I think this is the way we go as well. The only way I differ is that I doubt we'll select a kicker. But this FO has no track record to go on, so who knows?

Great post Loki...
I was not familiar with "future contracts" Here is what I found

So just what are these “Reserve/Futures” contracts that you hear about in the offseason so much?

Basically, when a player is signed to “reserve/futures” contracts means they are being signed for the upcoming season even though that season does not officially begin until the official start of the league’s new year as outlined by the NFL. Only players who were not on any NFL team’s active roster when the previous season ended are eligible for these types of contracts. If they were under contract, then they would remain so until the league’s new year starts. Players who were on practice squads at the end of the season are eligible to sign with any team. Hence the reason that you see many practice squad players being signed by their current team for the upcoming year to a reserve/futures contract. That way the team can continue to work with a player they’re familiar with and hopefully get them ready for an eventual roster spot on game day.

So I guess that Mitchell,Benard,Adams will be Browns at the start of the official NFL Season, if I'm following this correctly

Looking at your break down of positions, it seem obvious to me CornerBack is our biggest need. How we field that position is still in question, many scenarios in the draft. Can't wait till Thursday to see our next step to more Rookies being Browns!
We are intact with our young Browns Team

Correct.
Sine Benard was released by the Pats and Mitchell was released by the Cowboys prior to the end of the post season they were free to sign anywhere.

The future/ reserve agreement allows them to be at the facilities (if they so chose to use them) in the offseason.

I do not beleive it is binding after the start of the league season though, so they should be free to sign with whomever they can at this point. Though that may have changed with the collective bargaing agreement. Perhaps there is now a later date in place for that.

Either way, saying they are "under contract" would be a bit of a stretch, if ya know what I mean.

Quote:

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I think this is the way we go as well. The only way I differ is that I doubt we'll select a kicker. But this FO has no track record to go on, so who knows?

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I don't think we will either since we just signed Graham, but there is a outside chance. All I am saying is I won't be upset if we use a late rounder on a kicker.

not impressed.
first losses frostee rucker,gocong,and brown.
plusses kruger the dl from oakland= defense we are weakened.
ray horton=dick jauron arizona 1-6 verses playoff teams minus defense.
switching a proven middle of the road de to linebacker biggest mistake of all..
run defense horton defense was 28 in run defense there will no attact because teams will simply run on 3and 4yards to go.
plusses tj ward look for him to thrive then demand a 10,000,000 per year contract.
chud one winning season as a offensive coordinator draw.
norv turner versus brad childress t offense.
in conclusion a top 5 pick next year this offseason f

Man that little rant sounds familiar ......... and the writing style seems familiar ......... now if I could just place it ......... oh wait, I know .......

Your next name should be bounce ...... because you get bounced ..... then bounce back in ..... get bounced again .......

thank you have good day are saying kruger is better than dumervil?
skrine better than talib keep it simple yes or no

first of all this team is still weaker than december 30th period thanks for the smirk.

Troll!

you most not no very much it is a shame you cant talk football

can you tell the truth here without being labeled a troll?

Only A Troll worries about being called a troll ... JMHO

excellent typing can you get me some ribbon?I hope you understand I notice that you cant answer my question.

said like a true buckeye are you saying krueger is better than dumerville?

my days with the browns go back to leroy kelley I have earned the right to critisize