DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2013 NFL Season NFL Draft (2013) Final Draft Thoughts

Just get it right.

With all the regime changes that have transpired each draft has had "the brains" in charge.

I have tried to remain optimistic with each new group. The results however have not been good. The win column reflects the story.

So now Banner/Lombardi take their swing. Haslam has his own laundry to clean.

Get impact players. And for the love of Mike please find a quarterback who can run the show at a high level for the next 15 years.

Here is my questions:

If we trade down, all other things being equal, do you prefer a 2013 2nd round pick or 2014 1st round pick?

2013. We need help now. The extra year the pick/player is here means more experience and the faster he'll become what we want.

I think the only teams that can push picks to the follow year are ones that are already contenders (Pats). Not that they don't want them, its that they don't really need them to get to the playoffs. We do.

On WKNR thi morning they wee talking about a mock draft (Can't remember which) where they had us trading down with the Vikings getting#23 and a 2nd and drafting Geno Smith I would think if we went that low it would cost them a 2014 1st also ... JMHO

I was hoping we get it wrong.

My final draft thought is this:

I have never seen a worse pool of talent coming into the NFL in my 30 years of fandom.

Juxtapose that with one of the better draft classes in recent memory in 2014.

I know for a fact that 5 underclassmen would go before anyone in this draft:

Jadevon Clowney
Teddy Bridgewater
Johnny Manziel
Tajh Boyd
Marquise Lee

And there may be a few more that could be debated.

I would do everything in my power to stockpile 2014 first rounders at the potential expense of the 2013 season.

I ultimately want to see the Browns win the Superbowl.

The talent to do it hits shore next year.

I agree 100%. Since this isn't the draft to get the QB of the future. Fill up the rest of the roster with quality players and then get the QB next year.

Strongly disagree with you.

This draft is not very top heavy with can't miss guys, but there are some very talented players in this draft. Especially at the OT position, there could be 3 potential franchise left tackles there.

The problem is, this is a weak draft for QB's, WR'ers and RBs, so it's being looked down upon heavily. I don't think there is an immediate offensive star from this class.

My final draft thoughts:

1) If we don't get a 2nd Round pick via trade, then I'm automatically dropping the grade of our overall draft. Our FO has to know that we need help and just sitting on our picks as it is between #6 and #68 is unacceptable.

2) Avoid drafting a QB in the 1st and 2nd Rounds. This isn't a money issue to me. This is about talent. If we waste a a 1st/2nd on a QB then I'm automatically dropping the overall draft grade. We have to build around the QB first and we have to strengthen the D.

3) Make that reasonable splash via trade. Shock the football world (in a good way) and make BSPN po'd.

4) Just get it right. I agree with the OP.

This is a Defensive and a OL heavy draft. There are not any K and P even touted in this years draft. This is the year to grab the franchised CB. FS OLB ILB DE OG that we so need. There is even only 4 real TE in this draft. Next year there will be 15 QB and WR we can grab. It is a matter of where the Priorities are.
next year our draft is normal 1,2,3,4,5,6,7

Can someone please tell me the point of this thread?

My final mock draft:

1. Barkevious Mingo, OLB, LSU

3. Blidi Wreh-Wilson, CB, UCONN

4. Josh Evans, FS, Florida

5. William Gholston, DE, Michigan State

5. Michael Williams, TE, Alabama

6. Chris Gragg, TE, Arkansas

7. Quinn Sharp, P, Oklahoma State

Me i would much rather keep the #6 pick and draft a defensive stud at CB or OLB than trade down and pick up two good but not stud players.

The Browns need to come away with a difference maker, someone that offensive coordinators have to game plan against.

Millner, Ziggy, Mingo one will still be on the board at #6 and that is who the Browns need to draft.

.

Worst NFL Draft in past 10 Years +

There are always a variety of opinions about the NFL Draft. Opinions are like, well, you know. But a high-ranking team executive I trust implicitly says this: "Worst draft in past 10 years or longer."

"When we look back at this draft in five or 10 years," said the team executive, "we might view it as one of the worst we've seen in some time."

What I'm hearing repeatedly from some team personnel men, as the draft gets closer and the honesty increases, is that this draft is subpar. Extremely subpar. Few team personnel want to say anything publicly about the paucity of talent out of fear of hearing from the NFL. There's this thought process that if you criticize the draft, you risk the ire of the NFL; the league doesn't want anyone publicly criticizing the draft out of fear of injuring television ratings.

While it's generally acknowledged that teams can get solid players in later rounds of this draft, the quality of drafts are about franchise players. The exceptional. When a draft has a Manning or Elway or Marino or Newton or RG3, that is when scouts and league personnel marvel and smile.

The problem with this draft, says the general manager, is it possibly lacks two important qualities: franchise quarterbacks and large swaths of impact players. There will be more than a few solid players, this GM predicts, but not a large number of great ones.

"There will be 13-15 players picked in the first round that are true first-rounders," he said. "That's a fairly low number."

Last year, according to the general manager, there were 20-23 players who were true first-rounders. That's about average.

Quarterbacks shape a draft the way they shape teams. This general manager believes that none of the quarterbacks is an actual first-round talent. I find that borderline silly as Geno Smith certainly is; but this GM is not alone in his thinking. It does say a lot about this quarterback class when Ryan Nassib could be a top-10 pick. One scout called him Ryan NaLeaf, a totally unfair comparison to the epic bust, Ryan Leaf. Unfair, but kind of funny.

Many millions of people have been wrong about the draft -- including the experts, the men who do the drafting. Maybe this is a case of that. But I think this is mostly right. I think we'll look back at this draft and wince.

I hope I'm wrong, but I get the feeling the Browns are going to trade up (I hope I'm wrong as that would be a huge mistake).

We better not be trading up for anybody in this draft. Period.

I'd only look back at a draft and wince, if the Browns don't have any picks.

Yuck, not a fan of moving up. And the cost...a 2nd rounder, plus probably a 4th. I wonder if they're not comfortable with Sheard after the mini-camp and are considering unloading him?

Regardless, move down, not up please.

It's not about the money, it's about the talent or pick(s) we'd have to give up. We're short in both areas.

Well, the only thing I can say at this point is

In Lombardi We Trust! Said no man ever...

I think I'm getting lit up by about 830 tomorrow in case it all goes south. Between the Geno/EJ rumors, the trade up rumors, I don't know what to think. And while you can't believe anything these last hours, these guys sure as hell are making me nervous.

One other final thought:

The biggest holes on our starting units in order:

CB2: Buster Skrine

FS: Tashaun Gipson
TE: Jordan Cameron
LG: John Greco
QB: Brandon Weeden
WOLB: Jabaal Sheard

The space was intentional. Buster Skrine is awful. I really hope we come away from the draft with a guy we can plug in and play be it Dee Milliner or another one of the top 5 or so guys.

I also will point out that I hope we don't trade up for a WOLB when I want to see Sheard fail first.

I think a lot of people on here hate skrine... he's not a bad player. He's just not starting quality but makes excellent nickel/dime DB, and tackles very well for a DB.

Milliner or trade down

My final thoughts .....?

No one outside of the Browns brain trust really knows what they are planning. There has been plenty of speculation of them doing just about everything and anything. I think that there has been a lot of very carefully placed misinformation spread throughout the media.

The Browns could be staying put .... they could be moving up ... they could be moving down ...... no one (except them) is quite sure. I think that's probably good if they want to get the best value in a fairly flat draft.

I do bet that there will be people who are happy, and other rabidly PO'd by whatever the Browns do tomorrow.

Haven't spent months watching tape like last year (I really really overdid it then).

Just praying we don't take Gino Smith (or any other 1st Round QB), or Tyler Eifert (really? who came up with this one)

Other opinions:

Lotulelei and Ansah are beasts -- I think Lotulelei still goes top 10 for sure (and maybe top 5). I think too many draftnik's degrade him for a heart issue that turned into nothing. I'm not sure where either of these guys fit on a Browns defense, but I'd love to see them both in Orange and Brown.

Floyd was very productive in college, but I worry a bit about his skillset translating to the NFL, in my opinion he does an excellent job taking advantage of blocking mistakes - but isn't going to overpower, or get around, a technically sound OL.

Mingo is a much better fit (scheme wise) - and I think he's clearly the best pass rushing OLB in the class. Part of what makes him great though is his first step, something you might lose a bit of if he's not down on the line.

Not a big fan of Dion Jordan -- sure Oregon lines him up against WRs, but he's not doing that in the NFL, so how does that affect his evaluation? Jordan has almost no array of serious pass rush moves at this point. He gets a lot of credit for being in a scheme that makes him look more unique (faster) than he really is.

I like Milliner a lot, wouldn't mind having him at 6 -- on the other hand he's not Patrick Peterson, or even Claiborne. That said, having two solid corners allows you to do a ton schematically with your defense - and I think Milliner has a high floor. I like Xavier Rhodes, who seems to be sliding quite a bit.

Jonathan Cooper has more upside than Chance Warmack, but Warmack is probably a better scheme fit. They are both extremely solid - though I'm not sure if they are worth it at 6. I liked DeCastro more than either. Also, if I was picking #6 and was drafting for our line, I'd rather grab the faller out of Joeckel/Fisher and try to move Schwartz to LG. Would be a position change for him, but I think that makes a stronger line than picking either OG.

Please god, not Tyler Eifert. I think that's all I need to say (I don't hate him, I just like about 25 guys better).

Same with Geno Smith near the top of the first -- blah. He's worse in every respect than an RG3 type, and doesn't really seem to be a good fit for a deep-ball offense like ours. I'm not sure if we need to go QB this year, but if so, I think the value picks are Landry Jones around the late 3rd/early 4th, or Tyler Bray in the 4th. I wouldn't mind EJ Manuel in a mid-second tradeup.

'Twas the Night before Draft-mas...


By Mike Krupka
OBR Contributing Writer
Posted Apr 24, 2013



These are the 9 picks. . . That I would write long letters about to Joe, Chud, Ray and “Mick”!

4 Comments

1. Dion Jordan: Dion Jordan is my “Official Red Ryder Carbine-Action Two-Hundred-Shot Range Model Air Rifle!” And yes he’s still my most coveted player even if I shoot my eye out!

He is what I consider a Type B player: Exceptional Physical Talent - Dion will be a starter in his first season and reach Pro Bowl status when fully developed; he has rare athletic ability and position skills; is a top 5 - 10 selection; but his college circumstances/system limited his production in that he wasn’t asked to focus on rushing the passer and was used often in coverage schemes.

At 6'6", 248 pounds, there's no doubt the potential and the talent that exist within Dion Jordan. I think he is the best OLB prospect in the class due to his versatility. His athleticism, speed, fluidity in space and ability to cover the TE or WR in the slot (and dominate them) will be hard for the Browns to resist if he’s available at #6.

Consider also that Jordan is only in his 2nd season as a pass rushing DE --- similar to the short learning curve of Ziggy Ansah. Jordan’s roots are as a wide receiver and this skill set and understanding extend itself in coverage packages against opposing WR or TE. His length, speed, and explosion allow him to rush the passer whiling gaining the edge better than any prospect this year.

Jordan has a relentless motor and he's always flying to the ball, even 20 or 30 yards downfield. He has extremely active hands and has shown a good spin and swim move, which will provide a strong base skill set to build from at the next level. He really can do it all and in the type of scheme defensive coach Ray Horton wants to execute, Jordan could quickly reach Pro Bowl levels and give opposing offensive coordinators and head coaches’ nightmares.

2. Barkevious Mingo: I am banking on Dion Jordan being gone by the time the Browns first round “present” is delivered at #6 so I go directly down my Wish List and find a player who will make the opposing QBs say “FUDGE” - Barkevious Mingo.

He is also what I consider a Type B player: Exceptional Physical Talent – Barkevious will be a starter in his first season and reach Pro Bowl status when fully developed; has rare athletic ability and position skills; is a top 5 - 10 selection; but his college circumstances/system limited his production in that he was asked to play contain most the time and only really being unleashed in the bowl game vs. Clemson.

Mingo has the skill set and athletic qualities to be a dominating pass rusher at the next level. He has a good stock of pass rush moves that he will be able to develop and strengthen. Mingo does a good job of disrupting passing lanes when he is unable to get to the QB. He shows good hand usage but will need to develop better technique.

His burst off the line is elite and is undoubtedly the best in this class. In terms of pure pass rusher ability, I believe Mingo is the best prospect in the draft. Where he doesn’t get credit is that he can move in space nearly as fluidly and quickly as Dion Jordan and while I am not one to put my stock in a players’ combine metrics, his do tell this story. The reason his production numbers were low was because he was never asked to just rush the passer, rather play “robber” most the time.

3. Tavon Austin: If I can’t get my “Official Red Ryder Carbine-Action Two-Hundred-Shot Range Model Air Rifle”, I at least want to get some high octane fuel to make Norv Turner’s sleigh fly!

Austin’s speed and explosion jump off the tape and scream “instant mismatch” and “game changer”. I currently have him rated as my third highest player, taking a small recent jump up from the number four spot in my Browns specific board. In a recent discussion with my brother, Robert Krupka, he was also high on Austin: “Lots of teams would love to add that type of weapon and I think the 49ers might be trying to get ahead of the Rams to grab him.”

I consider him a Type C & I Player: Physically Deficient Star / Speed Player – He is similar to a Type B in that he will be a starter in his first season and reach Pro Bowl status when fully developed; has rare athletic ability and position skills; is a top 5 - 10 selection; while his size is a deficiency, his production and abilities help him overcome that and his final grade cannot exceed his physical grade.

Many sources have confirmed the Browns would be open to discussing and exploring trade talks for the #6 pick. I wouldn’t even need to if he was the player I wanted, as I would be fine if they picked him at #6 but Joe Banner has stated that in the event they trade back, he would want fair market value for the swap and the confidence that the total value they would add would be greater than that of the pick lost. Adding Austin helps that trade equation considerably, we would need to ensure we only drop back slightly, because he could literally and figuratively be gone!

Tavon Austin is electric with the ball in his hands and is an offensive coordinators dream. He can be used all over the field and instantly creates speed and coverage mismatches for defenses. Slot, X, Z, motion, pistol, reverse, bubble screen, pitch out, direct snap, option, hand off, slant, curl, post, out or "Hail-Mary"… the combination of Austin's versatility and speed with Trent Richardson's thunder is beyond exciting to consider.

4. Jonathan Cyprien: If The Red Ryder Bee-bee gun is Ralphie’s ultimate present, Jonathan Cyprien is the old man’s leg lamp.

I consider Cyprien a Type D Player: Pro Bowl Player – He has all the same components as a Type B player like Jordan and Mingo, but his athletic abilities are “only” near theirs. Cyprien will be drafted and be a starter in this league. As soon as first started to watch his film I had a feeling like I was watching a special talent.

I feel Cyprien has the ability to play either safety spot, showing the range, instincts, anticipation, hard hitting, and ball hawking ability to roam the secondary if needed and cause opposing QB’s and WR’s to wake up late at night sweating, a la the current Dwane Wade vs Kevin Durant Gatorade commercial. After further review, I have him back where I originally slotted him, as my highest safety in this draft class for the Browns. I would be beyond ecstatic if somehow we could land him via a trade back in the second round.

For me it would be like finding that stocking stuffer that you totally passed up in the morning, only to be reminded that it was there and not to forget about it; diving in and being overwhelmingly surprised and elated.

5. Robert Alford: If I were the Bumpuses’ dogs, Alford would be my figurative turkey, the object I would do anything to get, even if I have to wait for a while for the perfect opening to do so.

I firmly believe that when I watch the type for Alford that I am watching a future Type D Player: Pro Bowl Player – Alford owns all the same skills as a Type B player, but his athletic abilities and production are “only” near theirs. He’s a top 5 CB on my board and I would be thrilled with him in the 2nd round in a trade back where Cyprien was already off the board or somehow in the 3rd round. He would be what I consider an instant starter opposite Joe Haden and would give our defense the second corner back we need at an excellent value.

He is strong. Like really strong for a defensive back, tossing up 17 reps at the combine – and it shows on film consistently in his ability to play press coverage; consistently jam WR at the LOS; or beat blocks and find the play. He is very fluid and has a great back pedal with smooth, quick footwork. His hips are loose and he can flip them and run very well. His speed and explosiveness show up on film and helped him make up any lost space. His 4.39 second 40 yard dash at the combine only confirmed what I saw on the tape: he’s very fast. He also impressed with a 132” broad jump showing his explosiveness, as well as a 40” vertical. It’s those athletic qualities that I saw in him while watching him defend the pass and break up plays, and snag 4 INT’s this season.

We’ve all been bad here and there, but another lump of coal? Please spare me these picks!

1. Dee Milliner: Please no, not at six! I would rather sit there with a red bar of soap in my mouth for the entire offseason. At six, this pick would make me say “FUDGE!”

I consider Dee Milliner to be a Type D Player: Pro Bowl Player – He has all the same components as a Type B player, but his athletic abilities are “only” near theirs. Meaning that while he may be the best cornerback in his class, he is not elite. Many fans will take this that I don’t feel he will be good or that I don’t feel the Browns need a starting cornerback. These are both false.

I don’t see the value in drafting a Type D cornerback with the sixth overall pick when I feel confident that I can find a similar type player in the second or third rounds. Meaning, I feel that I can find the Browns a starting #2 cornerback at a better value and not spend the sixth overall pick on a similar player.

Watching Milliner’s film was fun. The kid can play and is fast. However, he seems to struggle catching the ball and missed several interceptions during game play, which also showed up in his field drills at the combine. He was never asked to back pedal, which could expose him early and often at the next level. He also tends to dive at ball carriers instead of breaking down and tackling with technique.

2. Ryan Mallett: This is like a completely different movie, a completely dumb movie, in fact this is the type of movie you get up and walk out on.

I consider Mallett a Type E player: An Under-Achiever – A player that is usually attractive to teams due to his physical abilities but lacks overall competitiveness; is usually a coach killer; “buyer beware” and “boom or bust” player. May have mental lapses in concentration or have off the field concerns as well.

If we are associated with Mallett’s name on draft day, and he ends up as a Brown, this means that we undoubtedly had to forfeit considerable assets to do so. I dislike this idea tremendously given how he grades out. This also means that Weeden likely won’t get a fair shot to start in a new system that fits his style and strengths. That means the Browns would have wasted a first round pick on Weeden and then wasted assets and / or picks in the trade for Mallett, ultimately netting the Browns 2 similar players.

Give Weeden a year with Norv Turner. If he doesn’t perform this year, go all in next year on your franchise guy, whoever that is.

Yeah, it’s ok to say it. . . what a lump of coal!

3. Jarvis Jones: Jarvis Jones is like Scut Farkus. He appears to be tough but deep down he’s nothing like you think he is.

I consider Jarvis Jones to be a Type D Player: Pro Bowl Player – He has all the same components as a Type B player, but his athletic abilities are “only” near theirs but there is a medical concern. Meaning that while he may be among the best linebackers in his class, he is not elite by any means.

The most important reason I do not want to consider Jarvis Jones with the sixth pick is because of his medical concerns. Say what you want, but the most medical grade are from team doctors and we will soon see if their concerns impact where he lands.

The next reason why I want nothing to do with Jarvis Jones because I do not think he fits the scheme here in Cleveland as a 3-4 OLB due to his inability and ineffectiveness to disengage from blockers. He struggled with this at Georgia and I think his production was more a function of his hustle and the scheme than it was anything else. Jones is not an elite athlete and I don’t believe he has the frame to add considerable weight to be an every-down linebacker at the next level in the 3-4 but perhaps he can find a good, productive home somewhere in a 4 -3.

4. Matt Barkley: Lastly, Matt Barkley, aka the Pink Bunny Costume. Of all things I have to find on draft day, a pink bunny costume would be pretty damn bad and outright embarrassing with the #6 pick.

I’ll keep it brief. Matt Barkley may well be a good NFL QB in time, but I just don’t see how he will overcome his physical limitations or more importantly, how he would fit into a vertical offense here in Cleveland? He is a perfect West Coast QB, a game manager, a “point guard” but not an elite talent that will lead you to the Super Bowl and help your team pick up chunks of yardage vs. NFL secondaries.

Much like several past Cleveland QB’s the intangibles are there: smart; good footwork; charismatic; huddle presence / leader; likeable; and good throwing on the run. But then you turn on the tape, you see a QB who ran a pro-style offense, with an average arm, who struggled with accuracy while essentially passing to 2 NFL WR’s and not being able to step up in the pocket consistently or avoid the pass rush using his athleticism.

In fact if we draft Matt Barkley at #6 I will wear a Pink Bunny costume and take a picture of me in it and use that picture as my new OBR avatar until next year’s draft-mas.



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