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We better not be trading up for anybody in this draft. Period.
I agree with that, even though I LOVE Ansah...if we trade up to get him it all depends on the compensation. I could see us dangling a player like Rubin or Sheard for Ansah
Lombardi is a size/speed and projectability sucker, so Ansah makes sense and is a rare player where I'd agree with him. Still, burning a future 2nd/3rd or Rubin/Sheard for him seems like a lateral move at best, but if we really move UP, then Ansah is the only option I could at least stomach, depending on the compensation of course
#gmstrong
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Please NO Dumb moves....
Yes we need to upgrade TE but not with the # 6 pick....
Yes we need a guard but look carefully at whom you pick, does Warmack really fit Chuds philosphy on offence or does a pulling guard for screen like cooper be a better fit, Warmack is a road grader nothing bad about him but can he do what we wanna do, and do we go guard at # 6
Everybody says trade down at # 6 I'm not so sure, Scouts are saying Dee if he's there could be the next island corner, .....do we really wanna trade out of the pick and not have a chance to draft him, ? why do we want 2-3 more picks to fill holes we've been tring to fill for years and pass up on talent, maybe we stop trading for possible talent and actullay start picking talent, Yes it might be just one but atleast we got talent.....
Lets be smart...NO QB ( Unless we trade Weeden)
Biggest needs
1. CB
2. Pass Rush from LB postion
3. Guard
4. Safety
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Trading Up??? Definitely not excited about the reports of us trading up to #3. Don't want to trade up from 6. But I'm not opposed to trading-up into the 2nd or 3rd.
Banner could use some of our late-round picks (or Sheard) to get us into the late 2nd or get an add'l 3rd rounder. As long as he's not trading future picks.
If he can keep #6 and find a route to get 1 extra pick in the 60-110 range, I'd be quite pleased. especially if we land a quality FS in the process.
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I was hoping we get it wrong.
You're so cool.
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My final draft thoughts:
1) If we don't get a 2nd Round pick via trade, then I'm automatically dropping the grade of our overall draft. Our FO has to know that we need help and just sitting on our picks as it is between #6 and #68 is unacceptable.
2) Avoid drafting a QB in the 1st and 2nd Rounds. This isn't a money issue to me. This is about talent. If we waste a a 1st/2nd on a QB then I'm automatically dropping the overall draft grade. We have to build around the QB first and we have to strengthen the D.
3) Make that reasonable splash via trade. Shock the football world (in a good way) and make BSPN po'd.
4) Just get it right. I agree with the OP.
You are either setting yourself up to get mad or looking for a reason to go off on the FO. Sheesh man.
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Some people like to type on a regular basis. Opinions matter; this is "pre-game" jitters chatting for the real kickoff tonight. The board vets are waiting on that to get all FO intolerant again, not so much here pre-game. 
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
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I do have a few final thoughts of my own: --I agree w/Held that this draft class is not very good. I keep hearing about how deep it is, blah, blah, blah. But I don't see the all the value picks that were in last year's class. Last year's draft class was one of the greatest of all-time. It had star power at the top. It had multiple QBs who were really worth a top pick, it had an incredible amount of value from the middle of the first round all the way into round 4. Heck, we even got a guy like Winn after that, and I always thought he could play. This year's class doesn't have quality at the top. I do think it's good for OL and secondary help. But, I think the words that pop into my head w/almost every guy in this draft are "has question marks..." --Heck, I think one of the safest picks in this draft is Eifert. The thing is that it would be foolish to take him that high. Perhaps in a trade down. But, there are problems w/this draft when perhaps the safest pick in the entire draft is a TE. --If we stay at 6, I would take Milliner. My next favorite player at that spot is Jordan. I think he has a lot of question marks, though. Like I said......it seems almost all these guys do. I thought Milliner was safe, but the injury thing raises some questions. --I am a little confused by almost everyone [posters and prognosticators] talking about how we really, really need to take an OLBer. I think we addressed that huge need for an edge rusher when we signed Kruger. I also think that Sheard could actually be more effective at rushing the QB and getting into the backfield in our new defense than he did in the 4-3. I think his lack of weight caused him to get worn down at times, as he was always going up against bigger, stronger RTs. I think standing up and being outside w/fewer run support responsibilities will free him up to make more plays. --All of this year's OLBers scare me. They all have question marks. Legitimate question marks. --I wonder why more people don't think we need another ILBer? I think Ogletree is a superb linebacker. He is very physical. He runs great sideline to sideline. And when he gets there, he explodes on the ball carrier. He makes good calls. He is a leader on the field. But sheesh, what a bonehead off the field? I wouldn't mind if we traded down and took this guy. I'm serious. I think he is going to be way more productive than all the guys rated higher than him. --I really hope we trade w/SF. They have so many picks. I think they might be generous in terms of compensation. Of course, all the other teams know this, as well. But, if we trade down w/SF and get a guy like Eifert, Ogletree, or Kevin Minter and also accumulate more picks, it would be a dream come true. --If we don't draft Milliner and especially if we get more picks, I would be very happy w/us taking Hayden, the cb from Houston. I don't think his injury --while serious at the time--will be a concern in the NFL. I like this kid's talent. Good speed and size. Good positioning. --My final thought of this post: I am already preparing myself to try and show some patience. I know that no matter what we do, there will be a slew of guys coming on here to complain and rip the new FO. I mean.....NO MATTER WHAT WE DO!!! And to make things worse, as I mentioned earlier, you can find questions [which become complaints] about just about every freaking player in this draft. Gee, that is going to be fun. 
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I know that no matter what we do, there will be a slew of guys coming on here to complain and rip the new FO. I mean.....NO MATTER WHAT WE DO!!!
Always.
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How can I say this..this is going to be a interesting evening if the Browns get to do what they are attempting to do... interesting to find out who they are targeting..man I would love to do a mock, but I never can with tradedowns..
But secondary help is a priority ..
Last edited by Attack Dawg; 04/25/13 08:48 AM.
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I don't think we trade from 6. I think we want to, but I don't think a deal for both sides is really there.
I think if Mike Lombardi and Joe Banner can hit on that first pick, people will back off a little bit on him. The media has buried these 2 before a game has even been played under their control.
I think they go pretty hard at trying to get back into the second round. I think the first way they would want to would be to trade from 6, but as I said, I don't think it happens. They may have to get creative.
I don't want to say I hate Dee Miliner, because I don't, but I only think they should take him if they are really really high on him. Not because there is a gaping hole at the position and he happens to be there. I think if you're drafting a CB in the top 10, he better be in the class of Revis, Haden, Sherman. I'm not so sure he is. He'll be a good pro but I think the dropoff to Rhodes and Taylor isn't much if any. Basically what I'm saying, go BPA with this first pick, outside of the offensive tackle position.
I'm not buying the Geno Smith talk all of a sudden. I think there's an 80% chance this pick is either Jordan or Mingo.
I like Geno Smith a lot, I don't think he's a good fit for us. I'm hoping for him he ends up in the right situation.
My dream scenario would be a trade back into the teens, where they could grab one of these primo guards, maybe Tyler Eifert, maybe a corner? Then have a 2nd round pick to boot?
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They want to trade down and aquire 2 particular players. Don't buy the Geno rumors ,thats not who Chud likes..well at least not at 6...
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You sound like you know something. 
Crowded elevators smell different to short people...
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JC
One thing I gotta give Banner and Co. credit for is keeping everyone in the NFL in the dark regarding who they like or don't like. The #6 pick is a question mark for everyone and nothing of significance has left the Berea draft war room. There are tons of rumors on pretty much every player and trade situation tied to Browns. The only thing Banner said several weeks ago was saying QB is not the focus at 6. But a trade down wouldn't rule out or a QB or perhaps they've changed their minds since then (I hope not).
#6 could go in so many directions in the minds of many.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
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You sound like you know something.
ha..I've posted a lot of things I know since I've been on this board..I leave a tip in here a lot of times..only a few who know me well understand what I'm doing at certain times..especially draft night.
Soooo this FO wants to put it's stamp on this draft...don't buy into they're trading up..they will only do if they catch wind a team above(yes the freaking Eagles) are after their guy.
But we all know they want to trade down..it's who they are after that might surprise U..actually it's a guy I like but much later in the draft..say second round.
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Talk about contrasting drafts....McShay's last mock has Geno Smith going #6 to the Browns. Kiper's mock doesn't even have him in the first round. Everyone mentally prepared for Smith to go #6 tonight?  I'm going to be talking myself into it throughout the day.
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First off I know many disagree but I believe that Geno is worth the risk at six.
Jason Campbell is a career backup. He has had many opportunities to be "the man" and has been unable to convince any coaching staff he has played under.
Brandon Weeden has stated by Mayock was a developmental quarterback who came into the league at 29.
Geno, plain and simple has more ability. Is he a risk? Of course he is a risk. But he has way more to work with than Weeden.
Even if he fails to me the Browns need to take that chance.
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Tavon Austin with the right team will be a touchdown machine.
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Dion Jordan well worth the sixth pick. Huge upside as a pass rusher.
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Ziggy overrated. Will get swallowed up by NFL linemen. One trick pony who needs to develop more moves. It will take time for him to reach potential. Have to convert to LB not worth the sixth pick.
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Dee Milliner solid pick. Productive. Not learning a new position. Well schooled. Immediate impact player.
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Do not miss on the sixth pick in the draft.
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jc...
Trying to look at this draft from the viewpoint of Haslam, Banner and Lombardi...knowing serious legal matters loom that could affect their future employment with the franchise...this could be the one and only draft these three individuals participate in...and I'm fairly sure each realizes that possibility...
...I look for Haslam, Banner and Lombardi to make a first round pick based on their personal emotions, trying to make the biggest splash they can, picking Geno Smith.
I hope they don't make an emotional pick, but human nature being what it is...and given the circumstances...I realize "emotion" is driving this franchise (Haslam, Banner, Lombardi) at this time.
The idea of building the team via the draft and developing the talent drafted went out the window when ownership changed.
Browns fans have seen it so many times...with each change in management and coaching comes the willingness throw away and waste draft picks made by the previous management and coaching staff...because they were not your picks.
I hope I'm wrong...I really do...but we have seen this show before.
The #1 need for the Browns is a shutdown corner... you don't get those in 3 rd round.
Last edited by mac; 04/25/13 09:25 AM.
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
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..actually it's a guy I like but much later in the draft..say second round.
Not sure what you know or don't know...but since I don't like many of the prospects rumored in that range, I'll probably freak out, lol
If they come away from a top 10 pick with their 1st pick being ANY of OLB Collins, TE McDonald, DE Hunt, TE Ertz or ANY OL (even though I like Warford) then we're being run by morons. If they do what you're suggesting then I hope you're talking CB Taylor, CB Banks, CB Wreh-Wilson, maybe FS Swearinger or FS Cyprien, but that would be buying high on both imho
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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What they want to do and will be able to do are two different things..they WANT secondary help in a tradedown..but they want something else too.
If I am able to do a mock later it might give a glance about it.
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I would like to see that ...
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Legend
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At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
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jc
FYI, NFL Network will have a report from the Browns war room in a couple of minutes
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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jc
FYI, NFL Network will have a report from the Browns war room in a couple of minutes
Thanks...
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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jc
FYI, NFL Network will have a report from the Browns war room in a couple of minutes
Thanks...
For all who missed it or couldn't see it: Solomon Wilcotts was a asked a couple of questions. They talked about the possible trade for Bess making sense consider ing our "size/speed" WRs on the roster. Bess would be a "chain mover"
As for the draft, he said that he's hearing we won't necessarily go top need in the 1st (DB), but BPA instead, be it OL, DL, QB or pass rusher: He was speculating that we'd look at either G.Smith or EJ Manuel in a tradedown scenario.
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
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Legend
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JC
A real good video interview with Joe Banner.
http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/media-cen...ff-492718686c19
at around the 3:25 mark he says there are no super star QB's a, obvious top picks PASS RUSHERS or big type recivers calvin johnson that are conspicious and exciting.
I guess we can cross every pass rusher anyone thought we would get at 6 off the list.
he said QB is no question the most important position in the NFL
this is a really good video.
thank you for sharing!
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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He also said fans may be upset if we don't take players at perceived holes, rather focusing on the long-term than short term holes (paraphrasing)
Maybe I'm reading too much between the lines but think he could be alluding to the CB position at number six and the Browns more value at LB, QB, DL and other spots instead.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
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Quote:
He also said fans may be upset if we don't take players at perceived holes, rather focusing on the long-term than short term holes (paraphrasing)
Maybe I'm reading too much between the lines but think he could be alluding to the CB position at number six and the Browns more value at LB, QB, DL and other spots instead.
considering he said the there are no superstar QB's... we can cross that off the list and DL (pass rushers)
maybe we draft an OL at 6.
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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Legend
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Quote:
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He also said fans may be upset if we don't take players at perceived holes, rather focusing on the long-term than short term holes (paraphrasing)
Maybe I'm reading too much between the lines but think he could be alluding to the CB position at number six and the Browns more value at LB, QB, DL and other spots instead.
considering he said the there are no superstar QB's... we can cross that off the list and DL (pass rushers)
maybe we draft an OL at 6.
Normally, I'd say that it'd be freaking insane to draft an OG at #6 overall, but, with the new rookie wage caps in place, it's not ridiculous at all, IMO, to do that.
The craziness is that it'd give us one seriously high overall investment level in the OL (Thomas, Mack, <rookie>, Schwartz).
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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He also said fans may be upset if we don't take players at perceived holes, rather focusing on the long-term than short term holes (paraphrasing)
Maybe I'm reading too much between the lines but think he could be alluding to the CB position at number six and the Browns more value at LB, QB, DL and other spots instead.
considering he said the there are no superstar QB's... we can cross that off the list and DL (pass rushers)
maybe we draft an OL at 6.
Normally, I'd say that it'd be freaking insane to draft an OG at #6 overall, but, with the new rookie wage caps in place, it's not ridiculous at all, IMO, to do that.
The craziness is that it'd give us one seriously high overall investment level in the OL (Thomas, Mack, <rookie>, Schwartz).
Call me crazy but my take from that interview is that this FO mind set is staight up BPA no mater what, and everything is in play regarding tradeing down or staying put. Personnally I would be quite happy with that.  
 Go Browns FO pick it right tonight!
No  picks
Otherwise we fans will be  for another season 
Hears to hoping Dorsey is the Browns Ozzie Newsome.
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Scenarios 1. Milliner @ 6 2. If Milliner is gone, Picking up Jordan/Jones will give us leverage and I can see Sheard being traded for a 2nd. This I'm ok with. 3. Milliner and whichever OLB we are eyeing is gone... trade down mid round take next top CB. If we also trading Sheard I can see us going Warmack. Absolutely dont want these players whatsoever....HoneyBadger, Mingo(not in the first/overrated/undersized/cantshed), Barkley, Keenan Allen(Robiskie but less talented) Geno Smith (not in the first), Landry Jones(anywhere), Ansah@6(Dont like the raw talented guy in top10/top10 is for surefire studs) Guys I absolutely want and where: Milliner(cb1), Vaccaro(s2), Warmack(g1), Barrett Jones(o-line late1/2nd), Eifert(telate1/2), Rambo (s3), D.Rhodes(cbmid1), Robert Woods(wr2), John Simon(de/olb 2late/3), Jake Stoneburner(te4), Zach Boren(fb5), Tyler Bray(qblate4/5), EJ Mannual(qb3/if we have another 3rd) Michael Muati(lb,late3/4) If we get half these players in the draft I would call it a successful draft. It feels some needs and brings talent to the the team.
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I'm looking for the Phins to make a big push for Lane Johnson. We may be too late but if not I want to bend them over the woodpile! Their first, Bess and a second for starters?
Look for a pileup to get the big three LT's.
Should be fun!
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But we all know they want to trade down..it's who they are after that might surprise U..actually it's a guy I like but much later in the draft..say second round.
If they traded back and got a second rounder from say, San Diego or Miami (don't put any stock in the Albert deal going through) and then trading back again to San Francisco and getting a player like Margus Hunt late in the first round but getting #31, #34 and #61 in return. Going from having no 2nd rounders to having 3 of them (including the one from either San Diego or Miami). That would be some kind of draft movement. 
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Quote:
Scenarios
1. Milliner @ 6
2. If Milliner is gone, Picking up Jordan/Jones will give us leverage and I can see Sheard being traded for a 2nd. This I'm ok with.
3. Milliner and whichever OLB we are eyeing is gone... trade down mid round take next top CB. If we also trading Sheard I can see us going Warmack.
Absolutely dont want these players whatsoever....HoneyBadger, Mingo(not in the first/overrated/undersized/cantshed), Barkley, Keenan Allen(Robiskie but less talented) Geno Smith (not in the first), Landry Jones(anywhere), [Email]Ansah@6(Dont[/Email] like the raw talented guy in top10/top10 is for surefire studs)
Guys I absolutely want and where:
Milliner(cb1), Vaccaro(s2), Warmack(g1), Barrett Jones(o-line late1/2nd), Eifert(telate1/2), Rambo (s3), D.Rhodes(cbmid1), Robert Woods(wr2), John Simon(de/olb 2late/3), Jake Stoneburner(te4), Zach Boren(fb5), Tyler Bray(qblate4/5), EJ Mannual(qb3/if we have another 3rd) Michael Muati(lb,late3/4)
If we get half these players in the draft I would call it a successful draft. It feels some needs and brings talent to the the team.
Nice rundown. I agree 100%........ 
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My final draft thoughts:
1) If we don't get a 2nd Round pick via trade, then I'm automatically dropping the grade of our overall draft. Our FO has to know that we need help and just sitting on our picks as it is between #6 and #68 is unacceptable.
2) Avoid drafting a QB in the 1st and 2nd Rounds. This isn't a money issue to me. This is about talent. If we waste a a 1st/2nd on a QB then I'm automatically dropping the overall draft grade. We have to build around the QB first and we have to strengthen the D.
3) Make that reasonable splash via trade. Shock the football world (in a good way) and make BSPN po'd.
4) Just get it right. I agree with the OP.
You are either setting yourself up to get mad or looking for a reason to go off on the FO. Sheesh man.
People often mistake anger with rational hoping. I'm willing to give this FO a chance. I'm not asking for so much. I'm fine with the combo of Banner/Lombardi.
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I already forgot, what is our head coaches name??? Is it Chuzdwanksty? ....Bahahahahahahaaaaaaaa........
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My final draft thoughts:
1) If we don't get a 2nd Round pick via trade, then I'm automatically dropping the grade of our overall draft. Our FO has to know that we need help and just sitting on our picks as it is between #6 and #68 is unacceptable.
2) Avoid drafting a QB in the 1st and 2nd Rounds. This isn't a money issue to me. This is about talent. If we waste a a 1st/2nd on a QB then I'm automatically dropping the overall draft grade. We have to build around the QB first and we have to strengthen the D.
3) Make that reasonable splash via trade. Shock the football world (in a good way) and make BSPN po'd.
4) Just get it right. I agree with the OP.
You are either setting yourself up to get mad or looking for a reason to go off on the FO. Sheesh man.
People often mistake anger with rational hoping. I'm willing to give this FO a chance. I'm not asking for so much. I'm fine with the combo of Banner/Lombardi.
Lets just hope they pass test #1 ...  
John 3:16 Jesus said "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027 |
his name is Ron Trzcinski, he also owns The Mattress Factory.
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Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 5,583
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 5,583 |
Quote:
his name is Ron Trzcinski, he also owns The Mattress Factory.
LOL!...Sumthin like that..... Expect 5-11 seasons. Live it. Love it. Learn it.
Last edited by SuperBrown; 04/25/13 01:10 PM.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,480
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,480 |
I think my Browns big board would look like this:
1.) Ezekial Ansah, DE/OLB, BYU
2.) Star Loutulelei, DT, Utah
3.) Luke Loeckel, OT, Texas A&M
4.) Eric Fisher, OT, Central Michigan
5.) Dee Milliner, CB, Alabama
6.) Barkevious Mingo, OLB, LSU
7.) Dion Jordan, OLB, Oregon
8.) Lane Johnson, OT, Oklahoma
9.) Jonathan Cooper, OG, UNC
10.) Chance Warmack, OG, Alabama
11.) Jarvis Jones, OLB, Georgia (** Depends on what the doctors have said)
A few notes:
1.) I don't think I'd trade up for anybody, maybe Ansah if we were trading to 5 and it was cheap.
2.) I really like Loutulelei, but we'd have to find a trading partner for Rubin
3.) Since the contract is based entirely on where you are drafted (not position), I think you get a better OL if you take one of the top three OTs and put them at RT (and then slide over Schwartz to LG) than you would get if you drafted either of the top OGs
~Lyuokdea
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums The Archives 2013 NFL Season NFL Draft (2013) Final Draft Thoughts
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