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This is the first time the Steelers have given away a future pick since the 1970s....there is something they must like about this player and we gave it to them on a silver platter. I don't like that one bit.
Gee, another agenda post from memphis. 
We fleeced the Steelers and you turn it around and make another ridiculous bash against the FO. Meanwhile, you never once criticized the previous regime. This was the worst draft class I have ever seen. Heck, even the top picks have question marks. I can't even remember the name of the first overall pick. A guy like Ansah goes top five. Jordon goes top five. Mingo top 10. I can't even remember most of the top picks. It was a putrid draft. We move out of the fourth and fifth rounds and move up a round in next years draft, which will be stronger. We screw the Squeelers and you complain!?!? GMAB!
Psssttttttt----I have a secret I will share w/you and mac. Heckert and Holmgren are gone and are not coming back.
Memphis Frankenstein 
being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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Legend
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This is the first time the Steelers have given away a future pick since the 1970s....there is something they must like about this player and we gave it to them on a silver platter. I don't like that one bit.
Gee, another agenda post from memphis.
We fleeced the Steelers and you turn it around and make another ridiculous bash against the FO. Meanwhile, you never once criticized the previous regime. This was the worst draft class I have ever seen. Heck, even the top picks have question marks. I can't even remember the name of the first overall pick. A guy like Ansah goes top five. Jordon goes top five. Mingo top 10. I can't even remember most of the top picks. It was a putrid draft. We move out of the fourth and fifth rounds and move up a round in next years draft, which will be stronger. We screw the Squeelers and you complain!?!? GMAB!
Psssttttttt----I have a secret I will share w/you and mac. Heckert and Holmgren are gone and are not coming back.
An agenda post? What the hell are you talking about? So, I don't like the fact we traded within the division to a rival....that's an agenda?
So many posters claim you have the agenda (which is rather accurate) and just because someone questions a trade "partner" (not the trade itself), you gotta try and pass that title on to someone else...nice try.
And naturally, you bring this all back to a previous regime WHICH NO ONE WAS TALKING ABOUT...and you say I'm the one with an agenda?
I can't stop laughing.
Tackles are tackles.
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That's okay, Mourg. I understand YOUR trepidation. You are a fair poster w/a good grasp of talent.
It could backfire. Both guys that were taken this year could end up being great players and we could draft two duds or use them to move up and draft another loser qb.
Nothing is set in stone, bro. I just think all things being equal, we got the better end of the deal.
Let me put it to you this way: Can you imagine how much COMPLAINING some of these posters would have done if we traded a higher pick in next year's draft for a lower pick in this year's weak draft?
Get my drift? Most of these guys were going to complain regardless. They would have been going through the roof if Pittsburgh would have done to us what we did to them.
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You can post all the gramlins you want, but your facade is not very convincing.
Bottom line: we got over on the Squeelers and you are still complaining.
Btw: did you say one negative word about giving up picks for TRich last year even though there was NO WAY IN THE FREAKING WORLD that Minni was taking him?
Let me answer it for you. NO, you did not.
You keep working hard at what you do. This isn't the other board and you BS doesn't fly as well here.
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Legend
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You can post all the gramlins you want, but your facade is not very convincing.
Bottom line: we got over on the Squeelers and you are still complaining.
Btw: did you say one negative word about giving up picks for TRich last year even though there was NO WAY IN THE FREAKING WORLD that Minni was taking him?
Let me answer it for you. NO, you did not.
You keep working hard at what you do. This isn't the other board and you BS doesn't fly as well here.
Why do you always say there was no way Minnesota was going to take him?...of course they weren't. Everyone knows that, champ. It was because other teams wanted to jump up and grab him over Cleveland, which their GM Speilman confirmed in a press conference. People have corrected this line of thinking for you over and over again.
I don't hate the trades in theory. I'm perfectly fine with the Indy trade and I'd be fine with the other trade if it wasn't the Steelers. And don't say we screwed them because we don't know what is going to happen- either with Thomas or who we get next year. Sorry, if a poster is weary about giving a pick to a rival....it's not like that's backfired on us before.
This was a fresh comment : "You keep working hard at what you do. This isn't the other board and you BS doesn't fly as well here." as of a week ago you were complaining about how bad this board is because no one wanted to respond to you and talk football. Don't worry, now that you've "brought out the guns", I'm sure that will change.....
Once again, you lump one thing that is concerning to a poster and turn it into a "he must hate everything about this draft and regime" You do this far to often and it's laughable. I loved the Mingo pick. I'm not sure about McFadden as I don't know much on him. I like the Indy trade, weary on the other trade because it goes to a rival...and the other picks are all flyers...Yeah, this must mean I hate everything about the draft. Give me a break.
But no, Vers, YOU keep working hard at what you do and people will soon realize, if they haven't already, who's peddling the real agendas around here.
Tackles are tackles.
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In the press conference this question was asked about trading intra-division and Banner said he never makes a trade he doesn't think he's winning. He mentioned the Donovan McNabb trade where they got picks and he, didn't say it outloud, thought they were getting a crap QB, which turned out to be true.
Has anyone thought the Browns knew exactly who the Steelers were going to trade up for and had that player low on their own board. Thought the player had some character flaw or was an injury risk...etc. Maybe the Browns were comfortably trading with the Steelers because the player they were selecting won't be any good in the eyes of the Browns.
Only time will tell but if I could get a 3rd round pick and have the steelers pick a crap prospect I would do it, wouldn't you?
Go Browns!!![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/BrowniePoints/AndersonSnowPic.jpg)
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Wow I cannot believe how many complainers there are...just amazing.
Point ONE n a Big BUTT point it is.
This was one of the weakest draft classes maybe seen in two Decades??? WEAK!!!
Boo hoo we traded a 4th for a Steelers 3rd. We are doomed really...a weak ass 4th round draft class for a much stronger 2014 3rd round pick??? Really.
Boo Hoo we passed on a GREAT SS of course if we took him the same guys would be saying...WHAT WHY ARE WE TAKING A SS when we got Ward...which would have been much football educated than the whine n lack of differentiating from our possible FS need compared with pretty MUCH ZERO Need for a SS. We passed on nothing.
Steelers have not faired that well over the last few drafts why they got a problem - In years past when they let go of a Harrison they had a stud waiting...where n when is he now?
OL didn't get a shot as the weak class had all the good OL n even 2nd round OL go quick.
2014 is suppose to be a stronger draft class so we are talking Player n talent wise I don't care if it is the SAME pick 2013 to 2014 we will have a better choice of talent...and it is far from SAME PICK...cause you got to add all the Compensation picks at the end of the 3rd.
Same with the 5th for the Colts 4th...who might have a bit tougher schedule this year than last!
Do I know our guys are going to be studs? Funny how some of you know a 4th round pick for the Steelers are going to be a stud. You do realize Palo n he play the same position. Palo going to FS cause of the beatings he takes...btw Loved Sanders where is he know? He took a beating.
I see us having very good players on this team from 2010,11 n 12 27 were on our Roster mostly from those 3 years. We added 5 key players who should all stick unless the DE/OLB Man among boys prospect falls in the cracks due to drugs!
McFadden I see as an excellent Cover Corner...hope he can play the run well. But he was in a Throw first Conference. He can press n play back also saw a lot of good diguise in his coverages as well! But we get Boo Hoo we could have had Honey Badger...pfft. Has a great support system w/Peterson - I hope he makes it. Meanwhile he is what 5'8" ours is 5' 10" and all I here is our guys is too short...lol  love the way that happens.
I've been accused of being a Homer in the past. Well you guys on the other side of the spectrum are so so unrealistic compared to my praises. At least I state - WHO KNOWS.
We did a good job overall. In a weak draft class we came away with: 3rd n 4thd round picks for 2014. Davon Bess a starting slot WR n maybe punt returner. Josh Gordon a #1 WR...n 5 picks who should make our Roster n contribute. The only Pie in the Sky prospect I see is this kid Bryant late round pick from a small school n a dumb arrest.
Risk is MINIMAL but the UPSIDE is Great. The words from some Scouts...real scouts not Pretend scouts were Ware like. Hey he'll be great or out of football in 3 years.
I think we made very key moves from 2012 to 2013 adding to our First Ever drafted Foundation of 27 players.
JMHO
The truely funny thing is you think over-all they did a good job. This was a terrible draft at best. The basisly got one player in Mingo and very little else help. The corner is a slot corner but will have to start and teams will throw and throw and throw at him all day long. We got no help at safety. I can go on and on but the basis fact is Banner and Lombardi just lack the ability to do the jobs they are hired to do. And I first like Truck Stop Boy but after he hired Banner then Lombardi you could see is going from bad to worse.
Just look at the character issues we have aquired this off-season.
Bryant - drunk
Bryant - the drug dealer
Groves - the john
Haslam - the fraud
Plus adding non quality players in
K. Davis
Barnidge
Campbell
Graham
Lewis
Bad draft Picks in
Bryant
Slaughter
McFadden
But the good news is hopefully in 3 years we get a new owner...
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Legend
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Is English his second language? 
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I thought it would be interesting to look at some of the "experts" opinions from a couple of years ago. Prisco thought that the Broncos made a huge mistake passing on Darius for Von Miller. He also thought that the Texans should not have taken JJ Watt with such a pressing need at CB. I don't think that either team would trade their guy away at this point. He also hated the Packers pick of Clay Matthews. He also loved the Jags trading up to pick Gabbert, while panning the Panthers for taking Newton with Claussen already on board. He also thought that Ponder was the best QB in the draft. Further ...... he said, and I quote ..... regarding the Niners ......... "Questionable move: Passing on Blaine Gabbert and then trading up to get Colin Kaepernick. They will now be linked together in 49ers draft history."  http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/story...-earn-top-marks
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Dawg Talker
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Banner's answer was basically that we saw an opportunity to screw a division rivalry and we took it.
Haslam TOLD him to do it. lmao.
Way 2 be Jimmy!!!
Mac. Mac. Mac. Shaking head at Mac.
Having only 5 picks is call for an immediate "C" from the get-go when you look at it like that.
NOW. Look at it like THIS. Which is REALITY.
First round—OLB Barkevious Mingo (6th overall)
Second round—WR Josh Gordon (taken in 2012 NFL Supplemental Draft)
Third round—CB Leon McFadden (68th overall)
Fourth round—WR Davone Bess (traded 104th & 164th in exchange for Dolphins 111th & 217th & Bess)
Fourth & Fifth rounds—Extra third- and fourth-round picks in 2014 for 111 & 139)
Sixth round—S Jamoris Slaughter (175th overall)
Seventh round—DE/OLB Armonty Bryant (217th overall)
Seventh round – OL Garrett Gilkey (227th overall)
That Mr. Negativity is an EXCEPTIONAL DRAFT in ANY YEAR!!
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Legend
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So it's just me being too hard on Banner?
Early returns on Cleveland Browns draft rate it average at best
By Mary Kay Cabot, The Plain Dealer The Plain Dealer
updated April 28, 2013
CLEVELAND, Ohio -- National experts weighed in on the Browns' draft Sunday, and the general consensus was that CEO Joe Banner and General Manager Mike Lombardi were very average in their inaugural selection meeting together here in Cleveland.
Most graders gave the Browns a C, with a couple of highly respected sites -- Sporting News and Sports Illustrated -- dinging them with D's. However, two analysts from Fox Sports liked what the Browns did, one giving them a B and the other a B-plus.
Most of the analysts seemed to like the first-round selection of Barkevious Mingo but some were puzzled by the pick considering the Browns signed pass rushers Paul Kruger and Desmond Bryant in free agency. Many didn't see the wisdom in the Browns surrendering fourth- and fifth-round picks this year for third- and fourth-rounders in 2014.
But third-round pick Leon McFadden, the cornerback out of San Diego State, was a popular choice among the pundits.
A look at the national grades and some of the comments:
Chris Burke, SI.com
Grade: D-plus
Burke described it as "bit of an unusal draft for the Browns, who landed an impact defender in OLB Barkevious Mingo at No. 6 and then picked just once more (CB Leon McFadden) in the next 167 selections." He noted the two selections for 2014 and feels the gamble on Josh Gordon in the supplemental draft paid off. "Strictly in terms of the 2013 draft, though, there's not much to go on here -- slightly disappointing for a team hoping to make big strides," he wrote.
Dane Brugler, CBS Sports
Grade: C
Brugler, who accurately predicted the Browns would select Mingo in his draft day mock, wrote: "I understand the passion to attack the quarterback, but I wonder why the Browns elected to pay for Paul Kruger if they were going to draft Barkevious Mingo at No. 6 overall. Where does that put Jabaal Sheard, who was one of the team's better players a year ago? I love cornerback Leon McFadden's athleticism as well, but he's just 5-10. Frankly, I thought the Browns got their best value in the seventh round with intriguing developmental pass rusher Armonty Bryant and Garrett Gilkey, a developmental offensive lineman who impressed me at the Senior Bowl. Adding picks for the 2014 Draft helps what otherwise I thought was one of the least impressive draft classes."
Mel Kiper, ESPN
Grade: C-plus
Kiper has his doubts about Mingo, which hurt the Browns' grade.
"I don't know if it's a good thing, per se, but the guy who will impact the Browns most in 2013 might not be the player they took at No. 6 overall," he wrote. "At No. 68 overall, they took Leon McFadden, a much-needed CB who knows how to operate on an island. As I look at the depth chart, I don't see a reason why McFadden can't break camp as the starter across from Joe Haden. That's not a small deal because it also maximizes Buster Skrine, who will be able to spend more time in the slot, where he's much better."
Consistent with his pre-draft evaluation, Kiper felt Mingo should've had more than 4.5 sacks last season despite drawing double teams and being asked to contain mobile quarterbacks instead of attack them at times.
He described Mingo as "a player I'm at once infatuated with as a talent, but skeptical of because of what I considered production that didn't match up with his talent. Now, Mingo adds depth at outside linebacker, but he's going to need some developmental work because he played with his hand on the ground at LSU. After that, there isn't a lot here that you'll see in 2013. Jamoris Slaughter could provide depth at safety. The lack of a second-round pick really hurt the Browns, who could have used a higher-rated guard -- though I do think Garrett Gilkey has the chance to start eventually -- and I thought would have been wise to add another inside linebacker. But Josh Gordon is developing and Davone Bess should provide Brandon Weeden with another solid target in the passing game. The hope is Mingo becomes a star, and McFadden can perform early. The good news is, both could happen."
Vinnie Iyer, Sporting News
Grade: D
Iyer was puzzled by a couple of Browns' decisions, including not taking a quarterback and selecting a cornerback whom he feels is more of an inside guy than a starter opposite Joe Haden.
"For a young team with multiple issues, it's odd the Browns worked their way down to just five picks," he wrote. "LSU first-rounder Barkevious Mingo is a high-risk, high-reward edge pass rusher for their 3-4. They needed a corner for the outside, yet took one, San Diego State's Leon McFadden, better suited for the slot. The biggest head-scratcher was the fact Cleveland officials, not all in on Brandon Weeden, didn't at least take a chance on one of the quarterback prospects after most of them slid.
Peter Prisco, CBS Sports
Grade: C
Prisco's favorite pick was McFadden, whom he deemed a bit undersized "but a solid cover corner who fits a need."
He also questioned the Mingo pick.
"They had two outside rushers and had some other bigger needs. He's a good player, but not a great fit."
He granted Notre Dame safety Jamoris Slaughter, who's coming off the torn Achilles tendon, his "third-day gem" status, acknowledging that he's a risk, but worth it if he can bounce back.
"In his first draft as general manager, I just didn't get the wow factor from Mike Lombardi," Prisco wrote. "I like Mingo, but I thought they had other needs. They did add receiver Davone Bess in a trade (with Miami) for very little.
Evan Silva, Yahoo Sports
Grade: C
Silva excluded Gordon from his evaluation, but included Bess. In exchange for Bess, the Browns moved down seven spots in the fourth round and gave Miami a fifth-rounder for a seventh. He did like the idea of stockpiling picks for next season.
"Mingo was the most naturally explosive edge presence in this draft," he wrote. "McFadden may be stretched covering outside receivers in the NFL, but projects as an upgrade on Buster Skrine at nickel back. Bryant has some upside as a small-school project. Slaughter can be a core special teamer if his Achilles' is right. Lombardi's first draft haul underwhelms on paper, but the Browns can capitalize on his forward-minded thinking next year."
Floyd Engel, Fox Sports
Grade: B
Of all the experts, Engel was the most complimentary of Lombardi and his first draft after five years as an NFL Network analyst.
"There is little not to love about what Mike Lombardi did, even the Barkevious Mingo gamble, which is the best part of this draft for them. They have a GM, a real-deal GM."
Alex Marvez, Fox Sports
Grade: C-minus
Marvez wasn't overly impressed with the Browns' "wait 'til next year" strategy in the middle rounds.
"Outside linebacker Mingo provides some bark to Cleveland's Dawg Pound, but the Browns added only one more player (San Diego State cornerback Leon McFadden) before Round Six," he wrote. "On the positive side, they secured extra third- and fourth-round choices in next year's draft through trades and have already started reaping the dividends of using its 2013 second-round pick in last year's supplemental draft on budding wide receiver Josh Gordon."
Peter Schrager, Fox Sports
Grade: B-plus
Schrager gave the Browns a higher grade than anyone else, particularly for parlaying the fourth- and fifth-rounders into third- and fourth-rounders in 2014.
"You can only do so much when you don't have a second-round pick, and I think Cleveland brass is awfully happy with Gordon, essentially their second-round pick," he said. "Mingo will complement Paul Kruger well in Ray Horton's 3-4. This was a productive draft for the long term."
web page
Those of you who thought this front office was focused on winning now...you are wrong. Obviously there is no sense of urgency to address the team's needs, preferring to write off this year.
The Steelers on the other hand, they want to win now and Banner is doing his best to help them do it. Every other team in our division used every pick they could get to help themselves win in 2013...except the Browns.
None of our division rivals traded away picks in this draft, preferring to wait till next year to address their needs. The quality of talent available in this draft was just fine with the Bengals, Steelers and Ravens as all of them used all their 2013 picks to upgrade their teams now.
Do you really believe the BS that Banner is just that much smarter than Ozzie Newsome, Kevin Colbert or Mike Brown?
While the Browns front office takes a wait till 2014 position, our division rivals just did all they could to address their team needs...to win this year.
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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jc
I've been back and forth on those two deals: On one hand, I like the idea of having an extra 3rd and 4th in a stronger class. Otoh, I keep hearing that saying "future picks are for future GMs".
Now, in terms of value I think many don't realize this, but it's a WASH. Yes, we DO draft one round higher, BUT we lose 2xone year of developing a mid round player. Then again it could be argued that we have enough young talent to "develop" already on the roster.
I really do not care much with WHOM we've traded, but it was really tough for me to see Shamarko Thomas, one of my fav prospects in this draft class, go to the Steelers with "our" pick. Fair or not, since Banner did not know who the Steelers would pick, but Banner will always be ripped apart when Shamarko makes plays, and trust me...if this little dude stays healthy, he will make his fair shake of them. On tape I saw him as being as good, if not better than Elam, who was picked by the Ravens at the end of the 1st. Hate to see those two in the AFC North. At least the Bengals picked up a dud S with S.Williams
I also thought the "strengths" of his class was in the 3rd to 5th range, so seeing us punt not only one but two of those into next year was a little disappointing to say the least. All 3 of my 5star players (S.Thomas, WR Patton and OL B.Jones) were still available when we traded the pick to the Steelers. Since I value any of those to be well worth a 3rd round selection, I would have rather have them develop in 2013 than hold the Steelers 3rd rounder in 2014.
Then again, it's better to have that pick instead of selecting a bad prospect. Obviously I disagree with the "value" they've given to some of who were left on the board at pick 111. The 5th rounder was the better trade imho, as the talent fom there down to the 7th was pretty equal imho.
The aquistion of Bess also has to be factored into those trades, so it's not like we got absolutely nothing back.
Still, looking at "what could have been", makes me cringe a little bit...imagine what was possible, without much hindsighting:
16 CB Rhodes/TE Eifert
42 FS Swearinger/CB Banks/CB Taylor
68 DE/OLB Moore/CB Wreh-Wilson/G/T D.Thomas
111 S S.Thomas/WR Patton/OL B.Jones
139 RB S.Taylor/QB Bray/RB Randle
175 OL Quessenberry/TE Gragg/RB Ellington
Ok with the 7th, although there were other good options too there
And that draft would have been with Bess in the fold too. Of course this best case sceanrio of mine includes taking the deal we had in the 1st, but this class was very possible
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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So it's just me being too hard on Banner?
Just because some talking heads didn't grade our draft highly doesn't add any validity to your opinion. Most of those guys are proven wrong one way are another anyway. Most of them do not follow the Browns closely enough to know what's going on. They're like draftniks who develop their opinions by reading the opinions of others without really checking it out for themselves.
In the article there are those who think trading the 4th and 5th pick was bad and those who think it was good. So which ones are right? The ones who agree with you?
There's one guy who give the Browns a bad mark for drafting McFadden calling him a "slot" CB. He obviously doesn't know much about McFadden at all so is judging him solely on his height, (which is 1-inch shorter than Joe Haden).
Half of the talking heads know nothing about the Browns. Nor do they know much about drafting as they look at it simply "filling needs" with no eye for value or BPA. Those who fill needs, regardless of the player or where he was drafted, get high grades for filling needs.
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None of our division rivals traded away picks in this draft, preferring to wait till next year to address their needs. The quality of talent available in this draft was just fine with the Bengals, Steelers and Ravens as all of them used all their 2013 picks to upgrade their teams now.
None of those three teams are in the situation we are in. The bengals were in the playoffs last season. The Steelers and Rats are desperate to not lose ground. The Steelers have already lost ground and are desperate to stop their skid with no cap money. The Rats were cleaned out and left with no cap money.
None of those three teams are starting with a new regime as are the Browns. So, of course they will approach the draft differently. Each AFC North team has approached the draft from the perspective of where their team is currently. The Browns did the same.
If you take out the "C" grades because those are average, neither good nor bad. Then the article has two guys giving the Browns a "D" and two giving them a "B". That washes to a "C". So all the article did in the end was state the Browns draft as average and in no way is it "being hard on Banner" as you claim they do in backing you up.
#gmstrong
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I thought it would be interesting to look at some of the "experts" opinions from a couple of years ago.
Prisco thought that the Broncos made a huge mistake passing on Darius for Von Miller.
He also thought that the Texans should not have taken JJ Watt with such a pressing need at CB.
I don't think that either team would trade their guy away at this point.
He also hated the Packers pick of Clay Matthews.
He also loved the Jags trading up to pick Gabbert, while panning the Panthers for taking Newton with Claussen already on board. He also thought that Ponder was the best QB in the draft. Further ...... he said, and I quote ..... regarding the Niners ......... "Questionable move: Passing on Blaine Gabbert and then trading up to get Colin Kaepernick. They will now be linked together in 49ers draft history."
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/story...-earn-top-marks
Proof that to grade a draft you need to wait a few seasons.
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Dawg Talker
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Those of you who thought this front office was focused on winning now...you are wrong
How could anyone be wrong when NOONE has ever even whispered those words?
I can tell you this dude. We didn't sign a young in their prime Kruger and Bryant to watch them get old and be gone when we make a run. These guys will be CORE parts of our winning. Sooner than later.
You need to just STOP trying to analyze Front Offices. You SUCK at it.
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Legend
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It looks like the Browns draft team was outmaneuvered by the Seahawks in the 5th round and once the Seahawks picked the guy our brain trust was counting on getting, Banner and Lombardi had no backup pick/plan, so they punted, preferring to wait till next year.
I didn't see any article about that. Did that actually take place or did you just decide it was the case? Just wondering
Daman...so it's just me being too hard on Banner and Lombardi, right ???
Trade with Steelers tops one of Browns' strangest draft days
By Steve Doerschuk
CantonRep.com staff writer
BEREA — Joe Banner is a plucky little cuss.
He boldly went where no Browns personnel man has gone before (at least not since 1968).
“I prefer to trade within the division,” the Browns’ CEO said after a strange closing day of the NFL draft. “You don’t make a trade if you don’t think you’re winning it. If you win a trade within your division, you’re obviously better off than winning a trade within another division.”
Such a tricky 2013 draft.
It occasioned the first Browns-Steelers trade since the year Richard Nixon edged Hubert Humphrey in a presidential election — the year Rob Chudzinski was born.
It was the first time Pittsburgh traded a future draft pick since the year Nixon resigned during his second term.
But then, it was the first time the Browns have conducted a draft under an owner who recently sold his share in the Steelers and is swimming in a federal investigation.
Unpredictability was predictable from a Browns draft room staffed by five men who were all someplace else at draft time last year.
Who knew “unpredictable” would translate to:
• Just two new players within the first 174 picks.
• A safety (Jamoris Slaughter, No. 175) who blew out an Achilles in September.
• A linebacker (Armonty Bryant, Round 7) busted for selling marijuana in October.
• That Pittsburgh trade.
With owner Jimmy Haslam’s on-premises approval, Banner opted to further test the patience of fans who already have suffered through five years of 23-57.
They, in consort with general manager Michael Lombardi, assistant GM Ray Horton and head coach Chudzinski, got through three days opting not to:
• Move down in Round 1 and replenish a lost Round 2 pick.
• Pick at No. 111 (Round 4), instead trading the pick to, yes, Pittsburgh, in exchange for the Steelers’ Round 3 pick in 2014.
• Pick at No. 139 (Round 5), taking a 2014 Round 4 pick from the Colts.
That left linebacker Barkevious Mingo at No. 6 and cornerback Leon McFadden at No. 68 as the team’s only picks until No. 175.
Analyst Mike Mayock, who worked with Lombardi at NFL Network, took a shot at reading the collective mind of the Browns’ brass as to deferring picks to next year.
“We’re kind of building with a three- to five-year plan here,” Mayock said.
That’s a miserable thought for Browns fans who have lived through five years in which the record was 4-12 or 5-11.
“Listen,” Banner said, “we’re not asking for a free pass for this year. We expect to improve. We expect it to be conspicuous.
“We’re not gonna reach all of our goals or fill all our needs this year, but I think we’ll be exciting and I think we’ll position ourselves well to become very good and sustain it.”
Chudzinski absorbed that thought from a perch beside Banner in the Browns’ fieldhouse, then said:
“Our goal is to win and it always will be. We’ll approach it from that standpoint.”
Elsewhere on the “opted not to” front, the Browns didn’t draft a quarterback. Neither, though, did they name Brandon Weeden the starter.
Chudzinski deflected the direct question: Is Weeden the starter?
“We feel good about the group we have,” he said. “How that all plays out, we’ll see in time. I’m excited about Brandon and the progress he’s made thus far. I’m also pleased with Jason in the role he’s taken.”
He stopped short of explaining that role.
As to weaving through the draft without picks in Round 2, 4 and 5, Banner said it was all part of the grand scheme. Friday trade pick-up Davone Bess is better than a draft pick in important ways, he suggested. Another wideout, Josh Gordon, stands a good chance to be worth the second-round pick it cost to get him.
And, as Banner said at the top, that deal wasn’t made to help Pittsburgh. It was made to beat Pittsburgh.
Something in the tough little cuss’s bearing was very convincing. At the very least, Banner seemed convinced.
Reach Steve at 330-580-8347 or steve.doerschuk@cantonrep.com
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Why be that way,, I asked a question because I hadn't heard it and I still don't know what the hell your talking about regarding the Seahawks.. The article doesn't say anything about the Seahawks..
So,, is this your MO,, someone asks a perfectly reasonble question, then you throw up an article that has no bearing on the question?
wow
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Quote:
...OL B.Jones) were still available when we traded the pick ...
Missing on that pick was the most disappointing aspect of our entire draft IMO...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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Why do you always say there was no way Minnesota was going to take him?...of course they weren't. Everyone knows that, champ. It was because other teams wanted to jump up and grab him over Cleveland, which their GM Speilman confirmed in a press conference. People have corrected this line of thinking for you over and over again.
Corrected me? I already knew that Tampa Bay reportedly wanted to move up. Big deal. Let them. TRich was not worth it. We gave up picks to do move up because we panicked and reacted to what someone else was doing. The smart thing would have been to make the trade w/Tampa Bay ourselves. We could have traded down and received multiple picks in one of the greatest draft classes ever. We could have then taken Doug Martin later, who I kept pimping before the draft as being a better back than TRich.
You freak out over us trading w/the Steelers, but applauded the TRich move last year. No complaints from you regarding Weeden, never mind that even if he does have adequate skills [that is highly debatable right now], he still didn't have the skill set to play in the WCO. Not a freaking peep from you.
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And don't say we screwed them because we don't know what is going to happen- either with Thomas or who we get next year. Sorry, if a poster is weary about giving a pick to a rival....it's not like that's backfired on us before.
LOL.....you don't want me to say we screwed them, but earlier you said we served up their player to them on a silver platter. You know, Banner has traded w/in the division before. How did the trade of McNabb to Washington work out for the latter? Did Banner serve up McNabb to the Skins on a silver platter? Perhaps he did, but underneath that silver cover of the main course was not filet mignon, but a huge turd.
I think Banner is a very savvy man. I think he has little-man syndrome [which isn't always a bad thing] and he is going to work his butt off to beat the other guys. I think he will be relentless. I think he is very intelligent. I think he understands the business. I have a lot of faith in the guy. I think this guy doesn't care too much of what the fans initially think because he knows [and said] this----if you win, the fans will be happy. He is building this team for long-term success. And trading mid-round picks in a crappy draft for higher picks in a stronger draft class is not stupid. It's smart!
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He is building this team for long-term success.
I DO believe that! He evidently has the smarts, certainly from a business perspective, to ensure long term sustainability which is what we want to see. Please, no major hills nor valleys. 
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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Quote:
Quote:
...OL B.Jones) were still available when we traded the pick ...
Missing on that pick was the most disappointing aspect of our entire draft IMO...
+1, another Loadholdt move that will haunt us
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A wise person knows whether or not to say it.
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Hey we need to have eyes wide open on this, we knew Banner was savvy with the business side and he will make the tough decisions visa vi cap and players.
I think he is very intelligent in that aspect... and many of his decisions will have their detractors... but I see a plan emerging and it appears they have the balls to stick to it. Still it was difficult to NOT add players, I undestand the reasoning, it just adds to our frustrattions and wanting a winner so bad.
Time will tell if he can deliver or will be packing up his office.
#gmstrong
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A wise person knows whether or not to say it.
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Mac...Ratsanplan n others entrenched in the Woah is we mentality.
First off Grades...as mentioned they bounce all over the place but I am actually shocked we are getting B's here n there. Cause if you all remember throughout our history whenever we drafted 9+ we always got high grades...teams who traded their picks away unless they were the Pats were always given bad grades - point blank they are grading the picks values n when you take five it adds up to less.
I think its rather funny that every player taken by the Steelers is going to be a starter/All Pro. I think its rather funny to think we picked a SS in the 6th to Replace Ward...lol First off 5th round on is for Special teams...if anything else comes out of it - Bonus points.
4th round came up n we didn't have a prospect on "OUR" board - not McShay's board - worthy of a 4th round pick. You guys think we pick prospects just from a list of Positions...well if this guy is gone we can get x,y or z...no We make a list of INDIVIDUAL PLAYERS We want on our Team!
Again Can you tell me when was the last time two OGs got taken in the top 10? Just guessing...NEVER??? This was a weak draft. 2nd rounders were taken in the first...3rd n 4th rounders taken in the 2nd...by the time we got to the 4th round we were drafting 5th 6th n 7th rounders there. We strengthened ourselves for 2014 a draft that is going to be much stronger in prospects than this year.
We came away with a FS Prospect, DE Prospect n OG/OT Prospect in the late rounds. Would you feel better if we took them in the 4th n 5th??? Our guys thought it was wiser to take these guys later n invest in next years better draft.
Just the fact that adding Bess is ignored shows that you are blind to what really happened. We came into this draft with 6 picks...we come away w/5 rookie n 1 veteran as bonus we have an extra 3rd n 4th in next years stronger class. We lost our 3rd string QB n who knows maybe Lewis beats out Colt in this Offense??? Maybe we lost the guy we were cutting???
But even our late round picks from No where schools...have a tremendous up side.
Gilkey in a year or two might be our starting LG maybe he can beat out Pinkston...the kid is nasty - I hope he makes it.
Bryant we explored in depth n felt his immaturity is behind him...this kid has amazing talent and supposedly our new D has our DE's slashing a lot...this kid can Slash inside...we are looking to add 20 lbs n groom him for a DE role. Hey a 4.8 DE is not that bad. But explosion excellent. Good Prospect - Bust or Excellent what else do you want for a late round pick.
our Safety without the injury he would have probably gone around 2nd round in this draft. Either he heals or he doesn't the kid is a very good player. But we will groom him for FS n SS Nickel n Dime packages n see if he can compete n win a spot...what else do you want from a late round pick.
4th round you want a guy to come in n compete for that starting position. We had none ranked on our board. Betcha we get a better prospect for this team in 2014.
Boo Hoo for nothing in the 4th? True Nothing is NOTHING added. But to pretend the 3rd round pick does not exist for this teams future is just not rational. And its not just a few slots. Even if the Steelers win the SB (more of a chance they will be last in our division than that happening) - Hows this Boo hoo on the Steelers we picked Gilkey n they didn't lol!
I'm tired of this opening up your Christmas presents not even looking at them as you unwrap but instead looking at the kid next to you n no matter what he gets -YOU WANT! And pout on your gift n take the attitude of why do I always get the worse gift. Its a state of mind. I can understand from our first 8 years or so. But we have drafted well of late. The guys who have stuck are pretty good DQ (top 100 by players), Joe T (HOF), Mack (Pro Bowl), Then 24 guys we drafted 2010,11,12 - We never had this kind of youthful talent on our team. There is no reason for this Woah is us...we have out drafted the Steelers n Ravens over the last 3 years. Yeah they got NUMBERS (9??) from a draft that is WEAK! like the grading shown...check, check check....REALLY automatic great players...lol Automatic starters - their biggest weakness was OL didn't see much help there.
Got to run catch you all later.
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Why be that way,, I asked a question because I hadn't heard it and I still don't know what the hell your talking about regarding the Seahawks.. The article doesn't say anything about the Seahawks..
So,, is this your MO,, someone asks a perfectly reasonble question, then you throw up an article that has no bearing on the question?
wow
daman...hopefully this answers your question...I read this story before making the original post...this talks about what might have lead to the Browns trading the 5th round pick...
.......................................................................
NFL Draft: Browns trade 5th round pick to Colts for 4th rounder in 2014
Waiting For Next Year:
The Browns have traded away a pick for the second time in the 2013 draft, sending their 2013 5th rounder to Indianapolis in exchange for the Colts’ 4th round pick in 2013.
The Browns now have traded out of the 2013 draft twice in favor of adding a higher valued pick in 2014. Cleveland also tradrf their 4th round selection for Pittsburgh’s 3rd rounder next year.
This is frustrating for Browns fans who see lots of holes on the team’s roster and want them filled immediately.Through five rounds Cleveland has only added three players, the two selections of Barkevious Mingo and Leon McFadden, and Davone Bess through a trade with Miami.
Seattle traded up two picks ahead of Cleveland at 139 to give them both picks 137 and 138, selecting DT Jesse Williams out of Alabama and CB Tharold Simon out of LSU. Simon, a teammate of Browns’ first round selection Barkevious Mingo at LSU was thought to be a possible target of Cleveland who despite drafting Leon McFadden in the 3rd round is still weak at...
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Daman...Also, I have read stories that the Browns were targeting the QB from Syracuse, Ryan Nessib with their 4th round (#111) pick but the Giants traded up ahead of us, to take him at #110 pick.
If both situations prove to be accurate, it shows a lack of perpetration by the draft team, having no plan B, if the guy we target are gone.
Also, it would seem that the efforts by the front office to disguise their draft picks might not have worked so well, if both the Giants and Seahawks jumped ahead to pick the player we were targeting.
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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Excellent Post eotab, I agree with everything you wrote.
My only concern is the Mingo Pick. If he was head and shoulder above everyone else on their board then so be it. I would have taken Milliner or traded back and picked up a second but we will see how it pans out in a few years.
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Corrected me? I already knew that Tampa Bay reportedly wanted to move up. Big deal. Let them. TRich was not worth it. We gave up picks to do move up because we panicked and reacted to what someone else was doing. The smart thing would have been to make the trade w/Tampa Bay ourselves. We could have traded down and received multiple picks in one of the greatest draft classes ever. We could have then taken Doug Martin later, who I kept pimping before the draft as being a better back than TRich.
Then why bring up Minnesota in the first place to justify your position...???. Why does it have to be that we panicked? Why not we made sure we got the best player on our board and knew other teams wanted to jump up to take him? If you want to use panic...you'd have a better argument using that for Weeden. This team, if not mistaken, had 13 or so draft picks last year. Who thinks we were gonna use all of them? We gave a 7th, , 4th, 5th, and our #4 to move up one spot to secure the guy we wanted. Oddly enough people aren't all that worried about punting a 4th and 5th round talent this year. And a 7th, is well, a 7th. They went and got their guy. If Banner and Co. traded up this year, I wouldn't have had a problem with it either. They would have gone and got they player THEY wanted. They just need to be right on it. Its kinda like what Indianapolis and Pittsburgh did over the weekend with us. You don't think Trent is worth it, I do. Moving on....
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You freak out over us trading w/the Steelers, but applauded the TRich move last year. No complaints from you regarding Weeden, never mind that even if he does have adequate skills [that is highly debatable right now], he still didn't have the skill set to play in the WCO. Not a freaking peep from you.
Freaking out? That's a bit absurd and over the top. But yeah, I'm not particularly a fan of it because, philosophically, I don't like trading within the division, regardless of the round and the deal. If we do win this one, wonderful. I'll be the first one to stand up and cheer, but I don't like handing a team we play twice a year a player they obviously wanted. What, is someone supposed to automatically accept a deal done with a team I hate?
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LOL.....you don't want me to say we screwed them, but earlier you said we served up their player to them on a silver platter. You know, Banner has traded w/in the division before. How did the trade of McNabb to Washington work out for the latter? Did Banner serve up McNabb to the Skins on a silver platter? Perhaps he did, but underneath that silver cover of the main course was not filet mignon, but a huge turd.
Yes, I am well aware of the deal Philadelphia made with Washington. He made a point to say it in the press conference. And yeah, the Eagles fleeced them on that deal. I got no problem saying that. However, I'll say I'm a bit more weary trading to a team that builds it's success through the draft and knows what they're doing (Steelers) than one that builds through FA and trades (Redskins). Furthermore, one deal is not inclusive or indicative of what will happen this time around. I like the Colts trade. I'd equally like the 4th round trade down IF it was another team. That's just me. Fine, you don't agree. That is rather evident.
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I think Banner is a very savvy man. I think he has little-man syndrome [which isn't always a bad thing] and he is going to work his butt off to beat the other guys. I think he will be relentless. I think he is very intelligent. I think he understands the business. I have a lot of faith in the guy. I think this guy doesn't care too much of what the fans initially think because he knows [and said] this----if you win, the fans will be happy. He is building this team for long-term success. And trading mid-round picks in a crappy draft for higher picks in a stronger draft class is not stupid. It's smart!
I think Banner is a very savvy man as well. But just because I raise a personal concern about a trade you blow it up and translate it to the rest of the board that I hate everything going on here. It's nonsense and tiresome (a phrase I have to use over again with you). I repeat less things to my 3 year-old niece. And don't tell me I (or anyone else for that matter) can't voice my opinion on a trade the day after it happened because you BASHED EVERYTHING the Browns did last year the minute the selections went down. Richardson, Weeden, Schwartz, and Hughes. Maybe Winn was the only one you "liked". So go practice what you preach before you come on here telling other posters how to feel about this year.
ONCE AGAIN, and I hope it finally sticks in your skull this time , I like the majority of what this team did in the draft (and in FA for that matter to cover all bases for you) but I inherently don't like trading with the Steelers, Ravens, and Bengals. Outside of that, they drafted the BPA at 6, a position of need in the third, and flyers the rest of the way. The future picks tell me that:
1. This team is not expecting to blow the roof off this year (which we all understand)
2. Indicate the coaches and FO may not be fully informed with the young talent here. Why bring in more guys in the 4/5 rounds when you can get a better sense of young talent currently on the roster in new schemes and make more informed decisions for 2014.
Last edited by MemphisBrownie; 04/29/13 11:04 AM.
Tackles are tackles.
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mac. are you really saying that we should have just taken anyone just for the sake of using the draft pick this year?
being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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Just clicking.
Hey guys, remember how we traded our future third pick to grab Martin Rucker in the 4th round...then traded our future 5th to grab Paul Hubbard in the 6th round?
How did that work out for us?
Just saying...
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
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It's like Banner said mac, and even though it was Banner who said it, it is still true, you don't make ANY deal unless you think you're getting the better end of the bargain. So, if you do get the better of the deal you've just made your team stronger and your division opponent weaker. One can hardly fault the logic in that.
Of course, it's left to be seen who got the better end of the deal.
It's a bold move..very few teams get the best of Pukesburgh..they find gems later in the rounds..they know how to evaluate and fit players into their scheme.
The Browns haven't had anyone who has had the brains to do that.
Is Banner/Lombardi the minds to match the Stoolers?
Banner did come from a organiztion who has drafted well over the years, I have mentioned many times how I envied the Eagles drafts and what they did.
This also seemed to have a touch of Bellyache's style of drafts..NE always..always accumilates picks..as do SF.
So we'll see..part one happens this year when S.Thomas is on the field ,not against us but every opponent.
Part two comes in the third rd in 2014 (If they don't package it in a trade) when the Browns draft.
Last edited by Attack Dawg; 04/29/13 11:04 AM.
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I wonder how many of our drafts that netted us 0, or 1 player after 2-4 years were graded? I don't seem to recall a bunch of "D" and "F" grades in there. He gave us a C in 2009,m and loved the Robiske pick. Instant starter, he said. Loved the James Davis pick as well. Loved his talent. He panned the Titans for taking Britt. Should have taken Robiske, he said. He disliked the Seahawks passing on Sanchez. These guys don't really know much more than we do. They have access to more information, but the writers aren't much better at predicting outcomes to drafts than fans are. (especially right after the draft)
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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My biggest complaint and utter irritation about the Stoller trade..
Freaking ESPN didn't announce the trade!!!!
I was sitting there wondering what happened and figured there was a trade and I had to go back online to hear they traded out!
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mac. are you really saying that we should have just taken anyone just for the sake of using the draft pick this year?
Apparently. By not taking a 4th round SS we will not be making the playoffs.
How does a league celebrating its 100th season only recognize the 53 most recent championships?
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The truely funny thing is you think over-all they did a good job. This was a terrible draft at best. The basisly got one player in Mingo and very little else help.
Glad I can make you laugh. Terrible draft at best??? I don't know u might be right I cannot see into the future. I am looking at talent.
You know what is Funny...I got one poster who says they agree with me but the question the Mingo pick...Then another (you) state I am Silly funny but you think our Mingo pick was the only good thing...Now that is funny
Look all I know about Mingo is he has a special First step...you can't teach that...n he has it. What he does with it we cannot predict...that is why they ALL ARE CALLED PROSPECTS.
I like the CB we got...I know he's a slot CB cause the Bozo's n Talking Heads say he is...they don't know. The kid has Cover corner written all over him. Do you realize he is the same size as Sheldon Brown??? Let teams throw to his side...its great for a DC when teams are predictable...we'll drop a CB or LB in the passing lane every now n then n get an INT from it. Besides the kid will learn fast 
You know not every thing we do is TERRIBLE.
If you cannot see the difference - Finally we have a drafted Foundation. Now its all about upgrading. This draft was weak n hard to upgrade. But we are coming away with at least 4 new starters n in others we have Prospects/Youth getting better. What happens when you have a Youth Foundation...Progress of the player. Not an overhaul.
We strengthened our 2014 draft. I know when the Patriots do it they are Geniuses. Us...Terrible. lol
I can only think you are a young fan who hasn't seen much since 1999. Bless all of you youngsters for sticking with the TEAM!!! Heck my first year of Football n Browns Football was our last Championship. So I really respect you young fans...heck n you don't have to be 20's to be young fans...you could have gone through the Denver Crapola n the Sipe INT to the Raiders as your initiation to the Browns. Younger than me
But I see a difference. McFadden is Good can't wait for him to show you all n make you proud of the Browns once more or maybe the first time!
Yeah we took a shot at a guy who wasn't that bright - selling drugs to a cop He gets arrested or something stupid again...he's done. He doesn't he actually could amount to something good.
The kid from ND...he heals up he's one heck of a football player. 6th/7th round there is no risk involved.
No time to commit suicide...Oh woah is us...sit back n enjoy the team you love. Being Bitter about it don't make it Realistic just Bitter.
Later sore all over as I walked 18 - therapy for me...Shot 40 on the back unfortunately shot 50 on the front  but won all my bets 
See it doesn't take much to make me Happy. We are getting closer n closer. I see a lot of good by the FO so far. As Banner stated we win...who is going to gripe
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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jc...
Did anyone catch PFT on NBC sport channel?
Florio and a couple of analists were breaking down the AFC teams draft.
Florio's comment about the Browns...it makes no since for Lombardi to wait till next year to fill positions of need that need addressed "now". Florio thought the Browns should have used all their picks.
Here is the PFT draft review of the Browns...
Draft review: Cleveland Browns
Posted by Mike Florio on April 28, 2013, 1:38 PM EDT
Before the draft, we looked at the needs of the Cleveland Browns. (Eventually, those needs included “a really good lawyer.”) Now that the draft is over, it’s time to look at how they did.
What they needed: Cornerback, quarterback, receiver, linebacker, safety, tight end, kicker.
Who they got:
Round 1: Barkevious Mingo, LB, LSU.
Round 3: Lee McFadden, CB, San Diego State.
Round 6: Jamoris Slaughter, S, Notre Dame.
Round 7: Armonty Bryant, DE, East Central (OK); Garrett Gilkey, OT, Chadron State.
Where they hit: Mingo can be called a luxury pick, given that the Browns didn’t have a pressing need at outside linebacker. But the ability to get to the quarterback no longer is a luxury in the NFL; it’s a necessity. With free-agent acquisition Paul Kruger, the Browns suddenly have the ability to apply the Chudzinski Crunch to the likes of Ben Roethlisberger, Joe Flacco, and Andy Dalton. McFadden gives them a potential starter across from Joe Haden, and Slaughter fills an obvious need at safety.
Where they missed: With their second-round pick used last July on receiver Josh Gordon, the Browns traded their fourth-round pick for a third-round pick in 2014, and then their fifth-round pick for a fourth-round pick in 2014. For a team that needs to get better now, deferring a pair of picks to next year won’t help that effort, regardless of who they eventually get.
Impact rookies: Mingo could become an instant star, especially if opposing offenses opt not to game-plan around him until he proves his ability at the NFL level. McFadden could get a lot of interceptions, if quarterbacks avoid Haden and test the rookie. And if the rookie passes.
Long-term prospects: The Browns already had a decent amount of talent, and the decision to not draft a quarterback means that Brandon Weeden will indeed get another year to show that he’s the long-term answer. The lack of any new tight ends, given coach Rob Chudzinski’s affinity for those who play the position, is a good sign for the five guys already under contract.
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While my viewpoint might not be popular with the home town crowd on this message board, many who analyze football for a business raise the same concerns I have raised.
Don't be upset with me because I'm not following the crowd on DT.
BTW, Florio criticized Lombardi for the trades...we all know that Banner made the decision to trade our 4th & 5th round picks away. Lombardi does not have that kind of authority...
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Quote:
We fleeced the Steelers and you turn it around and make another ridiculous bash against the FO
We FLEECED the Steelers? Yeah, the Steelers always get fleeced. Worst drafting team of all time..... Oh wait, NO THEY AREN'T. Even if we use the pick next year for a solid player, I'd hardly call forgoing a pick this year to take one slightly higher next year as fleecing someone. Maybe we gain 10 or 12 spots. WOW, what a deal. Meanwhile they have a player on their roster and we have.....HOLES at some positions that can be filled in the fourth(the HIGH fourth). And if they blow the pick next year? That's right, they can't blow a pick in your eyes. They have become the new Mankok. Infallible. Every move is genius, every pick a superstar. Just like the 09 draft. You thought that was awesome.
#BlackLivesMatter #StopAsianHate
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this seems like a fair assesment, that said ...I disagree that Gordon is a miss and he fails to mention Bess which also filled a need. the trade of picks? I do not know I am kind of torn. I would have preferred to add this year but I understand the reasoning. Yeah it can be labeled a miss this year,,, but IMO it will be a hit next year
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A smart person knows what to say.
A wise person knows whether or not to say it.
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Quote:
Quote:
We fleeced the Steelers and you turn it around and make another ridiculous bash against the FO
We FLEECED the Steelers? Yeah, the Steelers always get fleeced. Worst drafting team of all time..... Oh wait, NO THEY AREN'T. Even if we use the pick next year for a solid player, I'd hardly call forgoing a pick this year to take one slightly higher next year as fleecing someone. Maybe we gain 10 or 12 spots. WOW, what a deal. Meanwhile they have a player on their roster and we have.....HOLES at some positions that can be filled in the fourth(the HIGH fourth). And if they blow the pick next year? That's right, they can't blow a pick in your eyes. They have become the new Mankok. Infallible. Every move is genius, every pick a superstar. Just like the 09 draft. You thought that was awesome.
Roberts, who was hired by Savage in 2005, served as senior national scout the past three seasons. He was also the Browns director of college scouting in 2009 after spending the previous four seasons as a national scout.
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/
maybe they just don't trust the scouting staff?
being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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j/c
All I have been hearing on the radio, and reading on the net, is how we needed "bodies". If all we needed were bodies then the 17 UDFAs we signed should take care of that.
The thing is, we do not need bodies. We need players. We need upgrades to what we have. Is what was available in the 4th and 5th rounds of this draft (the weakest in God knows how long) really going to make a difference to this team?
I would imagine that the difference in talent between this year's 4th and next year's 3rd to be pretty noticeable. And same with this year's 4th and next year's 5th.
Let's let our guys play a year in the new system, and see who needs replaced.
Seriously, our decision makers know what our weaknesses are, even more than we do. They would not intentionally make moves that do not benefit the team. They had a plan, and they went with it. I am sorry if their plan did not include using the 5th round pick to draft some sleeper safety that some poster has had their eye on since he found some highlights on Youtube.
Let's see what happens before we grade this draft.
Or be like Prisco, who panned the picks of JJ Watt, Von Miller and Clay Matthews right after they were made.
How does a league celebrating its 100th season only recognize the 53 most recent championships?
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Quote:
j/c
All I have been hearing on the radio, and reading on the net, is how we needed "bodies". If all we needed were bodies then the 17 UDFAs we signed should take care of that.
The thing is, we do not need bodies. We need players. We need upgrades to what we have. Is what was available in the 4th and 5th rounds of this draft (the weakest in God knows how long) really going to make a difference to this team?
I would imagine that the difference in talent between this year's 4th and next year's 3rd to be pretty noticeable. And same with this year's 4th and next year's 5th.
Let's let our guys play a year in the new system, and see who needs replaced.
Seriously, our decision makers know what our weaknesses are, even more than we do. They would not intentionally make moves that do not benefit the team. They had a plan, and they went with it. I am sorry if their plan did not include using the 5th round pick to draft some sleeper safety that some poster has had their eye on since he found some highlights on Youtube.
Let's see what happens before we grade this draft.
Or be like Prisco, who panned the picks of JJ Watt, Von Miller and Clay Matthews right after they were made.
yea we have enough bodies on our team for about 3 years. now we just need talent.
being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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just clicking. The Draft is Over.
A saying comes to mind.
" You make your bed, you have to lie in it."
Last edited by THROW LONG; 04/29/13 08:30 PM.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Quote:
While my viewpoint might not be popular with the home town crowd on this message board, many who analyze football for a business raise the same concerns I have raised.
Don't be upset with me because I'm not following the crowd on DT.
People don't dismiss your viewpoints as a joke because they're negative.
They do so because most of the time your viewpoints are rooted in a narrow bias, and your comments aren't so much reasoned insight as 'how can I find an angle to trash the regime'?
Sure, some people don't and won't like negativity around here. But there's plenty of posters who are quite negative, but aren't a laughingstock. It comes from presentation and methods of argument more than just having an unpopular opinion.
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