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I just got off the Mt. Rushmore thread and this came to mind. Give me your 5 all-time most hated Browns. They could be players, coaches, FO guys, etc. Just leave Art off, because he'll be on every list. LOL Here is mine: John Collins: This guy was a snake in the grass and had a huge grip on Junior until he was soundly defeated by the fans and media when he tried to oust Savage. And no, I was never a fan of Savage. Tim Couch: Over-hyped, timid, cry baby who had great support here. His drafting and second contract killed the new-era Browns. Braylon Edwards: I have Leon stories that will boggle your mind. He was the most selfish player I have ever seen in a Brown's uniform. Randy Lerner: The silver spoon fed Junior inherited the team from his father, who helped Art move the team to Cleveland. What a coincidence that he got the Browns. Junior was weird. Doing interviews by emails. Making mass firings of secretaries, custodians, field workers, and the like. He never had the fortitude to stick w/a plan. Mike Holmgren: The Big Show had a big ego but did not put in the work. He set this franchise back years by insisting that we hire only guys who had the same agent as he and implementing his antiquated WCO. His arrogant and rude behavior was almost as bad as his indifference to Cleveland and his love affair w/Seattle. His in-season vacations to Arizona were the icing on the cake. Btw Mike..........any update on the playoff tickets?  Thank God all are gone.
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I have better things to do.
Joe Thomas #73
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2nd String
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I cannot hardly remember anything before The Move, so I will just stick to the "new" Browns. Also, I'll stick to players because the list would be too long if I included FO guys.
1. Jamal Lewis - I couldn't stand when we got him. I never like when guys switch teams and play for a rival; it really devalues the notion of a rivalry IMO. I'm not saying he didn't play hard for us, but I always knew he didn't care about Cleveland.
2. Willie McGinest - Talk about a dude who ONLY cared about a paycheck. Not to mention he was totally washed up by the time he got here. He stole money from us and gave us very little production in return. He's another guy who didn't ever care about us.
3. Shaun Rogers - Fat/Lazy/Unmotivated piece of crap. What a waste of talent he was and he wanted to be constantly placated to throughout his whole time here. I would say he gave us about 10% of what he could have.
4. Gerard Warren - See Shaun Rogers.
5. Trent Dilfer - It was tough to not say Jeff Garcia or Jake Delhomme, but neither of them badmouthed us when they left. Dilfer was garbage for us and then he had the audacity to talk crap on the franchise publicly.
Honestly, this list was tough to narrow down to 5. There were TONS more that I could list.
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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Jeff Garcia, Trent Dilfer, Jamal Lewis, Rison, John St. Claire, Dabool&Mangini
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Art Modell takes all 5 spots. 
You know my love will Not Fade Away.........
#gmSTRONG
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Quote:
Tim Couch: Over-hyped, timid, cry baby who had great support here. His drafting and second contract killed the new-era Browns.
Really?! The guy never had an offensive line, decent running back, or much of a supporting cast outside of Kevin "Me Me Me Me" Johnson. Couch was a formidable QB when given time to throw. Did Timmy spill your milk one day?
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Randy Lerner: The silver spoon fed Junior inherited the team from his father, who helped Art move the team to Cleveland. What a coincidence that he got the Browns. Junior was weird. Doing interviews by emails. Making mass firings of secretaries, custodians, field workers, and the like. He never had the fortitude to stick w/a plan.
You dislike him because he got rid of Mangini and brought in Holmgren.
Quote:
Holmgren Rant
Sure he had some gaffes but I don't think he's as awful as you described him. He tried to install an offensive system which required the QBs to make accurate and timely passes. He did draft those QBs. Not his fault they couldn't rise to the challenge.
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Legend
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I like most of our guys.
Probably Derek Anderson but a lot of that comes after the fact. Had no problem with him when he was throwing TD's in 2007.
Didn't like the signing, and starting of John St. Clair but that guy wasn't drafted and only lasted a few games before being buried on the depth chart. He was awful. Even Bears fans told me they hoped to God he wasn't starting for us.
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Seriously?!? Is something wrong with you?  What a moronic thread.
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Mike Phipps, Mike Junkin, Tommy Vardell, Bill Belichick, Gerard Warren (because I wanted LT).
Welcome back, Joe, we missed you!
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Art Model
Trent Dilfer
Joe Andruzzi
David Veikune
Pat Shurmur (I'll also include our other idiotic OCs in this.Brain DaBoll for instance.)
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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Quote:
Seriously?!?
Is something wrong with you?
What a moronic thread.
Dynamite drop in there. Forgot how hard it is to ignore a post you don't like to read. Also this thread is just some fun banter, try and not to be a stick in the mud.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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Quote:
Dead?
What a moronic thread.
I disagree... I think it is a good thread. It doesn't have to be player from 99-today either
the one that really comes to my mind is:
5 Touchdowns Tommy Vardell
4 years 1,070 yards rushing 3 TD's 434 yards receiving 2 td's
second one... Don Rogers - talk about blown talent.
third Gerrard Warren he wasn't worth a penny
fourth Orpheus Roye (just for going to the Steelers)
fifth- the three (overconfident trash talking yet worthless WR's) amigos Travis Wilson Andre Rison and Braylon Edwards
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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Legend
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one more that I had to look up his name... a couple of my friends dads used to complain about the only 2nd round punter the Browns ever took. his name was Johnny Evans.
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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Didn't Orpheus roye come here from the Steelers?
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Quote:
Didn't Orpheus roye come here from the Steelers?
Yep. He came from the Steelers to the Browns ..... then back to the Steelers for his final season. He was a 6th round pick of the Steelers in 1996.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Art Modell.
Everyone else can be forgiven.
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Art Modell and Winslow everybody else at least had some redeeming qualities.
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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Quote:
Art Modell and Winslow everybody else at least had some redeeming qualities.
Even Andre Rison? 
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I don't know if hate is the word....lets say disliked.
In no order.
Dwight Clark...he set up the Browns for failure once we returned.
Art...I also like the guy, but he did move the team so he has to be on the list.
Tim Couch...nice enough guy but we wasted too much time on him....maybe that wasn't his fault, but he makes my list.
Pat Shurmer....it wasn't his fault he was hired to be a head coach, but he sucked in every phase of the game.
Wali Rainer.....he made a bunch of tackles. The problem was they were all about 7 yards past the LOS. Chump Thompson could be tied here....he didn't make tackles but would always hustle ove to the pile....I suppose so in the film room the following week coaches could see his number somewhere around the ball.
Another guy I never like was Charlie Scales. The radio calls went something like this: " The pitch to Scales to the wide side....he has blockers in front!....He slips!"
That ticked me off. Seemed like he did that 2-3 times a game.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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My measurement tool for this would be "who had me cussing at the TV the most while they were here". So, that would be:
D.A.: I used to shudder and scream every time he dropped back.
John St. Claire: Watching him stand there while DL ran around and through him was excruciating,
Braylon: Just STFU
Doug Deiken: his holding penalties always seemed to stall drives or bring back good plays. I realize Deiken was a good lineman, but he really used to tick me off and have me screaming at the TV.
Tim Couch and Kelly Holcomb: They never failed to follow up a good game with a run of boring duds....dashing my hopes that things were turning around.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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Hate's not really in my vocabulary when it comes to the Browns. Life is way too short. But I'd have to say that I couldn't stand Brady Quinn. Not only a complete bust, but a punk to boot. I can't ever remember being so elated and so angry in one round of a draft.
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Are you a ref? Because you sure get away w/a lot of insults.
***************************
Some of you mentioned Andre Rison. He was the first guy I thought of and probably does deserve to be on the list.
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Hmm...wow, this one has my brain racing.
I'd have to go with:
Modell
Edwards
Butch Davis
Andre Rison
Ross Verba
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
#gmstrong
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Art Model
TD Vardell - I lost way to much money on him
MIke Junkin - A puppy in a candy store
Andre Rison - Still say his salary was the beginning of the end for the Old Browns
Art Modell - because I hate him twice as much as everybodty else.
#gmstrong
A smart person knows what to say.
A wise person knows whether or not to say it.
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Quote:
I just got off the Mt. Rushmore thread and this came to mind.
Give me your 5 all-time most hated Browns. They could be players, coaches, FO guys, etc. Just leave Art off, because he'll be on every list. LOL
Here is mine:
John Collins: This guy was a snake in the grass and had a huge grip on Junior until he was soundly defeated by the fans and media when he tried to oust Savage. And no, I was never a fan of Savage.
Tim Couch: Over-hyped, timid, cry baby who had great support here. His drafting and second contract killed the new-era Browns.
Braylon Edwards: I have Leon stories that will boggle your mind. He was the most selfish player I have ever seen in a Brown's uniform.
Randy Lerner: The silver spoon fed Junior inherited the team from his father, who helped Art move the team to Cleveland. What a coincidence that he got the Browns. Junior was weird. Doing interviews by emails. Making mass firings of secretaries, custodians, field workers, and the like. He never had the fortitude to stick w/a plan.
Mike Holmgren: The Big Show had a big ego but did not put in the work. He set this franchise back years by insisting that we hire only guys who had the same agent as he and implementing his antiquated WCO. His arrogant and rude behavior was almost as bad as his indifference to Cleveland and his love affair w/Seattle. His in-season vacations to Arizona were the icing on the cake. Btw Mike..........any update on the playoff tickets?
Thank God all are gone.
i disagree with holmgren. he had heckert as his gm, who drafted more talent than any gm from the past. other than jt most of our 1st and 2nd rounds picks were not in the nfl 4 yrs after we drafted them. you can go back to the marty's yrs and his picks of the horrible lb.. just think about it for awhile, only the 78 yr of oz and clay were good...
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1. Corey Fuller
2. Corey Fuller
3. Corey Fuller
4. Corey Fuller
5a. Corey Fuller
5b. Usama Young
I absolutely loathe and despise Corey Fuller as a player. I don't know anything about him as a person, so I'm limiting this to just his on the field performance.
Not only did he suck in general, but he'd trash talk a guy after giving up a 70 yard reception. He was just so horrible that simply thinking about him makes my blood pressure rise.
And, to make matters worse, there's a guy in my section about 15 rows down who has a Fuller jersey. It not only makes no sense that someone would buy a jersey of a crappy player, but that he'd wear it! I want to throw hot dogs at him every time I see it.
Usama Young made the list because he was just awful. Again, this is on the field only. Seems like off the field he's a stand up guy.
I just think about his "tackle" against the Titans a couple years ago and I want to barf.
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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Thanks for reminding me about Jared Cook. That may be my least favorite play of the new Browns ... or Northcutt's drop ... or Rudd's helmet toss ... or Stuckey's fumble ... or ...
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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Ross Verba and Pat Shurmur 
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Robert Royal - One of the most uncoordinated offensive players I've ever watched. Anyone remember the game against the Bengals a few years ago where he dropped three potential TD passes?
Gerard Warren - anyone who refers to themselves as "Big Money" coming out of college has a problem. Every year during TC we'd hear about how dedicatated he was to making himself a better player, but the results on the field never seemed to show. Him saying he was going to knock out Roethlisberger and then recording one tackle during the game was one of the more idiotic statements made by one of our players since the rebirth.
Charlie Frye - Hate to bash a hometown kid, but he had no intangibles. From running into sacks to throwing the most frustrating interceptions, he just didn't have "it". Can't believe we wasted a season and a half on him.
Quincy Morgan - Dropped so many of the routine catches most normal WR's make. I thought he made some negative comments towards Cleveland after he left, but can't remember exactly what was said.
William Green - Seemed like a thug from the start. I've heard a few stories about how mean he was to fans seeking his autograph after practices. Always looked like he was trying to run in quicksand.
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Quincy Morgan
Mike Phipps
Mike Oliphant
Shaun Rogers
Braylon Edwards
Bill Belichick (the guy had Bernie released, so I can't forgive him!)
There may be people who have more talent than you, but there's no excuse for anyone to work harder than you do.
-Derek Jeter
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I don't hate any former player or coach or owner. How could I, I've only met a handful of them over the years and they've been pretty nice.. nothing to hate them for.
I have hated the job some of them did. I have hated how some were misused/miscast
I've hated how a few of them couldn't stay healthy.
If I had to boil it down, for me the closest I get to hating on anyone is probably Art Modell. If he was truly remorseful (as he said he was) about moving the team, all he had to do was sell it to someone with the cash to bail him out.
But that's about it,.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Forgot about William Green. He literally shoved my little cousin and said "Get out my face man" after a practice one day when he was asking for an autograph. We were standing in one of those lines near the tent and Green was sitting down obligated to sign that day. Obviously everyone wanted to get his, as he finished up there was no one left in the line. My cousin went up to him as he was walking away and got shoved. It was his rookie year and I knew right then he was an idiot.
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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There are several but Ross Verba sprang to mind first...
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Quote:
Quote:
Art Modell and Winslow everybody else at least had some redeeming qualities.
Even Andre Rison?
I'm sure he had to have one redeeming quality. 
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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Quote:
Bill Belichick (the guy had Bernie released, so I can't forgive him!)
readin through this i was wondering if anybody was gonna mention that. First guy who popped in my mind.
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I wouldn't say I hated him, but I disliked Pepper Johnson for some statements he made about Browns fans needing to be taught about football. This was in the aftermath of Kosar's release when there was a large portion of fans disenchanted with Belichick and company. Others I disliked would be 'Chuckles' Belichick himself, Andre Rison, David Modell, and Carmen Policy.
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I don't see how any fan can "hate" a Browns player.
Many of the players didn't have a choice in the matter (they were drafted). And I'd be willing to bet that the vast majority do everything in their power to compete at their highest level.
Take a guy like David Veikune. It wasn't any fault of his that he was drafted in the second round by Mangini. As a person who watched him play at Hawaii I knew that was way beyond where he should have gone. And that level of production which was poor elicited "hate" from fans. Completely misplaced hate.
There are guys like Marecic and St. Claire that are miserable football players but I don't hate them. There are guys like Earl Little who write checks their body can't cash but I know that some people have to talk themselves up.
Finally a there are guys like Braylon who are given all the talent in the world but it goes squandered which is disappointing but shouldn't register to a level of hate.
I just find it of poor character to hate a player.
Art Modell consciously made a decision in his best interest at the tremendous expense of the city of Cleveland and the teams fans that I do think can register as a reason for hate.
But outside of that feeling hate towards a player is really low IMO.
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I remember discussing Veikune when we drafted him with you. Growing up in Berea, I went o TC every season, multiple times each season. Usually at least 5 a season. I have NEVER seen a player that belonged less on the field than that guy. Not only was he pathetic, he didn't look like he even GAF. After the first training camp practice I knew he was a bum. Also I dont think anyone of us are signing up to spit on these guys (outside of model  ) I believe hate is a term used in jest. Would you guys stop QQing about that if the OP changed it "strongly disliked the player/on the field production" ? I believe that's all they're getting at.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Your All-Time Most Hated Browns
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