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j/c
Put in a SOLID game today. 3.1 ypc.
Call canton, get his bust ready.
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Can't believe ppl are still torn up about this trade. We made out like bandits with this trade. RB's like Trent are a dime a dozen. He is not an AP, who was a once in a lifetime prospect at RB.
We got a first round pick for a RB that is average at best. He will have a great game here and there, but his consistency is at the 3 ypc range. You can get that with an UDFA.
Didn't hate Heckert and team per se, but the Richardson and Weeden picks in the first round were one of the biggest busts since our return. Right up there with how Mangini handled our two 2nd rounders. Imagine where we would be if we hit on those picks....
“It doesn't make sense to hire smart people and tell them what to do; we hire smart people so they can tell us what to do.” -Steve Jobs.
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Legend
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Why don't you post something I can argue with? 
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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I live down in Alabama football country, I got into it with an Alabama fan that thinks Trent is just the best thing that could happen for indy & can't believe the Browns traded him. I kept trying to tell him, he didn't know jack about Trent in the pros. I wasn't happy we traded up for Trent but was glad he was on the team. However, I never has seen a reputation proceed actual on fied accomplishments like Trent. Indy is finding out that too. ( except maybe tebow I wish him well but it is looking like we fleeced Indy on this trade. However, if the lights ever come on for Trent he will be a monster like Lynch for Seattle. Can't wait to see who will be on the Browns for Indy's pick.
If I only knew then what I know today...
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Quote:
In one of the most shocking in-season NFL trades in recent history, the Cleveland Browns traded Trent Richardson to the Indianapolis Colts for a 1st-round draft pick three weeks ago.
The NFL world took it as a sign the Browns were tanking, throwing away the season after a 0-2 start and trying to stockpile future assets.
While it was hard to stomach for Browns fans, the logic made sense.
But no one considered another possibility.... maybe the Browns just didn't think Richardson was any good.
Everyone's analyzing this trade under the assumption that Richardson is super talented (he was taken 3rd-overall in 2012, after all). But is he really?
There's a mounting pile of evidence suggesting that Richardson is an average-at-best player. And if that's the case (which it appears to be), this is an absolute steal and genius trade by the Browns.
Last year Richardson averaged 3.6 yards per carry (40th in the NFL) and only had two runs of 20 yards or more.
It wasn't his line's fault either. According to the advanced football stat site ProFootballFocus, the Browns had the 11th best running blocking line in the league last year, and the 5th best line overall. His back-up last year, Montario Hardesty, averaged 4.2 yards per carry behind the same line, which would have ranked 21st in the league.
So far for the Colts he has 51 carries for 151 yards (2.9 yards per carry) and zero runs of 20 yards or more. The four other Colts players who have at least 10 rushing attempts are all averaging 4.5 yards per carry or more.
Those are the statistics of a below-replacement level running back. And the Browns, who've become incredibly compelling since the trade, got a 1st-round pick for him.
Link
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I popped over to the Indy message board because I was curious what the fans were saying. There seems to be a few hopefuls, saying that he was only there for a few weeks, have patience, etc. But there are others who are starting to show concern. One poster noted that TRich was pretty much doing exactly what made him expendable in Cleveland.
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It's amazing how many of the TV guys never mention TRich's failures as a pro. They all act like he is this dynamic back. He is far from that.
He's been supplied w/a ton of excuses, but the fact is, his yards per carry suck and he misses holes consistently.
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It's amazing how many of the TV guys never mention TRich's failures as a pro. They all act like he is this dynamic back. He is far from that.
He's been supplied w/a ton of excuses, but the fact is, his yards per carry suck and he misses holes consistently.
I said at the time of the trade to a few people, that I was actually more disappointed in T-Rich than I was with Weeden so far in their careers. Sure, Weeden hasn't been very good himself, but at least he's got some legitimate excuses in receivers not getting open, having to learn a second offense in less than a year, and the fact that the QB position in general is a lot harder to step in and be immediately effective. T-Rich was supposed to be a legitimate franchise back ala LT/Peterson, which is why he went #3 overall. RB is a position where there isn't supposed to be a whole lot of learning curve ... you hit the hole and run. Instead, it seemed we drafted another version of William Green.
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Hell, I'd take William Green's production in the 2nd half of 2002 over Trent.
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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thats true.
Guess my prediction for 1600 and 18 TDs fell through pretty quickly. Oops to me.
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
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Was excited about the trade.....still excited about the trade
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J/C Thought this belonged here. Now we'll see if Richardson can carry the load. Now that Bradshaw has been shelved. This is Luck's team, but anything that can improve the potential for that first rounder, I'm all for. And 'No' I'm not hating on Bradshaw, as I hate to see anyone go down, but have been a fan of every team that has played against the Colts this year -- for obvious reasons.  web page Ahmad Bradshaw is shutting it down. NFL Media Insider Ian Rapoport reported Tuesday that the Indianapolis Colts running back will undergo neck surgery and miss the remainder of the season, per a team source. The Colts announced that Bradshaw was placed on season-ending injured reserve. ProFootballTalk first reported news of the surgery. Andrew Luck Bradshaw injured his neck in the Colts' Week 3 win over the San Francisco 49ers. Surgery loomed as a possibility, but the hope was that rest and rehabilitation would allow the neck to heal on its own. That plan has now apparently been abandoned. Bradshaw and Vick Ballard were expected to handle the majority of work at running back for the Colts this season. Instead, both were lost to season-ending injuries by the end of September. Trent Richardson and Donald Brown will continue on as the new face of Indy's backfield. "We really feel Donald Brown and Trent Richardson is a heck of a backfield," Colts owner Jim Irsay told Rapoport at the NFL Fall Meeting. This is a terrible setback for Bradshaw, who signed a one-year contract with the Colts and was hoping to prove himself as a player both productive and durable. With a neck injury to go with a pair of chronically bad feet, Bradshaw could find it difficult getting another team to take a chance on him.
And the next head coach is ......
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j/c Trent Richardson Just Plain Sucks Even before Trent Richardson almost fumbled away his team's upset victory over the Denver Broncos last night, he was having a bad game. Which is to say, he was having the kind of game he's been having all season. It's hard to believe that Richardson—the guy who was drafted third overall in 2012 and was poached from Cleveland by the Colts in exchange for a prized first-round pick early this season—can be this bad, but it may be time to face the fact that Trent Richardson is just not a very good running back. In his rookie season last year, Richardson didn't put up gaudy numbers, but he seemingly showed promise. He finished with 950 rushing yards and 11 TDs, and ran for over 100 yards in a game three times. Those numbers aren't bad, especially for a rookie who had to spend the year running behind the Cleveland Browns' offensive line, which Football Outsiders ranked as the 13th-worst run-blocking unit in the league by adjusted line yards. And yet, advanced stats do not paint a very flattering picture of Richardson's rookie season, either. Football Outsiders ranked him as the 6th-worst back in the league in 2012, as he posted a -51 DYAR and a -13.3% DVOA. Basically, he played far below replacement level for the entire season. Advanced stats reckoned him a worse running back than both Shonn Greene and Mark Ingram. And what of his pass blocking? Basic statistics indicated that he was a good protector in the backfield, but deeper investigations like this one, done at Football Perspective, indicate that he was average at best. But even when using advanced stats, it's tough to separate a running back's performance from that of his offensive line's, and vice versa—though Football Outsiders' metrics do try. Was Richardson really that bad of a runner in 2012, or did his talents simply fall victim to playing for a crappy team with a crappy line? Thanks to Richardson's arrival in Indianapolis after Week 2, it appears that we have the answer to that question. When Richardson left Cleveland for Indianapolis, he traded the 12th-worst offensive line for the league's best. Based on Football Outsider's adjusted line yards, the Colts have boasted the best run-blocking unit in the league this year, and yet somehow Richardson has continued to play poorly. He's currently ranked as the 15th-worst running back (out of the 36 with 50 or more carries) in the league with a DYAR of eight and a DVOA of -6.2%. Even more damning for Richardson is the fact that the Colts' other running backs have found great success running behind the team's line this year. Donald Brown only has 33 carries (he needs 17 more to qualify for Football Outsiders' rankings), but he's averaging 5.9 yards per carry. Before he went down with a neck injury, Ahmad Bradshaw was also carving up defenses on the ground. In three games, Bradshaw amassed 186 yards on 41 carries, good for 4.5 yards per carry. Meanwhile, Richardson's yards per carry average sits at a paltry 3.0. The Colts proved that they are a team to be reckoned with last night, and it's hard to believe that they won't be able to find a way to wring some value out of Richardson. If you're looking for a bright spot, his effective yards gained (311) outpace his total rushing yards (256), which may indicate that he's playing at least a little better than his standard statistics—which are incredibly bleak—indicate. Still, it looks like Richardson isn't the franchise running back so many people expected him to be. Before this season, we were told that he was set to become the next LaDanian Tomlinson, but so far he's looked a lot more like Curtis Enis. Richardson can likely be a useful cog in a successful team's running-back-by-committee scheme, but the Colts will very likely end up wishing they still had that first-round pick when all is said and done. After all, there are usually some pretty talented running backs to be had late in the first round. http://deadspin.com/trent-richardson-just-plain-sucks-1449011871
being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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I'll be the first to admit that I was so very wrong about this guy. He passed every single eye test, right up until he didn't hit his open run lanes. The only thing I could attempt to argue is that it took Hardesty a couple years to figure this same concept out before he started running well last year.
I've been a big Heckert guy, but his last draft sure is turning sour. What a shame.
To be fair, though, it seems Heckert and co. weren't the only people fooled regarding Richardson. The media talking heads and other coaches and GMs (including the Colts, obviously) thought highly of this guy's talent.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
-PrplPplEater
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Some guys just can't play in the NFL. They are drafted where they should be drafted they just can't play.
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I'll be the first to admit that I was so very wrong about this guy. He passed every single eye test, right up until he didn't hit his open run lanes. The only thing I could attempt to argue is that it took Hardesty a couple years to figure this same concept out before he started running well last year.
I've been a big Heckert guy, but his last draft sure is turning sour. What a shame.
To be fair, though, it seems Heckert and co. weren't the only people fooled regarding Richardson. The media talking heads and other coaches and GMs (including the Colts, obviously) thought highly of this guy's talent.
Yup, got me also..
You know who wasn't fooled by it, Jim Brown...LOL
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Who would've thought Jim Brown would be the voice of reason?
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
-PrplPplEater
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Who would've thought Jim Brown would be the voice of reason?
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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Who would've thought Jim Brown would be the voice of reason?
LOL,, Not me that's for sure.. What was it he said, Richardson isn't anything special or something like that.. Boy did he turn out to be right.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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LMAO!!! All the people that thought the sky was falling,and turned in your Brownie badges after that trade.Have some faith in the FO,as they got a sweetheart deal for a very avg RB.Yeah,Richardson is really tearing it up in Indy..lol..not!!! Anybody that thinks the new regime wasn't going to,or isn't going to gut this offense is in serious need of coffee.Get on board folks,and enjoy the show for the last miserable season,as the jokes of the league.I say embrace watching Weeden stink it up each week,embrace watching morons drop easy catches each week,as these will be the last days of them on our club.They were never wanted here to begin with and will be thrown out the back door,once the offseason starts.If these guys just bought the team for money,well I can assure you that there are far easier ways,to make it than buying a junk ball club.All of those draft picks,and plenty of cap space,was done for a very specific reason in their plans a very long time ago,of which we are not privy to.Hang in there Brownies,good times are coming for us again. 
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Richardson yesterday.......14 for 37..... long 8
Joe Thomas #73
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He left Cleveland with an average of 3.4 yards/carry. He is at 3.14 yards/carry for the season now. (actually, his season average is pi to 4 decimal places .... which is kinda weird) He is at only 3.0 yards/carry as a Colt.
That's on a better team with a far better QB.
Maybe the Colts aren't in a panic yet ...... but they have to be concerned.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I've seen quite a few Colts games since the trade,and I'm pretty sure they regret making that deal.If you are near the goal line,Trent will get in there,but aside from that he kinda stinks.Good for our FO on that move. 
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Stated from the moment I heard about it. I was excited about the trade then, and still am today. Oh the possibilities 
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Quote:
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Who would've thought Jim Brown would be the voice of reason?
LOL,, Not me that's for sure.. What was it he said, Richardson isn't anything special or something like that.. Boy did he turn out to be right.
Yep. And I think when he said it a lot of us where hurt, but as it turned out, he is spot on.
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Who would've thought Jim Brown would be the voice of reason?
LOL,, Not me that's for sure.. What was it he said, Richardson isn't anything special or something like that.. Boy did he turn out to be right.
Yep. And I think when he said it a lot of us where hurt, but as it turned out, he is spot on.
Maybe we should ask Jim Brown about who our QB should be
#gmstrong
A smart person knows what to say.
A wise person knows whether or not to say it.
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This trade is by far the best value this new FO has made, recouping a lot from Heckert's biggest draft mistake (yeah, bigger than Weeden, we discussed that to death and nobody will change my mind on it, lol).
Overall, Banner and co have mostly shown a good eye for value on NFL players (D.Bryant, Bess, TRich etc), but not so much with "converting" this value looking back to their 1st draft, though the big one where this value was punted to is the next one and that's the one that will make or break them.
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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Who would've thought Jim Brown would be the voice of reason?
LOL,, Not me that's for sure.. What was it he said, Richardson isn't anything special or something like that.. Boy did he turn out to be right.
Yep. And I think when he said it a lot of us where hurt, but as it turned out, he is spot on.
I wasn't hurt by his comments, I was just thinking he was an idiot LOL
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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but not so much with "converting" this value looking back to their 1st draft
It's week 8.
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Richardson yesterday.......14 for 37..... long 8
That sounds like Brandon Weeden's line too. 
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Richardson yesterday.......14 for 37..... long 8
That sounds like Brandon Weeden's line too.
Joe Thomas #73
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I've been a big Heckert guy, but his last draft sure is turning sour. What a shame.
I wonder how much of that was "forced hand" stuff. I thought both the Richardson and Weeden pick were pretty huge reaches. Even the Gordon supplemental pick (which turned out to be a bargain) all seemed to wreak of "We need to get an instant offense going right now or we'll be out of a job".
Most of his Best Player over Need picks seem to have been pretty decent.
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I've been a big Heckert guy, but his last draft sure is turning sour. What a shame.
I wonder how much of that was "forced hand" stuff. I thought both the Richardson and Weeden pick were pretty huge reaches. Even the Gordon supplemental pick (which turned out to be a bargain) all seemed to wreak of "We need to get an instant offense going right now or we'll be out of a job".
Most of his Best Player over Need picks seem to have been pretty decent.
I don't recall how the timelines matched up.... did Heckert already know about Banner at that point?
Maybe they knew they were already gone and just mailed it in or intentionally hosed it?
I mean, they HAD to know about Haslam at that point - I'm nearly positive of that... and if Haslam and Banner were all chummy by then, you know the whispers would have been in the wind.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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They might have had an inkling, but nothing was public knowledge at that point.
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I don't recall how the timelines matched up.... did Heckert already know about Banner at that point?
Maybe they knew they were already gone and just mailed it in or intentionally hosed it?
I mean, they HAD to know about Haslam at that point - I'm nearly positive of that... and if Haslam and Banner were all chummy by then, you know the whispers would have been in the wind.
July 27th, 2012 was the first "news" of an impending sale from Lerner ... but by then, you know they had to have been in talks for awhile. Banner was already a part of the group that was interested in buying, so it's entirely conceivable that Holmgren/Heckart knew that 2012 was going to be a do-or-die year/audition for a potential new owner. I'm not sure I'd go as far to say they intentionally tanked the draft to screw things up for a potential new GM ... but I think they certainly rushed into filling positions, hoping that they could generate some instant offense.
I just remember that draft being the only time I really shook my head at the first two picks made. They just seemed like huge reaches at the time, before I eventually talked myself into it.
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Quote:
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Richardson yesterday.......14 for 37..... long 8
That sounds like Brandon Weeden's line too.
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did Heckert already know about Banner at that point?
IIRC haslam and banner were mentioned in the same breath from the get go.
tradition can only carry you so far, then you have to start winning again.
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did Heckert already know about Banner at that point?
IIRC haslam and banner were mentioned in the same breath from the get go.
I guess it's possible that the negotiations could have been going on in April of 2012. I don't know how long it takes to complete an agreement for a football team.
Or maybe he just saw the pick as a bonus, because it was from a prior trade and we had already drafted our franchise player in Richardson (lol) so he figured low risk/high reward on Weeden.
The weird thing is, Weeden did not fit what Holmgren and Shurmur wanted. When you think that kind of offense, Weeden, and how he played at OKST really didn't pop out at me. I'm actually surprised they didn't chase Tannehill more. Most of us weren't big on the guy, but the kid ran a very similar offense at A&M.
Or maybe Heckert just had a few in him after celebrating the trade up to get Richardson?
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The weird thing is, Weeden did not fit what Holmgren and Shurmur wanted.
This could be one of the bigger indicators that the WCO was already dead in C-Town. Why else would they draft a guy that CLEARLY did not fit what they wanted to do?
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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j/c
keep hearing how Holmgren draft this qb and that qb. my question is who did heckert want from year to year?
being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum The belated TRich trade thread
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