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Exactly. At this point I wouldn't even think about trading him. If you do trade him and get a high draft pick what are you going to do with that? Pick a new WR straight out of college that has to prove he can do it in the NFL? No thank you! We have already seen that Gordon has what it takes to potentially be one of the best. So at this point I think it would be stupid to get rid of him since you'd be trading away almost you're only legit deep thread on offense. Also, a trade would further anger the fan base who is already unhappy because of the Weeden games that happened recently. Is that really something they want to do? 
Find what you love and let it kill you.
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The fanbase was up in arms over the Richardson trade ....... yet that appears to be the right decision so far. One thing about this front office so far is that they seem willing to do what they think is right, regardless of the PR side of things.
Besides, what if we trade Gordon for a 4th and a 6th ....... and he's suspended next year? Is that then a good trade? I think that it would be in that case. It is so hard to figure out a player's future, let alone from this far away. I would almost bet that the Browns have someone watching Gordon, either overtly or discretely, and that they have a good idea what he's doing at all times. If they trade him,especially in a "bad" deal, it's almost certainly because they got a bad report on his activities.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I actually think it hinges on the game against KC as silly as that sounds.
Not winning it losing. But with Cambell in, if we come out and look like a respectable offense, they'll keep him. If we come out looking like crap again. They'll trade him.
We can go out next year in FA and grab a guy like Maclin or Nix who aren't number 1#s by any mean. But will still produce and won't have the risk that Gordon comes with.
If the offer is there. I take it.
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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A 4th or even a 3rd is a joke.
For his talent it is. For his possibility of getting suspended I suppose it would be better than getting nothing for him. But then, he hasn't gotten suspended yet so it's only a gamble, not a forgone conclusion.
All considered though, if his only value right now is of a 3rd or low 4th round pick then I don't see the big issue. If he fails then he can be added to the long list of other failed 3rd & 4th rounders. But if he stays clean his value is through the roof.
That seems like a good gamble to take in my opinion.
It's not like he's a cancerous, self-absorbed, ego centered player like Leon. He's just a young guy who's made mistakes and is now facing the consequences of his actions. If he takes heed he can be a big contributor to a Browns team who've lacked big contributors for years.
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Anything but a 1st is a joke. ( I wouldn't trade him for a first) I realize there is risk in keeping him but I would take the risk. I think he could be that good. If he gets suspended then that is a risk we should take. (even a 1st round pick is a risk, we are the Browns) I don't think I could stand seeing him be traded to another team and watch him become Randy Moss 2.0
Totally agree. If we were to trade him for a 3rd or 4th and a 6th... even if he WAS suspended for a year, so what?! A WR we draft in the third or 4th isn't going to make a big difference the first year anyways! At least we'd know that there was a real talent coming back, and not a bit player or undertalented guy like Travis freakin' Wilson for crying out loud. This whole discussion of trading Gordon for anything less than a 1st and a player or a 2nd and an above-average defensive starter is just plain dumb.
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The fanbase was up in arms over the Richardson trade .......
I didn't really see that happen but with a small segment. In our local news reporters interviewing the "man on the street" it seemed to me that most accepted the decision. I didn't even see members here up in arms. But then, the board was down at the time of the trade so we missed that initial reaction. But by the time it was back up it seemed most were accepting of the trade.
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It is so hard to figure out a player's future, let alone from this far away.
I agree. But we're talking about two separate issues here. It's hard to figure out a player's future as a player using talent evaluation. But the issue here is not figuring him out as a player. It's figuring him out as a person, as in his character, as in what he might do or not do in his private life. That's much more difficult in my opinion. Many have straightened out their lives and contributed. Many have not and therefore failed in the NFL.
Stats, as in percentages of how many succeeded/failed are of no help. Each person is an individual. Some ignore help and some absorb the life's lessons.
I think he is worth the gamble. Especially if his current value is a mere 3rd or 4th round pick, (and that is based so much more on his character of private choices and less on is talent level).
If someone were offering the top half of the 1st round then that changes the thinking a lot. That could mean the possibility of trading an uncertain suspension waiting to happen for a possible franchise QB. Even then, we'd have to make the right evaluation on a drafted QB or we'd still get nothing for Gordon.
It's a slippery slope and I'm glad I'm not responsible for the decision as I'd have all you guys on my ass if I failed. Our FO seems ok with that responsibility and the potential backlash that may ensue. So I'm glad they're making the decision but have no idea which way they really lean or how they're weighing it out.
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Anything but a 1st is a joke. ( I wouldn't trade him for a first) I realize there is risk in keeping him but I would take the risk. I think he could be that good. If he gets suspended then that is a risk we should take. (even a 1st round pick is a risk, we are the Browns) I don't think I could stand seeing him be traded to another team and watch him become Randy Moss 2.0
Totally agree. If we were to trade him for a 3rd or 4th and a 6th... even if he WAS suspended for a year, so what?! A WR we draft in the third or 4th isn't going to make a big difference the first year anyways! At least we'd know that there was a real talent coming back, and not a bit player or undertalented guy like Travis freakin' Wilson for crying out loud. This whole discussion of trading Gordon for anything less than a 1st and a player or a 2nd and an above-average defensive starter is just plain dumb.
agreed
If he's traded it better be for a first. OR a QB (Mallett or Cousins) and still a second or third rounder.
IF it's just a 3rd or 4th rounder- what good is that. Just take the risk of a suspension and stick with Gordon.
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Yeah, I'm all for trading him, but not for a 3rd. If a team offers better than what we gave for him I'd probably bite.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Besides, what if we trade Gordon for a 4th and a 6th ....... and he's suspended next year? Is that then a good trade?
No,, because if it's a 1 year suspension, he'll be back the following year.
Make that a 1st or 2nd round pick, then yes because you can get a player that might fill his shoes..
Just an alternate opinion...
#GMSTRONG
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Damanshot
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j/c. A team devoid of playmakers shouldn't even be entertaining the thought of trading one of the few they do have. As far as I'm concerned, we only have 3.....Cameron, Gordon and Benjamin. No one else has made plays that can turn a game around.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
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Besides, what if we trade Gordon for a 4th and a 6th ....... and he's suspended next year? Is that then a good trade?
No,, because if it's a 1 year suspension, he'll be back the following year.
Not quite. He would be banned for one year. After that year was over, he would have to apply for reinstatement. That could be denied if it was determined that he shouldn't be reinstated.
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Besides, what if we trade Gordon for a 4th and a 6th ....... and he's suspended next year? Is that then a good trade?
No,, because if it's a 1 year suspension, he'll be back the following year.
Not quite. He would be banned for one year. After that year was over, he would have to apply for reinstatement. That could be denied if it was determined that he shouldn't be reinstated.
Perhaps the correct way to say it would be that he "COULD" be back in a year.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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j/c. A team devoid of playmakers shouldn't even be entertaining the thought of trading one of the few they do have. As far as I'm concerned, we only have 3.....Cameron, Gordon and Benjamin. No one else has made plays that can turn a game around.
How many does an offense need exactly?
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~ Legend
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j/c. A team devoid of playmakers shouldn't even be entertaining the thought of trading one of the few they do have. As far as I'm concerned, we only have 3.....Cameron, Gordon and Benjamin. No one else has made plays that can turn a game around.
How many does an offense need exactly?
I don't think there's a real set number, but my guess would be infinity.
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I don't know exactly. I would think more than two of your offensive regulars and a ST/situational player. We certainly can't afford to trade one at this point.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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A 4th or even a 3rd is a joke.
Also, I despise Hooley. So glad he's no longer in Columbus.
I agree with that. If that is really the level of pick being offered, then you keep him unless the player being offered in the deal is a good player.....maybe you listen.
Even a 2nd rounder doesn't toally capture me....that is at the point you start weighing the pick v the possibility Gordon smokes some crack this off season.
If it is a 1st rounder, I play Gordon this weekend for all he has and ship him Monday morning. Hopefully Gordon has a great game tomorrow, and the teams thinking about him are exposed by weak receivers and up the offer at the last minute, knowing their playoff season is on the line without a clear upgrade on the outside.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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J/C
I look at offenses as having to be able to beat you at all levels ... deep, intermediate, and out of the slot/backfield.
We were desperately missing a deep threat the first 2 games and the opposing defenses knew it ... our offense was suffocated.
Bess has been a disappointment so far (for whatever reason) and we have nobody as a threat out of the backfield either. We desperately need a scat back type (Dion Lewis injury KILLED us) and also a prototypical slot player, which is paramount in today's NFL.
Cameron/Gordon are legit threats ... IF we keep Gordon we'll need a reliable #2 across from him and also a slot WR with a dynamic upside
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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Can't argue with what has been said regarding Gordon and what he SHOULD be worth. But having seen how this FO operates so far I would not be surprised if Gordon is gone by Monday afternoon for as low as 3rd round pick. I wouldn't like it but they rarely ask me what I think about anything. 
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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jc
I'll take my chances with Gordon. Only 3 players have been banned for over a year for substance abuse. Most players get the wake up call and I believe Josh has got it. Even if he didn't, I'd still take a year of him not playing over us getting 3rd round pick. Or even a second round pick, tbh.
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Can't argue with what has been said regarding Gordon and what he SHOULD be worth. But having seen how this FO operates so far I would not be surprised if Gordon is gone by Monday afternoon for as low as 3rd round pick.
I wouldn't like it but they rarely ask me what I think about anything.
They don't call you? I get 2-3 calls a week.
I don't really understand your comment about the FO?? I think they have done a pretty darn good job and done a good job of staying above board.
You going to the Ravens game? I now sit almost directly opposite of you in the clubs. A few rows above the entrance you might see. I'll wave to you after every score we make.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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I get 2-3 calls a week...
You holding out for a Top 5 contract? 
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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I get 2-3 calls a week...
You holding out for a Top 5 contract?
LOL.....no player in me, anymore, if ever....simply a advisor these days. 
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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I don't know exactly. I would think more than two of your offensive regulars and a ST/situational player. We certainly can't afford to trade one at this point.
I think we only need 1 more consistent WR and a well rounded RB. A franchise QB can do the rest.
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No way we get offered a first for him... I think wt best we'd get a 3rd rounder.... I personally don't want to take him but I don't see getting a ton back for him honestly... He's a good WR with great potential with the right qb but the off field issues is a scare and he's not wt the elite level yet...
<><
#gmstrong
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I don't really understand your comment about the FO?? I think they have done a pretty darn good job and done a good job of staying above board.
No, by that I meant that once they make up their mind to go ahead with something (like dumping Gordon because of the likelihood of a possible year long suspension) they won't hesitate to pull the trigger. Even if they don't get optimum value in return.
And honestly, he only cost us a 2nd round pick so anyone thinking we'd hold out and only accept a first rounder is kidding themselves, IMO. No, I think that they would ask for a 2nd round pick but would accept a third rounder if push comes to shove.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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Ok...I got you now....I agree, they don't hem and haw over decisions. They make up their minds and move forward.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Ok...I got you now....I agree, they don't hem and haw over decisions. They make up their minds and move forward.
And they are quiet about it. Did you hear a peep out of anyone on TRich before hand? I didn't. Not a word.
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
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Damanshot
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....simply a advisor these days.
Eric, Eric...is that you?
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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j/c: I don't think we will trade him, because I don't think any team is dumb enough to give up a lot for him. Three or four weeks ago, I asked posters to look at it from the perspective of you being the GM for another team. Looking at it that way, I said I would not give up more than a 4th round pick for Gordon. I think people overrate the guy on here. Yes, he has potential, but he hasn't actually achieved a lot of great things yet, and he surely hasn't sustained excellent play. I think that expecting a first round pick for Gordon is ludicrous. It is just as bizarre as saying we will cut him this week. Ain't gonna happen. I think we should probably just keep him and hope he stays clean. I do think the FO will get trashed if he gets suspended. Many will say that they should have traded him when they could have.  I do wonder if the Browns are aware of Gordon's off the field habits this season, and know that it is just a matter of time before he gets caught for the sixth time?
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I just don't understand how getting high could be SO important.
Had he been at Baylor when RG3 blew up he probably would have been a firs round pick.
If the don't trade him. I would assume they have a handle on how he's living his life.
I'd say a conditional 3rd. If he stays clean this year we get a second, if he falls off the wagon we give that team a pick in return.
Guys like Megatron, Fitzgerald, Andre Johnson don't have this baggage find one of those guys you don't have to worry about. Even if they aren't on that top tier level.
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Many will say that they should have traded him when they could have..
Ah, the benefit of hindsight! I believe the majority of us see the potential Gordon offers, are uncommited as what to do with him, and therefore are sitting on the fence and willing to go along with our FO. There should be minimal repercussions either way...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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...I said I would not give up more than a 4th round pick for Gordon...
NRTU Vers...moreso to the point:
There is no way I'd trade Gordon for less than a 1st Rd pick. If the team sniffing after him is a playoff contender, I want MORE than their 1st Rd pick.
Let's say we trade Gordon for SF's 4th pick...which will be at the end of the round. Any player we pick at that spot - if they have Gordon's potential - will have warts. Others available will not have his potential.
Examples:
A receiver with great measurables but sloppy hands. (Maybe his hands will get better.);
An OT that we project to G. (Maybe he will make the transition.);
A small school phenom at ILB who needs to gain some weight & strength. (Maybe he can bulk up, stay fast, and transition to the NFL.);
A big school studly DB who blew out his knee at the start of his senior year. (Maybe he can recover and become a steal.);
A project TE who might become a serviceable #2 down the road;
Or simply a "depth" guy at any number of positions (maybe we find another Skrine  ).
Gordon - with his wart(s) - is a way better risk than any of those guys regardless of the circumstances. It's not even close.
Now...give me SFs 1st and 3rd and I'm beginning to listen. I'd probably want a 5th from them too - maybe next year's 3rd instead of the 5th this year. Not saying THEY would even consider that...but that's when I'd start listening.
Gordon is a potential #1 WR with little issues to his game and big issues to his willingness to party. 22 year old kids can be that way. He will get older - although not necessarily wiser.
I'd rather take a risk on him staying "un-suspended" versus any of the options I outlined above.
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You can have all the reasons you want why YOU wouldn't accept less than a first round pick. No one is going to give us that. Well, no GM who wants to keep his job anyway.
I think Gordon has actually learned his lesson. But let's say he hasn't. He gets traded for a first or even a second round pick to a contender. He's so happy he parties like it's 1999. He gets drug tested the next morning. Boom! He's gone for a year and the GM who made the trade has a big black mark on his resume. It may not cost him his job but it certainly wouldn't help.
That's why he's not going to get traded for a 1st or probably even a 2nd. IMO
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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I think for all the reasons mentioned above is why he has not been traded yet.
Other teams so far has not been willing to give the Browns what Gordon's on field potential should yield. And no, I do not think they are after a 1st. I am not even sure they are after a 2nd. I do think they are after a 3rd and a player and are only receiving offers of a 4th or a 4th and a player.
Will he be on the team next week at this time. It soley is dependant on will another team's GM on a playoff or bust pursuit get itchy and makes the gamble. Other than that I think he will still be a Brown.
I do feel the Browns FO see the on field potential of Gordon but fear the future risk in his behavior.
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You can have all the reasons you want why YOU wouldn't accept less than a first round pick. No one is going to give us that. Well, no GM who wants to keep his job anyway.
I think Gordon has actually learned his lesson. But let's say he hasn't. He gets traded for a first or even a second round pick to a contender. He's so happy he parties like it's 1999. He gets drug tested the next morning. Boom! He's gone for a year and the GM who made the trade has a big black mark on his resume. It may not cost him his job but it certainly wouldn't help.
That's why he's not going to get traded for a 1st or probably even a 2nd. IMO
You posted as to why another team's GM would not trade for Gordon at our price...I stated why OUR GM should not trade Gordon for anything less than a King's ransom.
I agree with you - from the other team's perspective. My post was from our perspective.
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I'm not sure this is a good move.I think he may have worn out his welcome with the FO,and they don't trust him to keep his nose clean.He is really talented and would just have to find another WR,but like I have stated before.."The new regime is going to gut this offense."
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You're just dying to see him traded as we pile up draft picks.
#gmstrong
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You're just dying to see him traded as we pile up draft picks.
No I'm not.Gordon is a top WR and not easy to replace.The FO doesn't trust him to stay clean,or this wouldn't even be an option.We don't know what is really going on behind the scenes.I would rather they keep him,and if they trade Cameron then I'm getting pissed.
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Wonder if they could trade Bess,for say a 2015 7th rd pick?... I won't watch this team if they trade Gordon and leave us him and Little for the rest of the year.
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761 |
jc Some stats...despite missing two games, Gordon is: - 15th in overall rec yds with 582yds - 2nd in yds/catch at 18.2 (behind only Torrey Smith) - 4th in yds/game with 97yds (trailing only Megatron, Julio and Blackmon) He's 22yo and in his 2nd season and people dispute that he's a #1 WR  Looking over the lists of WR, I'm still mad as hell that we drafted Leon freaking McFadden, a dime a dozen slot/#2 CB type over Terrance Williams. Man, what a freak WR-duo that'd be  , right Steve? I know you were very high on him too. From a BPA perspective he was a top3 consideration at 68ovr for me
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Josh Gordon Trade unlikely
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