|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,447
Dawg Talker
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,447 |
Quote:
Quote:
We should choose either Carr with our first pick or Tahj with our second pick.
Not that it's worth much, but my opinion is that Carr is a terrible prospect, and that Boyd is light years beyond Carr.
I've watched two games by Carr. He stares right into coverages and still throws the ball because that's where the play is designed to go on the first read. He's a good story and puts up good numbers, but the games I've rewatched have shown me a guy I want no part of.
Ive seen the same Toad. Carr will be a 6th rounder by April. He is the worst 1st round prospect Ive ever studied.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Quote:
I see. I think I misunderstood. I took it as you preferring to just take the QB that drops in the 1st round. Basically getting the guy everyone passed on because it was good value. We are actually totally in agreement then. If the top guy isn't available for us to go and get I would also rather just take a guy in the 3rd or later and try again next year.
 okay we're on the same page.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,370
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,370 |
Well, Hoyer just turned 28 about a month ago.
And I think we'll walk out of the draft on day 2 with a QB. We might even grab another one during day 3.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Quote:
Well, Hoyer just turned 28 about a month ago.
And I think we'll walk out of the draft on day 2 with a QB. We might even grab another one during day 3.
Taking a QB day two/three would be good, but ONLY if the team is unable to land one of the top tier QB prospects in the first round. I understand people like Hoyer, being a hometown kid and all, but he'll be 29 during the 2014 season. And coming off a knee injury. this is a guy with 4 career starts and 192 career passes. I wouldn't be will to pass on a Manziel/Bridgewater/Mariotta and put my eggs in the Hoyer basket,
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,212
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,212 |
i'm becoming more of a Manziel fan- three months ago no way i would have said that. The one knock on him is his stature, it is what it is. The second knock is his attitude- guy is cocky but the dang thing is he backs it up. He is being asked to do more this year simply because the a&m defense really sucks. He is putting up points in the SEC, and its not just garbage play inflating his stats. His arm might not be a rocket, but he can make all the throws- and what i like best about him is his improvization skills. He can side arm the pass with the same accuracy as his regular throwing motion- its almost Favre like. IF Manziel is sitting there in the middle of the first, i would be really happy to see him in Orange!!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,204
~ Legend
|
|
~ Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,204 |
Quote:
Quote:
Well, Hoyer just turned 28 about a month ago.
And I think we'll walk out of the draft on day 2 with a QB. We might even grab another one during day 3.
Taking a QB day two/three would be good, but ONLY if the team is unable to land one of the top tier QB prospects in the first round. I understand people like Hoyer, being a hometown kid and all, but he'll be 29 during the 2014 season. And coming off a knee injury. this is a guy with 4 career starts and 192 career passes. I wouldn't be will to pass on a Manziel/Bridgewater/Mariotta and put my eggs in the Hoyer basket,
I disagree. I believe we should draft two quaterbacks one with one of our first round picks and another with a 3rd or 4th round. That way we'll have three unproven QBs who we think can do the job. The Browns are really a good QB away from winning the division as our team is extremely stacked at the moment. Add in a few more positions in the draft (RB, MLB, Guard, WR(?), and maybe a tackle) that we have more picks than we have holes in the first time in forever. But we do need a QB badly so double dipping might not be such a bad option here.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Quote:
i'm becoming more of a Manziel fan- three months ago no way i would have said that. The one knock on him is his stature, it is what it is. The second knock is his attitude- guy is cocky but the dang thing is he backs it up. He is being asked to do more this year simply because the a&m defense really sucks. He is putting up points in the SEC, and its not just garbage play inflating his stats. His arm might not be a rocket, but he can make all the throws- and what i like best about him is his improvization skills. He can side arm the pass with the same accuracy as his regular throwing motion- its almost Favre like. IF Manziel is sitting there in the middle of the first, i would be really happy to see him in Orange!!
Being a lifelong a&m fan, I've seen every snap Manziel has played. the more people watch him, the more they are impressed with him. Does he need work? Sure. He still has some mechanics issues (though they have greatly improved since last season), and has a tendency to throw off his back foot. But those problems can be fixed with coaching. He also has a tendency to hold the ball away from his body when he takes off, but again that can be fixed. He also needs to learn to slide or step out of bounds when he runs instead of lowering his shoulder looking for contact.
But he has tools, talent, work ethic, and drive.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Quote:
I disagree. I believe we should draft two quaterbacks one with one of our first round picks and another with a 3rd or 4th round. That way we'll have three unproven QBs who we think can do the job. The Browns are really a good QB away from winning the division as our team is extremely stacked at the moment. Add in a few more positions in the draft (RB, MLB, Guard, WR(?), and maybe a tackle) that we have more picks than we have holes in the first time in forever. But we do need a QB badly so double dipping might not be such a bad option here.
I'd double dip in rounds 4-7 if a QB is taken in the first, but not in rounds 2-3. Not going to spend two premium picks on the same position when there are, as you said, other areas of need.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,204
~ Legend
|
|
~ Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,204 |
Quote:
Quote:
I disagree. I believe we should draft two quaterbacks one with one of our first round picks and another with a 3rd or 4th round. That way we'll have three unproven QBs who we think can do the job. The Browns are really a good QB away from winning the division as our team is extremely stacked at the moment. Add in a few more positions in the draft (RB, MLB, Guard, WR(?), and maybe a tackle) that we have more picks than we have holes in the first time in forever. But we do need a QB badly so double dipping might not be such a bad option here.
I'd double dip in rounds 4-7 if a QB is taken in the first, but not in rounds 2-3. Not going to spend two premium picks on the same position when there are, as you said, other areas of need.
I agree with you that round 2 is way too high after picking a QB in round one. But we do have 5 picks in the first 3 rounds including 2 in the third. If we get Tahj in the first and Aaron Murray or Zach fall to the third, I think we would be wise to take them. We'll most likely win Ben Tate in free agency and we don't need any younger WR's we need veteran leadership who can make the catch on third down. We would still have three picks left in the first two days to fill out the rest of the team.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
I think for me it would depend on the part of the third we are talking. Late third, I might bite.
As too Tate, if he signs here, i would hope that wouldn't proclude the team from taking a back in the 2nd or 3rd if the right value is there. If a Sankey or Seastrunk is there, I'd pull that trigger. Tate has never been the bell cow for an offense, even at Auburn, and has had his own injury concerns. I think having a two back system is the way to go.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
for what it's worth, these are the quarterbacks expected to be free agents in 2014. Can probably add Schaub to this list as well as it looks like he has fallen out in Houston and they seem intent on going QB in the draft. The $ is what they made in 2013.
Jay Cutler Bears $14,668,750
Michael Vick Eagles $7,500,000
Chad Henne Jaguars $3,375,000
Josh Freeman Vikings $2,833,334
Shaun Hill Lions $2,750,000
Charlie Whitehurst Chargers $1,525,000
David Garrard Jets $1,000,000
Rex Grossman Redskins $960,000
Dan Orlovsky Buccaneers $905,000
Kellen Clemens Rams $870,000
Josh McCown Bears $865,000
Luke McCown Saints $840,000
Derek Anderson Panthers $840,000
Tarvaris Jackson Seahawks $840,000
Seneca Wallace Packers $840,000
Jimmy Clausen Panthers
Trent Edwards Bears
Jordan Palmer Bears
Matt Flynn Packers
Colt McCoy 49ers
John Skelton Titans
Rusty Smith Titans
Curtis Painter Giants
Joe Webb
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,447
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,447 |
I actually really like the double dip idea. I'm not sure I'd use a 3rd but a 4th would be great. To me a 3rd rounder should be a significant contributor and starter if a certain position.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,650
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,650 |
I will simply point out that if you don't have a franchise QB, you are searching for your franchise QB.
If you recall, Haslam stated essentially the same thing last year.
The Browns need to be in the "QB find mode" until they have their franchise QB.
Until then, they will struggle.
Welcome back, Joe, we missed you!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 7,059
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 7,059 |
Quote:
... the quarterbacks expected to be free agents in 2014.
As the FA period starts before the draft, wouldn't it be great to land a Cutler (or ?) for example, thus allowing us to focus our entire draft on BPA/need. Man, we could do some serious damage...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 |
I think Norv could be the best thing to happen to Cutler. Jay is getting older. He's a guy that can come in here and be the defined starter. Not a guy we "think" can start (and I like Hoyer) But Jay throwing to Gordon? Yes please.
Then we can find a guy to sit and learn behind him. Have Hoyer on the bench in case Jay goes down so we don't have to go right to the rookie.
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,950
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,950 |
Quote:
Can probably add Schaub to this list as well
Dont forget to also add Brandon Weeden to that list... 
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Quote:
I think Norv could be the best thing to happen to Cutler. Jay is getting older. He's a guy that can come in here and be the defined starter. Not a guy we "think" can start (and I like Hoyer) But Jay throwing to Gordon? Yes please.
Then we can find a guy to sit and learn behind him. Have Hoyer on the bench in case Jay goes down so we don't have to go right to the rookie.
If you want to keep your rookie QB away from the field, you'll have to keep Hoyer (or get another vet backup). Cutler is getting fragile in his old age. Not to mention the guy will want to get that 15-17 million dollar deal. But on a two or three year lease, I'd do it,
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,447
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,447 |
I'd be alright with Cutler if the Bears let him walk. If we signed him we could use him for three years and keep stockpiling picks in the future for when we get our future Franchise guy. Plus he fits the system like a glove!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 |
I think the Bears will let him walk. They have been productive with McCown. And can get a guy to learn behind him for Trestman.
I also doubt we go after Cutler. I don't think our guys want a two to three high prices stop gap QB. If they want a stop gap they'll just go with Hoyer.
If he walks I expect him to end up in Arizona.
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,370
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,370 |
Quote:
Taking a QB day two/three would be good, but ONLY if the team is unable to land one of the top tier QB prospects in the first round.
What if they don't value any of those QB prospects that highly? Would you suggest that they take one just to get one and hope that he is better than they think he is?
Quote:
I understand people like Hoyer, being a hometown kid and all, but he'll be 29 during the 2014 season. And coming off a knee injury. this is a guy with 4 career starts and 192 career passes. I wouldn't be will to pass on a Manziel/Bridgewater/Mariotta and put my eggs in the Hoyer basket,
I like Hoyer because he gets rid of the ball much more quickly than any other QB on the roster. He has the skill set to get it done. Someone posted the time he was holding the ball compared to what Weeden was holding the ball and he was unloading it a full 1.5 seconds sooner. He knew where he was going with the ball.
The knee injury isn't bothering me as much as it once would have. Modern medical technology is far greater than it once was. The same applies to Tommy John surgery in baseball. The recovery time from these types of injury are much reduced today.
Fair enough. You wouldn't choose Hoyer over any of those guys. I happen to think that none of them are better than the mid-round selections two years ago. I would take Kirk Cousins, Nick Foles (yeah, I wanted the Browns to take him instead of Weeden), or Mike Glennon (from this year's draft) over any of those you mentioned.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761 |
Quote:
I think the Bears will let him walk. They have been productive with McCown. And can get a guy to learn behind him for Trestman.
I also doubt we go after Cutler. I don't think our guys want a two to three high prices stop gap QB. If they want a stop gap they'll just go with Hoyer.
If he walks I expect him to end up in Arizona.
We'd be crazy if we don't go HARD after Cutler, IF he becomes available, which I doubt, btw.
The Browns need good QB play ever since coming back and been wasting multiple high picks to fix the position. I don't care if he is not "our" franchise guy we groomed and only be good for 2-3 seasons. We have the cap room, we have a need at QB and Cutler is a good QB, that's a match. Don't overthink it.
And btw, Campbell and Hoyer are FAR from "expensive" backup QBs. To put it into perspective: Davone Bess makes more money than BOTH Campbell and Hoyer. John Greco makes about as much as those two combined.
That said, I'd keep only one of them if we'd sign Cutler and draft a mid/late round rookie to groom. I even think both will have some trade value after this season, where GMs had to watch their starters miss games more than ever. It cold cost a team like GB the POs, which is a shame. Decent backups/spot starters will have value this offseason and we hold two of them with actually affordable contracts. I think we could get as much as a 5th in the next draft or a maybe even 4th in 2015 for someone like Campbell. Especially if he ends this season respectably.
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Quote:
Quote:
I think the Bears will let him walk. They have been productive with McCown. And can get a guy to learn behind him for Trestman.
I also doubt we go after Cutler. I don't think our guys want a two to three high prices stop gap QB. If they want a stop gap they'll just go with Hoyer.
If he walks I expect him to end up in Arizona.
We'd be crazy if we don't go HARD after Cutler, IF he becomes available, which I doubt, btw.
The Browns need good QB play ever since coming back and been wasting multiple high picks to fix the position. I don't care if he is not "our" franchise guy we groomed and only be good for 2-3 seasons. We have the cap room, we have a need at QB and Cutler is a good QB, that's a match. Don't overthink it.
And btw, Campbell and Hoyer are FAR from "expensive" backup QBs. To put it into perspective: Davone Bess makes more money than BOTH Campbell and Hoyer. John Greco makes about as much as those two combined.
That said, I'd keep only one of them if we'd sign Cutler and draft a mid/late round rookie to groom. I even think both will have some trade value after this season, where GMs had to watch their starters miss games more than ever. It cold cost a team like GB the POs, which is a shame. Decent backups/spot starters will have value this offseason and we hold two of them with actually affordable contracts. I think we could get as much as a 5th in the next draft or a maybe even 4th in 2015 for someone like Campbell. Especially if he ends this season respectably.
To answer your first question, no. Never draft a need position just for the sake of drafting need if there is not value there.
As to the second part, what guys did I say I'd take over him? I'm confused. My only point with Hoyer is that I don't think he is a long term answer and the team should look to draft a guy to groom. Then decide if Hoyer or Campbell or a third option is the guy they want to hold down the fort for 2 or 3 seasons.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,212
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,212 |
if you are looking to hold the fort down for two to three seasons- and Cutler is available, he is the answer. It really is a no brainer!!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358 |
Yeah I think with our cap space wed have to give it a shot (of signing Cutler.)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 |
It would be interesting to see what Cutler could do here. I think he has the perfect skill set for Norv's offense.
I doubt it would happen, but it is interesting to consider him in a Brown's uni.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,447
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,447 |
Quote:
It would be interesting to see what Cutler could do here. I think he has the perfect skill set for Norv's offense.
I doubt it would happen, but it is interesting to consider him in a Brown's uni.
I said the same thing today. It's a shame I don't really see a QB of his mold in this years draft.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850 |
article on Bears decision w/ Cutler: http://mmqb.si.com/2013/11/21/jay-cutler-ben-roethlisberger-markets/?eref=sihpit's long, so I won't post the whole thing, but here is the important part about how much he might expect and the recent QB signings: Quote:
While the marketplace range is roughly $18-20 million APY and $52-60 million guaranteed, these deals are hard to compare as players come from different points in their contract stream: Manning was a free agent, Brees and Flacco were on franchise tags, Romo and Ryan were in the last year of their deals, and Rodgers and Stafford had two years remaining.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Like I said, I'd bet dollars to donuts that the Bears will slap the Franchise tag on Cutler. Buy themselves some time to figure out what they will do at the position moving forward, if they want to go another direction or give Jay an extension. They won't go into 2014 with a JAG McCown as their starter.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850 |
for those considering Hoyer to be "the answer at QB" (and I know that most are skeptical but there are a few), then this is a really good read about these QBs that are popping up this year (McGloin, Keenum - Hoyer not mentioned because he's injured but he likely would have been had he remained healthy): http://mmqb.si.com/2013/11/21/matt-mcglo...ersy/?eref=sihp
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Quote:
for those considering Hoyer to be "the answer at QB" (and I know that most are skeptical but there are a few), then this is a really good read about these QBs that are popping up this year (McGloin, Keenum - Hoyer not mentioned because he's injured but he likely would have been had he remained healthy):
http://mmqb.si.com/2013/11/21/matt-mcglo...ersy/?eref=sihp
Good read. For every Tom Brady and Tony Romo that come out of left field, there are dozens of Ryan Fitzpatricks and Chad Hutchisons Josh McCowns that get inflated by fan bases. These guys are good for a start or two, but you can't build a franchise around them. It's dangerous waters finding a QB.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,732
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,732 |
Quote:
Good read. For every Tom Brady and Tony Romo that come out of left field, there are dozens of Ryan Fitzpatricks and Chad Hutchisons Josh McCowns that get inflated by fan bases. These guys are good for a start or two, but you can't build a franchise around them. It's dangerous waters finding a QB.
Which is why I believe some of us want them to target "their guy" and not make a list of suitable draftees and just pick from them. Some here seem to make finding a QB for the future an easy task, or that you can just wait around and magic happens.
I'm not sure who they would target or where he will fall, but you have to have a target somewhere when it comes to a QB and not a list IMO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,030
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,030 |
My personal fear is that they want Bridgewater/Mariotta and the Jags/Vikings aren't trading them regardless.......lol.
Mariotta is intriguing, but he is going to need to sit and learn for at least a year. Therefore, in my opinion, outside of Bridgewater there isn't much difference between a guy like Hundley/Manziel that will likely go in the 1st round and a guy like Boyd/Murray who can be had in later rounds. If I couldn't get Bridgewater (which is most probably the case) then I improve the team by going BPA in the 1st, and drafting a guy like Boyd in the 2nd.
I understand the importance of a QB, but I also know that over-drafting a guy (Weeden, Quinn) is going to set you back at least 2 years while you figure out the guy was a dud.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 |
Quote:
Good read. For every Tom Brady and Tony Romo that come out of left field, there are dozens of Ryan Fitzpatricks and Chad Hutchisons Josh McCowns that get inflated by fan bases.
True. However, for every P. Manning or A. Luck, A, Rodgers, etc....there is a Timid Couch, a Brady Quinn, a Brandon Weeden, a Ryan Leaf, a Kelly Stauffer, etc, etc.
It's really hard to say, especially because the QBs coming out of college now are spread qbs and they are so much harder to evaluate because they don't make the reads that are necessary in the NFL.
And let's look at the top qbs in the league:
--Rodgers: Lower part of first round.
--Brady: 6th round?
--Manning: 1st overall.
--Wilson: 3rd round.
--Brees: 2nd round.
--Luck: 1st overall.
I didn't rank them in order. But, there is some variety there.
And again, it's going to be even tougher to evaluate qbs these days because of the gimmicky offenses that are run in college.
I don't have any answers, but I do think that there are a lot of questions.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,370
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,370 |
Quote:
Good read. For every Tom Brady and Tony Romo that come out of left field, there are dozens of Ryan Fitzpatricks and Chad Hutchisons Josh McCowns that get inflated by fan bases. These guys are good for a start or two, but you can't build a franchise around them. It's dangerous waters finding a QB.
The thing about the QBs like Brady (6th), Romo (UDFA) and Warner (UDFA) is that the talent has always been there. The only one that attended a heavy profiled college was Brady. The less heralded schools like Eastern Illinois (Romo) and Northern Iowa (Warner) have players (including QBs) with talent but they're not scouted nearly as heavily. This is true even now, but they're getting more scouts because of the talent that can be found at them.
There is a growing number of scouts going to these schools in search of diamonds in the rough.
We have a number of these 'diamonds' starting or getting significant time playing on the Browns.
Buster Skrine (Tenn-Chattanooga)
Armonty Bryant (East Central)
Ishmaa'ily Kitchen (Kent State)
Billy Winn (Boise State - yeah, I know they're on the map now)
I had been pimping Doug Martin before the 2012 Draft but we know what happened there.
Chris Owens (San Jose State - yeah, I know that we didn't draft him)
John Greco (Toledo - again, we didn't draft him).
Craig Robertson (North Texas)
Tashaun Gipson (Wyoming)
Those are those that are just on our own roster. We have a couple more that aren't starting or getting significant playing time.
Paul Hazel (Western Michigan)
Garrett Gilkey (Chadron State)
Don't look at the practice squad or IR.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,370
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,370 |
Quote:
Quote:
Good read. For every Tom Brady and Tony Romo that come out of left field, there are dozens of Ryan Fitzpatricks and Chad Hutchisons Josh McCowns that get inflated by fan bases. These guys are good for a start or two, but you can't build a franchise around them. It's dangerous waters finding a QB.
Which is why I believe some of us want them to target "their guy" and not make a list of suitable draftees and just pick from them. Some here seem to make finding a QB for the future an easy task, or that you can just wait around and magic happens.
I'm not sure who they would target or where he will fall, but you have to have a target somewhere when it comes to a QB and not a list IMO
In my view, you have to draft a QB that has talent. That's not to say that they won't have some flaws, but they will have natural ability and be able to be coached up and taught how to be a better QB.
That's my problem with Manziel. He may have all the talent in the world but I don't think he can be coached up, unless he mentally grows up.
I don't think we'll be in the position to draft the top few QB prospects. Maybe we could be in the position to trade up, but I don't think that this front office will do it and I don't think that they should.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 |
Two 1sts. A 2nd. Two 3rds. Two 4ths.
We have the ammo to move up to practically any position and STILL have a full draft.
I'm excited for it. I'm trying to temper it. As this season is far from over. And my brain says its November and I should start thinking about the draft.
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,370
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,370 |
Quote:
Two 1sts. A 2nd. Two 3rds. Two 4ths.
We have the ammo to move up to practically any position and STILL have a full draft.
I'm excited for it. I'm trying to temper it. As this season is far from over. And my brain says its November and I should start thinking about the draft.
I know the picks that we have in those rounds (plus the ones later). We might even get a compensatory pick or two. Who knows? But even so, I just don't think we'll be looking to move up.
We had fewer draft picks last year and traded some away to get more picks for this draft. We traded away a popular player, drafted the previous draft, to acquire more selections in this one.
They could move up, but I don't think so. My inclination is to believe that they value two high draft picks at other positions over spending multiple draft picks on a high-bust-chance QB in the top of the first round. If one that they like falls to them in the first round, they might draft one. That is, if a player they want at a different player isn't rated higher.
I'm sure that they have one eye on the present and one eye on the future. They may, in fact, have several sets of eyes on each.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,530
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,530 |
Quote:
My inclination is to believe that they value two high draft picks at other positions over spending multiple draft picks on a high-bust-chance QB in the top of the first round. If one that they like falls to them in the first round, they might draft one.
And that is why we suck year after year..
This regime has set the table to get a QB, hell man they have a sign hanging in Berea to the effect that great teams have franchise QB's. They will throw everything they got at getting a QB. If they fail they should do the same thing all over again...
Why??? Because we will continue to flonder until we do, its just that simple......
BTTB
AKA Upbeat Dawg
Can't believe I am in a group that is comprised of the best NOT just fans but people on the planet.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,475
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,475 |
I don't believe you draft a QB based on "need".
Actually point blank...YOU DO...in here lies our problem I guess. You are so off base with that comment I got to just point it our and stop there cause I got to run...not much more to say on that anyways.
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,276
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,276 |
One thing I was wondering about our draft history.
How many QBs have we missed a chance at?
Can't discuss 2013.
2012 Couldn't get RG3 and Luck. Passed on Tannehill, Wilson, Foles, and Cousins.
2011 Couldn't get Newton. Passed on Locker, Gabbert, Ponder. Couldn't get Dalton with our #2 and skipped Kaepernick and Mallett.
2010 Couldn't get Bradford, drafted McCoy, skipped Tebow and Clausen.
2009 Couldn't get Stafford. Passed on Sanchez and Freeman.
2008 No draft picks. If no Quinn, couldn't get Ryan or Flacco (#18, we were #22)
2007 Couldn't get Jamarcus Russell. Drafted Quinn. Passed on Kolb.
2006 Couldn't get Vince Young, Leinart, or Cutler.
2005 Couldn't get Alex Smith. Passed on Rodgers and Campbell.
2004 Couldn't get Eli Manning or Rivers. Passed on Roethlisberger.
2003 Couldn't get Palmer, Leftwich, Boller. Skipped Romo.
2002 Couldn't get Carr, Harrington.
2001 Couldn't get Vick. Passed on Brees.
2000 Passed on Brady
1999 Drafted Couch. Passed on McNabb, Akili Smith, Culpepper.
Of the good quarterbacks we passed on here is the list. (Ignoring 2012 for now).
Kaepernick, Aaron Rodgers, Roethlisberger, Romo, Brees, Brady, McNabb.
The only player we probably should have taken from that bunch was Roethlisberger. And we already had Couch and took KW2 who was a soldier until he busted his knee.
The Browns haven't really missed that many opportunities they had to take good QBs. In the year they took Quinn the only other QB was Russell. In the year they took Couch there was only McNabb and Culpepper. Rodgers, Brees, Brady, Kaepernick, and Romo all slid past many teams and have exceeded their expectations.
I think the only guy we truly missed on was not selecting Roethlisberger...and I can live with that. As the 2012 crowd develops we might have missed on Wilson or Tannehill.
Last edited by Kingcob; 11/23/13 11:09 AM.
|
|
|
DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Which QB Going Forward? (Next
Year)
|
|
