Toad, while people are asking you for QB scouting reports, do you have any thoughts on Kenny Guiton in his limited but very encouraging performances? What round, if any, would you gamble on him? I would love to get him in the 6th round.
If anyone hasn't seen Blake Bortles I suggest you watch the Fiesta Bowl..........big kid who is mobile and can sling it. He could very well be a Cleveland Brown in April.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
Quote: No, you hedge your bets like the best of them. It's incredible really. It makes me wonder if you're in politics.
Glad I'm not the only one that sees it.
Thought you were leaving. Not keeping your word? Now who's the politician
So this is where you come back with a predictably boring one-liner. Go ahead, get it outa your system, then shove it in a drawer and try being a bigger man. There's been enough lame-ass bickering around here and you're "style" has been part of the problem. Wanna talk football or spew venom?
Candy, this goes beyond "calling me on pretentious BS." Get past whatever stick got stuck in your ass and move on. Wanna talk football or chase me around like a kid? It feels alot like Rodgers defending himself because of gay rumors. If I'm some liar who rides the popular wave I'd be bashing Richardson instead of taking the very unpopular stance that I still believe he's going to help a team, and in spite of a wave of optimism regarding the talent on the team after 6 pro-bowlers came from this roster, I'm still of the opinion that we're not all that talented. I'm also not all that keen on the defense in spite of some nice rankings. Feels a little like a personal thing. Let it go. Such an attitude on your part is unbecoming because you didn't used to be that way.
Moving on...
Chincher, I think Guiton translates better to the NFL than Miller. I did watch his games here in Austin (The football Gods allowed me to watch nearly every single OSU game this year. I was stunned!) and I saw a guy who has some really good feel as a passer. I'm not going to go so far as to say he's going to develop into a starter, but I sure do feel like he's more accurate than Miller. I feel like he's the kinda guy who would go late in the draft or undrafted but would find a spot under traditional circumstances, but with the read-option really starting to take hold in the league, he becomes a guy that suddenly has more places where he fits in.
Guitton looks like he may actually be 6'3, and if the combine proves that out, he'll have enough size to fit in any offense. People have praised how he's handled the QB situation, which bodes very well for teams looking to take him as a backup QB who isn't going to rock the boat. If you watch him in interviews, he gives the impression of being just a humble, down-to-Earth kid, which is a coaches dream. He has plenty of arm strength which is paired with a quick release, none of this business where he has to drop his arm and get his body into the throw, ala Blake Bortles. I'm also very impressed that he's a pass-first QB. When in the pocket he's always looking downfield, even when there's pressure.
I'll tell you this. I like him better than I ever liked Pryor, and I could easily see him going in the 3rd or 4th round after teams are done with him in the combine.
Jester, soo while the girlfriend watched the AMC marathon of The Walking Dead, hehe, I loaded up everything I could find on James Franklin.
After I loaded up some games I realized I had watched him against Auburn. I remember being impressed with a guy I hadn't heard much about as a pro prospect. I see why you like the guy, and like Guitton, I can see him being a real sleeper going into the draft. He has a strong arm with a very quick, compact, over-the-top delivery which is more NFL-ready than Guitton's 3/4 delivery. He'll benefit from all the spread stuff in the NFL because of his running ability, which is solid. He's built like a RB. I didn't see a guy who has as much pocket savvy as Guitton, though. He looked like he lacks some of Guitton's natural feel and touch as a passer. It's only based on a couple of pics, but I question his hand-size going to the NFL as well. If they are as small as they look in the pics (which can be deceiving) it hurts his stock. That was a big problem for Chuck Frye when he was here and he had the hands of carnival midgets.
Here's a couple of things that really concern me with Franklin. One is his injury history, which is substantial. Even in the Auburn game I saw a guy who seemed to take a lot of hits. Some guys are very fast and elusive but don't know how to avoid taking punishment. RG3 and Mike Vick come to mind. Even though Franklin can run he's an easy target to find and will get smacked a ton. The other strange thing is that due to family beliefs he's not ever allowed himself to take pain meds. In the NFL if you're a running QB who takes hits and has known to miss time with injury, you're going to have to take pain meds at times if you intend on playing. I tend to view Franklin as more of a Tyrod Taylor type of guy. He'll get plenty of attention after the college season is over. More info and vids will be out then so we'll all get more info on him. I tend to think he may not go as highly as Guitton but it's still very early in the process.
Every year there are guys that people fall in love with as sleepers. Someone on the boards was a huge believer in Nick Foles. He was right. Too bad it wasn't me. For every Kirk Cousins I've gotten right I've had several Dennis Dixon's. It's a crapshoot, but someone like Franklin has a solid chance as any, though I tend to like Guitton better.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy. Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
With the confirmation of Bridgewater entering the draft, this is the guy I want. If it cost us both first round picks, so be it.
Him, Hoyer and then we will just call him player x cause I question if Jason won't just be released and I know, well am very much and quite confident Brandon WILL be released. Tanney, who knows... there hasn't been much of ANY talk or articles about him. Chud never talked about him in his conference except for a few times when he was just signed - and same with Norv.
Or, maybe Jason is retained and then we have Hoyer and the hopeful selection of Teddy?
Either or, Bridgewater and Hoyer would give me warm, fuzzy positive feeling going into camp
Let's just hope that Houston likes Johnny or bortles with our 4th and whoever else with our other first.
Otherwise it's bortles or Johnny. Not a huge fan of either. But one of those three will be taken by us by trading for teddy or sitting at 4. Sucks to take a Johnny at 4 though
I love his long ball. I drool thinking of us grabbing a Watkins to pair with Gordon then having Franklin throwing 1-2 40+ yard TD's every game :-)
Interesting observation on his getting hit.
Cannot even take pain meds? I am a doctor and hate when I have to deal with patients who tie one syringe behind my back because they have one of those funky religions.
How cool would it be if we drafted James Franklin Qb Missouri and hired James Franklin current HC Vandy? Maybe not that cool. Just making myself giggle with my warped sense of humor
Am I perfect? No Am I trying to be a better person? Also no
It's always funny what you learn about other posters at different times.
I never realized that you were a doctor. A doctor jester .... or a jester doctor?
I understand what you mean about some religions not allowing certain medications and such .... but I think that many have played even with such beliefs. Tommy Vardell was a Christian Scientist, and the team had him sign a contract covering injuries, He had to have major reconstructive knee surgery, and he did so without argument.
I think that a lot of that stuff can be worked out in advance, if the player truly wants to play in the NFL.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Quote: You know what they say. Laughter is the best medicine! Anyway, just as an fyi, I specialize in infectious diseases.
And yes there are ways around things but it is still a huge pain in the butt.
Literally, no doubt.
I cannot figure out why someone who has decided that they will not accept medical care would bother to go to a doctor to start with.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Either at number 4. If they are gone take Jimmy Garoppolo later. Personally I'm just not seeing Brigewater as a Brown. (Unless he's there at 4 and the other two are gone, then AND only then... maybe.) JMHO
Yeah, Jester, it's rare in today's age where players refuse to take any pain meds. It probably shouldn't warp my opinion of a guy but it does.
After watching the Tostitos bowl tonight, I saw the things why Bortles gets so much press, but I also saw the things which make me things he's over-rated. We all know about his mobility, which looks very much like Luck. He made a few very nice throws, including the wheel route down the left sideline, a TD on a short out-route near the end-zone, and another lofted ball down the right sideline. However, I saw at least 5 or 6 very short, very simple throws that every QB in the NFL should make every time but he missed them. He made a very poor decision on a screen pass where he was staring right at a defender but elected to throw the ball there anyway. Luckily the guy dropped it. Spielman indicated he Bortles made a poor read when throwing a deeper pick, though I disagree. Bortles did find the single coverage but just made a poor throw which earned him the INT. He was accurate on the short out's and in's but that's childs-play in college. Two of his TD's were on very short throws where the receiver took the ball the distance.
He has enough arm and shows good escapability. I do question if he can read defenses, and I wonder how quickly his mind processes the information he sees. Every college QB these days is accurate on the short stuff but he loses some of that as he goes downfield.
The announcers said scouts are split, where some have him in the 1st, others in the 4th. I'm still of the opinion he's a 2nd round guy, as the arm abilities aren't enough to push him high into the 1st. I wouldn't be very comfortable taking him in the top-5. He reminds me of Andy Daulton with Rottenberger's escapability.
More time spent watching vids will reveal more of his game.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy. Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
The only Mallett game on youtube I can find is his first preseason game and the 2010/2011 sugar bowl vs. OSU Since someone might actually want to watch the sugar bowl..
Quote: I've been saying it to everyone who will listen.
Bridgewater will be gone and/or cost too much.
Manziel has all the talent but I wouldn't touch him with a 10 foot pole.
Bortles is the guy I want.
He did look impressive. As I see there there are 3qbs at the top, and we pick 4th. If we want to gurantee one of the 3, we better move up to 2nd
i didn't think he looked impressive at all, imo.
his TD's came in the flats with the WR making most of the plays. that floater who threw up for big yards would get picked off in the NFL. with just one actually throwing it in the endzone. i came away more impressed with that WR and their RB than Bortles.
if Teddy is gone, i rather have manziel than Bortles.
Last edited by Swish; 01/02/1409:34 AM.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
And if we do not go that route...I watched at least 8 of his games and am a big fan of Manziel! I think with us he would fair well...also he could revive the pep in the step of our veterans with the change!
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off! Go Browns! CHRIST HAS RISEN! GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
Quote: Thought you were leaving. Not keeping your word? Now who's the politician
Your reading comprehension is a little bit off. If you go back and read you'd see I said I couldn't take watching the Browns any more. Meaning I'm not going to pay them for the privilege of watching them lose. I also said I'd be back here occasionally to read things and check in with friends.
Please continue on with your fence-sitting.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
Quote: I've been saying it to everyone who will listen.
Bridgewater will be gone and/or cost too much.
Manziel has all the talent but I wouldn't touch him with a 10 foot pole.
Bortles is the guy I want.
He did look impressive. As I see there there are 3qbs at the top, and we pick 4th. If we want to gurantee one of the 3, we better move up to 2nd
That's the worst case scenario: Bridewater, Bortles and Manziel all gone and we are on the clock with the 4th pick. I guess we auction it off for whoever wants Clowney the most.
Moving up to one will cost a ton. Not sure about moving to the second pick. Hopefully what the Skins paid to get RGIII doesn't skew the price this year.
Bortles will be that kind of beauty in the eye of the beholder prospect. He does some good things and some questionable things. He has some skills, size, mobility. Enough arm strength but not consistent accuracy. Another year in college would not hurt him.
He is not a top ten pick but he may be picked then.
He is to me a bottom of the first, top of the second guy.
He is the type of guy that you just don't know? He could turn out to be very good. He may be average at best.
Quote: And if we do not go that route...I watched at least 8 of his games and am a big fan of Manziel! I think with us he would fair well...also he could revive the pep in the step of our veterans with the change!
JMHO
haven't seen much of him ... what I have saw I am not really impressed with for an nfl qb ...
please give me your breakdown of him .... either in here or PM ... would like to know what u like about him as I just haven't seen enough of him to be confident in my take of him ...
Quote: ... Not sure about moving to the second pick. Hopefully what the Skins paid to get RGIII doesn't skew the price this year.
If I'm interpreting the general consensus correctly, the 'Skins significantly overpaid for RGIII. I would expect no team will make that mistake again...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
Quote: ... Not sure about moving to the second pick. Hopefully what the Skins paid to get RGIII doesn't skew the price this year.
If I'm interpreting the general consensus correctly, the 'Skins significantly overpaid for RGIII. I would expect no team will make that mistake again...
I don't see an Andrew Luck and an RG3 in this draft. That alone should lower the price for any draft pick.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Quote: ... Not sure about moving to the second pick. Hopefully what the Skins paid to get RGIII doesn't skew the price this year.
If I'm interpreting the general consensus correctly, the 'Skins significantly overpaid for RGIII. I would expect no team will make that mistake again...
I don't see an Andrew Luck and an RG3 in this draft. That alone should lower the price for any draft pick.
I have more faith in your "vision" than I do in our FO, YTBFan...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
Quote: is it the fan base that is so high on mallet? or is it a lombardi thing?
Just knowing how Lombardi reveres BB I see us getting fleeced.
JMHO
As if we haven't been fleeced by the NFL, Wash, Rams, Indy, Ravens, Jet's, JR. his father, and now the 3 stooges. Its happened before. Here we go again.
When Jay Cutler agreed to a seven-year deal to stay with the Bears, it kept the best potential free agent quarterback off the market.
Say what you will about Cutler’s shortcomings, but pairing his arm and experience with a talented receiver (say ... Josh Gordon) would be enticing to any team. Especially a team that went through quarterbacks in 2013.
The Bears understood, and kept him. Now they have Cutler throwing to Brandon Marshall and Alshon Jeffery and handing off to Matt Forte, which allows the Bears to concentrate on improving their defense.
[+] EnlargeMatt Cassel Kelley L Cox/USA TODAY Sports Matt Cassel is among the quarterbacks scheduled to be a free agent in March. If the Browns were interested in pursuing a free agent to truly come in and take over, Cutler was the most legitimate instant starter. Not that Cutler was ever leaving Chicago, or would have ever signed with the Browns.
But Cutler staying in Chicago means the best free agent will be Mike Vick, though the Browns could take comfort in the fact that Colt McCoy, Seneca Wallace, Brady Quinn and Derek Anderson are also on the free agent list -- and Brandon Weeden could be. Nothing says football like a recycled Browns quarterback.
The free agent list is far from set. Guys will re-sign with their teams, a surprise or two will enter the market. But the present list is far from inspiring.
As of today the list of quarterbacks scheduled to be free agents in March are:
Carolina: Jimmy Clausen and Anderson -- Anderson brought up coming back a year ago right?
Dallas: Jon Kitna, who signed with Dallas for the season finale when Tony Romo was hurt.
Detroit: Shaun Hill.
Green Bay: Matt Flynn and Wallace.
Indianapolis: Matt Hasselbeck
Jacksonville: Chad Henne. Hey ... he beat the Browns this season!
Minnesota: Josh Freeman and Matt Cassell. Cassell is an interesting name given Josh McDaniels, who will interview this weekend, once tried to trade for Cassell in Denver.
New Orleans: Luke McCown. Oops, forgot this former Brown.
New York Giants; Curtis Painter.
New York Jets: David Garrard.
San Diego: Charlie Whitehurst.
San Francisco: McCoy
Seattle: Tarvaris Jackson
St. Louis: Kellen Clemens and Quinn.
Tampa Bay: Dan Orlovsky, who once ran out of the back of the end zone as he escaped the rush, for a safety.
Tennessee: Rusty Smith.
Washington: Rex Grossman.
Two who could become available include Matt Schaub of Houston and Mark Sanchez of the Jets. The Texans have a new coach, and Schaub’s salary cap-cost is $14.5 million in 2014. As for Sanchez, the Browns traded the pick so the Jets could take him, why not make it full circle and bring him back.
Ah ... what would an NFL offseason be without an ongoing discussion of the Cleveland Browns quarterback.
_____________
sigh.... i'm...i'm really losing hope, guys.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
really if the rams covet Clowney or mathews they could trade with us and still get their player at 4. We would give up whatever is needed to make the trade equitable., as long as do not pay RGIII money for it, I would be good... especialy if it lands us Bortles.
One option I've seen us talk about is trade our firsts, a second, and a third to move up in the draft. Now that it appears there will be 4 QBs, we could stand pat and move a 2nd for Mallett and then draft whoever is left at 4... we may even have 2 rooks to pick from if someone wants clowney bad enough. Then we have our other first and 2 3rds to continue to load up on talent.
Then it's a QB competition for hoyer, mallett and rookie, not terribly unlike seattle did signing flynn and drafting wilson.
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
![[Linked Image from img.photobucket.com]](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v638/Concor1033/NEWDTsig.jpg)
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/GraffZ06/browns_factory_sig.jpg)
Not keeping your word? Now who's the politician 
