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Scenario
We are at #4
Teddy and Football are taken.
Clowney and Bortles are available.
The phone is ringing.
What do you do?
Barry Bonds Check
Roger Clemens Check
Mark McGuire Check
Lance Armstrong Check
71-79 Steelers Taboo
(Lets pretend it didn't happen.)
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Legend
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Trade back or take Bortles.... which one depends upon what is on the phone that is ringing. I run away from Clowney.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Legend
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Quote:
Trade back or take Bortles.... which one depends upon what is on the phone that is ringing. I run away from Clowney.
it's Papa John's saying the pizza is going to be 30min late
#gmstrong
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If I get a swap of firsts, with a team that doesn't have a franchise QB, and a first next year. Its done.
The swap would have to be in the top 22. The franchise QB thing is a gamble that if they don't have a franchise guy, the chances of them making the playoffs are much slimmer. So, the pick next year is a gamble, but one Im willing to take.
I'm playing for our franchise QB next year.
After last weekend, I've become enamored with 6 5" Quarterbacks who weigh over 240, and can run.
My new thing.
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Trade back. At this point I want nothing to do with Bortle Kombat. With the defense we ran last year Clowney is probably not a fit. To me he is 4-3 defensive end and that is it.
If the trade back is not possible I would consider one of the tremendous wide receivers that are coming out this year (Watkins, Lee, Evans, etc.) or double down on the defense and take Anthony Barr who can play outside linebacker in the 3-4.
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Legend
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I think it's wasted calories to talk about what defensive players might fit and might not until we know who is coaching the team. Who knows if we're going with a 3-4 or 4-3 next year.
Are Horton and Turner still currently our coordinators?
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Legend
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niether, take watkins at 4.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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Quote:
Are Horton and Turner still currently our coordinators?
I know we have given them liberal leeway to interview with other teams, and neither has been hired, so I'd say so. I think the new coach is the guy who will determine who, if any of the current staff are kept.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Legend
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Quote:
I think it's wasted calories to talk about what defensive players might fit and might not until we know who is coaching the team. Who knows if we're going with a 3-4 or 4-3 next year.
Are Horton and Turner still currently our coordinators?
I feel like we have been through this before.
This time we at least know that Banner and Lombardi favor the 3-4.
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Legend
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Yes, that is true and it is clear that that played into the hirings last time around, but with how quickly Chud was given Das Boot, I don't know that we'll have the same criteria in hiring this time around.
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Hall of Famer
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It depends on who else was taken and what the offer was (or offers were).
If Atlanta or Oakland offers up an additional 2nd rounder, I likely move down a spot or two. If Tampa offers 2 additional 2nd rounders or an additional first rounder, I move down 3 spots. Anyone else is harder to justify. Clowney going at 4 would guarantee that one of Watkins, Bortles, and a top OL are available.
If offers aren't good, take Watkins.
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for me, if we're at 4 in this scenario and we're switching to a 4-3 I take Clowney without hesitation. If we're staying in a 3-4, I think about taking Clowney but if I'm getting a top-10 pick in the 2nd or third to move back to 5, 6, 7, or 8 I'm probably taking it. Even the third rounder means we would have our shot at two of Skov, Seastrunk, Martavis Bryant, Hyde, Telvin Smith, Purifoy, Mettenberger instead of just one of them. If it's a second yeah I do that deal easy.
I do understand the need for a QB, I just don't think Bortles is all that, especially compared to the guys that would be available later. He played eh so-so in the Baylor game. He played like crap against South Florida. He's a guy that makes a couple really nice plays and a lot of dumb ones. Kind of reminds me of Tannehill in that sense.
As far as who I take in 5-6, Dennard wouldn't be a bad choice, but honestly there's not a must-have player there for me.
BTW, I think Derek Carr will be a Raider. No good reason, just a hunch.
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Legend
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I don't see the Rams not taking Clowney, but... if those are our options, then I would take Bortles. I would be open to hear what offers would be presented if Bridgewater is not an option.
This would shift a lot of "pray" and hope to Hoyer, but, it's a gamble that wouldn't necessary hurt my feelings at all. But, it'd have to be something decent cause I don't mind Bortles the more I hear and watch highlight reels. Prototypical pocket passer. Tough question!
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Blocking those who argue to argue, eliminates the argument.
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Legend
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Quote:
Scenario
We are at #4
Teddy and Football are taken.
Clowney and Bortles are available.
The phone is ringing.
What do you do?
At this point in my draft thinking, I do what is necessary to make sure this situation does not happen because I am sure the FO has begun to think about all possible scenarios. I'm not saying I don't like Bortles but my greater concern is, as a organization, not having a QB you really like, especially when we have the necessary ammo to make a move. Coupled with the fact this team has talent at other positions, a QB could really change the dynamic of this team. Thus, I do what is needed to trade up....to #2 or even #1 if you need to.
I was listening to "Really Big Show" this morning...normally a cardinal sin in my book but they did interview Peter King for about 30mins which was fun to listen to. In any event, they ended the segment with a question after having a lengthy conversation w/ Tony Grossi about the QBs and our 1st round picks:
Would you give up 3 firsts (both 1st round picks this year and one next year) to get the QB you really like, either Bridgewater or Manziel?
I really have no bearing of accurately knowing what QB is better than the others in this draft or even comparing the quality of QBs this year to other drafts (like RG3) when discussing value to move up, but I've been thinking about this question a bit today.
-Essentially the TRich pick is an bonus pick.
-Were not losing our #4 but simply switching a pick with someone else.
-What we are doing is losing one pick next year.
So for a potential franchise QB, is that price worth it? This is essentially what they were mulling over....
Tackles are tackles.
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The Rams already have two very good defensive ends in Robert Quinn and Chris Long. I see them trading out or taking an offensive linemen. It would also be nice if they got Sam Bradford a legit target at some point.
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No one seems to believe me, maybe because Bradford is so expensive, but I think they need to move on and get a QB.
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Maybe they do, but as you said they cannot get rid of Bradford because his contract is such a beast.
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I've mentioned more than once on the board:
It will take a swap, #26, and next years first to get Bridgewater.
Swapping with us is the Rams best case scenario unless somebody really wants to over pay.
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If we don't bite and the Rams take Matthews (which I think they should) then my scenario should play out.
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Quote:
No one seems to believe me, maybe because Bradford is so expensive, but I think they need to move on and get a QB.
No I agree and have posted so several times.
cfrs, if they trade or cut him they free up $10 million in cap space this year. I still think that plan is in play for them. Draft Manziel or Bridgewater, whoever doesn't go 1st, then trade Bradford for a 1st to BUF or OAK or MIN or TB or TEN or DAL or AZ or CIN.
Bradford would represent $14 million against the cap to his new team this year and $13 million next year, which is reasonable for a real starting QB.
They're really up against the cap (~$2.5 free space with a bunch of leaving FAs) and really only have 4 pieces or so that can make a difference. 1 is the only OG they have under contract ($4 M), one is their starting C ($4 M), one is the best DT ($4 M), and Bradford ($10 M).
Last edited by clevesteve; 01/14/14 05:34 PM.
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Quote:
cfrs, if they trade or cut him they free up $10 million in cap space this year. I still think that plan is in play for them. Draft Manziel or Bridgewater, whoever doesn't go 1st, then trade Bradford for a 1st to BUF or OAK or MIN or TB or TEN or DAL or AZ or CIN.
or CLE.
I do not see how Buffalo or Dallas would be in play. The Bills just drafted Manuel in the first round last year and Romo just signed a huge extension.
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yes, or CLE... I didn't mean to leave us out.
Forgot about Romo's extension.
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Quote:
Quote:
No one seems to believe me, maybe because Bradford is so expensive, but I think they need to move on and get a QB.
No I agree and have posted so several times.
cfrs, if they trade or cut him they free up $10 million in cap space this year. I still think that plan is in play for them. Draft Manziel or Bridgewater, whoever doesn't go 1st, then trade Bradford for a 1st to BUF or OAK or MIN or TB or TEN or DAL or AZ or CIN.
Bradford would represent $14 million against the cap to his new team this year and $13 million next year, which is reasonable for a real starting QB.
They're really up against the cap (~$2.5 free space with a bunch of leaving FAs) and really only have 4 pieces or so that can make a difference. 1 is the only OG they have under contract ($4 M), one is their starting C ($4 M), one is the best DT ($4 M), and Bradford ($10 M).
If I'm Cincinnati, I am really thinking about what it would take to get Bradford. They could be a QB away from being a SB contender. And their players aren't getting any younger. This may be a time where you go all-in to try and go for it.
Tackles are tackles.
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With our offensive line, if we could get lucky with a running back, I'll bet Bradford would end up being a lot better than many would think.
He's had a terrible offensive line.
Terrible receivers.
Terrible running game for the past 3 years.
Questionable coaching.
Not sure how anyone could have expected him to succeed under the conditions he's had. He would have been much better off if he had come to Cleveland in my opinion. As hard as that is to believe.
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At least if they do cut/trade Bradford they will do it well before the draft and we can plan accordingly.
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Bradford is underrated if you ask me and I would be very happy if he somehow ended up as our QB. He was on his way to his best season until he got hurt.
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Quote:
If I'm Cincinnati, I am really thinking about what it would take to get Bradford. They could be a QB away from being a SB contender. And their players aren't getting any younger. This may be a time where you go all-in to try and go for it.
When was the last time Cincinnati traded a draft pick?
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Quote:
Bradford is underrated if you ask me and I would be very happy if he somehow ended up as our QB. He was on his way to his best season until he got hurt.
I have seen him drop back and make throws that are just incredible.
I'd be surprised, in spite of the financials, if the Rams swap him out for Johnny Manziel.
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Quote:
Quote:
If I'm Cincinnati, I am really thinking about what it would take to get Bradford. They could be a QB away from being a SB contender. And their players aren't getting any younger. This may be a time where you go all-in to try and go for it.
When was the last time Cincinnati traded a draft pick?
2012.
Tackles are tackles.
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They traded back after missing out on Kendall Wright, not sure if that qualifies on what you are asking.
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Quote:
Bradford is underrated if you ask me and I would be very happy if he somehow ended up as our QB. He was on his way to his best season until he got hurt.
If you project his numbers out from last season to a full season he would have thrown for 3,856 yards with 32 td and 9 int.
I would take those numbers from our Qb
Don't blame the clown for acting like a clown.
Ask yourself why you keep going to the circus.
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Hall of Famer
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Quote:
Scenario
We are at #4
Teddy and Football are taken.
Clowney and Bortles are available.
The phone is ringing.
What do you do?
Answer it and listen to the offer.
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Quote:
With the defense we ran last year Clowney is probably not a fit. To me he is 4-3 defensive end and that is it.
From what I've heard, Ray Horton has been given permission to seek a lateral offer. That is, a DC job in the NFL. If he leaves, I think it's very possible that next year's defense could primarily be the 4-3.
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Would you give up 3 firsts (both 1st round picks this year and one next year) to get the QB you really like, either Bridgewater or Manziel?
========================================================
Bridgewater ? Yes.
Manziel I would not draft.
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1st String
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1st String
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Quote:
Would you give up 3 firsts (both 1st round picks this year and one next year) to get the QB you really like, either Bridgewater or Manziel?
========================================================
Bridgewater ? Yes.
Manziel I would not draft.
Teddy maybe. Johnny, no way.
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Quote:
Would you give up 3 firsts (both 1st round picks this year and one next year) to get the QB you really like, either Bridgewater or Manziel?
Yes.
I'd be ok if they pay that price for Bridgewater, even though I don't think it would be good value, but as long as we've been waiting and starving for a franchise QB, it's well worth it to overpay a bit.
I would even trade up for Bortles, if we can't get to Bridgewater. That would be a much bigger gamble and overpayment, but we'd have to if we can't make sure he falls to us at 4.
Of course there's Manziel. Opinions differ on him, but I would let some other team have that circus in town, but if our FO deems him a fQB then they'd have to trade up too to secure him. That would make me
 on draft day, probably worse than the TRich trade up (because more costly and much more important position).
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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j/c
Does anyone have access to ESPN insider? Mel Kiper released his first mock which apparently has Manziel going first overall?
While I'm fully behind Manziel at four, I really want to see Kiper's logic for the Texans taking him due to the vastly different opinions of him that exist out there.
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