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I believe being broke is our breaking point.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Quote:
I believe being broke is our breaking point.
If that was the case, Washington would already look like Kiev.
But, on a serious note, at what time do you see the demonstrations in the streets like they're seeing in Kiev?
I was at the 9/12 rally in DC in 2009. There were half a million people there, maybe more. We were there for ONE day. What if we arrived but didn't leave for a week? A month? Or longer?
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Quote:
Quote:
I believe being broke is our breaking point.
If that was the case, Washington would already look like Kiev.
But, on a serious note, at what time do you see the demonstrations in the streets like they're seeing in Kiev?
I was at the 9/12 rally in DC in 2009. There were half a million people there, maybe more. We were there for ONE day. What if we arrived but didn't leave for a week? A month? Or longer?
At what point?
Well, when one of 2 things happen - OR, when a combination of the 2 happen.
1. Those relying on the gov't. don't get their checks anymore. However, I don't see those people marching on DC.
2. When what used to be the middle class says "I'm tired of working and paying for things I won't get. My standard of living has decreased even though I still work. I can't afford food, housing.....why should I work?"
But, more than likely, the crap hits the fan when the country is forced to quit printing money and start paying back the loans.
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When a dependent culture is created and nurtured to the point that half the population contributes nothing to the coffers while believing the government is responsible for their well-being and owes them a living....it's just a matter of time as to when it will implode.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
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It'll basically die out like the Occupy Movement.
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I don't know, that looks a little more intense than what those tent city hippie wannabes were doing here in the US.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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I was talking about the 9/12 rally in that post.
Nothing good will come of this. The reign in power, while Democratically elected, are fairly corrupt and just have a load of problems especially when showing force is involved. But the opposition are essentially Nazis.
So nothing good will come of this at all.
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Quote:
I believe being broke is our breaking point.
 but truth...
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Quote:
At what point?
Well, when one of 2 things happen - OR, when a combination of the 2 happen.
1. Those relying on the gov't. don't get their checks anymore. However, I don't see those people marching on DC.
2. When what used to be the middle class says "I'm tired of working and paying for things I won't get. My standard of living has decreased even though I still work. I can't afford food, housing.....why should I work?"
But, more than likely, the crap hits the fan when the country is forced to quit printing money and start paying back the loans.
Thanks for the considered response. That's appreciated.
I think both of those are already factors in what will trigger the events that will play out. I think it goes a bit deeper than that though and it won't be as mild-mannered as we see playing out in Kiev.
Make no mistake, the current Ukrainian dictator will be ousted. It won't have anything to do with Biden's phone calls. He won't remain because of Russian power being exerted by Putin. It is forces within Ukraine that will make sure that he is gone.
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Quote:
When a dependent culture is created and nurtured to the point that half the population contributes nothing to the coffers while believing the government is responsible for their well-being and owes them a living....it's just a matter of time as to when it will implode.
So, when Atlas shrugs?
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The president is not a dictator, but he is very authoritative. And as much as we'd like to say it's all the Ukraine, they are getting a lot of money from the EU to cover their costs and even pay protesters.
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How soon before Yanukovych is ousted? Hours? Days? Will he last a week?
He has sent his children out of the country. My guess is that he's on the verge of following them.
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He seems to have lost all control of the situation. Its not an easy position to be in, because if you just squash the rebellion youre killing your own citizens which is not good...but if you let it continue youre lessening your power as well empowering future rebellion.
He's in trouble.
I heard today that Putin is sending an envoy to Ukraine...May we see the Ukraine split into two nations by the time this is over? A la Czech Republic/Slovakia/Czechoslovakia?
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
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jc.
when people think the US is sooo bad, they need to look at countries like Ukraine. i've lived in europe for 5 straight years before, and Eastern European countries all have problems like this in some form.
one thing our government doesn't do is shoot/kill protesters, as a matter of fact, its very rare that we, if EVER, have deployed our military an ordered such actions.
imagine the occupy wall street movement somewhere else; they would've been gunned down in other countries quickly.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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These are all very young nations going through growing pains. The U.S. had the same sort of rifts early in its own life.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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not being confrontational, i really wanna know this question.
did we ever have a president who went and asked for british help with finance during our early years?
if so, i'll step back. but if not, the ukrainian president has been keeping such close ties with russia and such that they offered to bail ukraine out. for a country that recently gained independence, i see why they protest, its like a slap in the face.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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cool, thanks.
couple of things:
- what was the law at the time? i know now, we aren't allowed to protest on federal property. its been that way since at least 1971. was it the same time then.
which ties into
- i didn't read anything on that link that said they were shot at while NOT on federal property. Ukrainians are being shot in public streets.
while both instances are very tragic, in my PoV, its still very different.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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There's been a few cases where federal and state governments have attacked peaceful protesters/strikers.
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gotcha. i am now more informed than when i posted.
thanks CHS and water.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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Save for Kent State that is.
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
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Some examples would be nice ..
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It's funny the people I usually discuss these topics to with kind of said the similar thing: "well at least they have the balls to revolt against a horrible leader and government, that's what we need to do". Neverhteless, I can already see the millions and millions (that we DON'T HAVE) being sent from US. Happy we raised that debt ceiling cause who else borrow money so we can babysit and try to handle/oversee everyone elses problems, all while not addressing our own, huh? Damn sure happy 
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What is the treasury printing , something like 75 billion a month ? We just run off another 20 billion and send them a Cashiers check ! 
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"too many notes, not enough music-"
#GMStong
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Quote:
It's funny the people I usually discuss these topics to with kind of said the similar thing: "well at least they have the balls to revolt against a horrible leader and government, that's what we need to do".
Neverhteless, I can already see the millions and millions (that we DON'T HAVE) being sent from US. Happy we raised that debt ceiling cause who else borrow money so we can babysit and try to handle/oversee everyone elses problems, all while not addressing our own, huh? Damn sure happy
Well, I can see strategic reasons for actually helping the Ukrainians out.
1. They are a agricultural breadbasket. Think of the American Midwest. The soil in Ukraine is very fertile.
2. They have huge deposits of iron ore. Krivoy Rog rivals the Ruhr region of Germay and the Australian Pilbarra.
3. The possibilities of American energy resource companies helping Ukranians to become self-sufficient in energy by hydrofracking is enormous.
4. They have a large number of capable ports in the Black Sea. They rank second only to Turkey with the length of coastline of the Black Sea.
5. They allow further access to energy resources (via the Black Sea) of the Caucasus region (Georgia, Azerbaijan, etc.) This was on of the primary reasons why Russia had their conflict with Georgia several years ago.
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Quote:
What is the treasury printing , something like 75 billion a month ? We just run off another 20 billion and send them a Cashiers check !
Or skim some off the top and send it to the Ukrainians instead of Goldman Sachs, BofA, etc.
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I won't even disagree with those statements, all of them. But why can't we just do what London does for example? Call or an international response for sanctions? Or do what Russia did or is doing (haven't kept 100% up-to-date) and just send a messenger/envoy? It'll be only a matter of time before we're sending aide, troops, money, helicopters, bubble gum, jets and firearms over there (in which likely will be used against us later down the future). I just don't like the fact we are so active with other countries problems, especially the middle eastern locations and etc. We help "them" at the expense of hurting "us". I mean my God, haven't we sent some 550+ million to Syria now? Where did this money come from (I know, China ultimately but it's a rhetorical question)? Why couldn't we have used that for Detroit or to maybe try to lower the trillions in debt? I swear every time I hear John Kerry ask for more money to be sent, I just want to... I don't know. It pisses me off, that I do know. 
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The UK is sending aid through the EU. I believe Russia is sending an envoy because they owe Ukraine about 2 bil from an agreement they made in December.
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Well, shouldn't we just do what Russia is doing then? You know, since we owe multi-trillions to China?
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Not if we want to have power.
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Do we really have power with the nation's debt? We are basically owned by China. I wouldn't really call that power. And power over what? The world?
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China relies on us just as much as we rely on them. It's hardly as dire as you're making it seem. And power is much better to have than money.
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Quote:
And power is much better to have than money.
Well, no denying that one truthfully! Usually the flow is with power comes money, I don't see any money coming. I see it going, but not coming.
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That's because the power in the U.S. is being consolidated at the 1%
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