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In the 4-3, Kruger is a DE. I think that he would be excellent in that role.
+1 but wonder about Desmond Bryant? guess he would be tackle? and then where does that leave rubin?
being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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so basically we have 5 LB's/De's on this team that would be best suited to play DE and we don't have any players on this team suited to play LB?
Blocking those who argue to argue, eliminates the argument.
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Anyone up for a 2-5 defense? Or a new 2-6-3 variation of the 46? 
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Come on, Steve. Teddy is being undervalued--or correctly appraised by many. Heck, you are one of them.
anarchy, Daman, PPE, That Guy, Mourg, bleed, etc. Phil Simms said that Geno Smith is a better QB. LOL
We'll see. It happens almost every year.
People get infatuated w/guys like Carr because of measurables and pass on guys who have what it really takes like Rodgers, Brees, and Wilson. Heck, the biggest reason Brady fell was because of his skinny frame.
Interesting, huh?
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They will probably cut Reubin. A lot of people were freaking out over when Banner was here, but now..........it will be okay.
Just like when Swish said that he would quit watching the Browns if they cut DQ. Well, you see, what had happened was..........Banner was here then. Now, it's different. LOL
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Speaking for myself, I see no upside in cutting Rubin. I think that he is an exceptional player, he makes plays all over the field as a DE. That is incredible. It's not like we are strapped for cap space. Now if there was a star QB hitting the market for sure, ala Peyton Manning, and we stood a chance to sign him, then I could see clearing cap space ..... but there is no need to open cap space here, and Rubin is a talented, and still young player, and a quiet leader on a team in desperate need of leadership.
I think it would be a mistake to up and cut him.
As far as DQ ..... my only question is, who replaces him? We has major issues at ILB last year, and right now we have a gaping hole there. Fortunately we also have a ton of cap space, and extra draft picks in this (said to be) deep draft.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Good post.
I don't want to cut Reubin either. However, I have felt it might be in the works. He is aging and has a pretty big contract. We are deep on the d-line and I just see it as business move.
I think Banner may have cut him. No guarantee about that.
I think Farmer may cut him. No guarantee about that.
I just think the reaction of the fan base would be totally different in regards to who cut him, just like the DQ thing.
Great point about who is going to replace DQ. That is a serious question. It's not like Robertson is a big star back there.
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I'm not sure we can sign enough free agents to spend the the money that we need to spend to satisfy the CBA. Its not like players are beating down the doors to come to Cleveland
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I don't get why you, and others, say that Rubin is "aging".
He's 27. That's the age of free agents we're pursuing in free agency. Dez Bryant is 28, and Paul Kruger is also 28. They are months older than Rubin. (he'll be 28 in July)
I just don't see age as as issue.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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It's his contract, YTown.
I could be wrong. It's just a feeling that he'll be moving on.
I won't argue it...............again, it's just a hunch.
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Quote:
Speaking for myself, I see no upside in cutting Rubin. I think that he is an exceptional player, he makes plays all over the field as a DE. That is incredible. It's not like we are strapped for cap space. Now if there was a star QB hitting the market for sure, ala Peyton Manning, and we stood a chance to sign him, then I could see clearing cap space ..... but there is no need to open cap space here, and Rubin is a talented, and still young player, and a quiet leader on a team in desperate need of leadership.
I think it would be a mistake to up and cut him.
As far as DQ ..... my only question is, who replaces him? We has major issues at ILB last year, and right now we have a gaping hole there. Fortunately we also have a ton of cap space, and extra draft picks in this (said to be) deep draft.
I think all this talk about Rubin being cut by the Browns is just that, talk. He's due a mere $200k and his $6.6 million this year is easily workable under the cap. This is just the writers needing filler.
They should be writing that Jason Campbell will be the next one cut. He's as good as gone and the same goes for Weeden. Weeden will be around until the 'final cuts' though or traded (not sure what they can get) because there is nothing more to pay him just for being on the roster.
I can see John Greco being axed. He's due $1.7 million soon.
Gary Barnidge is set to earn more than $1.1 million this season. I don't see it happening.
Jason Pinkston is due about $1.4 million. I see him getting released.
As for who is going to replace D'Qwell Jackson? A rookie draft pick is my guess.
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Meh, he's in the final year of his contract, and he's going to earn $6.6 million plus a $300K workout bonus.
Kruger, by comparison, will make $7 million this year. (just salary)
I think that both guys are high quality players, and with our cap as empty as it is, I see no reason to cut Rubin.
Also, Rubin led our DL in tackles last year, despite missing 2 games with injury. Next on the team, in terms of tackles, was actually John Hughes. (who I also really like) However, Rubin has better range than Hughes.
He could be gone ..... but I think it would be a mistake. When you have a sideline to sideline caliber DE, who also makes plays down the field, you keep him. When you are already some $56 (or more) million under the cap already, I see no need to cut a quality player, and a great person. I will be really disappointed is we dump Rubin.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Well, hopefully you are right. I like Reubin and hope we keep him, too.
I was just reading some of the Insider reports and they said Reubin might get the axe. They could be totally off base, though.
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Yeah, I have read reports on the PD that he may go. I just don't see the rationale for such a move.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Again we are talking about reports from just who...BOZOs...lol sorry vers I know you hate that term but hopefully you understand my mentality. Here is a report from a column that look at DQ and then look at the next highest Veteran similar to DQ who has not made the Pro-Bowl.
But unlike ILB that I think we must revamp the unit.
We are looking at DL probably our strongest UNIT - Football wise I don't think it makes sense to weaken our strongest - If anything if n when we get Mack, Ward, Haden done maybe we look into an extension for Rubin (just 27) He can play 3 tech DT - 5 Tech DE he's a tackling machine and at a pinch (even though he lost like 20-30 lbs. can move into NT if need be. He can play 2 gap or 1 gap penetration. He is the true meaning of a Football Soldier.
A HC and GM who admire Defense will love Rubin. The Bozo's see a player who in their STATS is similar to DQ. Drafted by Savage survived - Mangini, Heckert and Lombardi. And carries a 2nd contract...over 5 mil. So they state he COULD BE NEXT...like as if they KNOW something.
27 and has A LOT OF EXPERIENCE is a great leader for the DL and probably why its the best UNIT we got. Has a motor like nobody else and leads the DL to play that way. Hughes is better for it. Kitchen all of them see Rubin going all out every play so that they FOLLOW - good for young guys with Talent like the two Bryants and Taylor...I saw him hustle down field on a lot of plays following Rubin's lead!
I would be very very surprised if we got rid of Rubin this year.
jmho
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Many of the reports from those so called Bozos wind up being true.
I hope this is one that is false.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I betcha everything I own...MOST DO NOT...the ones that come true you like Remember reading it somewhere.
Ok I'll give you an example.
Trent got traded.
All of a Sudden - We were trading Gordon, We were Trading Cameron, I think I even read somewhere we were going to trade Joe Thomas. And that was just our team, then there was other teams - all from teams not known as Playoff bound all players going to WINNING TEAMS to make them better.
NOT A ONE CAME ABOUT...NOT ONE..but you forget about that. If one did...its aha - MANY come true.
Nah...they just throw anything out there hoping it sticks so they can claim the fame of I SAID IT...nobody keeps count of the NUMEROUS - We said it that just don't happen.
Don't defend the Bozo's you will lose... 
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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I don't remember anyone saying that we were trading Gordon .... but I have no doubts that we has conversations with a number of teams. Maybe we didn't initiate them, but most reports said that we were considering trading him, or had talks about doing so ...... not that we initiated those talks, or were actively shopping him. As far as most reports, they were along the lines of "this is rumored, but the Browns continue to deny it." Should reporters not report what they hear?
I remember no reports of us trading Cameron that were from a local, or major national site. Do you?
Joe Thomas trade rumors? I don't remember those either.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Actually yeah, there were reports we could trade Cameron. I posted a thread about it awhile ago that I won't bother to hunt down but yeah, articles were published about the possibility.
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Actually yeah, there were reports we could trade Cameron. I posted a thread about it awhile ago that I won't bother to hunt down but yeah, articles were published about the possibility.
even tj ward got a little trade talk back then lmao.
being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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I don't remember anyone saying that we were trading Gordon  Really Ytown??? It was all over the place. You usually are big time on remembering. And actually of all the ones I listed its the only one that is true.
Cause it was reported that Lombardi truly was shopping him around during the two game suspension...the others were pure Rumors. Thank goodness Chud wanted Gordon here n of course Others teams kicking themselves for not making an offer now.
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
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GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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From what I recall it was reported they were "listening to offers" but nothing said they were shopping him. at least that's the way I remember it. The talk was if they should trade him and what the FO would take to trade him. I also remember some of those saying we are set with Gordon as our #1 WR were getting seriously intense about the huge concern of him being suspended moving forward. but I guess that's a topic for another debate. 
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Listening to offers is as close as you can get to shopping him without instigating the calls to other teams. I don't see more than half-a-hair's difference between them.
For instance, do the Patriots listen to offers for Tom Brady? Or the Donks for Manning, etc, etc.
Only teams willing to trade a player will listen to offers for that player. Once they've shown a willingness to "listen" they don't have to call anyone. There will be caller from interested teams.
Shopping and listening is the same as the difference between a rock and a hard place.
Maybe I'm missing something here.
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But once again that's what we were told was happening. I don't believe we know if there was actually any validity to the rumor.
But I do agree that it's probably more of a play on words than anything.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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I think the real point that was being made in the beginning is that the BOZO's report a lot of this stuff like there's merit to it, yet, in the end it turns out to be nothing.
Same with reports about Cameron and others.
The BOZO's saw the TRich trade and assumed the Browns were cleaning house for draft picks, which never made sense.
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Oh I agree with that. Much like everyone was so concerned about the rumor over Carr and this regime being true.
But after the link to the video was posted, in actuality, it was attributed to the prior regime and the one who gave the report admitted he had no way of knowing if the current regime felt the same way.
A lot of it is nothing more than rumors that continue to be passed on. Often times there's little to no truth in what is reported.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Which is why I agree with eotab about the BOZO's being wrong much more than they are right.
If they are wrong then that story is never brought up again. We never hear another thing about it. On the other hand, if they were right then it naturally becomes a story so we hear more about it. That alone makes them seem like they're often right. But like 'tabber, I've got a bottom dollar to and likewise I'd bet it that the BOZO's are wrong far, far more often then their reports have merit.
I don't think I'm arguing with you. We seem to agree on this.
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I don't think I'm arguing with you. We seem to agree on this.
We sure do!
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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jc
the "bozo's" sure seem to be right about not only our W-L record every year, but us just generally sucking.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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4-3 is a possibility as our strength on D is the DL + 3/4 OLB.
However the defense that Pettine is known for is a Hybrid, multi look defense, that usually spells LBS as in 3-4 and then Change to a 2-5, 4-3 etc.
Either way you look at it we need ILB and more than one!
jmho
MP does like multiple fronts,,and I think in one of his pressers he said he wants to use the 34. Look at the type of LB's he likes and they all fast and can hit.
He also likes press corners so what we should see is more attention to the inside backers and man coverage corners.
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IF there are any legs to the Rubin stuff (whether a release or a contract re-struture) I really think it has more to do with scheme fit than age, money, etc., although I think $6.6M is high for Rubin based on his play in the 34 last year.
A main weakness in Rubin's game, IMO, is the lack of a pass rush, applying pressure in the pocket, and getting to the QB. I think that was apparent last year when he played 3-4 DE under Horton that the DEs were asked to do that often, and if we keep the 3-4 as a base in what is also being coined by this staff as a "attacking" defense by Pettine, I think the fit is the main issue here. Desmond Bryant excelled in that attacking defense and I thought it was clear Rubin did not.
The thing that hurts Rubin is the fact that Hughes and Winn are developing nicely. Winn gets behind the o-line much more than Rubin and I think Hughes as been good against the run and costs much, much, much less. NT would be an option but I don't think there is a chance he unseats Taylor.
Another issue MAY be from contract extension for other players now. Does Farmer want to extend people who are FA in 2015 to use this boat load of available money we have now? Does Rubin's contract impede that attempt? My gut tells me the DQ release fell under these pretenses beyond just his huge roster bonus. Maybe the Rubin contract is under a similar vein...
Now maybe Pettine likes Rubin and wants to have significant depth on the D-Line. A re-structuring doesn't always mean a pay cut. An option could be to extend him a couple years while lowing the long-term cap cost to the organization. I wouldn't be surprised that this conversation may have happened with Farmer and Co. Rubin is 27 yrs old. He has a few good years left in him. But at this point, he may be better as a 43DT than what may be the "best fit" for him here.
Last edited by MemphisBrownie; 03/02/14 09:00 AM.
Tackles are tackles.
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from what I recall it was reported they were "listening to offers" but nothing said they were shopping him.
1. at the time yes, after Lombardi got fired I read it in a couple of places.
2. my discussion point here is not semantics of shopping around or listening to offers.
3. My point is that I was giving an example of how BOZOS work. Not one of the "REPORTS" of these and other teams players going anywhere Happened and I was making a case of how INVALID an article reporting the possibility of us releasing someone after we leased one before (ergo trading somebody after trading Trent) just isn't valid.
4. It might happen, but these guys have no Inside info on it. They are just speculating cause its the dead zone and they got to Write/blog/tweet something astute.
That's all I'm saying...nothing more.
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I don't really disagree with you here. I do believe they do get inside info on occasion or simply guess right once in a while. It's not like they never get it right. But far more times than not, they're completely off base. I mean even a bling squirrel finds a nut once in a while.
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The thing that hurts Rubin is the fact that Hughes and Winn are developing nicely. Winn gets behind the o-line much more than Rubin and I think Hughes as been good against the run and costs much, much, much less. NT would be an option but I don't think there is a chance he unseats Taylor.
You know, that's a big hurt too. Hughes and Winn have developed nicely. If you'd ask me, I see no reason why they wouldn't be starters on any other team that lacks at the end position. I guess time will tell what happens with Rubin.
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I mean even a bling squirrel finds a nut once in a while.
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There are some other things to consider:
---Defensive linemen sub in and out a lot. Most teams have a rotation of d-linemen that they use.
--Taylor doesn't play many snaps, whether it is from poor conditioning or poor play--- I don't know.
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IF there are any legs to the Rubin stuff (whether a release or a contract re-struture) I really think it has more to do with scheme fit than age, money, etc., although I think $6.6M is high for Rubin based on his play in the 34 last year.
A main weakness in Rubin's game, IMO, is the lack of a pass rush, applying pressure in the pocket, and getting to the QB. I think that was apparent last year when he played 3-4 DE under Horton that the DEs were asked to do that often, and if we keep the 3-4 as a base in what is also being coined by this staff as a "attacking" defense by Pettine, I think the fit is the main issue here. Desmond Bryant excelled in that attacking defense and I thought it was clear Rubin did not.
The thing that hurts Rubin is the fact that Hughes and Winn are developing nicely. Winn gets behind the o-line much more than Rubin and I think Hughes as been good against the run and costs much, much, much less. NT would be an option but I don't think there is a chance he unseats Taylor.
Another issue MAY be from contract extension for other players now. Does Farmer want to extend people who are FA in 2015 to use this boat load of available money we have now? Does Rubin's contract impede that attempt? My gut tells me the DQ release fell under these pretenses beyond just his huge roster bonus. Maybe the Rubin contract is under a similar vein...
Now maybe Pettine likes Rubin and wants to have significant depth on the D-Line. A re-structuring doesn't always mean a pay cut. An option could be to extend him a couple years while lowing the long-term cap cost to the organization. I wouldn't be surprised that this conversation may have happened with Farmer and Co. Rubin is 27 yrs old. He has a few good years left in him. But at this point, he may be better as a 43DT than what may be the "best fit" for him here.
Cleveland Browns DL Ahtyba Rubin won't be cut or restructured agent says
CLEVELAND, Ohio -- Browns defensive linemen Ahtyba Rubin is in good standing with the team and not in jeopardy of being cut, his agent, Alan Herman told cleveland.com Sunday.
"I can assure Ahtyba is fine,'' said Herman. "All the conversations have been positive and everybody's happy to have him on the team.''
Profootballtalk.com reported on Feb. 28 that Rubin could be next after D'Qwell Jackson on the chopping block because of his $6.6 million salary for 2013, the final year of his contract.
"I met with (Executive Vice President) Sashi Brown at the combine,'' said Herman. "There will be no modifications to the contract and (coach) Mike Pettine is excited to have him. Who wouldn't be?''
Rubin, a seventh-year pro, finished first among Browns defensive linemen with 80 tackles last year and fifth overall after switching from defensive tackle to end in Ray Horton's scheme. Rubin, 27, signed a three-year extension in 2011 worth a total of $26.5 million, including $18 million guaranteed.
He was originally a sixth-round pick out of Iowa State in 2008.
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2014/03/cleveland_browns_dl_ahtyba_rub.html [list]
Rubin, a seventh-year pro, finished first among Browns defensive linemen with 80 tackles last year and fifth overall
not surprised. he is our best defensive linemen. its why he had more snaps than any of the others.
Last edited by pblack18707; 03/02/14 07:05 PM.
being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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Legend
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Legend
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Well, there you have it. The depth remains in tact.
Tackles are tackles.
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Legend
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Legend
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That is fantastic news! I know that the Browns just floated that rumor to get me to post what I thought, so they would know what to do ........ Rubin is absolutely one of my favorite players ..... the way he plays, just so relentlessly, never giving up on a play, and making plays few other DL would never even hope to make. His size and quickness are a unique package, and hopefully we are working on an extension for him.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
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Quote:
hopefully we are working on an extension for him
I think they will wait. he has been playing injured a lot the last 2 years. they might want to see if he can stay healthy?
being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum 4-3 or 3-4 DQ released now what?
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