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You never know, mack might just be getting some humble pie and be getting ready to work a deal out soon.
I still think everyone is over reacting and that there is still a LOT of time for other teams to show thier interest in mack. Like i said they are just not going to tie up thie FA money right away on a player they might not get anyways because of the Browns ability to match.
I'd say Monday you might see things pick up for him.
You can't fix stupid but you can destroy ignorance. When you destroy ignorance you remove the justifications for evil. If you want to destroy evil then educate our people. Hate is a tool of the stupid to deal with what they can't understand.
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I can't name 4 that are better than him either
Never mind I shouldn't have tried to explain things to you. 
If you can name 4 centers without looking it up you need a hobby lol.
Because model airplanes are so much better than loving football 
Mangold, Kalil, Hardwick, Pouncey, Pouncey, Wood, Myers, Schwenke, Unger, Hudson, De La Puente, Frederick, Wisni(Raiders), Smith, Sullivan, Kelce, Satele. Eh that's all I got.
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I honestly don't think anyones going to touch him...
No one is going to super overpay him, so why would a team put in all the work to agree to a deal just for us to match it...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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2nd String
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But Mack's agent is a genius and can out-smart the Browns
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We are not drafting a center.
Why not? I think we should. Guy to train to take over next year if the event Mack signs the transition tag then leaves next year. And insurance in case Mack holds out into the season. Worse comes to worse, we sign Mack to a multi-year contract and the draft pick offers us at a minimum depth at center to cover a Mack injury and hopefully the guy can play OG as well.
So why are we not drafting a center?
Am I perfect? No
Am I trying to be a better person?
Also no
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But Mack's agent is a genius and can out-smart the Browns
Mack's agent seems to be more a failure at generating any sort of interest and etc than Weeden is as QB...
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So why are we not drafting a center?
because Mack will be playing for us in 2014 and we have too many other needs to use a pick on a backup center (unless it is really late).
#gmstrong
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No flippers on Mack. Sure ride out of town. Hope he gets locked up, deals with it positively, and plays his butt off. 
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
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We have ten picks (although my guess is that we will not use all of them). We should use one of the late ones to take a guard/center. It is the smart thing to do.
This is all moot if we somehow get Mack signed long term.
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Annual franchising of Mack is financial suicide. It's certain to be over 12 million next year an will only increase from there. This is the time to resolve this issue. As I stated if I'm doing the negotiating I'm letting his camp know that we want to wrap up a long term deal before the draft. After that, there's little or no chance of a multi-year contract because other arrangements will be made. End of story.
I disagree. I think the best chance we have of getting a long-term deal is to extend our 2015 key free agents. If Mack's camp sees that we could tag him again next offseason, they might just bite the bullet and sign the longer deal.
To do so, it likely means that we are bleeding this process out until July (which I think is what is going to happen regardless).
Bleeding this negotiation out past the opportunity for the team to bring in an alternative only hands over more leverage to Mack. What advantage does that create for the team?
The only alternative is Greco. He is as good/better than anything on the market. We are not drafting a center.
At worst, Mack is playing 2014 for the Browns as can be seen from the complete lack of interest in Alex. If we want him signed long-term, then we need to strike the fear in him that this process will happen again next year. Only one way to do that.
Unless you can state with absolute 100 percent certainty which positions we will draft this May I'm unpersuaded that we will not draft a center. Also, Greco is far from the only solution. He only represents a shuffling of the chairs on the deck of the Titanic. The team already needs to address one guard position. Moving Greco to center just means we have to address both guard positions. In either case two OL may need to be added.
I suspect that some think that I may be saying drafting a guard AND center are absolutely necessary. I am not. My concern is if we don't get a deal with Mack before the draft he gains unnecessary leverage because we risk him playing under the tender, have no alternative on the roster that doesn't compromise another position on the OL (Greco) and he decides not to do a long term contract with the team at any point next year. At that point we become desperate for a new player. Right now we can make it known to his camp that we will not expose ourselves to that risk. We are willing to do a fair deal with him now. Certainly better than anything he's been offered to this point which appears to be squat. Once the draft comes and goes he will no longer be in our plans. Why? Transition tag is a 10 mil hit. A franchise tag will cost us at least another 12 mil. 22 mill for a center for two years is out of the question Alex, please sign here or find a new workplace in 2015.
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So why are we not drafting a center?
because Mack will be playing for us in 2014 and we have too many other needs to use a pick on a backup center (unless it is really late).
There are only 4 or 5 centers with a draftable grade we will have to take one relatively high or settle for scraps. Because we won't keep both Mack and the drafted player beyond 2014 the rookie needs to be of high enough quality to play by 2015.
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Why does everybody think our division is particularly hard-nosed and tough? There is virtually no data that supports this. In fact, the defensive lines in our division were particularly poor at producing pressure on the QB last year, compared to other divisions.
I agree. I think they are all hard.
I'd bet if you asked fans across the country, the toughest division would be the one their team in which their team plays.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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You can ask 10 different people the same question and get 10 different answers. We all know that. Following is the first three "Top X Centers in the NFL" grades I could find that weren't a slide show that I couldn't cut and paste... Top 5 centers in the NFL1. Maurkice Pouncey, Pittsburgh Steelers Grade: 4.05 Pouncey is the gold standard at the position today. At 6-4, 304 pounds, he has almost perfect size for the position, moves his feet as well as any offensive lineman in the league and seems completely comfortable snapping the ball and moving off the snap. The one question on Pouncey will be his health, as he has had trouble protecting his legs since he came into the league. 2. Chris Myers, Houston Texans Grade: 3.95 Myers may not be the ideal size you seek in a center. At 6-4, 290 pounds, you’d like him to be a bit more stout and built lower to the ground. But his great quickness and athleticism make him a nice fit in the Texans’ zone-blocking scheme, and Arian Foster has clearly become very comfortable reading and reacting off his blocks. 3. Max Unger, Seattle Seahawks Grade: 3.90 At 6-5, 305 pounds, Unger is tall for the center position but has learned to play with great leverage and enters 2013 as the best center in the NFC. Unger has played guard as well, but appears locked into the center spot in Seattle after showing steady improvement in each of his first five seasons in the league. Although there is some concern in Seattle about Russell Wilson’s ability to see passing lanes in the pocket due to his lack of height, Unger did an excellent job of positioning himself to aid Wilson in his rookie year. 4. John Sullivan, Minnesota Vikings Grade: 3.90 Many believe Sullivan is the key to the Vikings’ offensive line as its most consistent blocker and a huge cog in the running game for Adrian Peterson. Like many of today’s centers he’s a tad taller than you’d like at 6-4, but packing 301 pounds, he’s a good athlete with excellent initial quickness and nice punch when he gets the chance to use it. 5. Mike Pouncey, Miami Dolphins Grade: 3.70 Maurkice Pouncey’s twin brother, Mike stayed an extra year at Florida to switch back to the center position after having played next to Maurkice at guard for two years. Entering his third year with the Dolphins, Mike is an inch taller than his All-Pro brother but not quite the athlete, although Mike does move very well and has gotten more comfortable each year snapping and getting off the ball. 6. Alex Mack, Cleveland Browns Grade: 3.60 7. Nick Mangold, New York Jets Grade: 3.60 8. Jonathan Goodwin, San Francisco 49ers Grade: 3.50 9. Ryan Kalil, Carolina Panthers Grade: 3.50 10. Eric Wood, Buffalo Bills Grade: 3.50 11. Scott Wells, St. Louis Rams Grade: 3.45 12. Nick Hardwick, San Diego Chargers Grade: 3.45 13. Will Montgomery, Washington Redskins Grade: 3.35 14. Fernando Velasco, Tennessee Titans Grade: 3.25 15. Brian de la Puente, New Orleans Saints Pro Football Weekly Top 10 Centers1)Maurkice Pouncey, Pittsburgh Steelers. Pouncey follows a legacy of Dermonti Dawson and Mike Webster. He may never reach those heights but he still should be a perennial Pro Bowl performer. His movement and agility is top-notch. 2)Ryan Kalil, Carolina Panthers. Kalil's younger brother Matt was drafted 4th overall by the Vikings. He's a tackle while Ryan is a center who has earned three straight Pro Bowl honors. His movement is top-notch. 3)Nick Mangold, New York Jets. Mangold has the combination of size and strength that is necessary. He has missed two games with an ankle injury last year, which was the first time he missed time ever. 4)Chris Myers, Houston Texans. Myers is an excellent athlete who is a key blocker in their zone-blocking scheme. 5)Alex Mack, Cleveland Browns. Mack has never missed a start. At 6-4, 311, he has the size to last against some of those very big nose guards in the AFC North. 6)Scott Wells, St. Louis Rams. Wells is a durable player who is very intelligent. He played at a high level for the Packers and should improve the Rams' offensive line. 7)Eric Wood, Buffalo Bills. Wood injured his ankle last year after nine games and the Bills struggled. He did not allow a sack last year according to STATS LLC. 8)Nick Hardwick, San Diego Chargers. Hardwick also did not allow a sack according to STATS LLC figures. Wood also received a penalty in Week One and did not receive on the rest of the year. 9)Brad Meester, Jacksonville Jaguars. Meester is a tremendous run blocker. The Jags were able to run the ball even when teams knew they were because they had no passing game. Meester was a big part of that success. 10)Jeff Saturday, Green Bay Packers. Saturday has not missed a game in the last three seasons. After 13 seasons in Indy, he is off to Green Bay to try and win one more title. ATS SportsLine]ATS Sports Liine Top 5 centers in the NFLJUNE 15, 2013 BY MICHAEL RICHTER 2 COMMENTS 1. Mike Pouncey – Miami Dolphins His twin brother receives more recognition, but in my mind, Mike Pouncey is the best center in the league. One of his little known qualities is his ability to point out a blitz before the snap. He is an elite pass protector, he does an exceptionally well job at holding his own. He is very quick off the ball, and rarely loses the upper-hand. His run blocking skills are top notch besides one flaw: At times he’ll have trouble in one-on-one situations. Mike Pouncey is the NFL’s most complete center. 2. John Sullivan – Minnesota Vikings Sullivan is highly underrated by many people. Sullivan possesses better than average pass protection skills. Sullivan allowed 2 sacks and 8 QB hurries in 2012. Sullivan had a great season making running lanes for Adrian Peterson in 2012. He does a nice job at the second level, and is quick off the snap. Sullivan is the best run blocking center in the league. 3. Jonathan Goodwin – San Francisco 49ers Goodwin is a better pass blocker than most believe him to be. He did not give up one sack the whole season, and trust me, he was put in a lot of one-on-one situations. Goodwin has good movement for his size, but he’s not the strongest offensive lineman. Goodwin clears out running lanes with the best of them. He’s a big reason why the 49ers line is so good. 4. Max Unger – Seattle Seahawks Unger did not give up 1 sack all season long in 2012. Unger is a good pass protector, but not exactly great. Unger is very versatile, and can hold his ground in one-on-one situations. At times he’ll stand too tall and lose leverage against the defender. Unger is an elite run protector, he does a very good job of working his way upfield and taking linebackers out of the play. He’s constantly moving in run protection. 5. Chris Myers – Houston Texans Myers is a very agile player; weighing at 290lbs he’s a rather light center. Myers is one of the best pass blocking centers in the league. He does a great job of shadowing defenders, and his footwork is fantastic. If Myers bulked up a bit, he might be a better run blocker. He lacks the strength to be an elite run protector. Pro Football Zone
#gmstrong
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So it's safe to say he's one of the best in the league today?
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
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"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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It certainly is.
But caution, those sites are simply ones I could find. I was 5 pages deep on a Google search of "ranking NFL centers". I don't even know how credible they are. Their lists are here because they were there. I'm certain there are much better sources.
But it does go to show that there are some very good centers out there and their not all on the playoff teams. We see Mack as something really special partly because he is but I think mostly because he made the Pro Bowl and up until this past season Pro Bowl players have been pretty much absent on our team.
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It certainly is.
But caution, those sites are simply ones I could find. I was 5 pages deep on a Google search of "ranking NFL centers". I don't even know how credible they are. Their lists are here because they were there. I'm certain there are much better sources.
Regardless, you pretty much agree that he's at the very least top 10 and maybe even top 5 correct?
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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It certainly is.
But caution, those sites are simply ones I could find. I was 5 pages deep on a Google search of "ranking NFL centers". I don't even know how credible they are. Their lists are here because they were there. I'm certain there are much better sources.
Probably not....the names are close to the same. The ranking vary, that is subjective.....the point that EO is making is that Mack isn't head and shoulders above everybody else. I agree with him, we can find another good center.
I think as this plays out, he will be the highest paid center in the league and I missed him being rated to best center in the league.
I say he doesn't want to be here......cool....everybody can make a choice. If I was running the Browns, I'd explore every option possible to trade him. If not, we just blew 10 mil....I don't see him signing here ever again unless we use a tag.
Kind of like Dawson who demanded a multi-year contract from us but has now just signed his 2nd one year deal with the Niners.
Why wasn't Phil demanding a multi year deal from them?
I'll bet a decade from now Phil comes back for his ring of honor induction and act like Cleveland was his home away from home.
Screw Phil. I hope we don't put his name in the stadium.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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What I do know about football I have shared with you. I don't care if you choose to not believe me or not. That is your decision. But I know my OL. I've built a few, I've trained a few, I have befriended a few. My last game I went to were with comp tickets from a Brown OLman. Actually I'm getting tired of coaching OL I wish to do OC or DC now but I'm good at it.
What the heck can you ever expect to learn by coaching? Waste of your time. Watching TV is all you need to know. Guys like you and Vers and a few others think you know something. meh
Sorry tabber, but there's not a smiley I could put here that would express how stupid my comment just was.
Keep up the OL posts. This thread has been a gold mine for anyone willing to read, comprehend and not feel threatened by someone trying to explain something to them.
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Regardless, you pretty much agree that he's at the very least top 10 and maybe even top 5 correct?
Here's the thing about that. I don't care if he is or he isn't. Someone else's ranking of a player means nothing to me. Just look at those lists I posted. See how all over the place they are. As Peen said, it's all subjective. If one prefers a run blocking center then that type gets ranked higher. If one prefers a pass protecting center then that guy gets ranked higher. If one's own team has a very good center he gets ranked higher than a lot of others just because.
What it is is football. It's not ranking. The only ranking that matters is who won the Superbowl. To need answers as to where other people rank a player is akin to teeny-boppers wanting to know the favorite color of their latest heartthrob. In the grand scheme of things... it doesn't matter.
It's football. It's trying to understand what makes a good center and how the position fits into the scheme the team is running. It's trying to understand just exactly what good footwork is. We hear people say it about players all the time. Do we know what it really means? What the advantage of having good footwork is or the disadvantage if our center lacks it?
It's football. It's getting to the second level. Do we know what that means and how it helps the running game? Do we know how hard it is to be good at that and the skills required to be good at that?
It's football. It's making line calls. Do we know what line calls are? Do we have any idea of the subtle signals the center gives the line and how within a few seconds he can tell each of the other four guys what their assignment is? Do we really know how football smart one has to be to change the line calls at the last second when he sees something in the defense that needs countered? Do we have any idea what he could have seen, what kind of thing the defense might have been doing to make him change the call at the last second?
It's football. It's not favorite colors. It's not what ranking someone else has put on them. You can be ranked number one, but if you just lost a game what was the value in that ranking? I'll tell you, it's zero.
We have a handful of very smart football guys here that we can take advantage of to help ourselves learn the game. We can ask football questions. We can provoke good, honest discussions. We can become an intelligent part of the conversation.
Or we can focus on demanding to know is who is rated higher than who by who in the hell knows.
Sorry if that sounded preachy or condescending.
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Just say 'yes' so he can feel like he made a point and we can move on.
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Just say 'yes' so he can feel like he made a point and we can move on.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
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All i know is that Mack is the perfect center for our team and they better do what it takes to keep him.
I think too many of you forget what having just an adequate center like faine and others were like. They got knocked on their arse so much frye thought he was getting a lap dance all game long.
It is NOWHERE as easy as you guys seem to think it is to find a center who can stand up to the NT's of our division.
You can't fix stupid but you can destroy ignorance. When you destroy ignorance you remove the justifications for evil. If you want to destroy evil then educate our people. Hate is a tool of the stupid to deal with what they can't understand.
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Let me see if I get this... I think Tab is saying that Center is just not that important of a position relative to other positions and given that, we probably shouldn't be tying up lots of our money long-term paying for one. Not that hard finding a competent player to fill the Center position if Mack walks.
Is that about right?
I believe that's pretty much what he's saying.
I just wonder what that says about our FO and coaching staffs decision to transition tag him then?
I mean if it's not that big of a deal, why would they tag him at over 10 mil.?
I believe the big deal is his great ability to make the calls. Sure, you can have anybody make those calls. It doesn't mean they're really good at it. To me, that transition tag speaks volumes.
Maybe, and it's appearing that it's working, we wanted the market to dictate what he's worth long term. And he's getting a solid piece of pie slapped in his face right now.
All he needs is someone to offer him 5 years and 35M and we match it. He's not even getting a visit right now.
How do we know these so-called line calls are always the best calls? We don't. And last time I checked we still continue to suck at the ground game. Why is that? Hmmmmmm.
This is no different than our defensive woes on 3rd down. Been a problem for a long ass time. So what's the fix? Dump the guys that are always on the field for that, DQ and Ward. Replace them with better. And we DID.
I'm with Eotab. Love to keep Mack at 7 or so a year, but no way do I give him anything close to Haden money. Teams all over the league survive and make playoff runs every single year without a STUD at Center.
It can be legitimately argued that the Center position is the least important starting position in the NFL.
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I think too many of you forget what having just an adequate center like faine and others were like. They got knocked on their arse so much frye thought he was getting a lap dance all game long.
I get what you're saying, but if a center is getting knocked back into the QB that often, he is not adequate.
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All I have been saying is I like Mack - I wish for him to stay here. Its obvious to me he had enough with the last firing with the instability. As soon as Weeden said he didn't want to be here everyone said - forget about football I don't want somebody here that wants out...guess it was just about liking Weeden cause I don't hear that here.
I want him here I am 99% sure he will be here in 2014. But in the near future if we lose him/trade him...its not a position that we cannot invest in and develop a good Center maybe better or just good enough to make our OL UNIT a strong one. Not once in my posts did I state he was not a top 10 center 10 top 5 center - One of the top in the NFL...somehow that became the focus of one poster to possibly denote the fact that the skill set of a center is not that great. Keeping in mind whoever they are its the mental part of the game that has to develop with them.
jmho
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
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CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Ddub,Thanks for your help.
PDR, Stick it up there where the sun don't shine.
What question did I ask that was so horrible that it required a snide comment from you?
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
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How do we know these so-called line calls are always the best calls? We don't. And last time I checked we still continue to suck at the ground game. Why is that? Hmmmmmm.
I'm simply basing that on the fact they tagged him. I don't believe you would tag anyone for that kind of tender if you didn't believe they were superb at their job. Why would you tag someone to a 10+ mil. deal if you had someone else that could do that job? I'm actually a lot like others in my belief that if Mack end up not signing a long term deal, we need to make contingency plans for the 2015 season.
And as I said in my previous reply, if that's not the case, what does that say about this coaching staff and FO?
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This is no different than our defensive woes on 3rd down. Been a problem for a long ass time. So what's the fix? Dump the guys that are always on the field for that, DQ and Ward. Replace them with better. And we DID.
So by that same line of thought, you don't feel if the same could have been done with Mack, that they wouldn't have?
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I'm with Eotab. Love to keep Mack at 7 or so a year, but no way do I give him anything close to Haden money. Teams all over the league survive and make playoff runs every single year without a STUD at Center.
I don't disagree. What I'm saying is that he's already tagged for this year and if it was so easy to replace him, why wouldn't or shouldn't have that been done? As you pointed out, they had no problem doing that with DQ and Ward.
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It can be legitimately argued that the Center position is the least important starting position in the NFL.
Oh it can be argued.
But what is much harder to argue is you do need solid talent on your OL. If you don't have strong G's, you need that talent at other positions on the OL. You also need some continuity. I believe that is more the dilemma we are in.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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PDR, Stick it up there where the sun don't shine.
What question did I ask that was so horrible that it required a snide comment from you?
No LOL?
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PDR, Stick it up there where the sun don't shine.
What question did I ask that was so horrible that it required a snide comment from you?
No LOL?
So your saying you don't want to stick it there?
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Legend
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Legend
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I think a Center or OL position is more important or as important as a Good WR. You need them both but I cannot remember a team not winning a championship primarily due to the fact they lost a WR or a Center.
jmho...
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Dawg Talker
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One of the reasons I think we tagged him was because the fan base needs to see good players that we drafted kept around. I think the FO is under pressure to make sure that we believe there is a plan in place and its being followed. We have been told that we are going to build through the draft, and many of us are happy with that. As long as they do it.
Mack is good. He's developed into a really good player, yet he has had his down moments. We have offered him a ton of dough to play center. He and his agent have extended our embarrassment thing, when many of us thought it was over. I'm allowed to be *&^%$ off about him and his brilliant agent dragging us through the mud.
The topic seems to have been, is he THAT good? I'll let oline guys sell me on that. I have no problem with us paying him more than he obviously is worth. To break the bank, wreck our cap structure, and all the girlie sports critics to continue to pound us... that's a different story.
What are your predictions on how much money is on the table? What do you think the Browns have offered his brilliant agent? What are they sitting on?
My posts have been consistent. I'm not buying that Cleveland is a bad place to be and a bad place to play football. Its very, very easy to take shots at, but reality is that it is a potentially very good place to play football. If Mack thinks he has to go back to Cali in order to be happy, I disagree. If he has to pull this disrespectfull bull with his agent in order to get us to move - he wins. Lets spend the money elsewhere. Lets move on. I want people who are going to be a part of the solution (my problem being I need a Superbowl and nothing less matters).
Maybe he, Adam Gase, king james, and rg3, can all sit around tell each other how lucky they are to not be in Cleveland. They can feel better by making Cleveland jokes. Heck, the stooler stooge florio will even post it on his stooler message board, in between all his other slams, attacks, and misleading Browns posts. Meanwhile, we will slowly build something the rest of us can be proud of.
How much do you think is on the table right now? 15 mil guarnteed? 20? 25?
Agents can bully teams and have the girlie sports critics all back them up and ram their agenda down our throats. There comes a time to call a spade a spade.
Only a desperate team, making a bad decision, is going to offer Mack more than we have already put on the table. But, they do exist.
Our front office is doing more good by what they are not doing, than what they are at this point. Things are looking up.
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Legend
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Legend
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Maybe you should ask me six or seven more times.
Anyway, back to Mack...I really don't see a scenario where he signs a deal unless it's with us.
Demoff could get creative and craft something with a player option after the first year and a no tag clause, but I don't see a team putting themselves on the line like that.
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2nd String
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2nd String
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I feel like Mack would be dumb to turn down a long term offer for a lot of money. You are playing with fire if you think centers are going to be getting a huge amount of money, and with any sort of injury he would be screwed going into next years market.
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Legend
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Legend
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Quote:
I think a Center or OL position is more important or as important as a Good WR. You need them both but I cannot remember a team not winning a championship primarily due to the fact they lost a WR or a Center.
jmho...
I don't discount your point. I do however believe each case is different. I'm not speaking about a long term contract, but as it pertains to the tag this year. If he simply won't sign a long term deal, a contingency plan should be implemented to address it.
With Lavou leaving, I think we had to keep Mack for the continuity and physical talent aspect. I don't believe trying to replace two players who are right beside each other on the OL would be wise.
I also believe you need a pretty good talent level on your OL "as a unit". I believe the best players on our OL are Joe Thomas and Mack. I also don't believe there was a reliable replacement in the FA market this year.
So to me, our individual situation made putting the transition tag on Mack for this season essential.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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What do you think we've offered?
15 mil guarnteed?
20, 25?
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Legend
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Legend
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Quote:
One of the reasons I think we tagged him was because the fan base needs to see good players that we drafted kept around. I think the FO is under pressure to make sure that we believe there is a plan in place and its being followed. We have been told that we are going to build through the draft, and many of us are happy with that. As long as they do it.
If the fan base had anything to do with tagging Mack, we're in a lot of trouble moving forward.
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Mack is good. He's developed into a really good player, yet he has had his down moments. We have offered him a ton of dough to play center. He and his agent have extended our embarrassment thing, when many of us thought it was over. I'm allowed to be *&^%$ off about him and his brilliant agent dragging us through the mud.
I don't see it that way. It's simply business. I believe if I knew I had a limited career, I would try to capitalize upon it. I believe you need to consider that if a player is seriously hurt or injured, their career is over. I doubt Macks intention was to "drag anyone through the mud".
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To break the bank, wreck our cap structure, and all the girlie sports critics to continue to pound us... that's a different story.
I have never disagreed with this line of thinking.
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What are your predictions on how much money is on the table? What do you think the Browns have offered his brilliant agent? What are they sitting on?
Who knows. But if you give all 32 teams a chance to compete for your services, your chances at getting the best possible offer improves. It's a business.
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My posts have been consistent. I'm not buying that Cleveland is a bad place to be and a bad place to play football. Its very, very easy to take shots at, but reality is that it is a potentially very good place to play football. If Mack thinks he has to go back to Cali in order to be happy, I disagree.
I think only Mack knows what will make Mack happy.
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If he has to pull this disrespectfull bull with his agent in order to get us to move - he wins. Lets spend the money elsewhere. Lets move on. I want people who are going to be a part of the solution (my problem being I need a Superbowl and nothing less matters).
Maybe he, Adam Gase, king james, and rg3, can all sit around tell each other how lucky they are to not be in Cleveland. They can feel better by making Cleveland jokes. Heck, the stooler stooge florio will even post it on his stooler message board, in between all his other slams, attacks, and misleading Browns posts. Meanwhile, we will slowly build something the rest of us can be proud of.
I think you're taking a business decision far too personal. I haven't heard anyone say anything disrespectful in any way. Well, until I read your comments anyway.
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Only a desperate team, making a bad decision, is going to offer Mack more than we have already put on the table. But, they do exist.
And how does any other team know what we put on the table?
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Our front office is doing more good by what they are not doing, than what they are at this point. Things are looking up.
I'm not sure why you addressed me with your post. I have never advocated way overpaying for Mack.
But I'm glad you got all of that out of your system.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Legend
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Legend
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Last year we were trying out Greco at center all around it was said for us to have a contingency plan if Mack would not sign here. More than likely he will sign the Tag. We can still keep testing Greco. Or develop a rookie.
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,739
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,739 |
I agree with you and also see Lavau leaving as a big part of this as well.
My only point would be that if we were to try to move Greco over, we would be in need of two G's. That would most certainly destroy any sense of continuity at this juncture IMO
But we certainly need to address the OL. If Mack doesn't sign a long term deal, we will need a lot more than if he does IMO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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I'm not sure I was addressing you in my post.
I obviously didn't communicate what I was trying to say very well. Many of your interpretations aren't what I meant. My post was a general rant. Not intended to you, but I clicked reply to post my points.
Fan base, PR, signing players we drafted, I think they are important. Especially on losing teams trying to build themselves out of the rut.
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465 |
Quote:
If Mack thinks he has to go back to Cali in order to be happy, I disagree.
Maybe you should let him know that.
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Alex Mack Transition Tag in FA
Part 2
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