DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Cleveland Indians @ New York Yankees Series

Tuesday: Jake Westbrook (0-1, 7.36) vs. Chase Wright (0-0, 0.00)
Wednesday: Jeremy Sowers (0-0, 1.29) vs. Kei Igawa (0-0, 7.84)
Thursday: Fausto Carmona (0-1, 12.46) vs. Darrell Rasner (0-1, 4.66)

Preview
New York vs. Cleveland
@ Yankee Stadium

Former New York Yankees right-hander Jake Westbrook has developed into a cornerstone of the Cleveland Indians rotation - and has been on the mound for two of the Yankees' ugliest losses in recent years. On Tuesday, he'll take the ball at Yankee Stadium as New York tries to move past another painful defeat.

Westbrook made three appearances for the Yankees in 2000 before being traded to the Indians for outfielder David Justice - a move that was instrumental in New York winning its fourth World Series title in five years that season. Westbrook, though, has provided a return on the deal for his current team, winning at least 15 games and throwing more than 210 innings in each of the last three seasons.

The 29-year-old right-hander signed a three-year, $33 million contract with Cleveland (6-3) during the offseason.

"It's a good feeling to have, kind of a weight off my mind," Westbrook, 0-1 with a 7.36 ERA in two starts this year, told the Indians' official Web site. "I can just go out there and worry about pitching and not think about anything."

Westbrook is 2-2 with a 3.69 ERA in eight appearances against the Yankees, and his last game against New York came July 4, when he gave up one unearned run in seven innings of a 19-1 Indians win at Jacobs Field. The lopsided loss came on the 76th birthday of Yankees owner George Steinbrenner.

The defeat was New York's worst since a 22-0 blowout by Cleveland on Aug. 31, 2004 at Yankee Stadium - also started and won by Westbrook, who went seven innings and struck out five with no walks.

The sinkerballer will be facing a Yankees team that returned from Oakland following a stunning loss Sunday. Star closer Mariano Rivera allowed a three-run homer to Marco Scutaro on an 0-2 pitch with two outs in the ninth inning to give the Athletics a 5-4 victory and the series win.

"I was shocked," Yankees manager Joe Torre said.

The loss sent New York home after going 3-3 on its road trip. The Yankees (5-6) had Monday off to bounce back from the long flight, Sunday's disheartening defeat and playing 24 innings in splitting the first two games of the A's series.

Rivera should also have a good chance to rebound during this series, as he's converted each of his last nine save opportunities against the Indians. He's 2-2 with a 3.38 ERA and 21 saves in 24 chances against Cleveland.

Before Rivera gets another chance to nail down a lead, the Yankees will try to get to Westbrook, who allowed three runs in six innings of a 4-1 loss to the Los Angeles Angels on Wednesday at Milwaukee's Miller Park. Two of the runs Westbrook allowed, including one on a wild pitch, scored in the sixth.

"I felt a lot better than my last start," Westbrook said, "but I didn't do my job in the sixth inning."

The former Yankees prospect will be opposed by a current one, left-hander Chase Wright, who was recalled from the minors to start when Mike Mussina and Carl Pavano joined fellow right-hander Chien-Ming on the disabled list Sunday.

Wright, 24, went 1-0 while throwing seven scoreless innings in each of his two starts at Double-A Trenton this season, allowing four hits and a walk with 19 strikeouts. The Yankees hope he can give them a strong outing in his major league debut with three-fifths of their starting rotation on the DL.

"You're pretty much bringing in the person who's doing the best at the time," Torre told the Yankees' Web site. "We just decided that we saw enough of him to feel good about what (Wright) brings to the table."

The Indians have gone 2-1 in each of their three series so far, defeating the Chicago White Sox 2-1 on Sunday despite getting only one hit. Cleveland scored two unearned runs in support of C.C. Sabathia, who threw eight dominant innings.

New York's Derek Jeter is batting .368 (7-for-19) and Jose Posada is 4-for-12 with a homer and six RBIs against Westbrook.

The Yankees won two of three at home against the Indians last year and took the season series 4-3.

AP NEWS
The Associated Press News Service

Copyright 2006-2007, The Associated Press, All Rights Reserved

I'm sensing a .....



GO TRIBE !!!!

I just hope they get this game in.....Forecast: Low near 40F. Winds N at 15 to 25 mph. Chance of rain 50%.

BRING IT ON!

I've got a bet with the ex-girlfriend on this series.

Go Tribe.

Victor gets the start at catcher tonight......

wahoo > pinstripes

1-0 Tribe middle of 1st
Victor with an RBI

It's early but Westbrook is really pissing me off already.

Bases loaded w/ pinstripes 1 out

2-1 stankees end of 1

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No one's swinging at his sinker.

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They swung at that one.......Homerun 3-1 Yanks

Come on Tribe!

Nice pitching Jake...you stiff. Re-signing him was worse than signing Kevin Shaffer to his contract.

Bump up Sowers to #3 please...

Maybe the Yankees should try to sign a certain Ohio State QB, so you could be really happy

OMGZ FIRE WEDGE!!!

actually fire shapiro, holy hell batman. is that what we get for 33 million dollars? in my opinion tho, the order of resigning should have went CC, hafner, westbrook. To me hafner ain't gonna get much money cause he's a liability in the field so he can only go to AL, not to mention he's having a very average year so far.CC is every year pretty solid and def. number 1, westbrook is way to inconsistent for me as a number 2 or 3, especially as terrible as our D is. peralta to me is still junk. Should have hung on to omar another year or two. That guy is like the dick clark of baseball at the hardest position. But if we had CC locked up, hafner and westbrook are really a dime a dozen. Garko i think could easily DH and put Vmart at 1st cause i hate him behind the plate, then you put shoppach back there and your defense and run production looks alot better. And barfield imo is a downgrade from belliard. Belly was a good def. 2nd baseman with and average bat but could drive in the runs. We currently aren't doing that

I don't want to tear apart your post... but I'm a little bored...

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To me hafner ain't gonna get much money cause he's a liability in the field so he can only go to AL, not to mention he's having a very average year so far.

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You honestly think his year so far is going to have a huge impact on his price? He hit 42 HRs last year, and missed the final month. He is one of the best hitters in baseball... period. He's looking at Ortiz money (4 yrs. $52 mill), if not higher in this market.

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CC is every year pretty solid and def. number 1

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I love this! C.C. has never been considered an ace by Cleveland fans. They've always pointed out his mechanical flaws, his weight, etc... until he might be a free agent. Then he's a #1. The sense of worth Cleveland fans have is almost laughable. Sabathia is a great pitcher, but there is no way the Indians can afford him. Unless he tears a rotator cuff or has Tommy John this season, he will at least match, and quite possibly pass, Barry Zito's contract. I honestly think that he will get $17-20 million/season from some team. He's a young, powerful, healthy lefty... those don't fall off of trees. I'd love for Sabathia to remain an Indian, but a team with Cleveland's resources cannot afford to put that much money into a single player.

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is that what we get for 33 million dollars?...
westbrook is way to inconsistent for me as a number 2 or 3

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Westbrook signed below market value, perhaps a good deal below. He signed a shorter deal, a deal that will run through his peak years, at Gil Meche money. Meche has a career 4.61 ERA and was over 5.00 in two of the past three seasons. Meche has two seasons that he has stayed healthy. In comparison, Westbrook has a 4.39 career ERA (without coming near a 5 ERA since he became a starter) and has thrown at least 210 innings each of the past three seasons. Westbrook is a bargain. The only problem with him is that he relys on the umps to be calling the low strike in order for him to be effective. Westbrook's deal came up after this season, whereas Sabathia and Hafner had two seasons. Shapiro had to make a decision now on Jake, and he got a GREAT deal out of it. In the open market, I bet Jake gets 5 years (player option 6) for $60-65 million, perhaps more.

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Should have hung on to omar another year or two. That guy is like the dick clark of baseball at the hardest position.

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Omar is breaking every possible rule about SS's right now. At the time his contract was up, the MOST successful comparable players were Concepcion, Fernandez and Willie Randolph. None of those players came close to finishing out what would have been a three-year deal, and most of the comps retired following what would have been Omar's FA season. Plus, what sense did it make to go into a rebuild with a 37 y/o SS blocking the AAA MVP? Its easy to look back now, but statistically there is almost no comparison to what Omar is doing right now. I'm happy for him, but the Tribe made the right decision.

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hafner and westbrook are really a dime a dozen

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LOL!!! Show me a 42 HR DH that is a "dime a dozen". Think a team like the Yanks might want a Jake Westbrook right now? Dime a dozen??? Please...

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And barfield imo is a downgrade from belliard. Belly was a good def. 2nd baseman with and average bat but could drive in the runs.

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Ronnie Belliard is not, and was not, a good second baseman. He had no range and hid that fact by playing shallow right field instead of second base. He also made plays that should have been ordinary look spectacular by being so far out of position. Offensively, he was average, maybe a hair above. However, he is 32 years old, and after the trade last season hit .237 down the stretch. His demand was SO great, that he is now the utility infielder for the worst team in baseball. Barfield, meanwhile, is 24 y/o, coming off a rookie season in which he hit .280 with 13 HRs in, arguably, the worst hitters park in baseball. Belliard, meanwhile, hit .272 last season with 13 HRs, in a bad hitters park (Cleveland- 8 HRS in 350 ABs) and in a much better hitters park (STL- 5 HRs in 194 ABs). At absolute worst, if Barfield progresses not at all from last season, he is the same offensively as Belliard and much better defensively while running the bases 10x better.

But don't let these facts interrupt your point...

Don't mind me, Go Yanks. But on the other hand Cleveland looks like they could be real contenders this season if they don't falter toward October.

If the Yanks get eliminated I'll be rooting for them.

Very, very good post logdawg. So many Indians fans can be way too fickle. It's April. It's like having to deal with my fellow OSU basketball fans who decided just this November to jump on board.

Hafner is definitely going to get paid. He'll command Ortiz money. The fact he can't play the field doesn't matter as much. The Yankees would love to have a guy like this. If he didn't get hurt last year and the bullpen wasn't the most horrible thing ever, Hafner would have gotten strong MVP consideration. The man's got some $$$ coming to him.

CC is also gonna get his. I'm hopeful we can resign him, but that might just be wishful thinking. He's young, throws hard, is left-handed, and has been around the top third in ERA the last few years. He's got huge $$$ coming as well. Signing Hafner is a possibility, CC seems like an improbability. Your comparison to Zito was a fitting one. The Cubs, Yankees, Red Sox, and Mets seem like the teams that will be able to afford the massive contract he'll want. At his age, he'll get it.

It's hard to bash Jake this early in the year. The guy was a stud 2 years ago, and a solid pitcher last year. It's gotta be hard for him to throw his breaking balls in the miserable cold that was Yankee Stadium tonight. He started slow last year too. He'll be fine. Signing him was a smart move by Sharpiro.

I don't think people understand with Barfield and Peralta that potential upside had to outweigh what we had. With our payroll, resigning Omar was difficult enough. Plus he was 37. Not many SS play that long. Cal Ripken and Barry Larkin maybe. Good for Omar, but Peralta was a 22 year old stud that was tearing up the minors. I'm still hopeful that Jhonny will turn things around and get back to his 2005 form when no one dared to say the things they are now saying about him. Barfield over Belliard makes perfect sense. A good 24 year old 2B who hit .280 and plays good defense for an over 30 guy who had to play the softball position of short right to have any sort of range. He has struggled ever since we traded him. Barfield has unlimited upside.

With a lower level payroll, poor fan attendance, and potential stars bolting in free agency, Shapiro has done an admirable job in keeping this team competitive. He's doing with us what was done with the Oakland A's. Guys like Belliard, Crisp, Colon, etc are traded away when it becomes apparent that they want too much from our club. In return we get young prospects that become the future of this team. Right now we've got Barfield, Marte, Garko, etc that in time will hopefully replace a Hafner if we can't resign him. That's the reality of small market baseball. If you want to change it, sell out the Jake.

as soon as you show me facts then i won't let them get in the way. Hafner is not having a great year, is injury prone and is a DH, he won't get as big of money as you think, and westbrook to me is still what i say he is. And barfield..lmao, how many routine balls and bad throws does he miss, not to mention batting .162 or something dismal around there. you act like you know me, i've always been a CC supporter. I always knew he could potentially be a 20 game winner. and hes still relatively young, so i stand by my post saying that our priority in signing should have been CC, then hafner and westbrook if there was money left over

its not being fickle, its called being observant

V.Martinez .375 .500 4 16 0 6 8 2 0 0 6 3 2 0 0 0
R.Garko .320 .440 7 25 3 8 11 0 0 1 1 0 4 0 0 0
J.Michaels .313 .688 9 16 3 5 11 1 1 1 3 2 4 0 1 0
G.Sizemore .294 .706 10 34 12 10 24 2 0 4 6 11 8 3 0 0
T.Nixon .292 .417 6 24 4 7 10 3 0 0 1 3 5 0 0 0
D.Dellucci .269 .346 8 26 2 7 9 2 0 0 0 2 6 0 0 0
J.Peralta .265 .441 10 34 5 9 15 1 1 1 7 6 9 1 0 3
T.Hafner .243 .432 10 37 5 9 16 1 0 2 6 7 9 0 0 0
C.Blake .229 .371 10 35 6 8 13 2 0 1 2 5 6 0 1 1
A.Marte .194 .355 9 31 2 6 11 2 0 1 7 1 6 0 0 3
J.Barfield .162 .297 9 37 4 6 11 0 1 1 5 1 7 0 0 3
K.Shoppach .125 .313 6 16 2 2 5 0 0 1 2 4 5 0 0 0


hafner, peralta, and barfield, wheres our offense coming from this year

Nice post Log However some of the whiners are in full force already. We didn't go 162-0 during the regular season so The owner is cheap, Shipiro must go, Wedge is a bum, and every player on the team must be worthless

These same posters would find something to *female dog* about even if we win the world series. You know the type they could win 10 million in the lottery and they would witch and cry because some other guy hit it for 25 million last month, and it's not fair that they only get 10 million. How can they scrape by on 10 million. The lottery is a piece of crap because they only gave them 10 million.

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Hafner is not having a great year, is injury prone and is a DH, he won't get as big of money as you think

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This season is 10 games old, and he's "not having a great year"? More like he's not having a great week and a half. You honestly think that these 10 games are going to have more of an impact than the past two seasons in contract negotiations? 300 games vs 10... which would people look at? The market value for Hafner would be Ortiz' contract. They are roughly the same player.

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And barfield..lmao, how many routine balls and bad throws does he miss, not to mention batting .162 or something dismal around there.

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Again, you've been watching him for *maybe* 10 games right now, unless you live in San Diego and saw him last season. Last year, he deserved some RoY mentions in the NL. The mere fact that you'd rather have a 32 y/o journeyman over a 24 y/o future All-Star is humorous to me.

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you act like you know me

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I guess you are right. My basis is the fact that you think that you can base a season off of 10 games in other cases so I thought that you might have overreacted to things in the past. Considering the vast majority of Indians fans that have been whining about C.C. over the past few years, I naturally assumed that you jumping to conclusions after 10 games might have led you to be in that group. If you truly weren't, perhaps I was wrong. But, I find it hard to believe that you were never in that group being critical of C.C.

I just read most of this thread this morning.

Thank you log for having sense and tearing his post apart so someone else didnt have to.

I love when people overreact after 10 games of 162 game season. Classic.

j/c

Yeah, we're 10 games into the season, we've won every series we've played so far and, yet, we're in trouble already.

Sure, it is frustrating to watch our guys hit so poorly with men in scoring position. Yeah, Jake was throwing batting practice last night. However, it is WAY too soon to start pounding the nails in the coffin.

I don't think we're in trouble yet, but our holes and weaknesses are starting to become obvious, and I don't like them.

Westbrook hasn't looked good in one game so far, that scares me considering we just gave him a huge payday. All the money thrown into our bullpen doesn't seem to have done much, and we gave a huge contract to a #3 starter when most likely a guy from our farm system could have replaced him.

Will it be harder to re-sign C.C.? Yes. Is he short of being a truly dominant ace like Santana? Yes. But it's much harder to replace a guy like C.C. than a guy like Westbrook.

I'll feel a lot better when Cliff Lee is back, we'll see how Sowers does today. I'm big on him and think he's our future ace.

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I love when people overreact after 10 games of 162 game season. Classic.

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I know, my God, at the current pace, we would only win 97 games... that would suck.

Indians are coming to Tampa Bay this weekend!

Going to a baseball game in a dome is not the same as being under the clear blue sky!

Oh, shut up.

Log, loved your post. It is so true, alot of baseball left in the season gang. I was listening to the game the other day and the announcers were discussing Hafner's season so far and they are NOT worried one iota because they pointed out something very interesting. Hafner is like Thome in that they come out kinda slow in April, get the rust knocked off completely and by May are starting to get into a groove. They said Hafner started last season the same way. (don't know how true that is because I haven't looked up the stats)

I am enjoying the way the team looks. They are showing alot of potential for this season. CC is looking good and it always amazes me when people start bashing a player because they aren't "Perfect". If you look at the facts of some of the past few seasons games, those pitchers that did a stellar job but didn't end up with a lot of wins-wasn't always their fault that they didn't get the win. This year the bullpen looks better than it has in the past couple of years.

This team is probably one of the best looking teams that have been fielded in the last few years. I'm really looking forward to seeing how this season unfolds and how many of the folks that whinging about how awful this team is and how their f/o sucks crap change their song further into the season.

jmo

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This season is 10 games old, and he's "not having a great year"? More like he's not having a great week and a half.

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Also, on top of that, we can't forget what this team has gone through in those 10 games. All those days in a row of prepping for a game only to find out you aren't going to play, and then suddely jumping ship to Milwaukee for a series at the very last minute and having that be your "home opener" has an effect on the brain. It hard enough to produce when it's cold but its hard to concentrate when there have been so many interuptions this season.

The Tribe fans are melting down quicker than I had even predicted at the beginning of the season.....and they are playing well.

Shup Jules Its a long season .....Go Tribe

So...... did we win?