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Joined: Feb 2011
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Practice Squad
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OP
Practice Squad
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 165 |
I know that the draft is a crap shoot, but as an organization you would hope,at the very least, your 1st & 2nd round picks would immediately contribute in bringing the overall talent level of your team up. Pure, solid talent should be your goal, especially where the Browns have been picking over the past 5 yrs.
Unfortunately, this has not been the case with the Browns. Here are our 1st & 2nd round picks over the last 5 yrs. & my grade.
2009
#21-Mack-VG
#36- Robiskie-Weak-Gone
#50-Massaquoi-Weak-Gone
#52-Veikune-Weak-Gone
2010
#7-Haden-VG
#38-Ward-Good-Gone
#59-Hardesty-Fair-Gone
2011
#21-Taylor-Good
#37-Sheard-Good
#59-Little-Fair-Miss
2012
#3-Richardson- Fair-Weak-Gone
#22-Weeden-Weak-Gone
#37-Schwartz-Fair-OK-Based on a good R season & half an OK 2nd season
2013
#6-Mingo-Good-Fair
(S)-Gordon-VG
This is a huge draft for us, we need to pick the very best talent, not potential. Too many misses on very high picks in the last 5 yrs. has set us back way too many times.
Roughly 45 percent of our highest picks in the last 5 yrs., aren't even on the roster anymore.
Thxs
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1st String
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1st String
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The Browns really have to get better at drafting.I think the new FO are just the guys to get it done.When I think of all the wasted picks over the years..ughhhhh!!
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
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No doubt the Browns haven't been turning any heads in the draft room; however, I also firmly believe this:
If that ONE selection of Brandon Weeden would have turned out to be "VG" ... you wouldn't even need to bother posting your thread. Just like if the QB we select this year (wherever that may be) turns out to be "VG," nothing else will be magnified at all. JMO.
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 75,194
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 75,194 |
Quote:
The Browns really have to get better at drafting.I think the new FO are just the guys to get it done.When I think of all the wasted picks over the years..ughhhhh!!
I think we all "hope" they are the guys to get it done. However they have no track record for me to feel they "are just the guys to get it done".
None of them have ever been in charge of actually running a draft. All we have to base our feelings on is hope and being Browns fans.
JMHO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Legend
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Legend
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Can we just erase 2012 from existence? Good God that's a horrible draft.
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Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 433
1st String
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1st String
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 433 |
Quote:
Quote:
The Browns really have to get better at drafting.I think the new FO are just the guys to get it done.When I think of all the wasted picks over the years..ughhhhh!!
I think we all "hope" they are the guys to get it done. However they have no track record for me to feel they "are just the guys to get it done".
None of them have ever been in charge of actually running a draft. All we have to base our feelings on is hope and being Browns fans.
JMHO
We will see,but I'm not worried about them doing a better job at drafting than what we've seen from past regimes.
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Joined: Apr 2013
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1st String
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1st String
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Can we just erase 2012 from existence? Good God that's a horrible draft.
Yep..No team can afford to have drafts like that.Heck one of us could have thrown darts at the board and come out fairing better than that.
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 75,194 |
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We will see,but I'm not worried about them doing a better job at drafting than what we've seen from past regimes.
I really believe you are setting the bar far too low.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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~ Legend
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~ Legend
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at least we almost recouped the cost of Trent.
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Joined: Apr 2013
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1st String
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1st String
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Quote:
Quote:
We will see,but I'm not worried about them doing a better job at drafting than what we've seen from past regimes.
I really believe you are setting the bar far too low.
Loooool...yeah,it don't get any lower than that!
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Joined: Apr 2013
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1st String
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1st String
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at least we almost recouped the cost of Trent.
Absolutely! Great trade,and I still can't believe Indy was dumb enough to do it.
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027 |
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at least we almost recouped the cost of Trent.
That's the only saving grace, we got a mulligan on that pick. Sure we traded #3 for #26, but that's not the point. The fact that they were willing to admit they made a mistake and to actually get a 1 back is still mind boggling...
At least you have that, Joe, lol.
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,370
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,370 |
Quote:
Quote:
The Browns really have to get better at drafting.I think the new FO are just the guys to get it done.When I think of all the wasted picks over the years..ughhhhh!!
I think we all "hope" they are the guys to get it done. However they have no track record for me to feel they "are just the guys to get it done".
None of them have ever been in charge of actually running a draft. All we have to base our feelings on is hope and being Browns fans.
JMHO
All of them have been in the draft room of NFL teams. Running a draft? What have the draft gurus that everyone cites as being the 'experts' done?
As for that, I would say that I like that they have no track record. I want to see fresh ideas and bold selections coming out of Berea.
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Joined: Feb 2008
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Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
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Quote:
Quote:
We will see,but I'm not worried about them doing a better job at drafting than what we've seen from past regimes.
I really believe you are setting the bar far too low.
 It's what we're accustomed to as Browns fans.
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Legend
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Legend
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I'm sure if you looked at most teams their drafting would look similar to a point..
Maybe not 09 and 2012 bad, but yeah.. Not everyone hits on Pro Bowl 5th an 6th rounders every year...
I look at at team like New England, who for the longest time has been a top team, but if you look at their drafting? It's not that great. The only reason they are still a top team. They have the QB.
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,507 |
Quote:
I'll give my grades, in the form of letter grades.
2009
#21-Mack- A+
#36- Robiskie- F
#50-Massaquoi- D- (At least we got a little out of him)
#52-Veikune- F- (If possible. He never did a thing)
2010
#7-Haden- A
#38-Ward- B- (He became an upper level run stuffing, starting SS, though never a great cover guy)
#59-Hardesty- F (What did he ever do for this team?)
2011
#21-Taylor- B- (He's a solid player, though probably somewhat overrated by Browns fans)
#37-Sheard- B+
#59-Little- D+ (Only because he is a strong blocker, with a willingness to work hard, and had one solid half season where it looked like he was turning the corner)
2012
#3-Richardson- C- (One semi solid year with injuries, and one bad pair of games for us)
#22-Weeden- F
#37-Schwartz- C (Still could go either way)
2013
#6-Mingo- Incomplete
(S)-Gordon-A++
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Joined: Oct 2006
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Legend
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Legend
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2012 saving graces were getting the 1st back for Trent AND Josh Gordon. Supplemental pick was taken in 2013, but he was drafted in 2012. Sad to see so many of our past drafts end up coming down to 1 good player.
#gmstrong
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,960 |
Quote:
Quote:
The Browns really have to get better at drafting.I think the new FO are just the guys to get it done.When I think of all the wasted picks over the years..ughhhhh!!
I think we all "hope" they are the guys to get it done. However they have no track record for me to feel they "are just the guys to get it done".
None of them have ever been in charge of actually running a draft. All we have to base our feelings on is hope and being Browns fans.
JMHO
Hard for me to be optimistic after all the fails. But it wasn't these guys running the team that failed.
So, while it doesn't feel right to say it, we just have to wait and see and remain hopeful that this is the group that can get it done.
Hell, what choice do we really have?
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
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I didn't read the thread so forgive me if it's been said. Richardson was fair?  
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 75,194 |
Quote:
As for that, I would say that I like that they have no track record. I want to see fresh ideas and bold selections coming out of Berea.
No track record is better than the track record of those who have proceeded them.
My point was that we have nothing to base a "belief they will succeed" on. Once again, we all hope they do. We all want them to. But as of yet, the jury is far from in on these guys.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,728
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Aug 2007
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Quote:
I'll give my grades, in the form of letter grades.
2009
#21-Mack- A+
#36- Robiskie- F
#50-Massaquoi- D- (At least we got a little out of him)
#52-Veikune- F- (If possible. He never did a thing)
2010
#7-Haden- A
#38-Ward- B- (He became an upper level run stuffing, starting SS, though never a great cover guy)
#59-Hardesty- F (What did he ever do for this team?)
2011
#21-Taylor- B- (He's a solid player, though probably somewhat overrated by Browns fans)
#37-Sheard- B+
#59-Little- D+ (Only because he is a strong blocker, with a willingness to work hard, and had one solid half season where it looked like he was turning the corner)
2012
#3-Richardson- C- (One semi solid year with injuries, and one bad pair of games for us)
#22-Weeden- F
#37-Schwartz- C (Still could go either way)
2013
#6-Mingo- Incomplete
(S)-Gordon-A++
One thing to note on Little...Gordon seemed to me to be one of those guys content to coast through on talent and maybe never realize how good he could really be. I remember him completely gassed in his first camp. And Little took him under his wing. Started training with him. Getting him to eat right. And take care of his body. Then worked with him in the offseason. Training. Lifting. And now. Gordon is a physical beast. He's realizing his greatest potential. And he was the best WR in the NFL last year alongside Calvin. I'd give Little a B for that alone. I wish he was a better football player. But he's just not. Not a WR. Not a RB. I don't know what he is. Maybe they should flip him over to safety or something. He can't catch. But none of those safeties really can. LOL
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/Heldawg/rgiii2.jpg)
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,507 |
Quote:
Quote:
I'll give my grades, in the form of letter grades.
2009
#21-Mack- A+
#36- Robiskie- F
#50-Massaquoi- D- (At least we got a little out of him)
#52-Veikune- F- (If possible. He never did a thing)
2010
#7-Haden- A
#38-Ward- B- (He became an upper level run stuffing, starting SS, though never a great cover guy)
#59-Hardesty- F (What did he ever do for this team?)
2011
#21-Taylor- B- (He's a solid player, though probably somewhat overrated by Browns fans)
#37-Sheard- B+
#59-Little- D+ (Only because he is a strong blocker, with a willingness to work hard, and had one solid half season where it looked like he was turning the corner)
2012
#3-Richardson- C- (One semi solid year with injuries, and one bad pair of games for us)
#22-Weeden- F
#37-Schwartz- C (Still could go either way)
2013
#6-Mingo- Incomplete
(S)-Gordon-A++
One thing to note on Little...Gordon seemed to me to be one of those guys content to coast through on talent and maybe never realize how good he could really be. I remember him completely gassed in his first camp. And Little took him under his wing. Started training with him. Getting him to eat right. And take care of his body. Then worked with him in the offseason. Training. Lifting. And now. Gordon is a physical beast. He's realizing his greatest potential. And he was the best WR in the NFL last year alongside Calvin. I'd give Little a B for that alone. I wish he was a better football player. But he's just not. Not a WR. Not a RB. I don't know what he is. Maybe they should flip him over to safety or something. He can't catch. But none of those safeties really can. LOL
That is something that I forgot about Little. He did take Gordon under his wing, and does seem to have been a good influence on him.
Very good point.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Posts: 73,448
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 73,448 |
J/C
The 2nd round of the 2009 draft coupled with the selection of Brandon Weeden might possibly be the worse decisions in franchise history ... and we all know that is a tough statement to make.
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,507
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,507 |
Quote:
J/C
The 2nd round of the 2009 draft coupled with the selection of Brandon Weeden might possibly be the worse decisions in franchise history ... and we all know that is a tough statement to make.
No.
The panicked move by Belichick to trade down when a player he wanted was taken, which gave the Browns an extra 1st round pick, which then turned into an extra Ravens 1st round pick when MoSmell moved the team, and which turned into Ray lewis, IIRC. (It was either him or Jonathon Ogden)
That, for me, was the worst draft trade ever, because it put a Hall Of Fame player on the stinkin' Ravens.
Oh, and we got Craig Powell to help save the browns.  
Looking back at some older drafts .... taking Patrick Rowe (yeah ... I know ...... who?) WR .... in the 2nd round of the 1992 draft, following up the Tommy Vardell pick. might be right up there as well.
Man, I am depressed. I just looked at the draft history, and it's no wonder we've sucked for so long. A team just can't draft that badly, for that long, and hope to be any good.
I do agree that the examples you cite are pretty awful though. The one I cited has a special, vile place in my heart though.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 |
Quote:
The panicked move by Belichick to trade down when a player he wanted was taken, which gave the Browns an extra 1st round pick, which then turned into an extra Ravens 1st round pick when MoSmell moved the team, and which turned into Ray lewis, IIRC. (It was either him or Jonathon Ogden)
That, for me, was the worst draft trade ever, because it put a Hall Of Fame player on the stinkin' Ravens.
Uh.. So making a trade, that gets you a future HOFer is a bad trade?
The trades great... Wasn't Belichicks fault we moved..
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,507
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,507 |
Quote:
Quote:
The panicked move by Belichick to trade down when a player he wanted was taken, which gave the Browns an extra 1st round pick, which then turned into an extra Ravens 1st round pick when MoSmell moved the team, and which turned into Ray lewis, IIRC. (It was either him or Jonathon Ogden)
That, for me, was the worst draft trade ever, because it put a Hall Of Fame player on the stinkin' Ravens.
Uh.. So making a trade, that gets you a future HOFer is a bad trade?
The trades great... Wasn't Belichicks fault we moved..
That trade sucked, because it won the Ravens a pair of Super Bowls. Anything that helps the Ravens sucks in my eyes. 
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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