That pro day could be the best thing that could have ever happened to the browns if they are smart. If he doesn't have that performance he's the #1 pick easy. After the performance the dolts use to nitpick his throwing motion and size, and now he will probably go bottom half of the 1st. If these guys play their cards right they can get the "elite" guy they want and still get Bridgewater with a trade up.
Unfortunately, it's the Browns so we will end up with a RT, CB, and the Grappapalo kid...lol.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
Jmho.. I'm willing to bet $$$ that Mettenburger is the BEST QB prospect in this yrs draft! Injuries happen an just because you get lucky an predict a guy getting injured doesn't make you a profit! AT the very least had Mettenburger not been injured in the" LAST GAME" He's the best QB in this yrs Draft Period!!! I would Love to have him an if that means picking him at #4 then so be it! I just don't think he's going to make it out of the first round cause of all the teams that are in NEED of A QB!!!
Unfortunately, it's the Browns so we will end up with a RT, CB, and the Grappapalo kid...lol.
Getting the best QB in this draft would be a great draft to me =) Would rather have sammy than a RT though.
You can't fix stupid but you can destroy ignorance. When you destroy ignorance you remove the justifications for evil. If you want to destroy evil then educate our people. Hate is a tool of the stupid to deal with what they can't understand.
Only one since rebirth (the aforementioned Leon). The second round (high 2nd mainly) is we're the Browns have wasted a plethora of picks on WRs......KJ, Morgan,Davis,Little, Gordon, robiskie, off the top of my head.
Of course one could argue that WR is even a bigger bust rate than QB and I would agree with them. I think what Verse is alluding to is we have invested at least 7 top 50 picks on Wr since rebirth and have little to show for it.......it is by far the heaviest position we have drafted highly since rebirth as well.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
Brian Brohm had louisville top 5, he was projected to be a #1 overall there, until his fall from grace. His game was picked apart and the same thing is happening with Bridgewater.
Rumbles of his private workouts have been every bit as bad as his proday has killed his stock. I think high 2nd is now in question for the kid, and I hate that for him.
Quote: Brian Brohm had louisville top 5, he was projected to be a #1 overall there, until his fall from grace. His game was picked apart and the same thing is happening with Bridgewater.
Rumbles of his private workouts have been every bit as bad as his proday has killed his stock. I think high 2nd is now in question for the kid, and I hate that for him.
Where/what have you read regarding negative evaluations on Bridgewater's game play? Only negative I'm hearing is his size and pro-day. If you really get down to it and if game film is positive, Teddy's pro-day showing can be fixed. The biggest negative I see is Teddy's durability same as Manziel. If either had Bortels stature, this is a non-discussion.
Chris Mortensen was the first and it has been mentioned on a few of the draft shows although not sure if they are repeating what Mort said or if its other reports. Anyway, here is a good article thought u guys would like
_________________________________________________
Teddy Bridgewater is falling, and there's no real reason why
By Matthew Fairburn @MatthewFairburn on Apr 21 2014, 8:30a 399 Robert Mayer-US PRESSWIRE
Why is Teddy Bridgewater falling in the NFL Draft? Well, it's funny you should ask, because nobody seems to have an answer. Tweet (110) Share (329) Share 399 Comments Rec 4
It almost seems impossible.
When Teddy Bridgewater carved up Florida's defense in the Sugar Bowl as a true sophomore, nobody would have entertained the idea. When he continued to develop as a passer during his junior season, limiting interceptions and making every throw look easy, nobody thought twice. The times Bridgewater fought through injury or led Louisville to late-game comebacks didn't raise concern, either.
What about Teddy?
Why is Teddy's stock sliding? Bridgewater divides experts at pro day Bridgewater is Willie Beamen? Pre-draft process unkind to Bridgewater Mad Money, QB stock edition Tom Savage shooting up draft boards
And yet, here we are, a few weeks away from the 2014 NFL Draft, and Teddy Bridgewater is falling down draft boards.
It's silly, really, when you break it down. The criticisms of Bridgewater seem so juvenile. He's not big enough, critics say, despite the fact that he's 6'2 and 214 pounds. His hands are too small, even though they measured in bigger at the NFL Scouting Combine than Colin Kaepernick's did. And every bit of Bridgewater's pre-draft process has been picked apart, down to his decision to not wear gloves while throwing at his pro day.
The pre-draft process can be a funny thing. For an underclassman like Bridgewater, it breaks down into three parts: the combine, the pro day and private workouts. So what went wrong for Bridgewater that has caused him to become the first prospect people bring up when discussing players who could be in for a long wait on draft night?
Let's start with the combine. Bridgewater decided not to throw, like Johnny Manziel and Derek Carr. He also didn't measure in as big as some might have hoped, though as mentioned above, his height and weight were far from terrible. And while Manziel and Blake Bortles were dominating the room with their big personalities, Bridgewater was seen as the quiet one, both with the media and teams. His reserved personality may have hurt him a bit.
Then at Louisville's pro day, Bridgewater didn't perform as well as some hoped. Some of Bridgewater's passes didn't have a ton of zip on them, and there was the glove thing. The same people who repeatedly point out that pro days don't matter knocked Bridgewater for a less-than-stellar showing.
Now we're into the private workout stage of the process, and the news hasn't been any different. Chris Mortensen of ESPN even said the workouts were going "shakily" for Bridgewater. Again, he is perceived as a player who is falling down draft boards and could even drop out of the first round entirely. His agent pushed back, telling Pro Football Talk that Bridgewater had one private workout, at that point, that went well.
How much of that is perception and how much is reality? Surely there are teams uncomfortable with Bridgewater's lack of ideal height, weight or hand size. Others may prefer a quarterback who is a bit more outwardly confident. Some may take issue with the actual problems with Bridgewater's game -- like his deep ball or the possibility that he may not have the developmental upside of the other two quarterbacks.
Latest Mock Draft Carr over Bridgewater? Matthew Fairburn
Forget about what Bridgewater did on the field over the last three seasons, because the pre-draft process is eating him alive. He was never built for the pre-draft process. Bridgewater isn't the size-speed freak that some prospects are, and he doesn't blow anyone away with an interview.
But before we label Bridgewater a bust, let's remember that this same process of workouts and interviews has Pittsburgh quarterback Tom Savage shooting up mock drafts around the Internet. That's the same Tom Savage who bounced around to three different schools, showing the same mobility, accuracy and decision-making limitations at every stop. While Bridgewater read defenses like a seasoned pro and maneuvered the pocket with a natural feel for pressure, Savage looked like an NFL backup for most of his college career. What Savage does have is size and arm strength, two things that cause a quarterback to rise this time of year.
Meanwhile, a quarterback like Bridgewater, who has so many desirable traits for an NFL quarterback, has found a way to do the impossible. He's falling down draft boards months after taking his final snap in a real game. The best part is, nobody seems to have a good reason why. web page
Quote: Teddy can play. I don't understand this "falling" crap. I love that Mayock got called out for changing his tune because of a freaking pro day....
Yep and all the morons follow suit.
Now look at THIS. Here's a small piece of it. Quotes from Pettine.
Appreciative of the dedication, Watson gave Bridgewater the power to serve as a quasi-offensive coordinator on the field. Bridgewater made checks, slid protection, called audibles and signaled hot routes to the receivers.
“It’s very unusual to have a guy that can handle as much as he did for us at the line of scrimmage,” Watson said. “He processes it very smoothly. He’s got a great feel for the game of football and the strategies behind the game of football because one, he loves the game and then two, he’ll grind, he’ll do what’s necessary to learn what it is he needs to learn, and he’s a brilliant kid.”
Bridgewater’s experience in a pro-style offense and his cerebral prowess prompted Mayock to call him “the most ready-to-play NFL-style quarterback in this draft” during a conference call in February. Opinions among the media certainly have changed since then, though Watson’s faith in Bridgewater is unwavering.
Browns coach Mike Pettine shares many of Watson’s observations about Bridgewater. Pettine and Farmer have downplayed the importance of pro days this offseason, so perhaps Bridgewater hasn’t slipped on the Browns’ draft board at all.
“I think he’s extremely accurate,” Pettine said after the pro day in late March at the NFL owners meeting. “You can tell he’s a very cerebral quarterback. He understands the game very well, understands coverages, that kind of jumps off the tape at you. To me, he seems very unfazed by things. He plays very well under pressure. He’s a guy that’s NFL-ready. It doesn’t seem to be too big for him. He kind of has that calming presence out there. Some quarterbacks get real emotional, get real fired up, and he’s not that. He kind of has that quiet confidence about him.”
I hope we aren't as dumb as the national media. We have to remember that teams are often thinking something very different than what individual teams are.
Man, I still can't get over Mayock's quote from an earlier post. Look at this gem again:
Quote: I’ve never seen a top-level quarterback in the last 10 years have a bad pro day, until Teddy Bridgewater. He had no accuracy, the ball came out funny, the arm strength wasn’t there, and it made me question everything I saw on tape because this was live.”
Seriously, so his games never happened? They were staged? No one was in attendance to see them? Did someone alter the tapes afterwards? How does even have a job after making such an ignorant statement?
I think there are some of us who see why Teddy is so special. It's his mind. He has taken big hits and gotten back up. He overcame a wrist injury to lead a come from behind win. He can run when he has to, but only chooses to run when he has to. His arm is big enough. He is tall enough. But, none of that is what makes him special.
It's his mind. He is so smart. He has already proven that he can do the things that NFL qbs need to do and that are the burning questions for almost all college qbs.
It's hard to evaluate collegiate qbs because most play in Spread offenses and they are not asked to make hot reads. They don't make sight adjustments. They have one coverage read. They don't audible at the LOS. That is why some of these guys are not effective in the NFL, because their mind can't handle all of that.
Teddy is proven he can, yet people wanna talk about his pro day. Or the fact that he is 6'2" rather than 6'4." These are some of the very same reasons why guys like Rodgers, Wilson, Brees, Romo, and Brady were not drafted high. I am NOT saying that proves he will be good. I am simply saying that it is flawed logic.
On the other hand, there are guys like Weeden, J. Russell, Tannehill, Gabbert, and Ponder shooting up the boards every year. In my opinion, guys like Carr and Savage fit into that group.
Thanks for posting that. Once again, I hope that Farmer and Pettine are intelligent to see past all the nonsense and look at what was done on the field of battle.
Quote: I hope we aren't as dumb as the national media. We have to remember that teams are often thinking something very different than what individual teams are.
I agree with you, but the thing to remember is that the media idiots are the weather vanes in this and not vice versa. This means that Mayock etc have changed their tune because they've caught wind that Teddy isn't ranked nearly as high as most media outlets and talking heads had him slotted.
The ProDay is just the excuse they use to have a more "accurate" draft board come draft day....and by accurate I don't mean to say that Teddy should be outside the top 20, that's not my opinion....but it does tell us that he isn't very thought of by NFL FOs, because above all a guy like Mayock does not want to look like a fool, having a QB top 5 that drops out of the top 15 or possibly 30. Did you really believe they had any kind of backbone? They all want to look good and smart. Their "gods" are the NFL GM guys. Mayock isn't anyone's god around NFL FOs, if anything they use him and laugh at him.
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
Quote: This means that Mayock etc have changed their tune because they've caught wind that Teddy isn't ranked nearly as high as most media outlets and talking heads had him slotted.
Yes, you're right. That could be the case. I just have a hard time believing that he is falling that far. I've been wrong before and I'll be wrong again, but I really think this kid is going to be an outstanding NFL qb. He has the things that most young qbs do not have. Maybe the NFL guys are wrong again, just like they were w/the guys I mentioned earlier.
Or, perhaps there are one or two qb hungry teams out there--like the Browns and Jax---who are afraid that other qb needy teams are going to jump them in the this draft, thus they are putting out misinformation. I don't know.
What I do know is that I would take Bridgewater over any other player in this draft.
Quote: How many WRs have taken in the first round ever?
If you are talking about the Browns in the first round since the return, I can only think of Braylon Edwards. We did take KW2 but does he count as a WR? I wouldn't think so.
Thinking about years prior to the return, I can't remember when we took a WR in the 1st round. So I looked it up.
Webster Slaughter was a Second round pick but we didn't have a first round pick that year (1986)
Ron Brown was a second rounder in 1983 and again, we didn't have a 1st round pick that year either,
2 others that may be considered 1st rounders but were taken in the 2nd round in years where we didn't have a 1st round pick
2 TE's that were taken in the first found (ozzie and KW) if you wanna count TE's if you wanna count TE's as receivers. Certainly both of those guys were as much receivers as anyone.
The Final Answer is rightfully 4 since 1950
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
Quote: What I do know is that I would take Bridgewater over any other player in this draft.
I respect your opinion and would have no problem with selecting him at #4 (or ?). My only concern though, is who are you getting: the Bridgewater from the films, or the Bridgewater form his pro day/workouts...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
I like Bridgewater overall. My 2 concerns with him are:
1 - Size of his hands. They are Small. Question: too small?
2 - Demeanor. He has no fire to him. Does he have what it takes to spark a team? Weeden clearly didn't with his eeyore demeanor. He actually had the opposite affect he had such a blah personality. Hoyer brought that fire and enthusiasm that was contagious.
Am I perfect? No Am I trying to be a better person? Also no
Vers you and I have been on board with Teddy from very early in the process.
The first time I watched him play a game was against Florida in the Bowl game his sophomore year.
The first thing that jumped out to me was his natural feel for playing the quarterback position. He played the game smoothly. Like he was born to play quarterback. Like the game was in slow motion for him.
In the end it comes down to this: How does Farmer and his staff see the position and does Bridgewater fit what they have in mind?
Your points are well taken here, but if Clowney drops to number 4 I would take him in half of a heartbeat! Do you believe that a player that should be taken #1 overall in most scouts mind drops to #4 because of questions of Work Ethic, won't work even Harder to prove the other teams wrong? I believe he will be given the extra motivation to prove he is Best on Every down. JMHO Go Brownies!!!!
To be fair, below is what Mayock said in the paragraph from the article immediately following his comment about 'seeing it live'.
"I went back and watched a bunch more tape and compared him to the rest of the guys in the draft," he said. "And like it or not, I've come to a conclusion -- if I was a GM in the NFL, I would not take him in the first round of the draft."
That doesn't make Mayock correct...I think he's kind of a tool/fool. But he says he went back and re-watched tape. Who knows if he really did?
At the same time, I wouldn't take ANY QB from this draft in the first round...and I consider our 2nd round pick to be 'close-enough' to a 1st Rd pick that I'd not take one there either.
We are getting the opportunity to take (3) of the top (35) guys in a deep, deep draft. I'd wait until Rd 3 - or package a couple picks to move up from our first 3rd Rd pick to take (1) of the (8) or so QBs who are all within a hair of the other so far as NFL talent projection.
I think the Browns will take the best QB available at (26) or (35).
Quote: So you believe that QB position may be addressed by the "insert name, whoever falls" route?
Regarding THIS particular draft, the short answer is 'yes'. But only because I don't see a relevant difference between about (8) or so guys. The unusual thing about THIS draft is that none of the QBs appear to be consensus, top-shelf guys...but there are (8) guys that are all about the same IMO. No studs...but many with good potential.
Not one of those (8) guys will 'address' the QB position next year. The 1st guy has as many warts as the 8th guy. They all need time to develop. None are special.
It is too much of a crap shoot at #4 overall to take a QB just because we 'need' one when NONE of the name QBs are worthy at that spot while immediate diifference-makers are sitting there for the taking. One or more of those (8) QBs will be there later...talent like Mack/Watkins/Robinson/Matthews won't.
I'm sure talent evaluators would disagree with you. each QB has strengths and weakness. But to claim they aren't evaluated and graded differently or there aren't certain targets that have a much higher probability than others is simply not how the process works. Nor would it be an accurate description of how any other position is evaluated and ranked.
There are not 8 QB's in a group that close together and this years draft will point that out to be true.
I will say if they have one rated in the top 10, they should take him at #4 and not look back.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Quote: Your points are well taken here, but if Clowney drops to number 4 I would take him in half of a heartbeat! Do you believe that a player that should be taken #1 overall in most scouts mind drops to #4 because of questions of Work Ethic, won't work even Harder to prove the other teams wrong? I believe he will be given the extra motivation to prove he is Best on Every down. JMHO Go Brownies!!!!
I saw a video where a former player, Warren Sapp, IIRC, asked, If a guy won't work his butt off to be the top pick in the draft and make a lot of money, why would he work hard when he gets a lot of money?
Clowney scares the heck out of me.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
I know. You also didn't say anything about other QBs or other position players in THIS draft. My answer to your question required other comments to adequately explain my answer - as your question was very open-ended.
Quote: I'm sure talent evaluators would disagree with you. each QB has strengths and weakness.
I'm sure they would disagree...I know that each QB has strengths and weaknesses. I don't think any of them have enough strengths and enough fewer weaknesses to be picked in Rd 1.
Quote: But to claim they aren't evaluated and graded differently...
I didn't claim that. I know they are evaluated differently and graded differently by the experts. I am the one who has them all graded out about the same.
Quote: ... or there aren't certain targets that have a much higher probability than others is simply not how the process works. Nor would it be an accurate description of how any other position is evaluated and ranked.
I didn't say any of that either. I simply stated that IMO there are about (8) QBs who could just as easily bust as breakout. Picking which is which appears to me to be more like pulling a name out of a hat vs. pulling down one's pants for THE guy in a draft because he is darn near a can't-miss guy.
Quote: There are not 8 QB's in a group that close together and this years draft will point that out to be true.
I'm sure it will end up that way...but as it stands today, I think picking the guy who is THE guy is a crap shoot in THIS draft more so than normal...again IMO.
We need to walk away with one of the elite players in this draft at #4. At #26 I want a starter. I think we could get another starter at #35 by picking a ILB or G.
I like Murray, Mett, McCarron & Garoppolo as much as I do Bortles and Manziel. I don't think I'd draft Bridgewater or Carr or Fales at any pick in the draft until the 4th. If Boyd is there with our 5th, I'm picking him even after getting a guy in the 3rd.
Quote: I will say if they have one rated in the top 10, they should take him at #4 and not look back.
I agree...unless they are convinced that they could trade back and STILL get their guy a few spots later. I just don't think they will have a a guy rated top 10.
Quote: One or more of those (8) QBs will be there later...talent like Mack/Watkins/Robinson/Matthews won't.
I would agree with all of this except that there will be WRs there that are as good as Watkins. Also, Lewan is a good tackle as well. And there are some other really good players in this draft. It's all subjective to one's view of certain players. Some posters here think that Bridgewater is worthy of the #4 overall selection. Once upon a time, they might have been in the majority (although I don't really think so) but that isn't the case anymore. At least they're sticking to their guns - right or wrong.
Quote: Your points are well taken here, but if Clowney drops to number 4 I would take him in half of a heartbeat! Do you believe that a player that should be taken #1 overall in most scouts mind drops to #4 because of questions of Work Ethic, won't work even Harder to prove the other teams wrong? I believe he will be given the extra motivation to prove he is Best on Every down. JMHO Go Brownies!!!!
I saw a video where a former player, Warren Sapp, IIRC, asked, If a guy won't work his butt off to be the top pick in the draft and make a lot of money, why would he work hard when he gets a lot of money?
Teddy Bridgewater is the polar opposite, physically speaking, of J'Marcus Russell. I think that J'Marcus Russell could eat Teddy Bridgewater and barely put on any weight.
I was ..... but the Russell comparison might be valid too.
He got a huge payday, then stopped working, stopped working out, got fat, stayed lazy, and failed badly.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
final thoughts on Bridgewater... from a different thread
Brdgewater has size issues/ the ability to maintain weight has some injuries in the past, including a broken wrist and sprained ankle in 2012 inconsistencies with his throwing motion, deep ball accuracy. He has a low release point on his throws the ball often is wobbly out of his hand. His footwork is very inconsistent Bridgewater has a nasty habit of sailing passes high. When Teddy is lined up in the pistol he has a tendency of staring down slants and throwing them flat-footed. He makes a lot of risky throws due to playing it safe with touch passes instead of adding some heat on it. He takes unnecessary sacks instead of getting the ball off, due to his believe that his natural athleticism will get him out of a bad situation. Struggled at his pro day He's very quiet and not a vocal leader hasn't faced tough competition he is comparable to wilson more than rodgers minus the dual threat capability as a runner. he is good across the board but lacks elite qualities
he needs a year or two to sit on a bench and learn. I think he could be ok in the NFL but not great.
Quote: I disagree w/almost all of that. In fact, it seems like you were deliberately trying to be wrong.
Was it a joke?
no it was not a joke. I can't help it if you feel different or see things differently.
what part don't you agree with?
Brdgewater has size issues/ the ability to maintain weight fact small hands and all
he lost weight at his pro day fact
has some injuries in the past, including a broken wrist and sprained ankle in 2012 fact how can you disagree with this?
inconsistencies with his throwing motion, deep ball accuracy. fact how can you argue this? he has almost terrible deep ball accuracy
He has a low release point on his throws watch the film
the ball often is wobbly out of his hand. watch the film
His footwork is very inconsistent watch the film
Bridgewater has a nasty habit of sailing passes high. watch the film
When Teddy is lined up in the pistol he has a tendency of staring down slants and throwing them flat-footed. watch the film
He makes a lot of risky throws due to playing it safe with touch passes instead of adding some heat on it. watch the film
He takes unnecessary sacks instead of getting the ball off, due to his believe that his natural athleticism will get him out of a bad situation. watch the film
Struggled at his pro day fact
He's very quiet and not a vocal leader fact
hasn't faced tough competition fact
he is good across the board but lacks elite qualities
ummm watch him lob passes all over the field when he is under pressure. see film below
Can't run? where did I say that?
Inconsistent footwork? he is very inconsistent
Who hasn't had injuries? How many games has he missed in his career? Let me help you...........Zero! meh.. it's just something else
Low release point? How many passes does he have batted down? http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1825122/teddy-bridgewater Bridgewater has a lower than ideal release point with the ball shooting passed his ear. I can post tons of articles on people saying the same type of thing
Takes unnecessary sacks? Prove that one. I can post tons of articles on people saying the same type of thing
His coaches and teammates exclaim that he is a great leader.
cool. I never said they didn't. I said he isn't a vocal leader
Needs a year or two to sit? He is the only top qb who plays in a pro offense and is said to be the most pro ready.
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