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1946
1947
1948
1949
1950
1954
1955
1964
Champions
1951,1952,1953,1957,1965,1968,1969 Lost in Championship Game.
Jim Brown, Paul Brown, Otto Graham, Marion Motely,
Does it matter anymore? Is it relevant? Is the Browns history something anybody looks at when thinking about, or discussing us?
What difference does it make?
Barry Bonds Check
Roger Clemens Check
Mark McGuire Check
Lance Armstrong Check
71-79 Steelers Taboo
(Lets pretend it didn't happen.)
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history is history and nothing more.
IMO history is not relevant in anything going forward, it has no bearing on any future event, go back one year, two yeras, 10 or a hundred, it makes for nice reading and nothing more.
#gmstrong
A smart person knows what to say.
A wise person knows whether or not to say it.
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Legend
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Quote:
Does it matter anymore?
It never has, and always will.
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Is it relevant?
Depends upon the topic.
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Is the Browns history something anybody looks at when thinking about, or discussing us?
Nope, because it isn't who we are, it is who we used to be.
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What difference does it make?
Somewhere between None and Not Much.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Mine may not be a popular opinion, but to me the past is no longer relevant. The championships are a nice piece of Browns history, but I don't look back and think how great it must have been winning the 1946 AAFC championship while punishing such teams as the Colorado Rockets and LA Dons along the way.
To me, I lump those championships in a completely different era and category of professional football, not really part of the modern day NFL.
The days of winning championships are 50 to almost 70 years ago. Most people I encounter (outside of Cleveland), when discussing the Browns, only see them in their most recent incarnation as a bumbling franchise and they typically have a sense of pity for the fans or a "perplexed, hang in there buddy" attitude.
Lombardi Trophies are what teams are judged by in present day NFL and unfortunately, we have none.
My last fond memories of the Browns were as kid watching Bernie, Slaughter etc…and even those memories are fading after nearly 25-30 years followed by a move and historically putrid football to present day
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Legend
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It's relevant to Browns fans.
It's ancient history and irrelevant to anyone else.
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Know the names but I was born in the 80's, zero nostalgia for me.
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Legend
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I know what it was like to be there when the orange helmets were an intimidating, fearsome bunch that you expected to win. I want my son to experience that.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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 My sons, daughter, entire city of Cleveland, and all the Browns fans throughout.
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Legend
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To me it matters.
I'm old enough to vaguely remember Jim Brown and the 1964 team.
The team has a story that dates back to 1946. While I saw mentioned some of the teams we beat in those Championships, I think one needs to consider that many felt the Browns joining the NFL was laughable. They didn't think we were good enough or belonged in the NFL at all.
We need to remember where we came from, what we accomplished and where we are now simply for the sake of perspective. Even though it's a sad commentary, we can look at how great we were and look at the story of how we went from that, to where we are now.
Does that change anything? No. Does it tell a story? Yes it does. Unless people feel that history in general means nothing, then all history means something.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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I've made this argument before but with the Browns, their history doesn't do anything for the players. If it does, it's very little...
For the fans, of course it means everything. The Browns have a rich history. They were not an original team, but without their existence I don't think the NFL is the monster it is today. A lot of the great ideas and concepts were Paul Brown's thinking. The 40 yard dash, in-helmet speakers for QB's, balanced offenses, studying your opponents, etc... That all goes back to him. If Paul Brown never moves the Browns from the AAFC to the NFL, what does the league look like today?
With the actual current team, I think the move wiped out how history can have a direct impact.
When I think about the current Chicago Bears, you can see the pedigree of their players. Brian Urlacher learned from a guy, who learned from a guy that played with Mike Singletary. Mike Singletary learned from a guy, who learned from someone that played with Dick Butkus. When you watch guys in practice, veteran guys, great players. I think it can elevate your game. Who do our guys have that with? William Green? Kevin Johnson? Andra Davis?
These guys have to build their own thing.
I'm not saying that the pedigree is everything, but you can't argue that it doesn't have an impact for some of these teams with rich histories. Packers, Steelers, the Ravens (sorry), 49'ers....
It's going to take a few special guys to really start our own pedigree.
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I Think Browns History does mean something. It shows that the fans cared about the team and their past. It shows that Football.. Ohio Football was the foundation of the NFL. It is something to consider as to where we were.. where we are now.. where we are going. I live in Southern Ohio.. near Portsmouth.. Home of the Portsmouth Spartans.. now known as the Detroit Lions.
Yes.. History means something. It also shows you how to do things.. the mistakes made.. the pride you should have in where you were and where you want to go... without history.. and a knowledge of it.. we are rudderless.. my username is Halfback32.. Jim Brown's position and number ( I know.. some will say that Green was the halfback and Brown was fullback .. lol )
History is important for self.. for relevancy.. for a sense of place...
The Cleveland Browns - WE KNOW QUARTERBACKS ( Look at how many we've had ... )
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#gmstrong
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On a personal note, yeah, it means something to me.. All those championships have meaning of course.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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While Marion Motley will always be my favorite player it means zilch to me. I was 4 when the team left so the Browns will always be '99 to present to me. Pretty sad when you get made fun of growing up in NE Ohio for liking the Browns.
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I choose to take the view that I've learned nothing from our team's history, thus we SHOULD be "doomed" to repeat it 
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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I don't think that people need to compare what has gone on since 99 through now.
I think they should stop at 2006. I feel that 99-2005, they were on the upswing, trying to build from expansion, and develop an identity.
Everything since 2006? It has been a whole new level of suckage since 2006, cycling through the doldrums at the bottom of Niagara falls, looking up at teams that get 6 wins in a season.
Until this team shows that they know how to put a winning formula together, I don't predict they will get any better than 6-10.
No matter what they do in 2014 from here out, they have parted with, Dqwell Jackson, T.J. Ward, and Shaun Lauvao. It's a question mark, if anyone they replaced them with, will know how to win as a Brown.
That is alot of leadership to replace.
And the thing is, if any one of those 3 were healthy, they started, over anyone else at their position, for a few 3 or 4 + seasons, so replacing them, is complicated, and we have yet to see what cause and effect it will have.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Legend
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Quote:
Does it matter anymore?
Yes, as a memory or something to read about if you weren't around or old enough to remember.
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Is it relevant?
To what? To the Browns today? No it's not relevant, we are going to succeed or fail based on the team we have now and our legacy, for most fans today is a team that was great a long time but which has sucked for most of their adult life.
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Is the Browns history something anybody looks at when thinking about, or discussing us?
Yes if you are talking about historical franchises but if you are talking modern NFL, nobody cares about 50 years ago.
I will say this, as one of the traditional franchises and as one of the few remaining teams that hasn't won a SB, I think the NFL would really like it if the Browns got back to that level, it would create interest.
yebat' Putin
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History is always relevant. Only problem is this team's history actually began in '99. As much as we wish it not to be, that is the truth. The past belongs to the franchise now in Baltimore. I know that is a crappy thing to say, but it is the truth. Besides the colors and name, everything else was moved.
The team was on the rise and becoming a factor when the move happened, and they continued in Baltimore. Our team is called the Browns, but the original structure and everything else was taken from the city.
It was unprecedented that the Name and colors were retained, but when the team returned to the field, there was nothing, except the fans, that remained from the original franchise.
Sure the history is still brought up, but nothing about the team from '99 on, has any true ties to the former franchise.
I do find it funny though when I'm being beat down by Steeler fans. I'll mention the past championships and they laugh because they weren't called "Super Bowls". They bring up the fact that it was fifty years ago, but forget that it was 40 years ago when the Steelers won their first championships. But, they were called "Super Bowls", so they count.
Green Bay I believe have like 11 championships, but the media only counts "super bowls". Same with Detroit, who at one time were a powerhouse like the old Browns.
The history, IMO, is relevant to us fans, as it should be. Steeler fans have no remembrance of how bad a franchise the were for decades. Selective memory as I call it, lets them believe that before the seventies, the team didn't even exist.
I am proud of the history of the Browns. My first football game of any kind was a Browns game in 1966. It is why I have never wavered in my support for the team. The team, the stadium, and the fans made me become a lifelong Browns fan. I was 6 years old, and I still remember walking into the stadium with my uncles and the feeling it gave me. It was bigger than life.
I said above that since '99 this is actually a new franchise, but understanding that does not make me bitter or sad. The people of Cleveland and the fanbase around the world did something that no one ever did before by retaining the name, colors and history. For that effort, I will never waver in my support for the team. We the fans have got to keep the history relevant, because if you are like me, it is a part of my life.
We will get another championship, and it will be sweet. And when we do, I hope that finally the media and fans of other teams will realize just what our history means to us.
So when some jackahole steeler fans makes fun of you for being a Browns fan, ask them who the QB was before Bradshaw, then laugh at them because most have no idea. They buried their past, we relish it. That is the difference when it comes down to being a true fan.
When the season ended last year, my steeler friends said things like so what we have the Penguins to watch. Many bad mouth the team for not making the playoffs for two years. They have been spoiled, and I can't wait until their ride ends. We will see who are the best fans. IMO it's not even close. If they lost for four or five years in a row, I would gaurantee Heinz field would be empty, just like the seats at Pirate games.
If you are a TRUE Browns fan, the history is just as important as the present.
JMHO
#gmstrong
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Quote:
If you are a TRUE Browns fan, the history is just as important as the present.
JMHO
Dang 55 years only to told I am not a true fan because I don't care about history 
#gmstrong
A smart person knows what to say.
A wise person knows whether or not to say it.
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All Pro
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I can still hear the announcer, "Jim Brown and the Cleveland Browns."
GO BROWNS!
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While it is for some Browns fans, it certainly isn't for the NFL in general. Recently the NFL network did week long series "Dynasty" week. They promoted the Packers as the "first" football dynasty. Highly inaccurate. Aside from their AAFL dominance the Browns went to 6 NFL Championship games winning three during the 50's and early 60's. The very first year the Browns entered the league they won the championship, stunning the NFL in the process.That equals the recent history of the Patriots(6 SB's 3 wins). Yet no mention of the Browns was made. They also produce a show called "A Football Life" showing the history of the game and the players and coaches that made the game great. They've done Lombardi, and Shula, Landry etc. Hell even Ditka has had his time in the sun. Yet Paul Brown is conspicuously absent of any mention. Paul Brown was massively important in making the game what it is today. Before Brown, GM's would use copies of sports illustrated to select draft picks. Brown brought study and the classroom to the game. Modern scouting practices. Etc. Etc. The WCO that to this day is part of most offensive game plans, was based off Paul Browns offense. "The Catch" from Montana to Clark is a play called Sprint Right Option, a play many teams use every Sunday.... A Paul Brown play from the early 50's. All the "new" read option stuff? Why does it work well as part of the WCO? Because if you watch Otto Graham and the Browns from the 50's you'll see a lot of similarity(though in reality the option has been around as long as football itself).. Otto Graham was a running back in college. Brown turned him into a QB and they ran a lot of "read option" type plays back in the day. Every Sunday in every single stadium in the league Paul Brown is there in some from or another.....
I firmly believe the championship trophy should be renamed the "Paul Brown" trophy as he did FAR more for the game than Vince Lombardi did. But aside from some of us Browns fans, the 50's and the Browns championships aren't remembered or thought of. Paul Brown never existed. And a lot of Browns fans have no idea who the team was named after or the history of winning he forged.
#BlackLivesMatter #StopAsianHate
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j/c
Call me a romantic but to me the history is still important. For the team I think the details of pivotal player decisions, draft decisions or in-game decisions might provide insight in a particular situation. What I find difficult to believe is that a contemporary high ranking decision maker has time or the inclination to research what might have taken place in 1955 (my birth year, used for example, also a year when the franchise won an NFL Championship!) At the same time, I think it's important for players to have some sense of the Browns/Steelers rivalry. Particularly in-season situations that might offer parallels to a set of circumstances they are facing currently.
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Quote:
History is always relevant. Only problem is this team's history actually began in '99. As much as we wish it not to be, that is the truth. The past belongs to the franchise now in Baltimore. I know that is a crappy thing to say, but it is the truth. Besides the colors and name, everything else was moved.
The team was on the rise and becoming a factor when the move happened, and they continued in Baltimore. Our team is called the Browns, but the original structure and everything else was taken from the city.
It was unprecedented that the Name and colors were retained, but when the team returned to the field, there was nothing, except the fans, that remained from the original franchise.
Sure the history is still brought up, but nothing about the team from '99 on, has any true ties to the former franchise.
I do find it funny though when I'm being beat down by Steeler fans. I'll mention the past championships and they laugh because they weren't called "Super Bowls". They bring up the fact that it was fifty years ago, but forget that it was 40 years ago when the Steelers won their first championships. But, they were called "Super Bowls", so they count.
Green Bay I believe have like 11 championships, but the media only counts "super bowls". Same with Detroit, who at one time were a powerhouse like the old Browns.
The history, IMO, is relevant to us fans, as it should be. Steeler fans have no remembrance of how bad a franchise the were for decades. Selective memory as I call it, lets them believe that before the seventies, the team didn't even exist.
I am proud of the history of the Browns. My first football game of any kind was a Browns game in 1966. It is why I have never wavered in my support for the team. The team, the stadium, and the fans made me become a lifelong Browns fan. I was 6 years old, and I still remember walking into the stadium with my uncles and the feeling it gave me. It was bigger than life.
I said above that since '99 this is actually a new franchise, but understanding that does not make me bitter or sad. The people of Cleveland and the fanbase around the world did something that no one ever did before by retaining the name, colors and history. For that effort, I will never waver in my support for the team. We the fans have got to keep the history relevant, because if you are like me, it is a part of my life.
We will get another championship, and it will be sweet. And when we do, I hope that finally the media and fans of other teams will realize just what our history means to us.
So when some jackahole steeler fans makes fun of you for being a Browns fan, ask them who the QB was before Bradshaw, then laugh at them because most have no idea. They buried their past, we relish it. That is the difference when it comes down to being a true fan.
When the season ended last year, my steeler friends said things like so what we have the Penguins to watch. Many bad mouth the team for not making the playoffs for two years. They have been spoiled, and I can't wait until their ride ends. We will see who are the best fans. IMO it's not even close. If they lost for four or five years in a row, I would gaurantee Heinz field would be empty, just like the seats at Pirate games.
If you are a TRUE Browns fan, the history is just as important as the present.
JMHO
JMHO but you go on and on about how this is a different franchise and has no ties to the past yet if your a true fan the history is as important as the past?
If you're a true Browns fan as you state it you should probably be rooting for a purple team in Baltimore my friend. After all the original Browns history beliongs to them. We are no different than any other expansion. I don't think that's what you meant, or at least I'd hope not, but to come up with that logic and say anyone who doesn't agree isn't a true fan well that's insulting to more than just me.
Call me part of the politically correct generation(though I despise it more than anyone) but that's bull.
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Does it matter anymore? Is it relevant? Is the Browns history something anybody looks at when thinking about, or discussing us?
It does to all of us Browns fans who did whatever they could to keep the Name and History in Cleveland after Art ran off to Baltimore.
Last edited by Vambo; 04/29/14 09:41 PM.
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I disagree.
It was if the Browns players were, essentially, traded to Baltimore. The Cleveland Browns, and their history, belong to Cleveland. There is no way that you could ever convince me that Bernie Kosar and Brian Sipe were "really" Baltimore Ravens.
That said, history is nice to reminisce about, parts are really beautiful to look at occasionally, but does nothing to help this current team win. History is memories. I am ready for some new memories.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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jc
I think its very relevant because it shows that football has been at an elite level in Cleveland. It shows that it can happen HERE. Plus, you have those cardiac kids and being just one game away from the superbowl with Bernie. You have the great players from those teams coming to Cleveland to support the new team and giving them mentorship. Bernie and Brown are both taking time to push the players and remind them of what its like to have a winning culture in Cleveland.
Players talk about how awesome it is to have a man like Jim Brown rooting for them or having Bernie give them advice.
That history is VERY relevant especially for a young team looking to make its own mark in history. They can know that if they achieve greatness that they will be remembered in Cleveland forever. Players have said they KNOW, they KNOW that if they can just win that this town will explode because HISTORY shows how much we love our football.
So yes, our history is very relevant NOW and forever to our PLAYERS and to US. Once we are winning again soon it will be just that much greater.
You can't fix stupid but you can destroy ignorance. When you destroy ignorance you remove the justifications for evil. If you want to destroy evil then educate our people. Hate is a tool of the stupid to deal with what they can't understand.
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It's relevant in the sense that this is who the Browns were and, more importantly, who they strive to become once again. Do you want them to grow up to be the Steelers? The 49ers? The Pats? No. As a Browns fan you want them to attain the level of their former glory. The history of the Browns is a measuring stick. And a damn good one at that.
JMHO
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/hfMNC7T.jpg) "I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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Do you want them to grow up to be the Steelers? The 49ers? The Pats?
Yes
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"I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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It's fun to look at and was fun to live through some of that, but no, it doesn't matter.
Most fans don't even remember the team was moved. They just think of the Browns as a easy win for their team.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Quote:
If you are a TRUE Browns fan, the history is just as important as the present.
That's not even remotely true. What would you rather do on a Sunday afternoon in mid-January, sit and watch the Browns in a playoff game or sit and watch old video of the Browns winning a championship in black and white from 50 years ago? Yea, me too.
yebat' Putin
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That's not even remotely true. What would you rather do on a Sunday afternoon in mid-January, sit and watch the Browns in a playoff game or sit and watch old video of the Browns winning a championship in black and white from 50 years ago? Yea, me too.
What would you rather do in mid-December? Watch the Browns limp to the finish line with their 4th string QB ... or watch the 50 year old footage. 
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I disagree.
It was if the Browns players were, essentially, traded to Baltimore. The Cleveland Browns, and their history, belong to Cleveland. There is no way that you could ever convince me that Bernie Kosar and Brian Sipe were "really" Baltimore Ravens.
That said, history is nice to reminisce about, parts are really beautiful to look at occasionally, but does nothing to help this current team win. History is memories. I am ready for some new memories.
Exactly. The only thing that moved to Baltimore were the players and Art the Fart.
The history and colors remained HERE. Jim Brown was not a Raven. Otto Graham never wore a Raven uniform. And Paul Brown didn't create and coach the Ravens.
This team has a long and proud history. Just because we've fallen on hard times the past 15 years doesn't mean those days never happened. Someday, this team will turn the corner and make us proud once more. And all that history will be worth remembering again. If the NFL had allowed the Browns name and colors to move with Art to Baltimore, I wouldn't be a fan of the new Cleveland team. No matter what they were called. And I wouldn't be a fan of the Baltimore Browns. Professional football would be dead to me. I wouldn't even watch it. But, we did retain our history, name and colors. When you go to the Hall of Fame, those former greats still wear the name CLEVELAND Browns. As it should be.
Our new coach has been saying we need to play like "Browns". Well, he can't be meaning the team of the last decade. So he HAS to harken back to a time when this team played for championships. THAT'S what playing like a Browns should mean.
#BlackLivesMatter #StopAsianHate
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 5,915 Likes: 16
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 5,915 Likes: 16 |
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Do you want them to grow up to be the Steelers? The 49ers? The Pats?
Yes
Not me. I want them to attain the level the Browns USED to be at. Which was every bit as good as the modern Patriots. For a long time the BROWNS were the measuring stick. They were a football dynasty long before the Packers or the Steelers ever thought of themselves that way.
#BlackLivesMatter #StopAsianHate
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,065 Likes: 1
Dawg Talker
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OP
Dawg Talker
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,065 Likes: 1 |
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If you are a TRUE Browns fan, the history is just as important as the present.
JMHO
Dang 55 years only to told I am not a true fan because I don't care about history
Tex
If we ask people to comment and then take things they say personally then nothing productive will ever appear on this board.
I'm learning from what you guys are saying.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398 Likes: 280
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398 Likes: 280 |
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That's not even remotely true. What would you rather do on a Sunday afternoon in mid-January, sit and watch the Browns in a playoff game or sit and watch old video of the Browns winning a championship in black and white from 50 years ago? Yea, me too.
What would you rather do in mid-December? Watch the Browns limp to the finish line with their 4th string QB ... or watch the 50 year old footage.
They are equally depressing.. I'm going golfing.
yebat' Putin
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1st String
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1st String
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 433 |
The Browns are a bad joke in a bad bar right now.The name is synonymous with mud at this point.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,864 Likes: 26
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,864 Likes: 26 |
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The Browns are a bad joke in a bad bar right now.The name is synonymous with mud at this point.
People literally apologize and mock me when I say I'm a Browns fan.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,703
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,703 |
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The Browns are a bad joke in a bad bar right now.The name is synonymous with mud at this point.
People literally apologize and mock me when I say I'm a Browns fan.
I wish I still got mocked.
Around here, it's gotten to the point where people feel bad for me.
I hear things like "Oh man, that's rough. Well I hope they turn it around for ya"
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,276
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,276 |
I was born in the 80s. I'm not even sure how well my dad remembers the early championships.
I think going back to Bernie has some relevance, but 1940s? 1950s? Really? WW2 and Korean war eras?
I mean you could ask the same about any team. Does the greatest show on turf era still matter for the Rams? No. They don't have any players left from that era. Does the Manning era still matter for the Colts? I guess they still have Wayne? But mostly No.
History is in the past, the only eras that matter are the ones in the present where the team is still in tact. Even the early 2000s Patriots differ so much on defense that they are a different team now. The Steelers are the same way.
I care about each individual season and the consistency of a team between maybe a five season period. I found the "play like a Brown" stuff pretty revolting and silly. The narrative of "your team" is stupid, the game comes down the talent and coaching. The narrative of who you are as a team, winners vs. losers, has little impact on the outcome of games if you ask me.
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum History of the Browns - Is it
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