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I will find it really disappointing if Manziel does not win the job in camp.
I actually will be pretty surprised if JM wins the Starting job from camp.
Unless I am totally wrong about Hoyer I doubt it, don't set yourself up with disappointment. For some reason you are equating a 22nd pick rookie not winning the job with Failure and possible bust. The parameters involved in the decision is vast in variables, Hoyer is way ahead in taking the Playbook and not just knowing the play but what is needed to EXECUTE the play. We can still expect JM to do anything Hoyer does and Better (IN THE FUTURE) not from the beginning.
How bout our TEAM learn the new offense first then start to think about bringing in the young QB to start. Its not like we are in a system that 95% of our guys know inside and out. Everyone is learning it...not the environment to throw in a rookie...NOT AT ALL.
jmho - Hoyer to start if JM "WINS" the starting position wow oh wow! as in we have one of the greatest QBs of all time in our midst. 
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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If we take Manziel and march him out there against the Steelers in the opener, it won't be a balloon that pops, it'll be his confidence.
I have zero doubts that Manziel will be the starter before the year is over, but it can't happen right out of the gate. It just can't, not if we have an ounce of sense.
I don't see why it can't happen. Wilson did it in Seattle, came in and decisively beat out a guy with more experience... It can happen... and Wilson's confidence seems to be ok. In hindsight it's easy to say, "Sure but that was Seattle and we're not Seattle".. well neither was Seattle before that. They were 7-9 the year before with the 28th ranked offense.. it's not like anybody expected Wilson or the Seahawks to do what they did.
I will just say this, if Manziel looks decent in preseason but doesn't win the job... Hoyer better play well against the Steelers or this whole thing could go south in a hurry.. not saying he has to win but if he doesn't play well.. it will get ugly.
yebat' Putin
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Hoyer better play well against the Steelers or this whole thing could go south in a hurry
it's gonna go south no matter what hoyer does I'm afraid. the fans and boo birds are already practicing.
tradition can only carry you so far, then you have to start winning again.
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This is the only thing I didn't like about drafting Johnny, is the constant media/fan speculation that will be in full gear once training camp comes.
I think it's possible Johnny beats out Hoyer for the job. I like Hoyer, but it's not like he's won a bunch of games in his career. He has a leg up on the playbook, and chemistry with the players, but I don't think he's light years ahead...
I really don't care. I want the best guy out there week 1. If it's not Manziel, his time will come. It's Browns football. We use multiple QB's. Even if Hoyer is rolling they will probably have a package for Manziel...
I can't see Mike Pettine caving to the fans' pining for JFF. Considering he's a defense guy to begin with, I think he'll block that stuff out.
Johnny will play when he's good and ready.
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Some of you assume that Farmer wasn't on board with the pick. Why??
I think everybody was sold on Johnny Football
While that may or may not be true there is a funny side note to all of this.
Everyone denied and laughed at the thought that Haslam called for Johnny Football to be drafted.
According to our own QB coach, that's EXACTLY what happened! Haslam told them to move up and get the kid. Not farmer, not Pettine, but Haslam.
Hopefully that will put an end to the denial train.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Some of you assume that Farmer wasn't on board with the pick. Why??
I think everybody was sold on Johnny Football
While that may or may not be true there is a funny side note to all of this.
Everyone denied and laughed at the thought that Haslam called for Johnny Football to be drafted.
According to our own QB coach, that's EXACTLY what happened! Haslam told them to move up and get the kid. Not farmer, not Pettine, but Haslam.
Hopefully that will put an end to the denial train.
Yeah, but your taking a quote and you may be looking at it out of context. we don't know yet. It will come out however.
How do you know that it wasn't a foregone conclusion to pick Manziel? that it was decided and when that text came in Haslam just said what the QB Coach said he did?
But in the end, who the hell cares. He's here. He's a Cleveland Brown.. If he succeeds, there won't be another mention of this, If he flops, all they can say is Haslam picked him. That's the worst thing they can say.
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Yeah, but your taking a quote and you may be looking at it out of context. we don't know yet. It will come out however.
I hope not. I hope all of this swirling speculation just dies on the vine and JF can get on with playing football... Farmer can get on with running the team.. and Haslam can start writing playoff checks.
yebat' Putin
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Browns fans can only hope Manziel works out as well as that guy who was drafted on July 3, 1985.
I hope he does better than Bernie.
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Anyone remember the last QB who clearly wanted to be drafted by the Browns?
Brady Quinn?
Troy Smith,too.
Only one of them was drafted by the Browns and he didn't necessarily want to be here.
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Hoyer better play well against the Steelers or this whole thing could go south in a hurry
it's gonna go south no matter what hoyer does I'm afraid. the fans and boo birds are already practicing.
And that's the sad thing. A lot of the people who have already predetermined Hoyer's bad fate are probably the same people that, a little over week ago, "couldn't wait" to see him be the starter next season.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
#gmstrong
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Browns fans can only hope Manziel works out as well as that guy who was drafted on July 3, 1985.
I hope he does better than Bernie.
I have to agree.. look I love Bernie and I know it's heresy to say anything bad about him... in fact what I'm saying isn't even bad, it's just honesty... but he had what.. 3 or 4 really good years? His playoff record was 3-4.. one game winning drive in the playoffs.. He did a lot of good things and the fact that we didn't get to a super bowl is certainly not all on him by any stretch but you plop his 7 or 8 year record onto other teams that have had real success and he's a blip on the radar, not an idol..
yebat' Putin
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Hoyer better play well against the Steelers or this whole thing could go south in a hurry
it's gonna go south no matter what hoyer does I'm afraid. the fans and boo birds are already practicing.
Unfortunately, I agree with you. He better throw up 400 yards and 4 TDs, or people will be booing ... and then people wonder why we go through so many QBs. 
Like DC said, Russell Wilson was able to win the job and take over for Seattle. Fortunately for him, the hawks rely a lot on their run game, and he wasn't asked to do too much. That seems to be a common thread for non-#1 QBs to have success right out of the gate ... if they aren't asked to do too much, they have time to grow into the position. Guys like Big Ben, Flacco and Wilson all had great defenses and good running games, which meant they only had to game-manage their rookie year. They weren't expected to go 25/28 and put up 500 yards to win.
But people are acting like Hoyer is a bum too. He knows the playbook, he knows what it takes to run a team at the NFL level, and he's familiar with the players. If he wins the QB job, it's not an indictment against JM. I just hope the fans support him and not cheer for him to get injured like we normally do. The longer JM can learn the game without getting pummeled ... the better for him and the team.
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How does he have the owner's number and not the GM?
JM text'd Dowell Loggains not the owner.
I know. Dowell Loggains then forwarded the text to Haslam and Pettine. I'm guessing that the reason he didn't forward it to Farmer was because he didn't have his number.
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j/c
I think it's cute that you guys believe Hoyer will be the starter.
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jc
WOW, only with this fan base can we have a1st rounder that says he dpes not want to come here and we support / protect him and we have a1st rounder that wants to come here ( even said so before the draft) and we find fault with him because 1) He text the owner and the owner shoul dhave no say in any of this or 2) he is marketing himelf.
Tough crowd.
+1
Barry Bonds Check
Roger Clemens Check
Mark McGuire Check
Lance Armstrong Check
71-79 Steelers Taboo
(Lets pretend it didn't happen.)
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Yeah, but your taking a quote and you may be looking at it out of context. we don't know yet. It will come out however.
I hope not. I hope all of this swirling speculation just dies on the vine and JF can get on with playing football... Farmer can get on with running the team.. and Haslam can start writing playoff checks.
Yeah, that would be the preference, but let's not be naive here, you know that the question will come up in a presser and they will be forced to respond.
the other question(s) that will come up are:
Why did you ban national media?
Why did you tell JM that he had to prepare as the Back up?
Those are the ones that will be asked I bet.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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j/c
I think it's cute that you guys believe Hoyer will be the starter.
I'll try to remember this post. Let's see if you're right.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
#gmstrong
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j/c
I think it's cute that you guys believe Hoyer will be the starter.
you just never know. If someone would have told you that Carson Palmer would have to sit out his Rookie Year, would you have believed it?
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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j/c
I think it's cute that you guys believe Hoyer will be the starter.
you just never know. If someone would have told you that Carson Palmer would have to sit out his Rookie Year, would you have believed it?
If Hoyer beats out Manziel in an open competition, we have bigger problems. It's Quinn/Anderson all over again. I like Brian Hoyer, I love the story, but we're talking about a career backup that played in two games.
I'd love for it to workout so Manziel could sit, I don't see it happening.
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But..John Kitna...is soooo goood... My guess is Hoyer until week 5. Week 1 wouldn't surprise me. Manziel not starting this season would amaze me.
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Considering how dumb Marvin Lewis and Brown are, I'd believe it.
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“He shoots me a text that says, ‘I wish you guys would come get me. Hurry up and draft me because I want to be there and wreck this league together.’”
Love it. We need to have a cocky attitude. Hope he delivers.
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http://www.sportstalkwithbo.com/site/index.phpThink what you will, but the QB Coach said it as plain as can be, JM was high on the list. and he felt they were going to take him.. After evaluations, Johnny was at the top of the list and YES, Haslam liked him a lot. LIke I've been saying, there is more to it..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Yeah, but your taking a quote and you may be looking at it out of context. we don't know yet. It will come out however.
I hope not. I hope all of this swirling speculation just dies on the vine and JF can get on with playing football... Farmer can get on with running the team.. and Haslam can start writing playoff checks.
Yeah, that would be the preference, but let's not be naive here, you know that the question will come up in a presser and they will be forced to respond.
the other question(s) that will come up are:
Why did you ban national media?
Why did you tell JM that he had to prepare as the Back up?
Those are the ones that will be asked I bet.
I could live with those questions. That's Pulitzer Prize material compared to MKC at JM's intro presser.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
-PrplPplEater
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j/c
I think it's cute that you guys believe Hoyer will be the starter.
you just never know. If someone would have told you that Carson Palmer would have to sit out his Rookie Year, would you have believed it?
If Hoyer beats out Manziel in an open competition, we have bigger problems. It's Quinn/Anderson all over again. I like Brian Hoyer, I love the story, but we're talking about a career backup that played in two games.
I'd love for it to workout so Manziel could sit, I don't see it happening.
I'm thinking they just might have him sit until after the bye week, then it's full speed ahead.
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Hoyer better play well against the Steelers or this whole thing could go south in a hurry
it's gonna go south no matter what hoyer does I'm afraid. the fans and boo birds are already practicing.
Yep, Hoyer doesn't have a prayer of pleasing the Johnny football fans! His only hope is to pull a Tom Brady.
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it's not just the fans. the media has already started to stir it up.
there's no more sitting until you're ready.
tradition can only carry you so far, then you have to start winning again.
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Hoyer better play well against the Steelers or this whole thing could go south in a hurry
it's gonna go south no matter what hoyer does I'm afraid. the fans and boo birds are already practicing.
Yep, Hoyer doesn't have a prayer of pleasing the Johnny football fans! His only hope is to pull a Tom Brady.
How is dating a model going to help anything?
Oh.. nevermind
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Hoyer better play well against the Steelers or this whole thing could go south in a hurry
it's gonna go south no matter what hoyer does I'm afraid. the fans and boo birds are already practicing.
Yep, Hoyer doesn't have a prayer of pleasing the Johnny football fans! His only hope is to pull a Tom Brady.
How is dating a model going to help anything?
Oh.. nevermind
Side note. Bledsoe was an interesting QB. He was like one of those not quite elite, but elite sometimes QBs, no mobility, bad teams, and preceeded the Tom Brady generation of dominance. Very interesting career.
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Yeah, but your taking a quote and you may be looking at it out of context. we don't know yet. It will come out however.
I hope not. I hope all of this swirling speculation just dies on the vine and JF can get on with playing football... Farmer can get on with running the team.. and Haslam can start writing playoff checks.
Yeah, that would be the preference, but let's not be naive here, you know that the question will come up in a presser and they will be forced to respond.
the other question(s) that will come up are:
Why did you ban national media?
Why did you tell JM that he had to prepare as the Back up?
Those are the ones that will be asked I bet.
I could live with those questions. That's Pulitzer Prize material compared to MKC at JM's intro presser.
 My point was that when the next presser takes place, those are the questions that will be asked...
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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How do you know that it wasn't a foregone conclusion to pick Manziel? that it was decided and when that text came in Haslam just said what the QB Coach said he did?
I don't. What I do know is Haslam told them to move up and get him. Unless our QB coach is just plain lying. I wouldn't think he would need to tell them to do that if they were already going to do it to begin with.
I have no problem if he told them to, He writes the checks and all those under him are his employees. I just found it funny that people acted as though that could never have happened based on some PR statement that claimed it didn't.
To me there's as much of a possibility it did happen as it didn't. But it sure seemed like a big deal when some suggested it might have happened. Now? It seems like it's not. You don't find that odd?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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If we take Manziel and march him out there against the Steelers in the opener, it won't be a balloon that pops, it'll be his confidence.
I have zero doubts that Manziel will be the starter before the year is over, but it can't happen right out of the gate. It just can't, not if we have an ounce of sense.
I'm right there with you.
I agree as well. But I also agree with the poster that said he'd be disapointed if JM doesn't win the QB competition in camp.
What if JM really wins the competition in camp and they still start Hoyer? That will have an effect on his confidence as well.
Maybe he will win it in camp, but not get the starts right off the bat.
Ever think about that?
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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I would be pretty PO'd.
If I knew I was better and proved I was better, I wouldn't care much for my bosses at that point.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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How do you know that it wasn't a foregone conclusion to pick Manziel? that it was decided and when that text came in Haslam just said what the QB Coach said he did?
I don't. What I do know is Haslam told them to move up and get him. Unless our QB coach is just plain lying. I wouldn't think he would need to tell them to do that if they were already going to do it to begin with.
I have no problem if he told them to, He writes the checks and all those under him are his employees. I just found it funny that people acted as though that could never have happened based on some PR statement that claimed it didn't.
To me there's as much of a possibility it did happen as it didn't. But it sure seemed like a big deal when some suggested it might have happened. Now? It seems like it's not. You don't find that odd?
actiually, NO YOU DON"T KNOW THAT
Did you bother to listen to the audio I posted of the radio interview?
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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Yes I did. they liked Manziel. He was rated "highly" on their board. Once Haslam was told about Johnny's text he said "That's it, move up and get him".
We had the #26 pick and Haslam told them to make the move up to get Johnny. What about that are you missing?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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I sounded to me like they were planning on getting him somewhere. I think Farmer is not mentioned because, well the draft was happening. Farmer and Haslam and Pettine are in the war room, they are deciding win to do it. Haslam and Pettine ask the QB coach what he thinks, and he is on board. Then he tells Haslam about JM texting him and telling him he wants to come here.
I doubt highly that Farmer was sitting there silent. He may not have been texting the coach, but I'm sure he was involved with the conversation. It could have been him that suggested that since they were all in agreement, somebody ask Loggains for his opinion.
I don't see why you want to make a controversy out of this. I really don't see why it matters if Haslam did say to do it. It was a good move.
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I'm curious, if you were Haslam at that point, would you have said do it?
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I'm not going to post here like I used to. Due mostly to life reasons.
But I do want to say something here.
Can Johnny Manziel be managed in Cleveland like Ben Roethlisberger was managed in Pittsburgh?
I was of the opinion that when JM was drafted that he should sit no matter what until Week 5. But now. I've changed my opinion. I think Shanahan, with his prior experience, can script a package against Pitt for Manziel that is run heavy and features things he does well. I think the Browns can protect him schematically.
Ok. With that out of the way....
Guess what. If the Browns want to make the playoffs in 2014 then they probably have to beat the AFC North. Well we get two shots at that in the first three weeks. Why not use the offseason to game plan for three teams and beat some of them. Instead of coddling a Faberge egg.
Finally I'm going to say this.....
The one thing that confounds the most is the thing that is new. I think JM plays the game in a different way. He's a competent pocket passer. I really do believe that will play out. But I've never seen a QB with the balance, quicks and elusiveness that he has. Game planning for him is going to be difficult. Because I think Shanahan will slow roll the packages. And keep JM capable of running them.
Back to Roethlisberger and the Steelers.
Here are is pass ATTEMPTS per game his rookie season (14 games)
20
22
25
21
25
24
18
16
21
20
17
19
28
19
And his yards per game passing:
176
163
174
231
193
196
183
134
138
131
221
144
316
221
Now that's an example of effectively protecting a rookie QB. Can we do that? I don't know.
But I know it can be done.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,674
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,674 |
Sounds good to me.
We are Johnny Football.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 7,059
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 7,059 |
Quote:
I don't see why you want to make a controversy out of this. .
We do tend to dramatically over-analyze things...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums The Archives 2014 NFL Season NFL Draft 2014 Manziel Texted Browns To Draft Him
During Draft
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