This issue is near and dear to me. My calling took me to such a place. I know a Yup'ik (a branch of the Iniuit) Chief. He's one of the most giving, caring, and respectful individuals I've ever met in my life. His family took me in, lets me spend time with them, try new yummy food, and participate in cultural activities. I respect the family to no end. They support what I do, too.
To see all these groups, although Alaska Natives like to differentiate themselves from Native Americans, treated as redskin much akin to blackface aggravates me to no end.
Then you have the case of Wahoo...
No one is calling anyone racist if you have clothing which has these logos, if you like the logo, or anything like that. What these groups ask is that you step away from "you're calling me racist!" type arguments and see the bigger picture. Wahoo and the Redskin logo are the equivalent of little black sambo, blackface, and all the other awful racial attitudes of African Americans from before the Civil Rights Act.
Quote: Look up the history of how the Washington Redskins got that name in the first place.
Yes, they named it after some coach who falsified his identity to pretend to be a Native American. His genealogy has been heavily researched and he's basically the original Don Draper. Though the irony is very funny.
I heard something a little while back on the radio. I think that it was on the Rush show. (Hey, I wasn't driving that day) He said that the Washington team should keep the name "Redskins", and change their logo to a potato.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Quote: I heard something a little while back on the radio. I think that it was on the Rush show. (Hey, I wasn't driving that day) He said that the Washington team should keep the name "Redskins", and change their logo to a potato.
Totally agree
Actually, when I was a student at Ohio U, our rivals Miami (OH) were called the "Redskins" at the time and were in the process of changing their names to the now "Redhawks". Some clever OU student pointed out the same suggestion in the local paper. It's a brilliant idea
------------------------------ *In Baker we trust* -------------------------------
Many of them are numb or apathetic with the issue. They've dealt with hundreds of years of hearing "Hey, we're sorry. We just wanted more land because we felt it was our God given right to make you "less savage", take your land, and kill many of you. Here, have some of this land you can govern! We'll try and help out, too. Don't drink the alcohol!" as the government conveniently ignores the problem they created. When asked about the mascot issue many may just say "Who cares? Not like we'll be listened to anyway." They're a minority, too. Blackface, sambo style cartoons, and Song of The South (the Disney movie about the Jim Crow south) would be around today if the number of African Americans was around that of existing Native Americans.
Check here for an in-depth article on Native American attitudes towards it. The article was put together by Sports Illustrated. It's a great read. Article
I thought the commercial was a little boring and predictable. I got the message, but it hasn't changed my opinion any.
The name will stay as long as advertisers are still cutting checks to Snyder and the NFL. When public pressure gets advertisers nervous of product boycotts, including NFL tickets, that's when you'll see a name change. Until then, don't hold your breath.
If I were Snyder or Dolan, I'd change the name and logo 10 years ago. I wouldn't care if people thought I did it on my own or because I was forced to by the league or fans.
I would also point out, I'm disgusted that our government is wasting time talking about it and potentially thinking about forcing a change. Let the fans, advertisers, media, players and owners figure this out on their own. You've got enough to worry about.
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
Quote: Look up the history of how the Washington Redskins got that name in the first place.
Yes, they named it after some coach who falsified his identity to pretend to be a Native American. His genealogy has been heavily researched and he's basically the original Don Draper. Though the irony is very funny.
That name change story was debunked when they found an article from the 1930s with quotes from the guy who owned the team.. It had nothing to do with his coach or any Indian players or paying respect to Indians in general...
Here is a link which explains it and shows the actual article..
I guess I'm not all that interested in these things. I don't think that anyone named their teams with the thought in mind of demeaning a race of people. I'm pretty sure that wasn't the plan.
So to me, (and I get that I may bein the minority) it's much ado about nothing.
What are we going to do when/if people of African culture band together to get the Browns to change their name?
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
Quote: I guess I'm not all that interested in these things. I don't think that anyone named their teams with the thought in mind of demeaning a race of people. I'm pretty sure that wasn't the plan.
That's the point I was making with my last post. It doesn't matter if the intent to offend was there or not when the name/logo was created. Just because the intent wasn't there X years ago doesn't mean you get a pass now.
If your name or logo is offensive now, that's all that matters.
And again, I'm not on the "it's offensive and it must be changed" bandwagon. I get both sides of this discussion. If Snyder wants to keep it, then let him. Only when public support of the team and advertising dollars start dropping will he change it.
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
Quote: What are we going to do when/if people of African culture band together to get the Browns to change their name?
A: we didn't let the NFL take our name and history to Baltimore, included in that 'we' are several thousand Americans of African descent.
B: It is a well documented fact that our team is named after a white guy named Brown. Would be hard to make a fuss about that should someone be dumb enough to try.
But in all seriousness, I'm with you. Nobody set out to demean anyone or any race when naming a professional sports team.
Especially not in the Wild Wild West of Cleveland, Ohio.
WE DON'T NEED A QB BEFORE WE GET A LINE THAT CAN PROTECT HIM my two cents...
I imagine it wouldn't be that complicated to change Washington's name to an actual tribe name instead of the generic/racist Redskin. Unfortunately the Washington Piscataway's doesn't have much of a ring to it
As it stands right now I personally think the name is in the category of "unintentionally racist". Really only because the term redskin, I don't personally find the name Indians racist (except for Chief Sambo )
It would be wise to just shuck the racially based team names entirely. I think people are forgetting that Cowboys and Indians were immensely popular when these teams were choosing their names. Indians have sort of faded into history culturally so the naming is pretty puzzling in the modern era.
Quote: Phil, do you think Goodell will make it happen? He's barely touched the concussion issue...
I think he's gonna have to.
The issue is already spreading beyond football fans. Sooner or later the dam will break.
Could you imagine if the Skins made the Super Bowl this year? The issue would overshadow the game. The NFL's biggest PR event would be marred to the point where they're doing damage control. And what would Goodell do? Stand there and claim the name is OK?
Personally, I don't really care. But I totally understand why others do.
Quote: Phil, do you think Goodell will make it happen? He's barely touched the concussion issue...
I think he's gonna have to.
The issue is already spreading beyond football fans. Sooner or later the dam will break.
Could you imagine if the Skins made the Super Bowl this year? The issue would overshadow the game. The NFL's biggest PR event would be marred to the point where they're doing damage control. And what would Goodell do? Stand there and claim the name is OK?
Personally, I don't really care. But I totally understand why others do.
Well... and let's be honest here.. concussions are really just about a bunch of rich guys losing their motor skills and having severe bouts of depression way too early in life.. that could have potentially been eliminated (or at least reduced) if the NFL had not covered up medical evidence showing the long term effects of repeatedly being knocked in the head...
That hardly compares to a bunch of white people being offended on behalf of another group of people who may or may not be offended by a nickname and a sketch on a football helmet...
That does seem to be the focus in many things these days. As far as the "Skins (that better?) making it to the Super Bowl, well, that ain't gonna happen so no need to worry.
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
I think that they should change the name to the "Washington DC Area Generic Football Team" ....... that way no one ..... except brand name proponents, can be offended. Let's face it ...... rich people buy only name brands ..... so who cares about them?
Their logo could be a bar code.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Quote: I guess I'm not all that interested in these things. I don't think that anyone named their teams with the thought in mind of demeaning a race of people. I'm pretty sure that wasn't the plan.
So to me, (and I get that I may bein the minority) it's much ado about nothing.
What are we going to do when/if people of African culture band together to get the Browns to change their name?
I agree with you, and I hate this PC crap. Sports teams are named for speed, strength, and warrior spirit. You don't see the Irish complain about that Notre Dame leprechaun. They actually like the idea of Fighting Irish. You don't see white, blond, tall people in Minnesota getting angry over that silly Viking motif, and they were regarded as mere savages by most of the Christian world. Even the Seminoles love that Fl State carries their name.
Quote: I think that they should change the name to the "Washington DC Area Generic Football Team" ....... that way no one ..... except brand name proponents, can be offended. Let's face it ...... rich people buy only name brands ..... so who cares about them?
Their logo could be a bar code.
"Washington DC Area " That sounds pretty offensive to me
Quote: I think that they should change the name to the "Washington DC Area Generic Football Team" ....... that way no one ..... except brand name proponents, can be offended. Let's face it ...... rich people buy only name brands ..... so who cares about them?
Their logo could be a bar code.
"Washington DC Area " That sounds pretty offensive to me
Well, they are named Washington, and play in Maryland ...... so they can only be a team in the area ..... not in DC itself.
However .... given that the Redskins supposedly have a waiting list for season tickets some 160K long ....... maybe they should leave well enough alone.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
In common parlance white people is the only race I'm aware of where we refer to the people by the color of their skin.
The term White people might be racist for all I know. It might be considered such in the future. I wanted to coin the phrase "To the victor goes the guilt". I will note I find it kind of annoying to be refered to as a farang constantly in Thailand but the asian countries get their own "he's japanese, chinese etc."
I'm not especially invested in the general areas of race relations, gender relations and all that hubub. Far bigger fish to fry in terms of global politics and ethics, but I'm not particularly invested in those either
Quote: I think that they should change the name to the "Washington DC Area Generic Football Team" ....... that way no one ..... except brand name proponents, can be offended. Let's face it ...... rich people buy only name brands ..... so who cares about them?
Their logo could be a bar code.
"Washington DC Area " That sounds pretty offensive to me
Well, they are named Washington, and play in Maryland ...... so they can only be a team in the area ..... not in DC itself.
However .... given that the Redskins supposedly have a waiting list for season tickets some 160K long ....... maybe they should leave well enough alone.
This, they also are ranked #7 in merchandise sales. If they were last and struggled to sell out games they would have changed it a long time ago. If you don't like it then don't buy tickets, don't watch the game and don't buy merchandise. It's really that simple.
Changing the name/logo would probably put them at #1. You'd have people gobbling up all of the Redskins gear, on top of people getting the new Warriors (or whatever) merchandise.
I think they should change the Redskin name to the "Mighty Whites" or something of that nature. Put a mean looking white guy on the side of the helmet, and call it good. Of course then "people" would complain that there's not enough racial diversity in NFL mascots and ask that a "Toony" rule be instated that requires a certain percentage of mascots be of certain ethic backgrounds.
On a side note ... why is nobody offended by this mascot?
It's basically a caricature of a drunk Irishman looking for a fight ... because, well ... that's the stereotype. Of course, I guess someone will argue that it's okay, because the Irish were never slaves, were never treated as second class citizens and never had to deal with things like segregation or discrimination ...
The Irish are too busy getting drunk and fighting to complain about mascots ......
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
On a side note ... why is nobody offended by this mascot?
It's basically a caricature of a drunk Irishman looking for a fight ... because, well ... that's the stereotype. Of course, I guess someone will argue that it's okay, because the Irish were never slaves, were never treated as second class citizens and never had to deal with things like segregation or discrimination ...
Seems like a lot of people who think "it's much ado about nothing" sure seem to spend a lot of time talking about it.
If you don't care...............then it should not bother you if they change the name.
Btw..............the Celtics name derived from the a group of tribes called the Celts [pronounced Kelts]. If memory serves me correct, they were from the Iron Age in Central Europe. I don't see how that is derogatory at all.
How does the "Raiders" name disrespect any particular race?
Native Americans were not "red." They were shades of brown. Call them a particular tribe. Call them braves. Call them Native Americans. Call them Warriors. But no, don't call them "Redskins."
: a person who suddenly and unexpectedly attacks a place or group
: a person who enters a place in order to steal or take something
: a person who tries to take control of a business by buying a lot of its stock
Had you have read all Vers my main point was why is it Rasist to use "REDSKIN" but yet no one complains when the terms "White guy" "a bunch of white people used in this thread by ones crying foul.
So explain why REDSKIN is racest while WHITE PEOPLE is not?
So it's racist to use the term"Redskin" but yet a couple times in this thread the terms "White guy" "a bunch of white people " are not?
Really? The people who are saying and complaining about the "White guy" happen to be white guys. Also, I think it's rather funny that people still think Native Americans don't find that the term is racist. I ask you to go to any reservation and call those people Redskins instead of the coworker/classmate who used her 1/16th Cherokee blood as justification to wear a headdress to Coachella.
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