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Pettine: Browns will use RB by committee approach

By Dan Hanzus
Around the League Writer
Published: June 28, 2014 at 06:45 p.m.
Updated: June 29, 2014 at 07:40 a.m.


Ben Tate might not find anybody who scares him in the Browns' running back room, but he'll have company handling the workload on Sundays.

Browns coach Mike Pettine told The Plain Dealer that Cleveland will embrace a committee approach as the team attempts to put a better emphasis on the run in 2014.

"I think in the AFC North, you have to be running back by committee," Pettine said. "You'd like to have a guy that can carry most of the load, but also be able to alternate guys ... you've got to be able to get fresh legs out there."

Tate -- who signed a two-year deal in the offseason -- remains the favorite to see the majority of snaps this season. Pettine's comments indicate that third-round pick Terrance West and Dion Lewis will also be part of the game plan.

However the Browns attack it, they need to do a far better job establishing the run game in 2014. They led the league in pass attempts last season, an insane statistic when you remember their starting quarterbacks were Brandon Weeden, Jason Campbell and Brian Hoyer.

With Johnny Manziel still the favorite to open the season as the starter, the Browns will need a solid run game to protect their rookie quarterback. It won't be a one-man job.

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Doesn't matter what backs are out there is the zone blocking scheme/oline aren't doing their job. If that happens, then there is no reason not to use the weapons we have and keep fresh backs out there and the defense on heels.

Dion Lewis seems to keep making his name felt. Personally I want to see this kid in action. Real action against real defenses and not third string and beyond.

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Doesn't matter what backs are out there is the zone blocking scheme/oline aren't doing their job. If that happens, then there is no reason not to use the weapons we have and keep fresh backs out there and the defense on heels.

Dion Lewis seems to keep making his name felt. Personally I want to see this kid in action. Real action against real defenses and not third string and beyond.




He's certainly the smallest RB on the team, but curiously, he isn't the fastest.

Dion Lewis (from nfldraftscout.com)

Ben Tate (from nfldraftscout.com)

Terrence West (from NFL.com)

Isaiah Crowell (from draftbrowns.com)

Edwin Baker (from nfldraftscout.com)

Take it all for what it's worth to you.

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Dion Lewis seems to keep making his name felt.




Really? I don't see to recall reading much about him so far this year. What have you read or heard about him?


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With Johnny Manziel still the favorite to open the season as the starter,



Fan favorite maybe.. but why do they tack this on to so many articles when everybody within the organization says Manziel is way behind Hoyer......


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That irks the hell out of me too.


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It's like they are setting up the controversy so that if/when it is announced that Hoyer is the starter they can act shocked... or maybe if/when Hoyer looks better in preseason they can write that Manziel is losing the job? But it does seem like they are setting up the follow-up story if Manziel ends up not starting..


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With Johnny Manziel still the favorite to open the season as the starter,



Fan favorite maybe.. but why do they tack this on to so many articles when everybody within the organization says Manziel is way behind Hoyer......




I'm not even sure he's the fan favorite. He is certainly the media favorite. LOL I wonder if they can keep it up all season long.

I think they should sign Hoyer to an extension, right now and name him the starter.

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It's like they are setting up the controversy so that if/when it is announced that Hoyer is the starter they can act shocked... or maybe if/when Hoyer looks better in preseason they can write that Manziel is losing the job? But it does seem like they are setting up the follow-up story if Manziel ends up not starting..




Or that he (Manziel) is a bust. LOL

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Quote:

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With Johnny Manziel still the favorite to open the season as the starter,



Fan favorite maybe.. but why do they tack this on to so many articles when everybody within the organization says Manziel is way behind Hoyer......




Honestly, I don't know for sure that he's even a fan favorite to start right away. He may be the fan favorite long term, but I haven't had any friends of mine say he should start right away.


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FWIW

I'd like to see Dion Lewis in this group as an attempt at a Sproles-like back.

But w/ Tate, West, and Crowell's talent, it could spell the end of Baker and Oby in Cleveland.


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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

With Johnny Manziel still the favorite to open the season as the starter,



Fan favorite maybe.. but why do they tack this on to so many articles when everybody within the organization says Manziel is way behind Hoyer......




Honestly, I don't know for sure that he's even a fan favorite to start right away. He may be the fan favorite long term, but I haven't had any friends of mine say he should start right away.




No doubt Manziel is the fans favorite. Maybe not here as Browns fans, but this is a national piece, so the writer is thinking in terms of the national fan base in which case manziel is the favorite.


If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.

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Simple answer: It is the story they want to write. Not sure JM can compete yet at this level; Hoyer has won at this level. Trying to gin up a QB controversy; I hoped Hoyer would get props here for his work. can't throw everybody else under the bus on this team for media flavor of the day. Crappy journalism from what I was taught. Thought I would tuck this into the running back thread I expected.


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Personally, I don't think ANY rookie QB should start day one. I wish he had picked a better number, anything but 2. MAYBE, start the second half IF we are ahead.


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I agree with BP here.

Living in South Florida, I don't get to talk to many people who know much about the Browns beyond the big media pieces. Even the so called Browns fans here often rely solely on the national media coverage for information about the team.

I was having a chat with a so-called fan a couple weeks ago while out, and he thought Hoyer was a guy we picked up this year in FA. No clue he even was on the team and played last year. He was a "Johny Manziel should start" guy. I asked why and his reply was "He's a first round QB, you always start a first round QB."

The conversation pretty much ended there. He talked and talked, I just nodded and smiled, as I listened to him recite what could easily be a transcript from ESPN.


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Quote:

FWIW

I'd like to see Dion Lewis in this group as an attempt at a Sproles-like back.

But w/ Tate, West, and Crowell's talent, it could spell the end of Baker and Oby in Cleveland.




It could, but that is what the preseason is for.

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Quote:

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Dion Lewis seems to keep making his name felt.




Really? I don't see to recall reading much about him so far this year. What have you read or heard about him?




Said it right there in the article posted in this thread:

Quote:

Pettine's comments indicate that third-round pick Terrance West and Dion Lewis will also be part of the game plan.




To say/hint that this early, when there are other credible backs in Baker and etc - has got to be some kind of testament to the kid's ability/skillset. Hell Norv looked like he was going cry last year when we lost him. Norv seemed to have all kinds of hopes and wants with Dion. Like I said, he seems to keep making his name felt and seems to keep giving staffs a reason to consider granting him a few carries.

We all will see come September how the running back group shapes up and how Kyle is going to wish to use em' all... I'd say it's a good issue to have is to have a bunch of RB's you want to carry the ball/game plan around!

All JMO

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What matters to me is when it's crunch time and a game, a division game, is in the balance, and the opponent downs a punt on the Browns half yard line, so it's first and 10 on your own 0.5, who gets the ball.

My choice? I wish William Green was still around, he was very solid in those situations.


Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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I think that it's a great thing to have a bunch of depth and talent at any position. I just honestly don't recall having heard much of anything at all about Lewis at all this preseason.

I have heard that Tate has been in and out ...... that West has looked great .... and that Baker has shown really good speed and ability to make a definitive cut in camps. I just really haven't read much about Lewis at all.


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Honestly, I don't know for sure that he's even a fan favorite to start right away. He may be the fan favorite long term, but I haven't had any friends of mine say he should start right away.




Even if he is the fan favorite Pettine does not give a crap. That's what i like about him. He will do what he thinks is best and to hell with anybody else


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When I think about how the RB depth chart will shake out I try to keep in mind that a RB in a ZBS ideally is a one cut and go type of runner. Tate has played in the system when Shanny was in Houston. West, by all accounts and what I've seen on tape has this ability. Beyond those two I don't know. I suspect that Crowell may fit the system since he was brought to the team by the staff installing the ZBS. YT says he's heard that Baker has shown well up to this point.

A lot of this could turn around once the pads go on. For some of these guys it may depend on things other than carrying the rock. Certainly, how well they perform blitz pick up, can they be a factor in the passing game, do they have any utility on special teams?

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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

With Johnny Manziel still the favorite to open the season as the starter,



Fan favorite maybe.. but why do they tack this on to so many articles when everybody within the organization says Manziel is way behind Hoyer......




Honestly, I don't know for sure that he's even a fan favorite to start right away. He may be the fan favorite long term, but I haven't had any friends of mine say he should start right away.




If he's better than Hoyer, he should start right away. Hoyer had one good game and one mediocre game last year. I'm not pulling for either of these guys based on their name or where they've come from. Whoever is the better QB is the one who should start.

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Quote:

Quote:

Honestly, I don't know for sure that he's even a fan favorite to start right away. He may be the fan favorite long term, but I haven't had any friends of mine say he should start right away.




Even if he is the fan favorite Pettine does not give a crap. That's what i like about him. He will do what he thinks is best and to hell with anybody else




He (pettine) did say that he wouldn't let jersey sales dictate who starts. Pretty clear indicator that he's not swayed by popular opinion.

But, we'll see when the bullet start flying if he sticks to that.

The thing is, if Manziel wins the job, I'm as good as gold with him starting game one.


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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

With Johnny Manziel still the favorite to open the season as the starter,



Fan favorite maybe.. but why do they tack this on to so many articles when everybody within the organization says Manziel is way behind Hoyer......




Honestly, I don't know for sure that he's even a fan favorite to start right away. He may be the fan favorite long term, but I haven't had any friends of mine say he should start right away.




If he's better than Hoyer, he should start right away. Hoyer had one good game and one mediocre game last year. I'm not pulling for either of these guys based on their name or where they've come from. Whoever is the better QB is the one who should start.




Agreed, 100%


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I just honestly don't recall having heard much of anything at all about Lewis at all this preseason.





I was factoring in last year's "hype" too with Norv and etc, not just this off-season. It's clear he's doing something right in the eyes of this staff and previous - it already seems as-if he secured himself a roster spot IMO.

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I have seen nothing that would seem to indicate that.

Perhaps Pettine made a comment or 2 about him, but I have read, heard, and seen reported very little about him this preseason.

I would not count on anyone other than Tate and West making the team for sure. I like Baker, and think that he fits this offense beautifully .....and Crowell has a ton of physical talent. Then there is Obi, who can do anything in this offense,and has been productive, but has a fumbling problem ..... and finally Lewis. Lewis was brought in by the former coaching staff, because he fit their offense. Can a guy his size, who lacks breakaway speed, beat out a bigger and more powerful back? Can he make that one cut and go?

We saw Lewis in the preseason last year, and he looked good ...... but then again ... so did Weeden. I am not saying that he cannot be a RB on this team ..... just that I think that he has serious competition, and he may lose out in a numbers game. I don't see him having any advantage fo having spent last season here on the IR. I do not see him as having already secured anything. There is a ton of competition at the position.


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Is fumbling 5 times since 2009 after 144 attempts and over 600 yards rushing and 4.5 average and 96 receptions for over 700 yards receiving for an average of 7.4 yards considered a fumbling problem?

I mean that's 1 fumble every 48 times he touches the ball? Is that a lot. If my math is correct, thats about 2 % of the time. I'd think thats pretty good right?

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/O/OgboCh00.htm

All that aside, I think he doesn't make the team. I agree with you that after Tate and West, it's just guess work.


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It depends upon your perspective... 5 since 2009... no, that doesn't sound like much. That's just one per year.

But....
1 in 48 touches? You could easily conclude that an average back will see 24 touches per game... that is one fumble every other game. Eight per season.
Five fumbles in 600 yards? That's essentially 1 fumble every 120 yards.

Those are not acceptable numbers.


It also shows that despite the passage of time, the problem doesn't get better. Of course, this is a very small amount of data to look at and it could easily be skewed by one very bad but short string of time..... but, at face value, yes, that is bad. Very bad.


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2 fumbles in only 49 carries and 48 receptions is a concern.

Baker, by comparison, had 43 carries, 8 receptions, and no fumbles.

5 fumbles in 240 touches is a pretty fair number of fumbles. Tate also fumbles at the same rate. That's a lot.

Look at a guy like Ray Rice, who has 1430 rushes and 369 receptions, and only 9 fumbles in his career. That's roughly once every 200 touches.

Giovani Bernard, for the Bengals, had 1 fumble in 170 rushes and 56 catches.

Le"veon Bell, for the Steelers, had only 1 fumble in 244 rushes and 45 catches.

Yeah, 2 fumbles in less than 100 touches, and 5 in only 240 career touches is a lot.


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I have seen nothing that would seem to indicate that.

Perhaps Pettine made a comment or 2 about him, but I have read, heard, and seen reported very little about him this preseason.

I would not count on anyone other than Tate and West making the team for sure. I like Baker, and think that he fits this offense beautifully .....and Crowell has a ton of physical talent. Then there is Obi, who can do anything in this offense,and has been productive, but has a fumbling problem ..... and finally Lewis. Lewis was brought in by the former coaching staff, because he fit their offense. Can a guy his size, who lacks breakaway speed, beat out a bigger and more powerful back? Can he make that one cut and go?

We saw Lewis in the preseason last year, and he looked good ...... but then again ... so did Weeden. I am not saying that he cannot be a RB on this team ..... just that I think that he has serious competition, and he may lose out in a numbers game. I don't see him having any advantage fo having spent last season here on the IR. I do not see him as having already secured anything. There is a ton of competition at the position.




All valid points, but bottom line is you can believe what you wish and I'll believe what I wish. Judging by Norv's reaction last year when we lost Lewis, I actually kind of believe the statement made in the article to be true. There is a Dion Lewis in the game plan. How big of a role, IF ANY, is yet to be determined, but I am actually swaying to believing the comment (may just be me, and if so, that's fine.)

I think Lewis can unlock a lot of havoc as a pass catching back with ability to be more nimble/light on the feet than our monster backs. He'll be able to squeeze and burst through the holes. Break away speed, well it's documented on Dion's speed. He isn't even the fastest back on the team I believe... but I'll stick to my original comments, I'd like to see the kid in action. And don't include preseason cause... well, it's preseason. I want to see him carry the ball on defenses on game day, when the stats count. Then we can all know what the kid is capable of.

However, I will also include this. If he's cut tmw, I won't even blink an eye. It won't cause any losing of sleep. Nothing. But man, I'd still like to see what he can do in our scheme even if that's only a few carries per game before we write him off. He'd also back-up/provide an option at returner too, as I believe he did that in 2011 or whenever with Philly.


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If Norv were still here ...... then I might agree .... but Norv is in Minnesota, and his opinions on anyone are null and void now.

Lewis is not a flat out speedy guy. Not at all. He ran a 4.57 40 at the combine. West ran a 4.50.

Lewis is more agile than anything. He is not especially fast or powerful.


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The word Elusive is what I've heard used on Lewis. Hope that's the case.


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The word Elusive is what I've heard used on Lewis. Hope that's the case.






Quicks is what I call it....he shifts gears faster than other players.


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The word Elusive is what I've heard used on Lewis. Hope that's the case.





Quicks is what I call it....he shifts gears faster than other players.




Too bad he only has two gears

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The running game should be a strength of the Browns this season.

They have a good stable of backs and the competition should bring out the best.

The Browns have invested heavy on the OL and Shanahan likes to run the ball.

All the above reasons should make the Browns a much better team this year. Running the ball in our division is a huge factor in being successful. Division games are all outside and in cold weather as the season progresses.

The quarterback situation is unclear. Gordon has made the receiver corp questionable. However it shakes out with who is the starter and what receivers contribute. The coordination between the quarterback and the receivers needs time to develop. So, the run game must become the staple.

The coaches know it and the Browns will work hard to develop the running attack.

For me I love a power run game. It establishes a mind set and a playing personality. When you are successful running the ball you dictate the flow of the game. You can impose your will on a defense.

I am looking forward to it.

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Bone, I agree with you up to a point. If I was Pettine, I want to see balance.

When I look at the box scores and see Brown ran 60 plays, I hope I see 30 pass and 30 run plays. When I look at individual stats, I hope it is sprayed across each play maker evenly. Why? It'll make it extremely difficult for DCs to know how to plan or counter on any given play.

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Funny, but the same thing (or close to it) was said last year. Then Lewis went down, Richardson wasn't running well, then he was traded.


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not really anything here we dont already know but hadnt seen it posted
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/201...-backfield-mix/

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I'm not rooting against Lewis to make the team, that would be silly; to root against any particular player in the organization. As a matter of fact I hope that the running back competition is at such a high level they have extreme difficulty deciding on who makes the final roster.

Okay, with that out of the way I do have a question about Lewis. Obviously to be answered in training camp. Does his style as a ball carrier fit with the zone blocking scheme?

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Not really, I was hoping that Brandon Weeden would suck so that they could replace him with someone better. Nothing wrong with being pragmatic.

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