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Because those tests are easy to have a false positive on them. Thats why they do the sample A and B tests, which again, looks like a false positive. This is what happens when you drug test at such incredibly strict levels.
you had a good run Hank.
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Because those tests are easy to have a false positive on them. Thats why they do the sample A and B tests, which again, looks like a false positive. This is what happens when you drug test at such incredibly strict levels.
I will make a WAG here and say when he pee they didn't have enough to give a accurate reading in the second bottle and did not need it per nfl rule it only had to confirm that there was pot in him?
being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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Because those tests are easy to have a false positive on them. Thats why they do the sample A and B tests, which again, looks like a false positive. This is what happens when you drug test at such incredibly strict levels.
I will make a WAG here and say when he pee they didn't have enough to give a accurate reading in the second bottle and did not need it per nfl rule it only had to confirm that there was pot in him?
But, what if bottle A had been labeled bottle B, and the "B" bottle had been labeled A.
They test the A bottle - it's 13.6 ng - end of story, right? They don't even bother to check the new B bottle.
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Two states have legalized the use of marijuana and a year ago the World Anti-Doping Agency increased its marijuana threshold from 15 ng/ml to 150 ng/ml.
Well, at least 15 seems less arbitrary now.
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There are good points to be made about a team spirit and good decision making; but I can't help but think of an old man rattling his cane at the youngins and their reefer cigarettes.
Perhaps that is because you are narrow-minded and want to paint a negative picture on anyone who doesn't agree w/your line of thinking? If this is true, you would then need to assign a label to that particular person and make the argument more about him than about the topic at hand. I can't but think that is a very shallow and cowardly act of someone who isn't very open minded to hearing and considering the viewpoints of other people.
We can play this insulting game all day. It doesn't change the facts.
I haven't been reading the thread for long enough to understand why I just got a Vers style vitriolic slap. You are very willing to toss a lot of condemnation at people. I'm willing to call people cane rattling fuddy duddies, but to each their own I suppose.
I'm not entirely sure what facts you are referring to. I imagine you don't mean medical facts about weed in particular as those definitely side on "better for you than alcohol" to "numerous possible health benefits". I'm not sure what other facts are in play aside from Gordon failing numerous drug tests in the past. The current drug test failure hasn't yet reached fact status apparently.
The only way I respect someone having a negative opinion towards weed are two fold:
1. All drug use in general is a bad decision and coping mechanism for other problems.
2. Weed is currently illegal in most US states making its use incredibly irresponsible and risky.
I think the league is within its rights to set whatever policies they want. Once it is proven Gordon violated their guidelines I'm fine with them going by the book. I disagree with the current policy and would prefer they only test for PEDs. I'd also like it if athletes didn't use drugs and were upstanding citizens in all walks of life, the current policy seems to attempt straddling those two positions.
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Legend
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Are those results "drastically" different? I really don't know. Do you?
I do know that when a person gets pulled over for a DUI that he is tested twice. The results are different. I don't see too many people getting off of a DUI charge because their two results were different. Then again, they don't play in the NFL.
What the heck, let's drop all the player conduct rules. Let them do whatever they want, whenever they want. They score touchdowns. That's all that matters.
vers...yes, those results are "drastically different".
...a spread of 2.4 ng/ml on a scale of 15 ng/ml is unacceptable when we are talking about the same freaking urine sample.
Is there anyone who believes Gordon's urine sample varied 2.4 ng/ml?
Or, is the NFL's test so flawed that it can't reproduce consistent and accurate results?
I believe the NFL has some explaining to do and I would insist on a review of Gordon's test results, right down to the individuals who did the testing.
Also, there should be a further review of the NFL's testing procedure to determine if variances that showed up in Gordon's testing are the norm for the NFL's testing program.
How many other players could have potentially lost millions of dollars in fines due to the NFL's inaccurate and inconsistent drug testing results?
No doubt, the NFL is willing to suspend their players if the results are over the limit by 1 nanogram/ml limit, therefore the players should without a doubt, expect the NFL's test results of the same urine sample to be accurate down to the nanogram...
...and in Gordon's case, there is a spread of 2.4 nanograms on a scale of 15 ng/ml....yes, Gordon's test results of the same urine sample are "drastically different".
Last edited by mac; 07/30/14 09:11 AM.
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.. the immunoassay test .. why no one is talking about that?
First I've heard this. Where is this info coming from?
I was not aware they did blood tests for doping etc on players. Interesting.
I doesn't say but I though it was saliva test? I think it is one of those instant test?
Actually I did some research... it can be Blood, saliva or Urine I believe. It sais body fluids and on eplace di dmention blood testing... then it got waaay over my head so, perhaps someone in the medical field can tell us.
Last edited by texaslostdawg; 07/30/14 09:18 AM.
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A wise person knows whether or not to say it.
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Was bottle A or bottle B on the missed flight?
Joe Thomas #73
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Because those tests are easy to have a false positive on them. Thats why they do the sample A and B tests, which again, looks like a false positive. This is what happens when you drug test at such incredibly strict levels.
I will make a WAG here and say when he pee they didn't have enough to give a accurate reading in the second bottle and did not need it per nfl rule it only had to confirm that there was pot in him?
But, what if bottle A had been labeled bottle B, and the "B" bottle had been labeled A.
They test the A bottle - it's 13.6 ng - end of story, right? They don't even bother to check the new B bottle.
then there would not have been enough for the test.
Last edited by pblack18707; 07/30/14 09:27 AM.
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Two states have legalized the use of marijuana and a year ago the World Anti-Doping Agency increased its marijuana threshold from 15 ng/ml to 150 ng/ml.
Well, at least 15 seems less arbitrary now.
of course in the great pothead state of Washington if you test 5 ng/ml while driving you get a dui.
being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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I still wish that he--and the Browns--would have manned-up and taken the punishment. As an educator, I fully understand that society doesn't believe in accountability much anymore, but I think that is a huge mistake and that we are instilling the wrong values in our children.
Taken the punishment for what? Testing negative for pot?
I agree with your second sentence, however, hanging Josh when he is actually innocent will do more harm than good in re-instilling the values espoused in your second sentence.
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Who the heck does the NFL think they are....16 nanograms? For reference pilots are allowed 50 nanograms per milliliter and the Olympic committee allows 150. NFL thinking they are the CIA or something. Quote:
"For air traffic controllers, it's three-times higher," Schaffer said. "For WADA (World Anti-Doping Agency), the cutoff level is 175 -- that's for Olympic athletes -- which is over 10 times greater than what we deal with. People who are landing planes can be at 50 nanograms, but an NFL player hurting on Sunday night are at 15? For personal use in your home? I don't get it. I've tried to push the union to raise the threshold for a long time, and I've tried to push the league office to push the threshold higher. I've advocated for this for over a decade. "To me it's a win-win situation -- not suspending your best players for doing something everyone else is doing. If you're that worried about Josh Gordon, get him help. Don't penalize him. And if teams are worried that pot makes players less aggressive, then, hey, that player will eventually get cut if that's the case. But the way this policy is put together now doesn't make sense anyone."
http://mweb.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/jas...se?v=1&vc=1
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.. the immunoassay test .. why no one is talking about that?
First I've heard this. Where is this info coming from?
I was not aware they did blood tests for doping etc on players. Interesting.
I doesn't say but I though it was saliva test? I think it is one of those instant test?
Actually I did some research... it can be Blood, saliva or Urine I believe. It sais body fluids and on eplace di dmention blood testing... then it got waaay over my head so, perhaps someone in the medical field can tell us.
me too lol. but in the article it said screening test so i assume its a instant test of some sort. like you can buy at drugstore to test your kid.
being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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Gordon’s appeal hearing is scheduled for Friday in New York. Goodell may not even be in attendance; he is expected to be in Canton for Pro Football Hall of Fame Enshrinement Weekend festivities.
I hope that is just conjecture on ESPN's part- Goodell makes the final decision, he has to hear the other side of the story. It would be poor form on his part to not be in attendance- afterall, the league set the date of appeal.
A couple years ago a couple Vikings took there failed tests on a supplement to court, 1 guy retired and the other, if I recall, never served any suspension. Could Gordon challenge this in court if an indefinite suspension is levied and no compromise can be reached??
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Made a statement several months ago " Goodell sucks " and took a ton of flack from the Board .. So now we get the Rice decision and speculation that Goody too shoes might not even show up at Goedons hearing ????? They ( the NFL ) have a PR nightmare and Goodell is front and center .
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afterall, the league set the date of appeal.
Interesting that they set a date on which Goodell had a previous commitment and couldn't be there. Of course, I imagine he has commitments nearly every hour of every day so it's not like he's sitting around doing nothing every other day but Aug 1.
What I do find interesting and a bit frustrating is that the final say on punishment is Goodell's and since he won't be at the hearing he can't pass judgement until after the Aug 1 meeting. So Gordon, the team and the fans still won't know anything until a later time.
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There are good points to be made about a team spirit and good decision making; but I can't help but think of an old man rattling his cane at the youngins and their reefer cigarettes.
Perhaps that is because you are narrow-minded and want to paint a negative picture on anyone who doesn't agree w/your line of thinking? If this is true, you would then need to assign a label to that particular person and make the argument more about him than about the topic at hand. I can't but think that is a very shallow and cowardly act of someone who isn't very open minded to hearing and considering the viewpoints of other people.
We can play this insulting game all day. It doesn't change the facts.
I haven't been reading the thread for long enough to understand why I just got a Vers style vitriolic slap. You are very willing to toss a lot of condemnation at people. I'm willing to call people cane rattling fuddy duddies, but to each their own I suppose.
I'm not entirely sure what facts you are referring to. I imagine you don't mean medical facts about weed in particular as those definitely side on "better for you than alcohol" to "numerous possible health benefits". I'm not sure what other facts are in play aside from Gordon failing numerous drug tests in the past. The current drug test failure hasn't yet reached fact status apparently.
The only way I respect someone having a negative opinion towards weed are two fold:
1. All drug use in general is a bad decision and coping mechanism for other problems.
2. Weed is currently illegal in most US states making its use incredibly irresponsible and risky.
I think the league is within its rights to set whatever policies they want. Once it is proven Gordon violated their guidelines I'm fine with them going by the book. I disagree with the current policy and would prefer they only test for PEDs. I'd also like it if athletes didn't use drugs and were upstanding citizens in all walks of life, the current policy seems to attempt straddling those two positions.
I'm just gonna say what a person does in the privacy of their own home that doesn't hurt anyone else should not be anyone else's business. If you pay your bills, treat your wife and kids good then IMHO have at it. People should stay the tuck out of your business.
That being said any drug that alters your mental state is just flat out stupid to use. I don't care if it's too much beer, coke, pot, or crack. It's bad and it's illegal like it should be. When Denver loses a generation of their kids to pot because of their greed for tax money I don't wanna hear about poor Denver.
Pot makes you stupid and everyone knows it. That's why we make fun of them in movies and laugh at them because a pothead is is so obvious. It can cause you to suffer bouts of depression and make you suicidal which I have seen first hand. It can make you suffer severe panic attacks and hallucinations to the point where you will harm yourself which I have also seen first hand several times. there are countless scientific and medical studies that show the harmful effects of pot which is why it is a federally illegal drug.
If your dying then use whatever drugs you want and God bless. You want to make up BS about abusing that substance to make yourself feel better about your drug habits then have at it too. Just don't cry poor me when your life goes down the drain along with your family's later on when they say well dad did it so it must be ok right? Kids getting a hold of pot can suffer permanent brain damage that never heals. I have seen it first hand over and over again. Be in denial all you want but you better keep that poison away from your kids because it will flush their life right down the drain.
Sorry for the rant wont say anymore since one of the side effects of using pot is that it makes you not care anymore. So I know you don't care. So what's the point. I hope Josh learns to care before he throws his career away and tens of millions of dollars for a "harmless" drug.
You can't fix stupid but you can destroy ignorance. When you destroy ignorance you remove the justifications for evil. If you want to destroy evil then educate our people. Hate is a tool of the stupid to deal with what they can't understand.
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The worst thing it did for me in my years of abusing pot, and believe me this is plenty bad enough, is that it made me very un-motivated. I'd make plans to do this or that which would directly improve my income or other quality of life and then get a buzz and blow-off my plan for another day. I'm very glad that's behind me.
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The hypocrisy in the NFL is so blatant it boggles the mind.
The owners are supposed to be held to a higher standard. Haslam buys his way out of a felony. A felony where a swat team from the FBI raided his business and seized his records. What's $93 million good for? A way out.
Irsay gets a DUI and is in possession of controlled substances also a felony. NFL has done nothing.
Haynesworth stomps a guy in the head after a play and gets five games.
Of course the Ray Rice suspension goes beyond absurd.
If what has been recently reported surrounding the Gordon case is accurate then by comparison he should not be suspended at all.
The fact that he has passed 70 tests along with the discrepancy between the tests leave more than reasonable doubt.
We are talking about millions of dollars for Gordon.
The other cases were clear cut and factual. In the cases involving Rice, and Haynesworth we are talking about violence against others that could have resulted in serious injury. In the case of Donte Stallworth it resulted in death.
If this was a case that went before a judge and jury. Gordon would get off scott free.
But this is the NFL. Goodell is the judge, jury, and hangman.
If the NFLPA has a backbone they should back Gordon and draw a line in the sand.
The NFL has been handing out opiate based pain killers like jellybeans for years. Cortisone shots (which is a steroid) is dispensed like potato chips.
It is easy to overact to Gordon. Because of the history involved. However, when you really look at it seems minor by comparison.
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http://deadspin.com/how-do-other-notable-nfl-suspensions-compare-with-ray-r-1610186053Quote:
How Do Other Notable NFL Suspensions Compare With Ray Rice's?
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How Do Other Notable NFL Suspensions Compare With Ray Rice's?
With news coming down that Ray Rice will be suspended a mere two games for knocking out his wife and then dragging her unconscious body out of an elevator, we figured it would be constructive to look back at the length and severity of other notable NFL suspensions from the past.
Life
May 15, 1989: Bengals fullback Stanley Wilson banned from the NFL for life for cocaine abuse. Wilson had previously been suspended for the entirety of the 1985 and 1987 seasons for testing positive for cocaine.
Indefinite
Aug. 26, 2007: Falcons quarterback Michael Vick suspended indefinitely after pleading guilty to his involvement in a dog-fighting ring. Vick served 19 months in prison, and was later reinstated by Roger Goodell in July 2009. In the end, he was effectively suspended for just two games.
Full season
May 17, 2007: Titans cornerback Adam Jones suspended a season for various violations of the league's personal conduct policy. He'd had numerous run-ins with police, the most serious stemming from his presence at a club shooting that left one man paralyzed. Roger Goodell wrote a letter to Jones detailing the suspension. Part of it read as follows:
Your conduct has brought embarrassment and ridicule upon yourself, your club, and the NFL, and has damaged the reputation of players throughout the league. You have put in jeopardy an otherwise promising NFL career, and have risked both your own safety and the safety of others through your off-field actions. In each of these respects, you have engaged in conduct detrimental to the NFL and failed to live up to the standards expected of NFL players. Taken as a whole, this conduct warrants significant sanction.
Aug. 13, 2009: Browns wide receiver Donté Stallworth suspended an entire season after pleading guilty to a DUI manslaughter charge. Stallworth had hit and killed a pedestrian while driving under the influence, and served 30 days in prison.
May 2, 2012: Saints linebacker Jonathan Vilma suspended for a full season for his participation in the Saints' bounty program. Vilma wound up playing in 11 games during the 2012 season, though, as his suspension was eventually overturned.
Drug-related suspensions (various lengths)
Since Roger Goodell took over as NFL comissioner in 2006, over 70 players have also been suspended for violating the league's substance abuse policies. Some of these suspensions were due to positive tests for performance enhancing drugs, while others came from positive tests for "drugs of abuse" such as marijuana.
Most recently, Colts wide receiver LaVon Brazill and Chiefs offensive lineman Rokevious Watkins were suspended four games each for testing positive for "drugs of abuse." Cardinals linebacker Daryl Washington was suspended for the entire 2014 season after testing positive for drugs for a second time.
In November of last year Jaguars wide receiver Justin Blackmon was suspended for the final eight games of the season after violating the league's substance abuse policy for a second time. Browns wide receiver Josh Gordon is still facing a potential season-long ban for smoking marijuana.
Eight games
May 17, 2007: Bengals wide receiver Chris Henry suspended eight games, also for violations of the league's personal conduct policy. Henry had previously been suspended two games for testing positive for marijuana, and had been arrested on weapons charges, driving under the influence, and serving alcohol to minors leading up to his eight-game suspension.
June 5, 2007: Bears defensive tackle Tank Johnson suspended eight games for possessing six unregistered firearms and violating his probation from a previous gun charge.
May 2, 2012: Former saints defensive tackle Anthony Hargrove was suspended for his participation in the Saints' bounty program. Despite his suspension eventually being overturned, Hargrove didn't play a game in 2012.
Six games
April 21, 2010: Steelers quarterback Ben Roethlisberger suspended six games (later reduced to four) after being accused of sexually assaulting a 20-year-old woman. The charges were later dropped, but Goodell justified the suspension in a letter to Roethlisberger:
The Personal Conduct Policy makes clear that I may impose discipline "even where the conduct does not result in conviction of a crime' as, for example, where the conduct 'imposes inherent danger to the safety and well being of another person."
Five games
Oct. 2, 2006: Titans defensive tackle Albert Haynesworth suspended five games for stomping on Cowboys center Andre Gurode's head after Gurode's helmet had fallen off during a play. Gurode required 30 stitches, and commissioner Roger Goodell proclaimed that there was "absolutely no place in the game, or anywhere else, for the inexcusable action that occurred in yesterday's Titans-Cowboys game," when handing down the suspension.
Aug. 18, 2011: Former Ohio State quarterback Terrelle Pryor suspended five games for receiving impermissible benefits while playing at Ohio State. Pryor had not yet been drafted into the NFL when this suspension was handed down.
Four games
Dec. 3, 2008: Giants wide receiver Plaxico Burress suspended four games for accidentally shooting himself in the leg at a night club.
May 2, 2012: Saints defensive end Will Smith suspended four games for his participation in the Saints' bounty program. He was able to play in all 16 games that season, however, because his suspension was eventually overturned.
Three games
July 1, 2010: Chargers wide receiver Vincent Jackson suspended three games for violating the league's personal conduct policy. Jackson was suspended after his second DUI arrest in three years.
Sept. 23, 2011: Bengals running back Cedric Benson suspended three games (later reduced to one) after being arrested on misdemeanor assault charges stemming from his involvement in a bar fight.
May 2, 2012: Former Saints linebacker Scott Fujita suspended three games for his involvement in the Saints' bounty program. His suspension was eventually overturned, but he only played in the first four games of the season before getting injured.
Aug. 20, 2012: Free agent cornerback Aaron Berry suspended three games after being arrested twice in one month. He was first arrested for allegedly pointing a gun at three people in a parking lot, and later for driving while under the influence.
Two games
Nov. 26, 1986: Packers defensive end Charles Martin suspended two games for body-slamming quarterback Jim McMahon in a game. At the time, it was the most serious suspension that then-commissioner Pete Rozelle had ever handed down. Here's how that hit looked:
How Do Other Notable NFL Suspensions Compare With Ray Rice's?
Nov. 24, 2011: Detroit Lions defensive tackle Ndamukong Suh suspended two games after stomping on Green Bay Packers lineman Evan Dietrich-Smith's arm.
Oct. 21, 2013: Washington safety Brandon Meriweather suspended two games (later reduced to one) for making too many head-to-head hits in games.
July 24, 2014: Ravens running back Ray Rice suspended two games after knocking out his wife and dragging her out of an elevator.
And this, from our friends at Sports on Earth, is a good illustration of what kinds of offenses get the biggest suspensions:
How Do Other Notable NFL Suspensions Compare With Ray Rice's?
#gmstrong
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Just a note dude.. I don't smoke pot. I don't think teenagers should smoke pot. I don't think teenagers should drink, I don't think they should take ritalin, drink caffeine, smoke cigarettes, and probably shouldn't take anti-depressants. You shouldn't mess with a developing brain unless you know exactly what you're doing. The scientist - is cannabis really that bad I don't think pot is a bigger deal than alcohol for most people. I personally think people shouldn't take any mind altering substances. I understand these two beliefs are not commonly combined.
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The problem w/taking this report as gospel is that we don't know who the source is.
No offense, but man .... everyone took the ESPN, anonymous source, report as gospel ......
Including you. You have all but convicted the kid of every possible drug offense there is
All of that is because of one unnamed source. One unknown source is OK, but a different unknown source is not?
I mean .. that is a rather ironic statement. 
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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.. the immunoassay test .. why no one is talking about that?
First I've heard this. Where is this info coming from?
First I have too.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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afterall, the league set the date of appeal.
Interesting that they set a date on which Goodell had a previous commitment and couldn't be there. Of course, I imagine he has commitments nearly every hour of every day so it's not like he's sitting around doing nothing every other day but Aug 1.
What I do find interesting and a bit frustrating is that the final say on punishment is Goodell's and since he won't be at the hearing he can't pass judgement until after the Aug 1 meeting. So Gordon, the team and the fans still won't know anything until a later time.
This is where I am also. I don't understand how they can have an appeal hearing if the judge/jury/executioner is not in attendance. Who will be there to hear the appeal? Will they be speaking to a glorified receptionist who will take notes and then update Goodell later on that weekend or the following week? Or has Goodell already made his decision and this appeal hearing is an obligatory thing that has to be done to justify/satisfy the CBA and the player's rights? Very frustrating!
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JMO, but just because the face-to-face is happening Friday, don't think there aren't other moving parts happening as we speak. I think it's pretty much nothing but a formality, this Friday gathering.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
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Quote:
Very frustrating!
What's frustrating to me is the fact that there was even 16ng of THC in Gordon's urine to begin with. I don't buy the "contact buzz". I work in an industry that does random drug screens and I know for a fact that the "contact buzz" excuse is pretty much laughed at by any employer that I know.
Basically if you were sitting in a car with closed windows while people were consistently smoking for two hours that you got a contact buzz and enough THC in your system to get popped for the test then that is your own damn fault.
IF the NFL wants Gordon out there then they will find a way to reduce his sentence. If they don't then Gordon has only himself to blame.
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Quote:
Quote:
Very frustrating!
What's frustrating to me is the fact that there was even 16ng of THC in Gordon's urine to begin with. I don't buy the "contact buzz". I work in an industry that does random drug screens and I know for a fact that the "contact buzz" excuse is pretty much laughed at by any employer that I know.
Basically if you were sitting in a car with closed windows while people were consistently smoking for two hours that you got a contact buzz and enough THC in your system to get popped for the test then that is your own damn fault.
IF the NFL wants Gordon out there then they will find a way to reduce his sentence. If they don't then Gordon has only himself to blame.
You're comparing applse to oranges. Let me post this again.
Quote:
"For air traffic controllers, it's three-times higher," Schaffer said. "For WADA (World Anti-Doping Agency), the cutoff level is 175 -- that's for Olympic athletes -- which is over 10 times greater than what we deal with. People who are landing planes can be at 50 nanograms, but an NFL player hurting on Sunday night are at 15? For personal use in your home? I don't get it. I've tried to push the union to raise the threshold for a long time, and I've tried to push the league office to push the threshold higher. I've advocated for this for over a decade. "To me it's a win-win situation -- not suspending your best players for doing something everyone else is doing. If you're that worried about Josh Gordon, get him help. Don't penalize him. And if teams are worried that pot makes players less aggressive, then, hey, that player will eventually get cut if that's the case. But the way this policy is put together now doesn't make sense anyone."
Typical employers laugh off the "contact buzz" excuse because they test at like 100-300 nanograms. Gordon had 15? Wouldn't have tested positive in that case.
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Very frustrating!
What's frustrating to me is the fact that there was even 16ng of THC in Gordon's urine to begin with. I don't buy the "contact buzz". I work in an industry that does random drug screens and I know for a fact that the "contact buzz" excuse is pretty much laughed at by any employer that I know.
Basically if you were sitting in a car with closed windows while people were consistently smoking for two hours that you got a contact buzz and enough THC in your system to get popped for the test then that is your own damn fault.
IF the NFL wants Gordon out there then they will find a way to reduce his sentence. If they don't then Gordon has only himself to blame.
You're comparing applse to oranges. Let me post this again.
Quote:
"For air traffic controllers, it's three-times higher," Schaffer said. "For WADA (World Anti-Doping Agency), the cutoff level is 175 -- that's for Olympic athletes -- which is over 10 times greater than what we deal with. People who are landing planes can be at 50 nanograms, but an NFL player hurting on Sunday night are at 15? For personal use in your home? I don't get it. I've tried to push the union to raise the threshold for a long time, and I've tried to push the league office to push the threshold higher. I've advocated for this for over a decade. "To me it's a win-win situation -- not suspending your best players for doing something everyone else is doing. If you're that worried about Josh Gordon, get him help. Don't penalize him. And if teams are worried that pot makes players less aggressive, then, hey, that player will eventually get cut if that's the case. But the way this policy is put together now doesn't make sense anyone."
Typical employers laugh off the "contact buzz" excuse because they test at like 100-300 nanograms. Gordon had 15? Wouldn't have tested positive in that case.
Even at 15ng the contact buzz is a laughable defense.
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I don't necessarily disagree with you about him knowing better but I also know it's not that hard to trigger that test from second hand smoke. You can walk into a party heavy with it and in 30 minutes be toast.
Josh might just be uninformed enough to not have known driving all over the country with his friend who obviously was smoking in his car would mess him up. I mean he has probably done it several time and not had a problem with those other 70 tests. You never know his friend might of had an especially strong bag this time around.
Even with second hand pot smoke your judgement can become impaired after a short while so he quickly would stop caring about it.
To me the 15 standard is too strict anyways and I HATE pot. It should be 50 like the other sports have it.
You can't fix stupid but you can destroy ignorance. When you destroy ignorance you remove the justifications for evil. If you want to destroy evil then educate our people. Hate is a tool of the stupid to deal with what they can't understand.
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Legend
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Legend
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OK, let's look at this though .....
Gordon was arrested for DUI, while in a car described as being similar to a Cheech and Chng mobile. Even if he did not smoke it himself, how much would get into his system if he drove his friends around like that for an hour or 2?
I truly don't know ...... but it seems like it is at least feasible that such an event could trigger a false positive .... to some extent anyway.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
OK, let's look at this though .....
Gordon was arrested for DUI, while in a car described as being similar to a Cheech and Chng mobile. Even if he did not smoke it himself, how much would get into his system if he drove his friends around like that for an hour or 2?
I truly don't know ...... but it seems like it is at least feasible that such an event could trigger a false positive .... to some extent anyway.
As I said before, if you were sitting in a car filled to the brim with smoke then it's his own doing. 15ng is a small amount but to register that concentration it tells me he took a hit or two.
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I have read a lot about whether Gordon's "transgression" is worse than other substance abusers, or Ray Rice knocking out his fiancé but still can't get past 2 main issues.
Is this all not supposed to be "confidential"? I would be so tempted to sue the league for violation of my rights to privacy unless the team let it slip.
My other issue is if it is confidential and we are relying on anonymous sources, how can so many of you posters be so confident in how things will work out? People in high positions need to shut their mouths.
I think of all the issues I had with the Banner Lombardi team, this PO'd me the most. There were constant rumors flying from our team mismanagement. I am not saying it was JB or ML, but someone had really loose lips.
It has been nearly 3 months since this confidential information was "announced" and it is ridiculous. I would like to see some repercussions for this behavior..
Also, this is not to justify what JG did or did not do, and if it is worse than Ray Rice, Vick , STalllworth etc.
Juts my 2 cents.
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Quote:
Even at 15ng the contact buzz is a laughable defense.
At 50ng, like normal drug tests, yes it's a laughable defense.
At 15ng, it's not a laughable defense. There have been many studies that have shown second hand smoke can leave the amounts of THC that were found in Gordon's system.
Do I believe it was second hand smoke? No.
But, it does stand a very good chance at holding up and overturning his suspension.
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Typical employers laugh off the "contact buzz" excuse because they test at like 100-300 nanograms.
I just asked our human resource lady (explained to her the context of why I was asking first.  ) She said we test to two different levels. Pre-Employment is tested to 50ng/ml. Our Random Screens and Post Accident Screens are tested to 15ng/ml.
She said that the Random/Post screens are tested to higher levels to counter flushing and diluting agents.
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Legend
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the good news for me is that even with his problems, I am very confident now that Gordon has not smoked weed or eat Brownies, whatever...since coming into the NFL. He has passed too many consecutive drug tests. He did have Script for the Cough medicine. Not over the counter. He owned up to that.
This time there was no doubt in my mind that this was due to contact smoke of Weed. I said so prior and now it is revealed that was this case and is being fought as so. Just too low a result for smoking and I thought it was obvious it was contact smoke.
Now I am a little disappointed in him letting smoking going on around him. His friends just aren't friends if they do so in his presence. He should insist...NO! Sorry not in my CAR! I'll stop by the Park if you have to. At a party/get together. Please respect me and take that weed to another room. If not I have to leave. In this area I'm disappointed. But now I am confident that he has kicked the weed. Does not have an existing problem...he just needs better friends! If he didn't do what he did in college and in his first test into the NFL...He wouldn't have this problem. But since he has been a Brown. He's been Good!
Jmho...the facts do show this even with the Failed Tests and all!
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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I don't buy that, how is he stage 3 if he never had a positive test?
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Legend
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I have no idea what you are talking about other than to shift the blame on me in some lame attempt at thinking that makes Gordon the "poor victim."
The attitudes of the majority of posters on this situation is beyond disappointing. Keep deluding yourselves and who knows..........pretty soon he'll be anointed for sainthood. A modern day Joan of Arc.
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~ Legend
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~ Legend
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People who have problems during college can enter the NFL in stage 1. I assume with Gordon being kicked off of two teams and entering the supplemental draft that he was already in the first part.
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I don't buy that, how is he stage 3 if he never had a positive test?
He entered the league in stage 1 already. He did get caught his rookie year. He has been clean since except for taking cough medicine without realizing he was doing something wrong.
He is getting tested 10 times a month. Has passed 70 consecutive tests or 7 months since the cough sryup. That is what Eotab is saying. Chances are he is not smoking himself anymore especially when he knows he is getting tested several times a week. I think he just didn't realize what a danger his friend's pot was putting him in. I bet that wont happen anymore either.
Just a young man making mistakes and learning from them. I don't see it as him purposely trying to self destruct. though I do worry about the speeding and possible problem with drinking too much.
You can't fix stupid but you can destroy ignorance. When you destroy ignorance you remove the justifications for evil. If you want to destroy evil then educate our people. Hate is a tool of the stupid to deal with what they can't understand.
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Legend
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I don't buy that, how is he stage 3 if he never had a positive test?
For a smart guy..you don't get it?
He came in with a strike cause of his history, several have. He failed a test more than likely at a medical thing for his Draft thing which is different than the combine test I guess but I'm sure they give him one...I believe he failed.
Since then - he seems to be clean. Unless you just don't believe that he has tested negative for 70 tests and last off season (winter I believe) tested for codeine. And now this one which again I thought was obvious due to the count and for the fact he hadn't failed a Weed test since his first failure, that this was from Contact smoke.
What we are all to believe that we will/can die from Cancer + many other ailments due to contact smoke from cigarettes but Weed slips and slides a Humans system from contact smoke.
I never stated that he didn't fail a test. Obvious he failed 3 since coming to the NFL. The last two however were in the Midst of 70 tests that he was good! It also was stated after the above failed test he had taken and passed. I'm stating that he doesn't have a Weed Problem. I was struggling how one would actually SMOKE WEED with all that in risk and full knowing that you are taking a test every couple of weeks. It baffled me cause I knew a lot of POT HEADS (what we called them back in the day) and not a one that I knew had a problem stopping COLD TURKEY when the time came! We are talking wake up and the first thing they do is light one up Pot Heads.
That was my problem with Gordon...as in how could blatantly choose Weed over Football. Now I feel confident he hasn't and that he hasn't smoked in probably two years. If you choose to feel otherwise go right ahead. But don't suggest I'm stupid for doing so cause I know what I know and am confident it is that way.
Just face it...the kid might be a fool - not checking with the NFL on a prescription Cough Medicine. For hanging with so called friends who were smoking soon before a test he was going to take! Fool? yeah he has to make better decisions!
Uncontrollable Pot Head? Nah I think he's kicked it no problems at all - like the many I knew before him.
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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