DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Dansby: Gilbert "Has To Look in the Mirror"

I am glad that we have a veteran leader, a real leader, who is willing to stand up and call out a guy who is under-performing. Hopefully Gilbert takes him up on his offer to mentor him, and teach him how to be a professional.

Karlos Dansby on struggling rookie Justin Gilbert, 'he has to look in the mirror': Cleveland Browns Insider | cleveland.com
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ss...t_story_package

BEREA, Ohio – If embattled rookie Justin Gilbert wants advice on how to make the proper transition to the NFL, one of the Browns' locker-room leaders is willing to help.

But inside linebacker Karlos Dansby made it clear the No. 8 overall pick needs to take the first step and become more motivated to succeed.

"I don't know if he can make the transition," Dansby said Monday in a conference call. "It has to be within him. He has to look in the mirror and do that himself. I can only give him the keys. I can't make him drive."

Gilbert's rocky first season reached a new low Sunday playing just 17 snaps in the 17-13 loss to the Panthers despite the fact Pro Bowl corner Joe Haden and K'Waun Williams missed the contest due to injury. Fourth-round pick Pierre Desir, who held his own against Kelvin Benjamin, has moved ahead of Gilbert on the depth chart.

After the game, coach Mike Pettine said Gilbert had a poor week of preparation and Desir merited the additional reps – a season-high 77. The coach also benched rookie Terrance West for a similar reason.

"Some of it was on the practice field," the coach said Monday regarding Gilbert and West. "Some of it was not. There was no violation of team rules. But that's just something that I consider family business. I'm not going to elaborate on it."

Many expected the Oklahoma State product to win the corner spot opposite Haden out of training camp. Instead, he's earned just 375 snaps – or 710 fewer than Buster Skrine. Gilbert has 29 tackles and one interception this season.

"It's tough man, it's tough," Dansby said. "It's not college. In college you have two or three years where you can play around. This is real life. Lot of people out here are fighting for jobs and fighting to feed their families. Justin is trying to make a transition and it's not easy, man, it's not easy. ... One of the hardest things to do at this level is be consistent.

"You'll have a guy come in and play two or three years and be out of the league and you'll never hear from him again. There are so many first-round picks that have done that. Second -ound picks that came in for two or three years because they couldn't make the transition and were out of the league."

Dansby, an 11-year veteran, said as a young player with the Cardinals he sought the counsel of veterans such as Emmitt Smith, Edgerrin James and Kurt Warner. The inside linebacker and Gilbert haven't spoken, Dansby said, but he would welcome the opportunity.

"Like I say, 'I'm an open book,'" Dansby said. "Everybody in there knows I'm an open book. ... I'm going to put it to him. He's got to search for that knowledge. I'm here. I'm here to give it to him, but he's got to want it. He's got to ask. I'm not going to just give it to him. No, you've got to go get it. If you want it, you've got to go get it, and that's just how I've always been."

Pettine said rookies such as Gilbert need to use team leaders as a resource and that words from coaches will "only take guys so far." Dansby believes Gilbert will evolve.

"I can't make the decision for him," he said. "He's a grown man. I have faith in him that he'll be able to get an understanding and make progress. That's all you want to see is a young guy like him make progress."

This is something that is often taken for granted when it comes to players or prospects.

After one year, the 2014 draft has yielded a #8 pick that can't see the field over UDFA's and converted safeties, a #22 pick that is the living embodiment of Yakety Sax, and a third rounder who has been repeatedly benched.

Not off to a good start.

Great pick Farmer.. an unmotivated project with no passion for the game. Who makes these picks..? Over and Over and Over. The fans could pick better than our GM's have these past years.. MADNESS !!!! I'm afraid I would end up like Jerry Jones and make the damn picks myself if this is what I would end up with...

Yeah I mean.. Look at this scouting report..



How dare we draft the Top Prospect at a position... Just silly..

I hope he takes this in the spirit it was hopefully offered and he agrees to follow in Dansby's footsteps. I love that guy more and more each day, despite his "lobester mash" or whatever it is...

I'm extremeley unhappy with this pick of Gilbert. I didn't like it when they made it,and now I want to puke about it. That's 2 first round picks the FO spent,with nothing to show for it this year. Teams can't do that...its just too costly. I can understand missing on a QB,it's a crapshoot,but not a overall #8 CB. You darn well better know he can play,or you'll be like Dallas with Claiborne. Cleveland could have had a sure thing in Mike Evans,and we wouldn't even be talking about Gordon's problems on the field right now. If this FO blows they're next 2 first rounders again,then they should be fired ASAP,with no questions asked.

So if you draft someone, and they are not immediately seen as a great pick..

Then that pick is a failure.. And will never be a good player..

So everyone should be fired a year after they make a "bad" pick?

So Lets look at the list of teams who will be firing their FOs this coming offseason..

Houston - #1 OVERALL PICK.. only played in 4 games! Terrible!
St Louis, Atlanta & Tennessee - All took OTs that cleary aren't as good as Joe Thomas.. What a waste!
Detroit - Eric Ebron? Are you kidding me? Who wants potential! We need production!
Chicago - Kyle Fuller had one good game! Then the defense fell apart!
New Orleans - Cooks couldn't even finish one year! What a waste!
Minnesota - Bridgewater couldn't even beat out Christian Ponder until he got hurt! And they traded up for that guy?! Crazy!

Wow.. that's a lot of people getting fired this year.. Good thing cause apparently we're ganna need a new FO soon..

[This post contains mild hyperbole]

How many years has Skrine been in the league? Honestly, this is his first year where I was happy with his production..

point is.. everyone progresses at their own rate.. Hopefully he'll have a chance this offseason to learn and evolve into a top corner.

#induetime

I guess people don't understand that rookies need to also learn how to properly prepare at the NFL level. This was year one, let's hope he learns.

"The fans could pick better than our GM's have these past years." No, they couldn't. For every "I told you so," there are a hundred failed "We gotta draft this guy" picks the fans woud have made. Drafting isn't easy, it's not a science, it's a gamble. These guys spends months of scouting and picking apart these players, we could never draft as well unless we made it our full-time jobs and had teams of people around us to help.

J/C

My gripe with Gilbert IS NOT the fact that he's struggled on the field ... that's basically expected and I understand the learning curve.

My problem is the fact that he doesn't seem to "get it" based on teammates/coaches comments and actions ... for Dansby and Pettine to even HINT at a lack of preparation/accountability/etc speaks VOLUMES

Obviously there is something going on with Gilbert other than a lack of NFL readiness

Nice post.

The pitchfork crew is alive and well.

Someone mentioned Claiborne and Dallas. They just won their division. How did they do that if Claiborne was a bust? Unbelievable.

Cincy just made the playoffs by beating Manning on primetime with Dalton and Marvin Lewis. What do they have that we don't?

Maybe this fanbase does deserve its misery.

j/c:

No way to sugar coat those comments from a very successful veteran. It clearly shows that Gilbert needs to step up.

However, I think we've seen better play from him as the season has gone on. Still, it's not #8 pick in the draft-type performance, and hopefully he reaches that level. I won't write him off just yet.

Rookies need to also learn how to properly prepare at the NFL level. This was year one, let's hope he learns.

I agree 100% ... it's a process to mature in all regards.

I just find the fact that they are publicly mentioning these issues to be a big red flag

Yeah, it's the fault of the fans.

Thus far, our first round picks are awful. They challenge the TRich and Weeden picks for as bad as it gets.

No one is calling for anyone to be fired, but sugar coating poor decisions and poor play is ignorant.

It's a huge indictment on Gilbert to be called out by Dansby and Pettine. The guy has sucked all year and I haven't seen progress.

But yeah, it's because of the fans.

Exactly what veteran leadership looks like. We will see what Gilbert is made of in how he responds to this type of " incentive".

Well hopefully Gilbert learns what he needs to. I look at it a bit different. We grabbed 3 corners iirc. Gilbert, Desir, and Williams. So far 2 look to be doing well.

So at the end of the day we hit on 2-3, and if Gilbert wakes up, then we did even better. At least first round picks don't cost what they used to. I'm not sure how much it matters anymore.

I don't get the love for DeSir. The guy gave up 6 first down completions last week against one of the worst passing teams in the entire NFL. He got beat out for playing time by several "nobodies" before that. He stunk in preseason.

I am not saying he can't turn it around, but thus far, he has stunk.

I mentioned Claiborne and Dallas. How did they win their division with him? I don't think you know about him then. Claiborne is one of the biggest busts ever at CB. That guy has never even made it through a camp in 4 years straight,and has a big fat total of 4 picks in that span...4!!! They even traded up to get him as the #6 overall pick. He's on IR and even left the team when informed he was being benched for Scandrick,but hey don't take my word for it...go over to the Dallas Forum and ask the guys what they think of Claiborne. Then get back to me on that.
( Sorry Rishuz.....I meant to reply to ThatGuy...still getting used to the new site set up )

No argument from me on any of that.

I'm just trying to tell the fans to chill. Give it time. Other than not finding a QB our biggest enemy has been turnover.

I did not like the Gilbert pick so I could take the course of action like many on here do and use this article as a springboard to say I told you so, but thats childish and shortsighted and speaks more to me taking joy in the fact that I was right instead of being bummed that I was right ...because at the end of the day I'm still a fan right?

You've got many on this board and other boards and those who are calling into talk shows who want Pettine and Farmer fired. It's beyond idiotic. It will be beyond idiotic if it happens next year. The only way we are going to get better is to find the QB and have some continuity for once. And it would be nice for that QB to step into a stable situation.

Thank you for making my point.

No ones giving love to Desir. Stop getting dramatic. Geesh.

Based on how he had played in preseason....which was completely clueless....he showed a lot of improvement yesterday. What's wrong with pointing that out?

I agree that it is idiotic for fans to be calling for Farmer and Pettine to be fired. In fact, I agree w/you 100% on that.

I guess my issue is that some guys seem to be off-limits around here. Gilbert has stunk despite more opportunities than Manziel, yet gets almost no criticism.

A guy like Mingo gets ripped unmercifully while Gilbert does not.

Phil Taylor is rarely criticized despite being a huge disappointment.

Gordon is revered as some sort of god around here despite being suspended multiple times and playing poorly this year.

Heck, Hoyer was brought in here for a dime and he gets beat up by many.

Just seems odd to me.

Check out the Post Game comments in the Game Day thread.

I don't think anyone is off limits but perhaps one of the reasons Gilbert doesn't get talked about too much is because his absence hasn't hurt the team. Skrine and Williams have been very good this year.

I hated the pick. Still do. Farmer being cute instead of taking the best player.

how thrilled would we be if we would have gotten Buffalo's 1st Rounder AND Odell Beckham Jr?

Some of'em do deserve their misery.
The rest of us don't deserve their misery.

I think this is really one of the biggest differences between college and the pros. In college lots of excellent athletes can get by on pure athletic dominance and perhaps prep and technique can be shorted a little (or a lot). That just won't fly in the pros. I'm fond of telling the guys I train with that if you want to go elite the first thing you need to practice is practice. Get good at training.

When I play the "if I were GM" game that we all love to play I like to say that one of the things I'd develop immediately is some kind of diagnostic test for prospects to gauge their mentality and emotional maturity. Does this kid have the desire or even the ability to sit and study film? To repeat drills ad nauseum? Does he have an irrational belief and need to prove they can beat out similarly athletically blessed players? When he gets knocked down a peg or three for the first time in his athletic life how will he respond? In short, will this dog hunt? They ALL say they are that guy and their college coaches will attest to their work ethic etc but it's a common bait & switch. They might even really believe they're that guy. But In the back of their minds they think they'll still be able to dominate, maybe just a little less and then the day arrives they discover the margin is nil in the nfl. How does that kid respond? So far Gilbert seems to have wilted.

Clearly Dansby is calling him out, and clearly year one was overwhelming for the rookie. Also, it is clearly too early to call him a bust. He has talent and he's a good person, he now needs to reach deep inside himself and decide that he is going to be a difference maker in the NFL. If he is willing to do that, chance are he will become one. He has flashed and I'm certainly not writing him off at this point.

Its not? Didn't they call and try to bring them in for that look? Did the pull the names from a hat?

To borrow a little bit of what you just said...all players are "brought in to look at"

Gilbert was the first guy we wanted to "look at"
Then "Manziel"

These are guys that "looked" good. The 'looked' like they would be stars.

And then you said "if they make it, its on them, nobody else" You could say the same for Gilbert and Manziel, no?

You can't have it both ways...this organization brought in the draft picks and the rookie fa's.

Some are looking good....some aren't looking good yet.
some look like crap, that may change, or it may not.

I don't get how you can say what you did. All you are doing is increasing your 'chances' by picking a guy in the first round.

It is certainly troubling that 3 of the Browns first 4 picks have serious work ethic concerns.

I am not so much concerned with Gilbert's play on the field at this moment, as I am his apparent unwillingness to put in the work. I believe Haden even commented on it earlier in the year.

Pettine has benched West twice this year and Gilbert is getting benched basically for any CB that puts on a uniform. Manziel, admittedly, didn't prepare as hard knowing he was the back-up. Clearly, Pettine's message is not getting through to these guys. Next year, will tell more of the story. Good to see guys like Dansby take a leadership role and hold guys accountable.

Pettine wanted guys that weren't afraid to bloody their nose a little bit, let's start with guys that are actually interested in dedicating themselves to their profession first.

Whatever method Farmer and company use to evaluate the character and passion for football during draft evaluations needs retooled.

Sorry bonefish I was trying to quote one line... Can't figure it out... duh lol.


As far as drafting... I see us in the bottom trying to work up..