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Rookie Shaw excited about chance to start for Browns

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/rookie-shaw-excited-chance-start-browns-191828242--nfl.html

By TOM WITHERS (AP Sports Writer)
December 24, 2014 5:45 PM
AP - Sports

BEREA, Ohio (AP) -- Connor Shaw played for his dad in high school and ran South Carolina's offense under the ultra-demanding Steve Spurrier in college. If that won't toughen a guy's skin, nothing will.

Raised in a football family, Shaw knew when he was 5 years old that all he ever wanted to do was be an NFL starting quarterback.

The undrafted rookie may get his shot on Sunday.

With Johnny Manziel done for the season with a hamstring injury and Brian Hoyer still unable to throw because of a sore shoulder and biceps, Shaw will likely make his starting debut when the Browns (7-8) conclude another disappointing season this week against the Baltimore Ravens.

For Shaw, it's a dream come true, the chance to show he belongs.

''I'm really excited about it,'' he said. ''It's been a long season.''

And a long journey for the former Gamecocks star, who went 27-5 as a starter in the SEC, but then was invited for just one visit to an NFL team before May's draft. He wasn't selected, but signed in May.

During training camp, he was an outsider in the quarterback battle between Hoyer and Manziel. But the 6-foot-1, 210-pound Shaw showed enough during the preseason - he went 8 of 9 for 123 yards and a touchdown against Washington - that the Browns decided to keep him on their practice squad. He was around in case of emergency - and he's needed.

Shaw doesn't have much time to get ready for the Ravens, who can still earn a playoff spot with a win and loss or tie by San Diego, or with a tie and a San Diego loss. But Browns coach Mike Pettine believes the 23-year-old Shaw, who threw 23 touchdown passes and just one interception as a senior, will produce even on short notice.

''You just look at him, and does he pass the eye-ball test? No,'' Pettine said. ''He doesn't have the strongest arm, and he's not the fastest. He's not the biggest, but he just found a way. He's just got something about him.''

That's always been the case for Shaw, who likened his college game to Manziel's. He's mobile, can run for a first down when needed, but don't expect him to flash any ''money'' signs if he scores.

''I'm a tough, gritty guy,'' he said when asked to describe his playing style. ''I feel like I'm smart with the ball. We'll see. I haven't had a whole lot of reps in the NFL, especially live reps so we'll see how it plays out if I suit up.''

Shaw got his first snaps with Cleveland's offense Tuesday, and by all accounts showed he's spent the past few months studying. He wasn't out of place in the huddle or behind center.

''I was impressed,'' said tackle Joe Thomas, who was named to eighth straight Pro Bowl team. Thomas said he didn't know Shaw's background.

''I can't really remember taking any reps with him,'' Thomas said. ''But he stepped right in and hardly made any mistakes calling the plays.''

Although he was out of sight for much of the season, Shaw worked hard. He was behind Hoyer and Manziel on the depth chart but alongside on the ride.

''I was doing everything they were,'' he said. ''I was trying to stay as sharp as possible because you never know when you're going in.''

It's been quite a year for Shaw, who married his high school sweetheart, Molly. They recently welcomed a baby girl, Mila.

And now, his career might take a step forward, too.

''Hopefully we can cap it off with a win,'' he said.

NOTES: Pettine said ''there's no doubt in my mind'' that he and owner Jimmy Haslam share the same vision for the team. ''I get together with Jimmy for a minimum of an hour every week. We are very much on the same page.'' ... Pettine said he was alarmed and encouraged to hear Manziel admit he didn't take his job seriously enough this season. ''It's rare that you have a rookie like a Joel Bitonio, who comes in and it's seamless. Most rookies typically are shocked by the speed of the game, by the challenge that it brings, going from being a college student and football is a part-time thing where now it's to 9 to 5-plus. You might as well carry a briefcase.''

---

AP NFL websites: www.pro32.ap.org and www.twitter.com/AP-NFL



(end)

Sadly, it's already the last game of season... That went quick!

I hope Shaw kicks some serious butt for us, just like he did in preseason.

-GO BROWNS!

Oh yeah!!! Wouldn't that cloud the picture at QB for next season...

I know this has been beat to death however, the following two excerpts from this story clearly demonstrate how one rookie is mature and understands he has to earn his job and an immature rookie who thinks he entitled to the job:

Shaw



Manziel



If Shaw does come out and light it up against the Ravens, who are playing for all the marbles in this game, he should solidify a roster spot in front of Manziel going into next year. Maybe then Manziel will get the wake up call that this is why the NFL truly does stand for Not For Long.

Just my 2 cents worth.

Happy Holidays Everyone.

As always, Go Browns!

If Shaw kicks some and clearly outplays The Man-child then Shaw goes to two. The stench was bad after Jonny 1 and J2. I want a mature lunchbucket type at QB.

It is extremely hard for an UDFA player with poor size to make it even to the #2 spot on an NFL team. Maybe Shaw will be the huge exception, but I am not going to count on it.

I have a feeling that a lot of people are setting themselves up for massive disappointment with this kid. He might play "OK", but to expect him to come in and light things up, or to play so well that he cements the #2 spot next year is really unrealistic. It's really not going to happen. Maybe he puts himself in position to compete for a roster spot next year .... but that's really about the best he can hope for.

I have read that Foles is not the mobile kind of guy that Kelly wants in Philly. I wonder if he might be on our radar? I also do suspect that Sanchez could be a veteran we'll look at if Hoyer moves on. I think that Manziel will be #1-2, solidly, going into camp next year, unless we draft another QB high in the draft.

I believe any depth chart is fluid. It can change at any time depending on the play and effort by those on the depth chart. If Shaw were to play clearly better than Manziel has, I don't see why you wouldn't change the depth chart putting Shaw ahead of Manziel.

Now that doesn't mean that depth chart is set in stone or "cemented" as you mentioned. It could change at any time. But if you're not willing to change a depth chart based on the actual performance of the players, what incentive do players who are lower on the depth chart have to play hard.

Shouldn't hard work and producing better than others have some reward?

I don't care if this kid solidifies a spot next year or not, all I carr about is beating this team. They shouldn't exist. If Art Modell doesn't move the team that genius in New England would have done all that here (possibly) that he's done there.

How many Super Bowls might we have if Modell doesn't Fire Paul Brown?

Is that a Freudian slip?

I don't know if he'll light it up and end up in front of Manziel next year, but it should mean he's on the roster.

What I think it would spell is the end of Hoyer.. Too bad, I like Brian and really wanted him to succeed.

Against all odds, against all preconceived notions of what makes an NFL QB, wouldn't it be nice to have a starter come out of nowhere! Little to no chance that Shaw will do that, but it would be nice.

What will probably happen is that we will be crushed.

J/C ..... but man, no offense, and not saying you particularly, but it seems like we are still stuck in "abused fan syndrome" ..... where if a player looks even remotely competent for one game, then he's gotta be the starter, and if he plays well .....

Well, Brian Hoyer.

I get caught up in it as well. We are missing that great QB, so we are desperate for anyone who might fill that role, and Lord help them if they struggle for a game or 2 to start their careers. If a 1st round pick isn't immediately a star, then he's a bust. I mean, it's nuts.

We have to know for sure what we have in both Gilbert and Manziel, yet some are ready to write them off already. Maybe both guys will bust, maybe neither will, and we have to know for sure which is the case. 1st round picks are too important to a team's long term health to write off after a couple of bad games.

There is no doubt that Manziel has screwed up this year. It shows on the field, and when he speaks.

The real question is will Manziel know how to deal with adversity.

I remember when my children were growing up and my oldest daughter was doing awesome in school. She was getting good grades almost without trying. Then she hit a wall, and didn't know what to do. Her grades dropped, she started saying well i'm not good in this or that. She's still a smart kid, but she never got past that hurdle.

My second oldest daughter struggled, she had problems reading, she kept trying and trying though. I can't count how many times she would cry when i read with her, and helped. Well one day she got it. Her confidence soared, she knew with hard work and preparation that she could do it. She is in college today and getting good grades.

With one kid it always came easy, the other clawed to get it. In the face of adversity the latter will be more likely to succeed, she's been there, she knows what needs doing. She is humble.

The former face some adversity and you don't know what will happen. Time will tell with Manziel.

I honestly don't care who they start, just pick someone and let them learn. Manziel only has 7 quarters. Shaw will have 4 barring injury.

I'm not holding my breath, but I hope Shaw plays well. Manziel doesn't deserve to go into the offseason as the surefire starter.

Play the guy that wants it more, and stick with him.

Gilbert has at least shown SOMETHING on the field. If he gets his head right, he's go the physical tools to compete. I'm sure you know what I feel about Manziel in that department.



It was my understanding that his not getting drafted #1 was the adversity he needed to prove himself. Oh wait, no it was the fact that he didn't win the starting job out of pre-season. Or was it after his first start where he got embarrased on national TV? I'm not saying that I had it all figured out at 22 but no one ever came close to making as many excuses for me as he's received, with little, if nothing to show in return except assurances that NOW he "get's it".

There are no assurances with Manziel. That is the only certainty. However, let's say that he has started the final 5 games, and been ..... OK. There would still be no assurances. I am hugely worried that he has not been a student of the game, because that seems to be one trait that many great players seem to share. (even above talent) However, let's face it. he wasn't a student of the game in college. The game came easily to him.

It did not come easily to him in the pros .... so hopefully he learns from that. No guarantees though. Manziel was always going to be a huge risk, potentially huge reward kind of guy. Thus far he has not been worth the risk .... but it is his 1st year. We'll see how he does with a full off-season, and hopefully working on his craft all year round. It is too soon to give up on him completely though.

I'll just state the obvious that I was never "on" him to now give up on him at this point. I think you've hit the nail on the head and that's, that it's not only his physical skills that aren't translating, it's his work ethic as well.

I'm just saying that i think it probably came easy for Manziel. So here he is thinking he's got it, and he gets in a game and looks like crap. He's either going to get his crap together, or fail.

I don't know this kid, has he ever struggled prior to this in college?

wasn't at you 3rd. Didn't know that quick reply goes to the op.

And I fully expect that barring a complete melt down with Shaw, that Pettine will say just enough positive about Shaw to send a message to Johnny that he shouldn't be so sure that he's the starter.

I was hoping for Hoyer to finish the year and do that, but it didn't happen.

LSU shut him down pretty good.

He really isn't meant for the pro game. His skill set doesn't translate.

There was very low odds of him making it at the NFL level. His attitude and penchant for being a jackass put those odds even lower.

We're just now starting to see how poor of a gamble it was. Manziel was the type of prospect you take in the third round, at the highest. He had no business being considered in the first. But the hype machine doesn't infect just the fans.

There was always going to be a steep hill for him to climb...I don't think he realized how steep.

I'll admit i don't watch college football, so i looked after you said that and found this

Link

So i certainly see your point. I can't believe that he was drafted if someone didn't think his skillset would translate. They saw something, so i'm not sure thats fair.

I certainly think most qb's have a low success rate in the NFL, so this isn't anything new.

I just don't think you can judge a guy after one year, let alone 7 quarters. He did however look like like crap.

And i do agree that i don't think he realized what is involved. I can't think that most rookies do. We'll know soon enough.

I'm excited to see him play... can't be much worse, if any, than what we have been use to...

What you note in hindsight is true, so I agree with it. But mayybe CS got short shrift and shuffled aside without showing whatever stuff he has. Now is the time to know. If he is a baller that beats out the other two, I am not going to sell him short or write him off without at least some day in court.

I like the attitude, the work ethic, and package. I can stomach a loss though I hate it with a kid who games his butt off trying to win. Not correcting you or arguing. Hope he gets a fair shake and all the support we can. Win one, baby.

I'm not following, but I'll take a guess at my misspelling of care for carr? No,Mir wasn't a slip, it was a genuine typo, even with a biv screen on my phone typos still happen. :-)

Yep.

...But it's always nice to think positively (wishful thinking/denial?) before that may happen, isn't it?

I am not trying to crush your optimism, but Ken Dorsey was reported to be one of the hardest workers on the team, who studied almost constantly, as well.

Those with marginal skills have to work 3 or 4 times harder just to get to the NFL. I am not saying that he cannot make it ..... just that it is extremely unlikely that he will be much more than a 3rd string/possible #2 QB.

I would love to be wrong ..... but I just don't see it. Small QBs with weak arms and questionable arm strength, (and who had the weakest throws of any of the QBs at the combine, failing to break 50 MPH on any of his throws) typically would be expected to struggle in the NFL. He can probably play dink and dunk, but if that is all he can do, sooner or later defenses will take away those throws. Maybe he gets away with it for a game or 2. Maybe he can win this weekend. I am not going to hold my breath though.

I truthfully had no idea who this #54 even was, where he came from or his first name. It only took a few plays for that to change. He was all over the place. He was good against the run. He was effective rushing and showed some decent explosion off the line.

He will be someone I'll be tuned in often and watching. This could make the thought of resigning Jabaal a tough one if he's wanting a lot of $.

From Wiki:



Impressive for sure.

I especially like him coming of the bench while sick and having a banged up knee to bring the gamecocks back for the win against Missouri.. Tough kid

Will it translate to the NFL?

Hope so, but I'm not counting on it. Lots of young men come out of college with impressive stats, few actually make it to the NFL, even fewer are exceptional at the next level.

Odds are not in his favor.. still, I'll be rooting for him.

I always hope that the next guy to take a snap for the Browns turns out to be the guy who will be good enough to win the Super Bowl ..... even if it is highly unlikely for a particular guy to ever have a chance at doing so. However, I don't count on us finding the next Tom Brady or Kurt Warner ...... but who knows? Maybe we'll get lucky. I am not going to hold my breath though.

Seriously pulling for this guy. I have family in SCAR and they absolutely love him (they're even more Clemson fans than SC).

I don't think he can win the job with one start or anything, but I think he can at least throw his name in the hat with a good game.

If they would have started Thigpen, I wouldn't watch. That's mailing it in for me. Putting Shaw out there says they are gonna give a young guy a shot. I'm like all of you guys, I don't bail on my team, but I would have bailed on tomorrow's game. Either way, I can't wait to close the book on this year. What a shame the whole thing was.

I wonder how excited he is now that Gordon has been suspended.

I don't remember the comments the fans were making back with Tom Brady was suddenly thrust into the mix.. I expect they had negative feelings about the potential of an UDFA as well..

And you mentioned Kurt Warner,, That's another one that St. Louis fans probably said,, OH NO, we're done LOL

Funny how it can work out.

No, I don't expect that in this case.. but I can hope....

I had a 3rd round grade on Shaw and loved his upside. I felt his vision was very underrated but physically his body needed time to mature. He doesnt have a weak arm but he doesnt have a strong arm either. I thought he was the perfect QB to groom for long term potential.

He was the most composed QB we had in preseason and the most accurate. Once his body gets to 225 range, he could be a legit NFL QB.

He had the worst ball speed of any QB at the combine. That would seem to indicate that he does, indeed, have a weak arm. He threw a ton of short passes, with only moderate velocity from the highlights I have seen, and he really needs to wind up for the middle to deeper passes.

Do you think that he has the frame to add another 15#? He is 6'1" and 210 now. That is a fairly significant amount of weight to add to a player at a position where flexibility is probably as important as overall muscle. He doesn't appear to have a large frame.

I have seen so many of these guys who do their best to do everything right, but simply do not have an NFL arm. Ken Dorsey, mentally, probably could have been a successful NFL QB, if he had anything even remotely resembling an NFL body, or an NFL arm. Unfortunately, his arm was so far below NFL par .... and all of his positives couldn't come close to overcoming his major weakness. Do you really think that Shaw can?

Shouldnt be to hard to add 15. Getting him on a proper diet is the key. College, these kids really have no idea what proper diet is. The money they get for meal rations covers a happy meal. The NFL knows how to bulk while maintaining flexibility.

Improving mechanics, develop a stronger core and legs and he can really improve velocity. With all that said, he is a project and you never really know if there is more to the kid but I think he has the frame to bulk without it being all that noticeable. Which I am sure by now that he is much stronger than he was back in preseason.

I disagree with the whole "the money they get for meals........" statement.

Ever hear of a "training table"? At least at Bowling Green, food is no problem. That is the only college I can speak of with certainty, but trust me, food isn't an issue. They have plenty of it, at all times. Even at tiny BG, a guy I went to h.s. with went from 6'6", 225 lbs to 6'6", 315 pounds.

As he explained it - the trainers and nutritionists told him "eat. We'll turn it into muscle - you just eat."

Yet I look at a guy like Russell Wilson, and how much weight has he put on since turning pro? He was 204 at the combine, and he is now listed at 206.

Crowell is a couple of inches shorter, and 225#. He appears to have a larger frame. Look at his legs and the size of his arms. A guy like Shaw is unlikely to be able to get that big and ever hope to be effective. He might be able to improve his core strength to a degree, and maybe marginally improve his arm ..... but I just can't see him adding a bunch of weight.

I think that someone posted Shaw's scouting report on this thread. Compare that to the scouting report for a guy like Russell Wilson.

Big difference between his and Shaw's. In fact, Shaw seems to be the anti-Wilson, except for a shorter stature. I have serious doubts as to all of the shortcomings he has can be overcome to the degree that he becomes a solid NFL starter.

I would love to be wrong, and have us luck into a plus level starter .... but like I said .... I'm not going to count on it.

Here is Wilson's scouting report, by the way. Notice that many of the things you say Shaw can develop are already strengths for Wilson. His only real downside was size.

NFL Events: Combine Player Profiles - Russell Wilson
http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/russell-wilson?id=2532975

OVERVIEW
Wilson is this year's big-time question mark at quarterback. Unlike those who have held this title in the past, Wilson is a stellar passer who shows arm strength and accuracy when he is able to deliver the ball without a hitch. A transfer from North Carolina St. over the summer, he has outstanding football intelligence as he picked up the Wisconsin offense in a short time and was the opening-day starter. However, at his height teams will have concerns whether or not he can see to make the throws at the next level. He is a mechanical mover who has strong technique and leadership qualities. If Wilson were three inches taller there would be debate at the top of the draft as to where he fits in, but look for teams to take a flier on him in late rounds to see if he can develop and outplay his size.

ANALYSIS

STRENGTHS Wilson is an accurate passer. He is a very mechanical quarterback who is consistent in his drop step and thoroughly understands how to move within the pocket and evade when the pocket collapses. He is an athlete and can torque his body to make any sort of throw on the run, and is accurate in this setting. He is a born signal caller who shows command of the offense. He has the arm strength to make the deep throws and the touch to put it on a receiver in stride. He is effective when scrambling and is a classic play extender.

WEAKNESSES Wilson's height will be his biggest inhibitor at the next level and the largest reason for his late-round value. It remains to be seen if he can throw effectively from the pocket at the next level.

If he goes to #2 then who is #1? Hoyer will be gone, so who is our starter? Johnny? Or are we hoping to pick up a FA?

He's taller than Johnny. He can either sling it or he can't. I'm actually looking forward to seeing if he's got an NFL arm and brain.

The Browns clearly need to re-sign Hoyer. When you look at the list of available FA QBs ... there's just no one better. The leverage pendulum between Hoyer and the Browns has swung several times this season, and right now its back in Hoyer's direction.

There are mid-round prospects better than Hoyer in the draft. We don't have to re-sign him at all.