|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,205
Legend
|
OP
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,205 |
The 10 Great Mysteries of the 2014 Browns SeasonJan 02, 2015 By Tony Grossi, ESPNCleveland.com One of my responsibilities as chronicler of the 100 Years War is to recount at the conclusion of each Browns season the issues that shaped the past year. More times than not, these issues are without logical answers and thus qualify as great mysteries. I am sure that every NFL team’s season contains a set of mysteries that defy reasonable explanation. I don’t imagine, however, that any NFL team has more unanswered mysteries than a typical Browns season. And so, here they are – the unexplainable, head-scratching mysteries of the 2014 Browns season. 10. What happened to Ahtyba Rubin? Mike Pettine said early on that no tackle had better skills for his system than Rubin. Pettine returned Rubin to his natural nose tackle position and bumped Phil Taylor to end. Rubin proceeded to have his least productive season since his rookie year in 2008. The easy answer is that Rubin was bothered by ankle injuries throughout the year. There were whispers that Rubin had something going on in his personal life affecting his season – a relationship turned sour. It drove home the reality that players are people, too. The sad thing is Rubin’s poor year came with his contract running out. Wouldn’t surprise me if Rubin leaves in free agency to rejoin former Browns coach Romeo Crennel with the Houston Texans. 9. Why did Ray Farmer give up so quickly on Charles Johnson? Johnson was the receiver the Browns poached off the Green Bay practice squad in 2013. He showed up with a torn ACL, causing the Banner-Lombardi Browns further ridicule, and his 2013 season was shut down after surgery. After eight months of dedicated rehab, Johnson was active in training camp, but clearly not up to full speed. In need of receivers, the Browns declined to save a spot on the regular roster for the 6-2, 215-pound Johnson. He was re-signed to the practice squad. In Week 3, the Minnesota Vikings poached Johnson from the Browns’ practice squad. By December, Johnson surpassed Cordarrelle Patterson as Teddy Bridgewater’s No. 1 receiver. He finished third on the team with 31 receptions for 475 yards and two touchdowns. 8. Why didn’t the Browns throw more to their backs? Of 274 completions by the Browns’ quarterbacks, only 32 went to their backs. Terrence West led the backs with 11 receptions; Isaiah Crowell had nine. The simple explanation is the rookie backs didn’t know how to release into pass routes after their initial blocks. But there was little enthusiasm to throw to the backs when veteran Ben Tate was the starter. He had only nine receptions. Every time I asked coordinator Kyle Shanahan about this, his answer was the same: “We want to throw to our backs.” OK, fine. 7. Why did Justin Gilbert never get the chance to return kicks? I spent half the season explaining to fans that Gilbert did not return punts after his freshman year at Oklahoma State, only kickoffs. Still, how hard is it to teach a professional football player to field a punt and run with the ball? OK, we know that the disciplines of punt and kickoff returns are different. So why not utilize Gilbert’s skills as a kickoff returner – he had six touchdown returns at Oklahoma State – as a means of getting the enigmatic rookie incorporated into the speed of the pro game? I understand that early on, Pettine wanted Gilbert totally focused on learning the cornerback position. But after seeing Gilbert run with an interception in the Indianapolis game – his lone defensive play of the year – it became obvious that the coaches totally blew the chance to exploit a potentially dangerous returner. What if Arizona had done the same with Patrick Peterson as a rookie? 6. What pile of dung did Josh Gordon fall in during his 10-game suspension? Instead of returning from his self-induced, 10-game suspension for failing another marijuana test – his fifth as an NFL player – committed to repay the Browns, Gordon came back as a pouty malcontent seemingly determined to undermine the goals of the team. Somehow during his suspension, Gordon transformed from quiet, humble, unassuming, immature, emerging star into a paranoid, self-entitled, spoiled, diva wannabe who didn’t know the plays. This did not reflect well on the Browns’ new director of player programs, Jamil Northcutt, whose No. 1 priority, it would seem, was to babysit Gordon during his suspension and bring him back in the proper frame of mind. 5. Why did Pettine create a quarterback controversy? Some believe the season turning point occurred when Pettine opened the door to a quarterback change after the Atlanta game. Brian Hoyer had laid an egg against Houston the week before and sputtered in Atlanta before pulling out a win with a final drive to go to 7-4. Pettine had a chance to set the agenda when questions arose about Hoyer’s job security. Instead of staying true to his convictions and declaring that Hoyer would remain the starter through thick and thin, Pettine succumbed to pressure inside the Browns’ building and opened the possibility of Hoyer losing the job. Hoyer’s play descended and two weeks later he was demoted. The Browns didn’t win another game. 4. Why was Hoyer so unloved inside the building? According to sources, some coaches considered Hoyer a “know-it-all.” Outside of the coaches, Hoyer was never embraced once Johnny Manziel was drafted. It’s almost as if the owner, his inner circle and Farmer's football operations held it against Hoyer for being better than they expected and winning longer than they anticipated, thereby forestalling Manziel’s debut on the field. The disrespect Hoyer received was palpable. 3. What did the Browns have against Josh Cribbs? If ever there were a perfect match of a popular player rejoining his former team for one last go-round to fill a short-term need, it was Cribbs and the Browns. Yet the Browns were obstinate in refusing to let it happen. Farmer probably thought Cribbs was a pulled hamstring waiting to happen and was trying to latch on for an easy pay day. How wrong. Yes, Cribbs looked slow, old and out of shape when he arrived for his third game with the Colts on Dec. 7. But in six games with Indianapolis, Cribbs averaged 32.0 yards on 19 kick returns and 6.6 on 19 punt returns. Cribbs’ 125 yards on punt returns were two fewer than Travis Benjamin had all year. 2. Who was responsible for drafting Manziel? Quarterbacks coach Dowell Loggains, the point man in the Browns’ scouting of college quarterbacks, said in his infamous radio interview in May that when he took the Browns’ job he knew “that our owner liked Johnny a lot.” On draft night, Loggains relayed Manziel's seductive texts and said owner Jimmy Haslam ultimately gave the instruction, “Alright, pull the trigger, we’re trading up to go get this guy.” Nowhere in Loggains’ recounting of that night did he indicate Farmer made the call. Yet that became the team’s narrative. In his post-season press conference, Farmer disputed Loggains’ account, but did not take accountability for drafting Manziel. 1. Who was responsible for starting Manziel in the second Cincinnati game – the biggest game of the year? The only explanation from Pettine was that Hoyer’s descending play left him no choice. All week, Pettine and other coaches said they had no idea how Manziel would respond in his first NFL start. Reports later surfaced that Manziel had a bad week of practice. Only the team and coaches knew this, of course. He proceeded to have arguably the worst debut of any Browns quarterback in history. This was a case of the organization failing its team and its fans. It put a player on the field in the most important position wholly unprepared for the biggest game of the season. http://espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&action=blog&r=17&post_id=40971
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 2,657
Dawg Talker
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 2,657 |
The 10 Great Mysteries of the 2014 Browns Season1. Who was responsible for starting Manziel in the second Cincinnati game – the biggest game of the year? The only explanation from Pettine was that Hoyer’s descending play left him no choice. All week, Pettine and other coaches said they had no idea how Manziel would respond in his first NFL start. Reports later surfaced that Manziel had a bad week of practice. Only the team and coaches knew this, of course. He proceeded to have arguably the worst debut of any Browns quarterback in history. This was a case of the organization failing its team and its fans. It put a player on the field in the most important position wholly unprepared for the biggest game of the season. http://espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&action=blog&r=17&post_id=40971 This is the one single item that I can't get over. This one decision has almost single-handedly changed the direction of the organization. I can't believe that JM showed anything in practice that would allow them to start him over Hoyer - Yes Hoyer was stinking up the joint, but we still were in games. If you let Hoyer go lose the Cincinnati game, then you bring out JM the next week and he plays badly - everyone says "well he was a rookie and a work in progress - aka Manning"...We won't forget the way we lost in the biggest game of the season needing a win...were we hoping for a miracle?? Not saying JM is the answer at all however imo the way we closed the season was the worst way possible... Question: Had Hoyer laid the egg on Cincinnati, then JM plays against Carolina, even if we lose, would the JM perception be different?
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." [Mark Twain]
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 |
4. Why was Hoyer so unloved inside the building?
According to sources, some coaches considered Hoyer a “know-it-all.” Outside of the coaches, Hoyer was never embraced once Johnny Manziel was drafted. It’s almost as if the owner, his inner circle and Farmer's football operations held it against Hoyer for being better than they expected and winning longer than they anticipated, thereby forestalling Manziel’s debut on the field. The disrespect Hoyer received was palpable. Wait.. they hate him because he won games? Makes sense....
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 13,810
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 13,810 |
1. Who was responsible for starting Manziel in the second Cincinnati game – the biggest game of the year?
Jimmy Haslam...
No doubt in my mind, that after seeing Manziel lead the Browns to a TD against the Bills prevent defense, after the game was out of reach for the Browns...the guy at the top wanted Manziel to start against Cinci.
Farmer has done an excellent job of covering Haslam's butt.
My fear going forward, that Haslam again putts his finger on the scales, pushing Hoyer out of the organization so his prize draft pick gets handed the starting job for 2015.
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,024
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,024 |
My fear is they let Hoyer walk and turn it over to someone like a Cousins or Sanchez.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 9,145
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 9,145 |
Cousins I wouldn't want. Sanchez, mebbe. He can't be all that bad, he did do well enough to get to two AFC title games.
But I would prefer Brian as the bridge to the next 'whoever', 'cause I certainly don't see 'whoever' coming out in this years draft.
WE DON'T NEED A QB BEFORE WE GET A LINE THAT CAN PROTECT HIM my two cents...
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 |
My fear is they let Hoyer walk and turn it over to someone like a Cousins or Sanchez. I honesty don't see that much between the 3. Hoyer has the advantage based on knowing the system, but so does Cousins. And he played well in it (I was at the Washington game he started) Sanchez has shown with a strong running game and good defense he can lead a team to wins.. How is that different than Hoyer?
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,551
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,551 |
10 Rubin will forever be what we want in a Brown but he sucked this year and I would be shocked if he returns.
9. Charles Johnson blah who cares.
8. I think both Crow and west are dual threat backs and as they mature within the scheme, it will be scary. I expect huge years from both next year with the OL returning to form.
7. Gilbert never earned the right to play. If you are sleeping in film sessions and late for meetings you just aint gonna get a lot of opportuity in this league.
6. Gordon was ticked that the team didnt kiss his ass while he was suspended. No one wanted to hang with me. well boo freaking hoo. You screwed your teammates over when you failed the drug test. Understand?
5. Pettine did not create a QB controversy. Hoyer's play did.
4. There was this love affair with the FO and Hoyer up until the report came out that Hoyer would not resign if Manziel remained. That rubbed people the wrong way and then the pouting when he was benched was the final straw.
3. Not bringing in Cribbs was a huge mistake by Farmer. It would have been a great PR move to bring back one of the Browns all time favorites and it would have filled a desperate need.
2. Loggains was not in the Browns War room, so his version of what happened isnt much better than mine or your version of what took place. I know Haslam loved Johnny but also felt Farmer did as well. At this point it doesnt matter. If Gilbert and Johnny dont work out it will be on Farmer's head. Not like he can fire Haslam lol
1. Pettine didnt want to start Manziel but it was our Hail Marry attempt to save the season. Our offense was a total disaster and Johnny had brought some magic against a Bills D that had Hoyer befuddled and his embarrassing performance against the Colts was just to much to take without trying something different.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,024
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,024 |
Cousins is awful.
The game against us was an anomoly.
I don't think Sanchez will have the fortitude it would take to be the QB of this team. He's a slumped shoulders Charlie Brown type. I don't think guys would rally around him.
Hoyer is by far the best of those three choices. And the continuity of keeping him cannot be understated.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 |
Cousins is awful.
The game against us was an anomoly.
I don't think Sanchez will have the fortitude it would take to be the QB of this team. He's a slumped shoulders Charlie Brown type. I don't think guys would rally around him.
Hoyer is by far the best of those three choices. And the continuity of keeping him cannot be understated. I don't really see any options beyond Hoyer that make me say "Yes do this" The only thing that really intrigues me is a trade for Glennon. But that's still a risk.
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,024
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,024 |
Why do so many people like Glennon on here?
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 9,433
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 9,433 |
Tony, I lost respect for you after your personal vendetta against Eric Mangini. Your Randy Lerner comments didn't help too much, either. I'm afraid to say you're just as awful as you used to be. Let's break some of this down. 7. Why did Justin Gilbert never get the chance to return kicks? Obviously lack of effort during practice played into this. This is why his playing time saw constant curtailing. Why did Ray Farmer give up so quickly on Charles Johnson? We had enough unknown WRs. Be happy that Gabriel and Hawkins turned out the way they did. Stop trying to create controversy for the sake of controversy. Why did Pettine create a quarterback controversy? Why did the media create a controversy?! Hoyer continued to show diminishing play over a span of five weeks. Arguably Gordon may have played into that. However, you would've done the same as a coach. Why was Hoyer so unloved inside the building? Unloved?! His teammates gushed about him. Ever Pettine did, too. I'm tired of this Hoyer persecution complex. Who was responsible for drafting Manziel? Jerry jones 2.0 made a Holmgren move and drafted him. Who was responsible for starting Manziel in the second Cincinnati game – the biggest game of the year? Pettine did. Hoyer wouldn't have won us that game. He was too rattled from prior weeks. The right call was made.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 |
You don't like young, 6'6 QBs that have shown talent?
I project him as a guy that can come in and run the offense we ran the first 10 weeks, and then eventually grow into more...
Is he perfect? No. Is any option?
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,024
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,024 |
I don't get all the hate for Grossi.
I think he does a good job on the radio as well when he calls into the various shows.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,024
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,024 |
You don't like young, 6'6 QBs that have shown talent?
I project him as a guy that can come in and run the offense we ran the first 10 weeks, and then eventually grow into more...
Is he perfect? No. Is any option? I think that was meant for me. I'm not judging him on his size but from watching him play.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465 |
10. What happened to Ahtyba Rubin? Your expectations were too high? Rubin was never a great NT. He was always serviceable, which was a great value coming out of the sixth round, but outside of 2009, where did he show impact that made you think his play would be a part of a top 10 'what went wrong?' list. 9. Why did Ray Farmer give up so quickly on Charles Johnson? Miles Austin, Travis Benjamin, Andrew Hawkins, Taylor Gabriel, Josh Gordon. Someone had to go. While it would have been nice to still have him in our back pocket, I can't really rue the day as far being a top ten reason why things went wrong. 8. Why didn't the Browns throw more to their backs? I recall reading quite a bit that a problem with our young RB's was a lack of focus when they weren't being handed the rock. Beyond that...we had plenty of open WR's downfield this year. The backs not getting the ball wasn't an issue as to why our offense wasn't effective. 7. Why did Justin Gilbert never get the chance to return kicks Because it's a dangerous position with little upside given rule changes, and by all accounts he was a lazy ass. 6. What pile of dung did Josh Gordon fall in during his 10-game suspension? Josh Gordon is an idiot. 5. Why did Pettine create a quarterback controversy? Pettine didn't create anything. Hoyer's play was atrocious. 4. Why was Hoyer so unloved inside the building? I don't know what went on behind the scenes, but he visibly unraveled during his slide. That said, I saw nothing but support from his players and coaches. 3. What did the Browns have against Josh Cribbs? I would've brought him back, but again...this is really one of the most pressing issues or mysteries this season? 2. Who was responsible for drafting Manziel? Any answer is a scary answer. If it was Farmer, then our current GM is responsible for the worst QB draft reach since Tim Tebow. Hard to put faith or trust in that. If it was Haslam, you have a meddling owner that can't be fired. 1. Who was responsible for starting Manziel in the second Cincinnati game – the biggest game of the year? Again...any answer is a scary one. I've never heard a coaching staff talk in a more defeated and disparaging tone about their starting QB than the week leading up to that game...'I don't know what to expect'...seriously? It was a panic move. To be fair, I thought this staff showed more restraint in that area than previous regimes, but a panic move, pure and simple.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,447
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,447 |
One way to beat the stacked box D is to utilize your RB's in the passing game .. Hello !
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 15,979
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 15,979 |
Why does it take so much time, for the Browns, to throw, a screen, pass.
I mean so many seconds after the ball is snapped for the pass to be thrown.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,387
Dawg Talker
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,387 |
My fear is they let Hoyer walk and turn it over to someone like a Cousins or Sanchez. If they get Sanchez, I might be done for good as a fan. I'd rather have Johnny start than butt fumbler.
Congratulations to our 2016 NBA Champion CLEVELAND CAVALIERS!!! Greatest comeback in sports history... Hail to the King!
The great QB guru and the Moneyball group: 1-15 Record of Criminal Haslam owned Browns: 20-60 (0.250)
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,024
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,024 |
I'd rather have Sanchez than Cousins but Hoyer over both.
None of the three options are all that attractive, but I'm holding out hope that Hoyer is not a finished book yet combined with the fact that he was only a year removed from an ACL.
We know the guys will play for him and that a contingent of the locker room respects him. He studies hard and will give his all. He's fairly smart with the football.
He was a bit of a crybaby, but I'm willing to overlook it for the positives I believe it will bring to have him back as the undisputed starter.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,419
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,419 |
One way to beat the stacked box D is to utilize your RB's in the passing game .. Hello ! The QB has to be willing to throw to the RB. It seemed like Hoyer rarely looked in the direction of the RBs. It could be that the reads never took him there, but that is hard to believe given that throwing to the RB is a staple of the WCO. In 2013, the Redskins threw to their backs almost 50 times. It was closer to 60 in 2012. in 2011 it was close to 90 times. We threw to our backs 29 times last year. I think that the decisions on the field may have played into that a great deal.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,711
Dawg Talker
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,711 |
I seem to remember us keeping our backs in for pass protection a ton. Passes out to the flat would have been awesome, but i don't think we were sending them all that much.
Attitude is everything....FEAR THE ELF!!!
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 2,657
Dawg Talker
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 2,657 |
One way to beat the stacked box D is to utilize your RB's in the passing game .. Hello ! The QB has to be willing to throw to the RB. It seemed like Hoyer rarely looked in the direction of the RBs. It could be that the reads never took him there, but that is hard to believe given that throwing to the RB is a staple of the WCO. In 2013, the Redskins threw to their backs almost 50 times. It was closer to 60 in 2012. in 2011 it was close to 90 times. We threw to our backs 29 times last year. I think that the decisions on the field may have played into that a great deal. Isn't the RB a 2nd/3rd option by default in the WCO?
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." [Mark Twain]
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 |
Once again, the Browns are a mess.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,551
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,551 |
I read the ask Mary Kay and thought u would enjoy this part I'd also draft the best quarterback the Browns can get. I'd make a pitch for Heisman Trophy winner Marcus Mariota, although it'll take a king's ransom to get him -- the No. 12, the No. 19, and next year's first-rounder. cleveland.com/browns
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 |
She--like most fans--is clueless.
Mariotta makes one read. He often sees less than half the field. Seriously, there are many throws when he is looking at one quarter of the field. That is pretty lame. JM was more advanced in that part of the game in college than MM is.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 12,635
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 12,635 |
I read the ask Mary Kay and thought u would enjoy this part I'd also draft the best quarterback the Browns can get. I'd make a pitch for Heisman Trophy winner Marcus Mariota, although it'll take a king's ransom to get him -- the No. 12, the No. 19, and next year's first-rounder. cleveland.com/browns That is a king's ransom. Not sure how I feel about that. I am sick of picking QB's in the first round as-is now anyway.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,551
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,551 |
I think if we want him he will be there at 12 anyway.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 |
We should have taken Teddy.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 9,433
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 9,433 |
You'd figure everyone would watch Draft Day and get a decent blueprint for a good path to success on draft day.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 12,635
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 12,635 |
I think if we want him he will be there at 12 anyway. Don't think he will make it by Tampa Bay which picks #1 overall. If he's there at #12, I say take him! I dislike the RGIII like-trade or as the delightful Mary Kay calls its "king's ransom" for him though. For any QB for that matter. We've not had much luck with our first round picks, especially at QB. We should have taken Teddy. I without a doubt and was on record during draft time that was who I wanted. Especially since he was there for the picking as' well. But nothing I could about it when the pick for JF came in. I've never seen a backup QB get so much attention, attention that he hasn't earned at all on this level. All JMO
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,991
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,991 |
[b]2. Who was responsible for drafting Manziel?[\b]
I don't care who, I just hope they learned their lesson.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,075
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,075 |
Once again, the Browns are a mess. ...according to Tony Grossi. Before taking that elevator to the roof, first consider the source. Know what I mean? 
"too many notes, not enough music-"
#GMStong
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,419
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,419 |
One way to beat the stacked box D is to utilize your RB's in the passing game .. Hello ! The QB has to be willing to throw to the RB. It seemed like Hoyer rarely looked in the direction of the RBs. It could be that the reads never took him there, but that is hard to believe given that throwing to the RB is a staple of the WCO. In 2013, the Redskins threw to their backs almost 50 times. It was closer to 60 in 2012. in 2011 it was close to 90 times. We threw to our backs 29 times last year. I think that the decisions on the field may have played into that a great deal. Isn't the RB a 2nd/3rd option by default in the WCO? In the traditional WCO, short passes to the RB often replace many of the run plays. Shanahan does actually run the ball, so that part is non-traditional when it comes to the WCO he runs. However, yes, in many cases in the WCO, the RB is either the 2nd or 3rd option. Often a RB will chip and release.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,064
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,064 |
Rooling tthe pocket, screens, swings, slants, seams, they all help to get people out of the box if you make them work. Serious weak spot IMO in prepping for next year. We run poorly enough at times. Needs addressed and given priority for the Baby Backs to blossom.
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,475
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,475 |
seeing Manziel lead the Browns to a TD against the Bills prevent defense,
Unfortunately Mac love your passion but why I can't take your posts seriously.
Please tell which of his Completions went to a WR wide open underneath the PREVENT COVERAGE...you know how prevent is to prevent a big play take time off the clock and leave WRs wide open underneath with so that they can get just 5-8 yards and get tackled with the clock moving? Just didn't happen. Possibly you had a point there...possibly not. But when you distort the facts it means all is distorted.
jmho
Last edited by eotab; 01/05/15 10:19 AM.
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off! Go Browns! CHRIST HAS RISEN! GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465 |
I think what Mac is trying to say is that the Bills defense wasn't really trying at that point, which was evident. Even Pettine had to admit one couldn't really draw any conclusions from it, as Buffalo was more or less coasting at that point.
As far as Haslam making the call to start Manziel for the Bengals game...maybe, maybe not. Pettine clearly favored Hoyer throughout the season, but down the stretch, Brian made it difficult not to turn to any other possible avenue.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850 |
man, Tony just likes to stir up stuff to stir up stuff. that reads like a conjecture post from guys on here. sad.
and, I think that many of us are letting the hindsight of how terrible Manziel looked against Cinci help us forget how terrible Hoyer was in the Indy game. Any offense, any at all in that game and we win. Hoyer was falling for weeks, but the Indy game was the last straw and I find it difficult to believe that any coach wouldn't bench a guy for the performance (along with those leading up to it).
and, once again we seem to have a DA v. Quinn QB-debate rather than a Rivers v. Brees one. someday, we'll find that QB. really, I think it might actually happen. sigh.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,693
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,693 |
down the stretch, Brian made it difficult not to turn to any other possible avenue.
^This. The game Hoyer played against the Colts made it virtually impossible to not start Manziel.
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/hfMNC7T.jpg) "I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,475
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,475 |
I think what Mac is trying to say is that the Bills defense wasn't really trying at that point, which was evident.
What football do you guys watch. Bills are fighting for their PLAYOFF Lives and you think they wouldn't really try with basically an entire qtr left (little over 12 minutes) It doesn't make sense. I didn't see any prevent out there. Now you say well it wasn't technically prevent but you have some special devise that measure's the HEART OF A TEAM...lol come on man, some things just aren't so. All be it one series...it was a good one. It was a simple one and it was executed well. I doesn't undo the next game and then some. But to say it doesn't exist and then paint it as a NONE positive conveniently by saying well it was against a Buffalo PREVENT D. And even worse well it was against a Buffolo's D that wasn't really trying. btw Tell that to Austin who went on the IR from the hit he took.
These guys were playing to win even with 12 minutes left.
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off! Go Browns! CHRIST HAS RISEN! GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
|
|
|
DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Grossi: The 10 Great Mysteries of
the 2014 Browns Season
|
|