DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2015 NFL Season The NFL Draft 2015 With the 12th and 19th pick in the 2015 draft CLEVELAND selects...

If we could those three picks off end of draft, I'd be very happy. Erving is probably one of the two best picks we could make on OL since our #1 need is depth/flexibility. Of course, OO is one of my favorite prospects. I think we could do better than Heeney in the spot. I don't know much about Nunez-Roches. My only concern with Shaw is his glaring lack of long speed. Otherwise he's a good player I think.

Whoa. Deja vu.

I would not be upset if the Browns took two first round OL if that's what they chose to do.

Frankly, I would trade back first, but I wouldn't be upset. I'd rather have more selections, even if we might lose some 'initial ability' in the process.

1. Oline
2. WR

No kidding. Nobody get's top Olinmen in later rounds. And the Brown's need more then just JT up front that's obvious.

Tell that to Aaron Donald.

Do you really think we only have JoeT that is good on the OL

Bucky Brooks (spelling) via NFL.com released his first mock draft either today or yesterday and his picks had me thrilled!

Danny Shelton DT/Washington & Jaelen Strong WR/Arizona State.

I would be happy with a 1st round like that.

It also came out today that the Eagles are looking to move up to get Mariota.

What if Cleveland calls them up and offers a 2nd, 4th and 6th round draft pick for Nick Foles? This then gives them extra ammo to move around in the draft.

The jist I am beginning to gather is... and pardon me, I'm not a college knowledge packed person outside OSU - but this Danny Shelton guy is just too beefy (pun intended) for other teams to pass up and won't be available at #12. Will it become wheel-n-deal Farmer again last it was last year, but on the aggressive side of the trade? We'll see!

Shelton is impressive though. I had to watch some YouTube but there isn't much else to say other than he's a freaking wrecking ball. Would love to have him.

And in terms of taking a WR in the first, I totally wouldn't be objected to that decision either!

If we could those three picks off end of draft, I'd be very happy. Erving is probably one of the two best picks we could make on OL since our #1 need is depth/flexibility. Of course, OO is one of my favorite prospects. I think we could do better than Heeney in the spot. I don't know much about Nunez-Roches. My only concern with Shaw is his glaring lack of long speed. Otherwise he's a good player I think. [/quote]

Nunez-Roches is a South Miss. Eagle. 6'2", 302. Tony Pauline got me interested in him on his Draft Insider site naming him on of his "Week Ten Risers"...

Rakeem Nunez-Roches/DT/Southern Mississippi: USM is in the midst of a two game losing streak yet Nunez-Roches has significantly raised his level of play. During Saturday’s loss to UTEP he led the team with 11 tackles including 3 for loss as well as 2 sacks and 1 blocked field goal. The prior week his numbers read 5 tackles with 2.5 for loss. Nunez-Roches looked like a promising prospect as a sophomore in 2012 before being sidelined with a knee injury last season. His play has steadily improved over the course of the year and he grades as a disruptive front line player to monitor.
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Its been hard finding much tape on the kid but what I've seen he is a penetrating DL but also will pursue ferociously inside out. I recall reading somewhere recently that if you're impressed with So. Miss alum Jamie Collins then Nunez-Roches has the potential to surpass him.

Heeney is a high effort player with pretty good LB instincts. He is limited physically but he has plenty of "want to". I think the ILB prospect pool is shallow this year. I'd be interested in who you like as a mid round prospect.

My favorite 3-4 ILBs in this draft are:

1) Paul Dawson, TCU
2) Bernardrick McKinney, Miss St
3) Stephone Anthony, Clemson
4) Eric Kendricks, UCLA
5) Jake Ryan, Michigan

Dawson and McKinney are likely to be top-50 picks, so I think it's unlikely we get one of them. Anthony I've seen a lot of different prognostications on... anywhere from 4th to 6th. But the guy can blitz, he can cover, and he fills holes with great speed. He's a very nice player. If he's there when we pick in the 4th I wouldn't hesitate to turn that card in. I like Kendricks but most think he'll go in the third and there are guys I like significantly more that I think we can get in the third. Ryan has just got awesome instincts. JMO.



As far as mid-late round NT prospects, Jester's got a doozy

OK, I have a feeling there is a joke in there somewhere but I searched his post and didn't see one that revealed his pick. Don't see that he posted in this thread so I looked mainly at the #1 QB thread, again I didn't see anything.

The suspense is killing me, let me in on it.

Nope. that's his guy. I'll let him call him out first when he wants to.

Thanks Steve, but feel free to share as if your own.

Terry Williams ECU

Excellent find Jester.

Guy has superb tape. Immovable, pushes the pocket with pure strength and extra effort on GL or short yd plays, even showed a surprise spin move once, eyes always on the ballcarrier while doing all of that. Good motor, follows the action.

Best NT I've seen so far, but there seems to be a character problem. He was suspended TWICE by the team. In 2012 because of Mary Jane (possession and selling) and then again last year (undisclosed). Well worth the risk on day 3 of this draft. He isn't on cbs top 1000 list, lol

If philly really wants to move up for Mariotta, I would be surprised if they gambled to the point of waiting for him to fall to 12. I imagine they move sooner once he falls a little. If he falls a little.

Updated mock for the Browns:

[1] 12) DeVante Parker, WR Louisville {16} [starter]
[1] 19) Cameron Erving, OL Florida State {26}
[2] 43) Markus Golden, OLB Missouri {48}
[3] 79) Grady Jarret, DL Clemson {99}
[4] 112ish) Stephone Anthony, ILB Clemson {170}
[4] 116ish) Terry Williams, NT East Carolina {--}
[5] 151ish) Antwan Goodley, WR Baylor {178}
[6] 189ish) Josh Robinson, RB Miss St {184}
[6] 202ish) Jemauria Rasco, OLB LSU {225}
[7] 227ish) Mitch Morse, OT Missouri {316}

2 OL, 2 WR, 2 OLB, 2 DL, 1 ILB, 1 RB


Go after UDFA CBs:
Donald Celiscar, Western Michigan {382}
Drequan Hoskey, Virginia {490}
Jimmy Jean, UAB {821}
Jamerson Love, Miss St {969}

if UDFA, QB:
Anthony Boone, Duke

UDFA WR:
Bud Sasser, Missouri
Andre Davis, South Florida
Anthony Johnson, West Texas A&M (yeah yeah... I know, I know)

if UDFA, C:
Dillon Day, Miss St
Max Garcia, Florida





Alternatively:

[1] 12) DeVante Parker, WR Louisville {16} [starter]
[1] 19) Owamagbe Odighizuwa, OLB UCLA {39}
[2] 43) Josue Matias, OG Florida State {76} [starter]
[3] 79) Grady Jarret, DL Clemson {99}
[4] 112ish) Stephone Anthony, ILB Clemson {170}
[4] 116ish) Terry Williams, NT East Carolina {--}
[5] 151ish) Antwan Goodley, WR Baylor {178}
[6] 189ish) Josh Robinson, RB Miss St {184}
[6] 202ish) Jemauria Rasco, OLB LSU {225}
[7] 227ish) Mitch Morse, OT Missouri {316}

2 OL, 2 WR, 2 OLB, 2 DL, 1 ILB, 1 RB

As far as ILB. I watched some Anthony and Taiwan Jones since you pimped them both. I have to say I like what I saw from Jones much better. Excellent mix of physicality and brains. Probably only a two down thumper, didn't jump out as blitzer or in coverage, but he'd be the perfect "platoon" ILB to rotate with Kirksey next to Dansby.

Neither Clemson prospect you like, Anthony and Jarrett, does much for me, but I'll watch more.

Speaking of deep sleepers: two guys that impressed me when I actually watched others (those finds are always "interesting"): watching NT Terry Williams, I was impressed with South Florida's center. Only OL I saw who could handle him. Smart guy knew he couldn't beat him with strength, so he used his brain. Sure enough, he is draft eligible, Austin Reiter is his name, he's currently 25th C on cbs and 794 overall. UDFA

Watching PJ Williams, I came away more impressed with his CB mate Ronald Darby, who too entered the draft as a JR. He's 127th on cbs. After "hitting" on EJ Gaines as the mid round sleeper to have last draft after watching him shut down Evans, I feel really confident to pimp guys who jump out on tape while watching others. J.Harrison, who started at C as an UDFA rook for the Colts, was another guy I remember from last draft.

I have never pimped Taiwan Jones. Not the current one, not the Eastern Washington one.

My bad Steve. I mixed him up with your 5th ILB from Michigan, Ryan.

Now go watch Taiwan Jones

I don't know the Clemson guys or the 6th and 7th rounders but otherwise I really like this draft.

Here is my question for you. Why DeVante Parker over Kevin White? Ihave been struggling with the decision of which to pick if both are available.

Parker has great hands and a longer track record.
White looks faster, has good not great hands.

Both seem to run good routes

What I like about White is how he is really aggressive going up after the ball. Parker seems to let the ball come to him. That had me leaning toward White over Parker.

"I see Mariota as the same negatives as Manziel just one year removed."
=====================================================

Please explain.

Walter Football in his first 4 round mock has us going..

12: Danny Shelton, NT Washington
19: TJ Clemmings, OT Pitt
43: Garrett Grayson, QB Colorado State
77: Ty Montgomery, WR Stanford
108: Ray Drew, DE/DT Georgia
112: Tyler Lockett, WR, Kansas State

I'm ganna be totally honest.. I hate that draft..

1. I don't think Shelton will be there at 12 anyways..
2. Unless Clemmings coming in can either play Guard (I don't think Schwartz can) then that is not a great improvement for the 19th pick..
3. And again, unless we think Grayson can come in DAY ONE and be the guy.. I'm not ready to take a QB in the 2nd round..

I would prefer, and I'm going to base this loosely off of Walt's mock, because I'd definately take OL Erving in the 2nd round, but he has him going late 1st (so i'll let that one go).. so I'll throw together..

12: Kevin White, WR, West Virginia
19: Eddie Goldman, DT, Florida State
43: Owamagbe Odighizuwa, DE/OLB, UCLA
77: Nick O'Leary, TE, Florida State
108: Max Garcia, C/G, Florida
112: Tony Lippett, WR, Michigan State

There's a bunch of different WR, DT, OLB combos you can do with those first 3 picks depending on who goes where and when.. That was just one I went with..

Clemmons is overrated and doesn't belong in the 1st round.

I am not sold on Grayson. I would consider him in the 3rd and definitely take a chance on him in the 4th but not the 2nd.

Not of fan of Montgomery either. But in the 4th I'd be okay with it.

I definitely like your draft much better.

I am okay with Goldman but prefer Malcom Brown DT Texas.

Yeah I agree with everything in Jester's post except for the Grayson thing.

about your question on White and Parker... I think either would be fine. Here are my thoughts on them.

I like both guys' size and run after catch ability. I think both should improve their route running.

It seems to me like Parker actually does a much better job high pointing the ball than White. White looks like he's putting a lot of effort into it, but if you look at where those balls are actually caught I believe Parker is more talented/natural in that area. If you look at the successes of rookie wideouts last season, a lot of their successes came in those situations... Evans, Benjamin, Hurns, Beckham... each one of those guys had multiple plays where they had to go downfield at high point. You can look at Matthews' red zone success the same way.

white is stronger and a better blocker, but I have some concerns about him. One thing is he sometimes places his hands in a weird way that makes his catches awkward. The other thing is outside the Bowl game, all his production in college came with one of the best passers in college football in Trickett while in a high powered offense like West Virginia. Parker's production actually increased on a per game level after one of the best college QBs of the past few years left his school. White's declined with Trickett out.

I'd be fine with either, but I think you know what you are getting better with Parker. I think he's more of a natural athlete than a high effort athlete. JMO.

I'll have to find time to go back and look at that high point thing. I remember thinking that White was aggressive going up getting the ball but I didn't notice where the ball was when he was catching it. Nothing stuck out to me as not being high pointed but then again I wasn't particularly paying attention to that.

I'd gladly take the two best run stoppers at 12 and 19. The run defense for this franchise has been an embarrassment for such a long time. Also, pursue Suh and Jason Pierre-Paul in free agency. Make offenses literally scared to run against this defense and immediately remove half of their gameplan every week.

I'd strongly consider Maxx Williams with Buffalos 1st.

RFA Tender:
Craig Robertson (UDFA -- 2nd Round tender)
Tashaun Gipson (UDFA -- 1st)
Johnson Bademosi (UDFA -- 2nd)
Ish Kitchen (UDFA -- 2nd)

Without re-signing any unrestricted free agents

[1] 12) Malcom Brown, DL Texas {22}
[1] 19) Josue Matias, OG Florida State {76 - lol yeah right}
[2] 43) Clive Walford, TE Miami {71}
[3] 79) Ladarius Gunter, CB Miami {131 - not a chance}
[4] 112ish) Stephone Anthony, ILB Clemson {193}
[4] 116ish) Terry Williams, NT East Carolina {--}
[5] 151ish) Josh Robinson, RB Miss St {184}
[6] 189ish) Jemauria Rasco, OLB LSU {225}
[6] 202ish) Bud Sasser, WR Missouri {374}
[7] 227ish) Mitch Morse, OT Missouri {311}


UDFA Targets:

WR Evan Spencer, Ohio State
WR Anthony Johnson, WTA&M
WR Andre Davis, South Florida

QB Anthony Boone, Duke

OLB Rashod Favors, Oklahoma

FS Adrian Amos, Penn State
FS Nick Perry, Alabama

K Jared Roberts, Colorado State
K Marvin Kloss, South Florida


1a. Malcom Brown is a top end run stuffer who gets off of blocks in the run game as well as any DL in the draft. He is also pretty quick for his size. We finished last in run defense again last year.

1b. Despite how some may choose to take it, this is not an endorsement of Schwartz/condemnation of Greco. I have followed Matias since his freshman year and this guy is an elite-level prospect at OG, especially in a ZBS (like our new OC has confirmed we will retain.) I was completely on board with the Bitonio pick in the 2nd as a player last year (he was my top choice of healthy players going into round 2, behind only banged-up Marqise Lee) but I am *more* excited about Matias. Quickest off the snap I have seen for an interior lineman, is a terrific pulling guard and actually finds people to block. He is clearly a better player than Tre Jackson, his teammate who is one of the top rated guards this year.

2. I recently watched the Nebraska/Miami game (yes, I still have games from September on my DVR) and Walford was a complete monster. He is a very natural catcher of the ball and showed at the Senior Bowl he is terrific at getting open. He is also a decent blocker (better than Cameron.)

3. IMO, Gunter is the guy Farmer and Pettine hoped they were getting in Gilbert and Desir, minus the return skills but with better tackling. He is long, has terrific press man skills, and swats passes. He's another guy I've had my eye on for a few seasons and he seems to just keep getting better. I do not see him lasting to our 4th.

4a. I think Anthony as a player is everything Kirksey is supposed to be good at but better. I watched Clemson play Georgia, Florida State, and Oklahoma to watch Jarrett and Beasley and Anthony kept standing out. The OK game he was out the first half IIRC for a targeting call in the previous game. Anthony is great in coverage as a LB, is fast, can hit, but best of all he fills holes immediately. There's a reason Clemson had the top defense in the NCAA this year and Anthony was a big part of it. It's not clear if he'll be available here, but if he is I'd like us to scoop him up as Dansby's eventual replacement. If he's not here I'd go ahead and take Williams now.

4b. Terry Williams, as discussed above, has tremendous movement skills for his size and is so powerful and disruptive. I disagree with Django's assessment that the USF C handled him, I think they just had him in for too many snaps. He needs more breaks. He came in to school as a 250 pound linebacker and now is a 340 pound dancing bear. He moves like a linebacker in short areas. I wouldn't risk letting a talent like his slip past this pick. If Anthony was gone and Williams was the other 4th, I'd look at who was still available at WR.

5. I think Robinson is a good runner with strength, vision, and receiving skills. He was a dominant player at Miss St and I think he adds an extra dimension our backfield is missing right now.

6a. Rasco is another super long and quick DE similar to Mingo with limited sack production (though he led the team in sacks each of the last two years) in LSU's scheme. He's a lot bulkier than Mingo, however, and this late his talent is well worth the pick IMO.

6b. I like Sasser a lot and he has been very productive with absolutely terrible quarterbacking at Missouri. He is big, he gets open, and he catches the ball.

7. Morse is a guy with multiple year starter experience at LT and RT in a productive offense in a difficult conference. He is athletic tackle who could serve initially as a backup swing tackle. He was invited to the Senior Bowl and turned down the invite. Savage listed him as one of the players who turned it down "the right way" whatever that means.


Offense: 23

QB: Hoyer, Manziel, Shaw/Boone (PS)
RB: West, Crowell, Robinson
FB: Winston
X: ** Gordon, Benjamin, Sasser
Z: Hawkins, Gabriel
TE: Walford, Dray, Barnidge
LT: Thomas, Morse
LG: Bitonio
C: Mack, Greco
RG: Matias, Painter
RT: Bowie, Schwartz


Defense: 27

DE: D. Bryant, M. Brown
NT: P. Taylor, T. Williams, I. Kitchen
DE: B. Winn, J. Hughes
LOLB: P. Kruger, J. Rasco
ROLB: *A. Bryant, B. Mingo, S. Solomon
SILB: K. Dansby, S. Anthony, T. Carder
WILB: C. Robertson, C. Kirksey
CB: J. Haden, P. Desir
CB: L. Gunter, J. Gilbert
Nickel: K. Williams, R. Nelson
FS: T. Gipson, J. Poyer
SS: D. Whitner, J. Bademosi


Specialists: 3

K: Roberts
P: Lanning
LS: Yount


* I think we should switch Armonty Bryant to OLB. I've thought he should be an OLB since we drafted him. He would help in our run defense because he can actually set the edge and is strong. He is also probably our best edge rusher. It makes too much sense to me to not do it. I have too many questions about the pass rushers in this year's draft to rely on one to make an impact, thought I think there are a few guys projected to go late who have potential to make an impact (Rasco, Wagenmann [Montana], Favors [Oklahoma]) who are at least worth a late rounder to try.

** I don't think Josh Gordon will be on the team next year. I also don't think we're going to just cut him. So until I know what we end up getting for him (player or pick if anything, etc.) I'm just going to leave him there on the 53.

I've been hoping for this starting lineup since 2013. We've had variations of it but never at the same time, consistently. That being said, if we can upgrade, fine.



I think it is certainly worth a serious look. Not sure about coverage skills but that is second to have another outside pass rusher to Kruger.

If Cameron is gone. I've been thinking the same thing.

Good job Steve. I have a lot of catching up to do on those prospects. Please open up more individual threads on those guys, even if it's just a c/p of what you've written in here. Makes easier to discuss every prospect on his own. Maybe we can create positional threads close to the draft when we have 100+ covered

As for Terry Williams vs the USF center. I didn't pimp Reiter to diss Williams. I'm on board with him, best NT in this class I've seen so far. Just observed that he did an admirable job against that mountain of a man

Do I think Mariota can be successful? Yes. But it will take time.

I compare him to a Ryan Tannehill, who looked ok for a while, and only played very well until this season..

If I'm picking one of the two main QBs, I'm picking Winston.

Yes he's had troubles. But (IMO) he can come in right away and be good. If he wasn't such a douche people would put him only below Luck in comparing recent College QBs.

If you put Winston (again this is IMO) on the Browns, i think you contender for the division immediately. Sort of like Ben's first year in Pitt (maybe not 15-1)

Mariota, at least, strikes me as someone that will have the maturity and work ethic to actually apply himself at the next level.

Manziel has very clearly demonstrated that he is not that guy.


That said, I don't want anything to do with either one.
If we're going to go with another project, make a smaller investment and take sure-fire picks with our first rounders.

Character and work ethic only get you so far. Tebow is unemployed.

That's ok Manziel will be unemployed this keeps up too.