DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns' Mess Starts with Haslem

JC

I was just watching a Seinfeld rerun... for some reason George's boss Mr. Kruger reminds me of Haslam... " eh I'm not too worried about it"

And contrary to want Lacanfora says there is no truth to the rumor that when asked about dysfunction Haslam was heard to say:

Dis Function
Dat Function
We all got our jobs to do and we just need to do them.

here's my expert opinion:

We suck.

LOL.

You guys are a trip. Last night it was a pretty epic battle of tit for tat. At various points I felt like I wanted to jump in and defend you. I think you certainly portray yourself as more "real" or "human" than PDR, even if your board persona is that of a raving lunatic.

You do realize that the world isn't as black and white as you make it, right? You like to make things black and white when it fits your agenda, I've noticed.

Shanny is completely innocent. Check.

Farmer is a complete bafoon. Check.

No way LaCanfora is embellishing. Check. I mean it's there in print. It must be true! As long as it fits your agenda.

webbagio

Bob Hunter commentary: Cleveland Browns are becoming the NFL's kings of comedy

By Bob Hunter
The Columbus Dispatch • Thursday February 5, 2015 9:16 PM
Comments: 0 0 2 18
The most intriguing moment in a Cleveland Browns offseason that resembles the Great Chicago Fire came when general manager Ray Farmer chastised Josh Gordon, one of club’s resident arsonists, saying he needs to make “substantial strides to live up to the positive culture we are trying to build this football team upon.”

Positive culture. Farmer really said that. Don’t you wonder if we haven’t somehow stumbled onto the set of a Mel Brooks movie? Seriously, is there an expression that describes the Browns any less than that one?

Farmer’s quote came in statement released Tuesday, the day the NFL suspended the receiver/slacker for a year for again violating the league’s substance-abuse policy. That was a day before it was reported that Farmer was under investigation for violating league rules by texting assistant coaches during games, and he might face a multigame suspension.

You can’t make this stuff up, and if you did, no one would believe it. The Browns aren’t good at football, but they have somehow managed to become the most interesting team in the NFL. For sheer entertainment value, the Browns are better than a warm fire and a good movie. They have turned incompetence into an art form.

When describing an offseason that is just five weeks old, it’s hard to know where to start because so many of the team’s current embarrassments have roots stretching into the 2014 season and beyond.

The big Johnny Manziel mistake started with the draft, festered through his months of partying and seemed to come to a head when he played two games and actually looked like a guy who had partied more than he had prepared.

Sent to the sideline because of an injured hamstring, Manziel couldn’t make it for treatment the day before the last game, and security had to be sent to his house to try to rouse him.

Gordon also missed work that day and reportedly partied at Manziel’s place; a couple of weeks ago, the Slacker Twins were photographed partying together in Aspen, Colo. Then, last week, Manziel checked himself in rehab, which is the closest thing to good news that the Browns have had.

In the meantime, offensive coordinator Kyle Shanahan talked his way out of the last two years of his contract and made a sideways move to Atlanta, presumably to get away from a) Manziel, and b) Farmer, who apparently was texting his play-call suggestions during games.

In his place, the Browns hired John DeFilippo, who has never called plays in the NFL. Kevin O’Connell, who has never coached in the NFL, will coach the quarterbacks next season, although at the moment, no one is sure who those quarterbacks are.

Brian Hoyer, the team’s most successful quarterback in the past decade, got shoved aside for Manziel and is now a free agent.

Jason La Canfora of CBSsports.com cited team sources who said it was owner Jimmy Haslam who wanted to draft Manziel to make a splash — even though the draft board had Derek Carr and Teddy Bridgewater ahead of him — and now Haslam is plotting to trade up and try to draft Oregon quarterback Marcus Mariota.

“Jimmy is way too hands-on,” the source said. “He’s like Jerry Jones, only without the football knowledge. There’s tension between (team president) Alec (Scheiner) and (coach Mike) Pettine. Everybody sees that. Alec is involved in everything; it’s too much for him. There are no divisions. The guys on the business side want to run football operations.

“The GM wants to coach the team and have input on play calling. Jimmy calls the shots, and everyone is afraid of him with that quick trigger finger. If you stand up to Jimmy, he’s done with you. Jimmy’s own worst enemy is Jimmy.”

Browns fans deserve much better, but sadly, that isn’t a new story. The only new element is that under Haslam, the Browns have found a way to become more entertaining.

It’s just too bad this is supposed to be professional football and not a situation comedy.

Bob Hunter is a sports columnist for The Dispatch.

I've seen nothing to make me doubt this.

OMG! Now we've got one journalist quoting another journalist. As someone said previously (Vers, I believe), if you say it enough times, it becomes the truth...

As usual, you put words in peoples mouths..

Just tossing this out there.

If the Browns are forced to give up a draft pick because it is concluded that Ray Farmer did text down to the sidelines, how many would be alright with Farmer being fired and the GM duties being handled by Mike Pettine with many Assistant GM duties being handed down to the team's top scout?

lets just get the homeless guy.

Becoming? I'm pretty sure we've held this title for some time now.

jc...

This is bizarre. At this point we all know there is dysfunction in Berea, as there is with every other team in the NFL. But has there ever been a bigger piling on job than this? Every time I come on here there's a new article about the same thing. It's like it's open season on the Browns and every one wants to take their shot. I find it disgusting and amusing at the same time.

To the crowd that is taking great joy in this, what is it that you want? How can you take your complaints and put them into action? Do you want Farmer fired? Do you want Haslam to sell the team? The posts I read on here paint a picture of no hope about those two guys. Are you thinking a petition? Letter to the NFL offices? Are you going to let your feet and wallet do the talking and not watch any more or buy a single thing related to the team?

Or does the action stop with just complaining over and over and over again and trying to get others to complain with you? And when others don't join in, will you continue to question their morals (one of all time favorites, Vers)? Is that where it stops? Because while that may be therapeutic for many, it's fairly unproductive. Take action. Turn those thoughts into action and make something happen.

At this point I find it odd that with all this piling on by the media that fans wouldn't start standing up for their team and its members. This is a full on attack of the team you love. With passion and emotion dripping off every complaint, there is enough emotional investment to draw the analogy that this is like a family member under attack. Would you walk away from a family member even if you knew they were wrong? It's one thing for you to punch your brother in the face, but Tommy down the street better never lay a hand on him.

I wouldn't be surprised with a few articles over the next few days that support the Browns, as a backlash to this piling on. I've never seen anything like this. It's like an article every two hours.

I'd have no problem if they fired Farmer depending on his reasons for texting. I'm overall still not convinced that they all just didn't like what they saw of the Offense and It would not surprise me to find out that there were questions about how shanny was handling things. maybe that's what caused the meddleing by Farmer. I don't know.

As for Pettine taking over as GM, no, I don't think the timing is right for that. he's a 1 year HC and hasn't cemented himself in that role yet. Adding to his duties seems like it wouldn't be a good idea.

Players, coaches and executives are little more than mercenaries in my eyes, with very few exceptions. I don't feel a need to support or protect them from criticism, especially when such criticism is more than warranted.

Didn't you post some blathering essay on here one time about how much the Browns mean to you?

Could you edit your above post and right underneath the post you just made put the essay again?

Actually, don't worry about it. I already know what you'll say. Your essay that you desparately wanted us all to read to show how much you love the team doesn't mean you still don't view them as anything other than mercenaries. It is the idea that you love, not the actual people that perpetuate the idea. Blah, blah, blah.

The piece was about the Browns community of fans, which have been here for the last fifteen years of this spectular misery, and will probably still be around for fifteen more.

The players, coaches and executives come and go, often in the proverbial blink of an eye. I really have no allegiance to them and certainly don't consider them 'family' in any capacity.

The family thing was an analogy. I'm sure no one feels the team is 'family'.

But people love this team. By your own admission they keep sticking around, no matter how much misery they bring. There are very few emotional attachments in this world that bring about that kind of loyalty - actual family being one.

And what's happening in the media right now feels unprecedented to me. It's like rapid fire. No one is claiming there aren't issues or there isn't dysfunction. But I seriously doubt anyone in the Browns organization deserves the venom that is being spewed, Haslam included. I'm sorry, it's not warranted. Not at this level. And I'm surprised more people aren't rallying around that. Well, maybe I'm not surprised.

We're a dysfunctional mess coming off another losing season where we spent high end assets on a cornerback so immature and lazy that his own teammates spit venom at him and a QB who may as well have had DO NOT DRAFT ME tattooed on his forehead. And to top all of that off, we're facing sanctions for rule violations.

I think they more than deserve the derision we're getting.

No, he's most definitely had ears in the building the last two years.

It would make me feel better about the org's structure if we could have a gag order in talking to him in place, but its either not been stated, or no ones listening.

But is it warranted? We have very few facts, but a ton of speculation, rumors, one side of a "story", etc, and a lot of it based on LaCanfora articles. When (if) the facts are made public, then we can change or refine our opinions as necessary. Until such can be proven, I remain unmoving...

honestly bro, i can't recall too many times when didn't have this kinda stuff happening that didn't turn out true.

we call them bozo's, but more often than not, they end up being right about our team.

every.

single.

time.

I'm not feeling the need to come to the team's rescue. My hope is the barrage of negative articles is getting the point across to Haslam and his band of fools to get their act together. I'm sure Haslam is embarrassed. No billionaire business man enjoys seeing his name dragged through the mud like his had been as of late.
Now we can only sit back and see how he responds. Does he double down with his heavy handed meddling to 'prove them all wrong' that he is a football guy and can draft talent? Or does he sit back and shut his yap at let the guys he's hired to do the job do the job?
I think we'll be learning an awful lot about our owner in the coming year. Is he Daniel Snyder 2.0 or has he learned his lesson?

I don't need the specifics of a LaCanfora article to see how dysfunctional this organization is.

We drafted and prematurely started an undersized redshirt sophomore with glaring character concerns who appeared far more interested in doing cocaine than learning how to play NFL football.

That right there is the mark of an incompetent and dysfunctional organization.

Our management does not seem to be on the same page, and,again, it doesn't take the specifics of a LaCanfora report to see it.

Is that a proven fact...or speculation?

http://www.silverandblackpride.com/2015/...oakland-raiders

Just when you think things couldn't get any worse for the Browns, they always seem to sink a little lower. I don't say this to pour any salt in the wounds of Browns fans. To the contrary, I feel their pain. I don't know how they manage to stay loyal through it all.

The funny thing is, the Browns looked like a real contender early this season. They even led their division at one time near midseason. Then the wheels came off and they tumbled out of playoff contention and back to the dumps.

When they were winning, it was their defense and some decent play from Brian Hoyer at quarterback. But all the while Hoyer was leading the team to wins, their first round pick Johnny Manziel was on the sideline waiting for his shot. In week 12, Hoyer threw 3 interceptions with no touchdowns but the Browns still won. Then over the next two weeks he threw 4 interceptions with no touchdowns and the Browns lost both games. This ushered in the Johnny Football era. But it was short lived.

Manziel came in week 15 and stunk it up in his first start. The following week he suffered a terrible knee injury and was out for the finale. The Browns sat at 7-4 after week 12, firmly in playoff contention. Then promptly lost their final five games to miss the playoffs.

Since then the Brown has really hit the fan.

In the past few days, the news out of Cleveland is of the most dysfunctional team possibly in all of sports. And that is even without the ongoing Federal fraud investigation currently underway into owner Jimmy Haslam's truck stop franchise, Pilot Flying J.

The team's elite wide receiver, Josh Gordon, failed an alcohol test which, because he had a DUI on his record, was a big no-no. He had already been suspended the first 10 games of last season for failing a previous drug test. Now with this latest failed test he is officially suspended for at least a year.

Also having serious alcohol problems is Manziel who checked himself into rehab recently. That in and of itself is a good thing. The fact that it came to this is not.

This is where Derek Carr comes in.

Browns GM Ray Farmer wanted to draft Derek Carr. According to CBS Sports, the Browns draft board had Derek Carr squarely atop it followed by Teddy Bridgewater and then Manziel. After surprising everyone by taking cornerback Justin Gilbert with their top pick, their second pick was at 22 overall and all three of their QB choices were on the board.

Even with Carr and Bridgewater as the top two players on their board, owner Jimmy Haslam stepped in and make the executive decision to take Manziel. Thus leaving Bridgewater for the Vikings to trade up and draft at 32 overall and Carr still on the board when the Raiders picked at 36 overall in the second round.

While the main crux of the issue in Cleveland is the meddling of Haslam, in this case it saved Derek Carr from joining the tire fire in Cleveland. Carr ended up starting all 16 games for the Raiders. Bridgewater had a pretty good season in Minnesota too.

Meanwhile in Cleveland, the news would get worse.

As it happens, both of the Browns first round picks were causing problems. Justin Gilbert was late constantly and is said to have not gotten along with his teammates. His lackadaisical attitude had him buried on the depth chart.

With all these issues swirling, offensive coordinator Kyle Shanahan wanted out of his contract after just one season with the team. In an odd twist of fate, replacing Shanahan as OC was Derek Carr's quarterbacks coach in Oakland, John DeFilippo.

One of the reasons Shanahan wanted out - one of a reported 32 reasons - was the team is under investigation for alleged illegal texting of playcalls by the GM to the sideline. If they are found to have committed the offense, they will receive some harsh penalties including loss of draft picks.

Though losing draft picks isn't the end of the world, especially considering they have not shown they know how to properly use them. And, ironically it's for that reason the Derek Carr was not subjected to that dumpster fire along with the very reason his former QB coach is now part of it.

Derek Carr is known for thanking God for just about everything. Well, add this one into those prayers.

Unbelievable low, getting truthful smack from raider fan. =(

J/C

Man, even Raiders writers get to call Cleveland a hot mess.

Speaking of Raiders,

If Marcus Mariota is still on the board at 4, I call Oakland and offer them both of our first rounders for Carr. They might say no... heck, they'll probably say no, but it wouldn't hurt to try.

Consider it akin to 'OJ Simpson killed two people'.

...and if the glove don't fit, you must acquit.

I don't see Oakland willing to part with the kid. They've finally drafted someone who has shown some potential and talent. Likely couldn't pry Carr away from them using the jaws of life!

If the QB's rolling bills, your chance to win is nil.

I think that would have sounded better if you went with ... if your QB is rolling a bill, your chance to win is nil.

Flows better, rhymes better.

I had read for months leading up to the draft that Carr was Farmer's number one guy. I was surprised when we drafted Manziel.

I'm convinced that the drafting of Manziel was nothing more than a PR move.

As the old saying goes, the best laid plans of owners and the homeless often go awry.

I agree 100%. Nothing like a few more $ for our crooked owner!

I would imagine in the end he loses money on Manziel

A few million I suppose but to a Billionaire, that's not a lot of money really. Would be for me however.

And I believe you made the same point I did, just a more long winded version of it.

You can editorialize an article to give it the worst possible slant. It seems we totally agree on that based on your post.

I believe what we may see differently is that no matter how it's editorialized, it doesn't change the facts. From Johnny Rehab to texts being sent to the sidelines, it's a mess. As I said earlier in a post, either Farmer was ignorant of the rule, or he intentionally broke the rule, neither is good.

I've watched over the season every possible excuse for JFF. How he's just a young man being a young man. How the pictures weren't indicative of anything. How it all meant nothing. I think JFF going to rehab is a good thing for him, not bad. But it obviously goes to show just how in denial many posters here are and how they have been about everything that led up to this.

I believe the same is true with the LaConfora article. I believe that Haslam interfered in the draft. That's a HUGE concern. I believe JFF was a HUGE reach given the other QB's on the board and has Haslams finger prints all over it.

I believe from many reports that Farmer did in fact text to the sidelines. Now if you don't feel that smells of dysfunction, then fine. If you somehow feel the messenger changes the facts of what happened, then fine. But as we've seen by the results, as much as we despise the way he presents his articles, more often than not, the facts he presents usually have some merit.

You seem to concentrate more on where the message comes from than the facts contained in the message. And just like with JFF ending up in rehab, for some to finally accept what's going on, the truth has to punch them in the face for them to realize it.