DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Farmer Responsible For Text To Sidelines: Browns Coud Lose Draft Picks

I am NOT rejecting it, but it is ONE report. Why are so many people acting like one report has more weight that all the other reports combined? Why aren't other reporters--or the Browns---verifying that report?

That report reportedly came out before Shanny left. Do you think it is possible that there was some news of the Shanny and Haslam meeting before the meeting actually happened? If so, can you make the connection that is where the report came from? And can you then deduce that when the facts came out, that report was not used again and reports that had more factual evidence were pursued?

I thought you were some master reader or something.

Who's blaming LaCanfora or Shanny for the Browns problems?

And is anyone, such as yourself, going to answer a question I've asked multiple times? What is it that you want? Do you want Farmer fired? Do you want Haslam to sell the team? Do you want Goodell to do a do over on last year's draft? What is it that you want exactly? I read a lot of complaining, but I don't know what the justice is you seek. I don't think it's fair to constantly gripe when its's not clear what it is that you want. It smells of complaining for the sake of complaining.

My thoughts on the article are these.

There is nothing new in the piece it is a comprehensive piece that puts all the tid bits we have all known about in a nice tidy pile, thats all it does. Any of us could have written it. The disturbing part for everyone I believe is to see it all put together.

Make no mistake Haslam runs all things Browns including play calling on Sunday which for me is the single most disturbing part.

Can I prove it? hell no, but Ray Farmer isn't the source of the texting, he is just another one of Haslam's fall guys. Bet the house in the not so distant future Farmer resigns that is if he has a set.

When Haslam was advocating accountability and basically fired Chud for not holding players accountable I agreed with the move. But you don't have to be a rocket scientist to see that accountability didn't extend to the entire roster. If you take that just a step further, I think Pet was pushed into how things were handled, again fueled by Haslam.

I mean how could JF and Gordon carry on the way they did? and not be protected, or treated like special cases. You simply cannot have that it creates all sorts of problems within the locker room. It is what I have been talking about going way back to the start of last season. The QB handling was simply the absolute worse I have ever seen and now I know why. Haslam

This is bad folks real bad, I sure hope Haslam has learned from his mistakes but somehow I don't think so. Can you imagine texting a coach during a game to call plays. Wow

Really? And what have I been preaching for the last while: don't take as "gospel" the rumors, innuendo, etc that is out there; wait for the FACTS to surface then change your position, or not, in accordance with those facts. I tend to focus on the positives and accept, as we are not perfect, that we need to learn from our mistakes. I will not change that perspective. And "despicable"? Where have I attacked your person...I thought not.

I am. So what?




LOL.......there multiple pages where guys like Memphis, Daman, mac, etc, etc are going off about LaCanofora and Shanny. They don't even mention a possible dysfunction in the Browns organization. It's deflection through deception.

I spoke up because the real message was getting lost. Who cares if LaCanafora embellished? Who cares if Shanny told someone about what was going on in Berea? They are NOT employed by the Browns. The problems w/in the organization are real. They won't go away by blaming two people who aren't even employed by the team. It's like sweeping the dirt under a rug right before company comes. While you might not see it right away, the floor is still dirty.




I want the Browns to fix their mess!!!! Fix it!!! I want them to freaking realize that forcing draft picks on the staff is unacceptable. I want them to realize that FO types breaking down film w/the coaching staff is counter-productive. I want them to stop texting plays to the OC. I want them to quit making roster decisions for the coaching staff. I want them to quit telling the coaches who to play.

I do not want them to think that what they are doing is okay because a bunch of Brown's fans are blaming others for the problems in Berea.

I didn't say anything about firing anyone or starting a petition for the owner to sell the team. Instead: I want them

--to be held accountable for their actions.

--to recognize what they have done wrong.

--to develop new strategies that won't alienate coaches and players.

--to develop an organization w/a hierarchy where people are experts at their roles and job descriptions and responsibilities don't overlap. For example, I don't wan the team president involved in game planning or breaking down the tape and I don't want the OL coach heading the draft. Know your role, do your job, respect other experts, combine your knowledge, and make wise decisions instead of knee jerk decisions based on nothing but personal opinion, greed, and/or arrogance.

That is what I want!

Ytown...maybe you were thinking of this comment from Lane Adkins I posted back in the Shanahan thread?

Jan. 8th
LA - theOBR
‏@LaneAdkins
Shanahan played some media like a fiddle, little did he and same media know the Browns have been working on OC and QB coach spots

Link

Thread Link

Ticked off? Nah, I don't take this seriously enough to be ticked off. A few years ago, maybe. But I'm so used to the dysfunction that I've grown numb to it. And obviously I don't take your comments nearly as seriously as you believe I do.



No doubt about it. Everybody does. When you look at Kosars comments a few months ago and now the LaConfora article and put them together, I do think there are a lot of problems behind the scenes.



Perfection isn't expected. Not making this team look like a laughing stock would be a good start.



No worries. I think the biggest problem is the owner pulling Farmers strings. And we certainly can't fire the owner.



Actually I feel I'm being very reasonable and not going off the deep end at all. On the other thread about "The Mess Starts With Haslam", I posted some of the comments Bernie made a short time ago before any of this happened. Many of the things he said were pretty much in line with what's being reported now. I don't believe that's accidental or some simple coincidence.

Now you may feel that having my opinion is somehow going off the deep end, but in case you've missed it, so far Haslam has a way of cleaning house. We have a turnover at OC every year. It appears to me that things are very broken.

Now that's fine if you believe that people with a different opinion than yourself are going off the deep end. You have every right to your opinion. But believe me, I'm not mad, upset or even aggravated at all. You'll rarely ever see that happen on here. And if you do see it, you'll certainly know it. This certainly isn't one of those times.

Very well thought out. That simply is what we all want...

That could have been it. Thanks!

Find me a post where I 'go off' on LaCanfora and Shanny.

Don't worry, I'll wait......

So what do the Browns need to do to get there, bonefish?

That is a fair assessment, bone'. Perhaps though, Haslem already has the right people in place...

I've been lurking that long- for some reason it just looks brighter now. Maybe its just this new format. Or my eyes are going south as well...... who knows.

If Farmer isn't fired then you know Haslam is behind this entire side show.

I can agree with that. The Browns are Haslam's financial investment and perhaps his "toy". As such, I would expect Haslam to "tinker" with his toy, but hopefully not to the extent that Farmer is just his mouthpiece. I don't know whether or not Haslam is a micro-manager. Haslam should only provide the vision, the rest of the FO merely should execute that vision. That perhaps may be a fairy-tale world...

Brian Hoyer admits that Text-gate and Kyle Shanahan's departure will impact his decision: 'You don't just leave a job to leave'

By Mary Kay Cabot, Northeast Ohio Media Group
Follow on Twitter
on February 07, 2015 at 4:29 PM, u

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- Brian Hoyer admitted Saturday that the events of this offseason, including offensive coordinator Kyle Shanahan walking out and the Text-gate scandal involving general manager Ray Farmer, will impact his decision on whether or not he returns to the Browns.

"I think what happened at the end of the season speaks for itself with Kyle (Shanahan) and Dowell (Loggains),'' Hoyer said after signing autographs for two hours at The Great Big Home and Garden Show at the I-X Center. "I mean, you don't just leave a job to leave. So to say that I was unaware I think I'd be lying to you, but to the extent, I had no idea. I'm just as interested as all of you to see what happens.''

Hoyer, who's set to become an unrestricted free agent on March 10, acknowledged that the circumstances surrounding Shanahan's departure and Text-gate will impact his decision on whether or not to return to the Browns.

"It obviously will, I think,'' he said. "I'm going to make the best decision possible. To read the stories and see what's going on, I'm just as interested as you guys are to see where that comes out, especially because when you read it, it has to deal with the quarterback situation and playcalling. That's something that could affect how I feel about it. For me, I'm looking forward to see what comes out of that. Obviously it's an ongoing investigation, so I'm not going to comment more than the fact that I'm just as interested as all of you are to see where that goes.''

NEOMG reported that Farmer is facing a possible suspension and the Browns are facing a fine and loss of a draft pick for impermissible texts sent by Farmer during games. The texts, which occurred in multiple games, included thoughts on Shanahan's playcalling and use of personnel, sources told NEOMG. CBS Sports also reported that Loggains, who's in the coaches' booth during games, was the recipient of at least some of those texts. Loggains was fired on Jan. 8, the day Shanahan was granted his release from the final two year of his contract.

Hoyer said Shanahan didn't confide in him, but that it was evident there were issues.

"Sometimes you can read people and you can get a feel for how things are going,'' said Hoyer, who went 7-6 this season and 10-6 as a Brown. "It's a long season and you spend a lot of hours together, so I think the actions speak for themselves.''

Hoyer attributed his strong start -- including a 7-4 record and sole possession of first place in the AFC North at one point -- in large part to Shanahan and Loggains. Both coaches liked Johnny Manziel as a person, but both left here with serious doubts about his ability to succeed in the NFL, multiple sources have told NEOMG. Manziel recently checked himself into rehab for possible dependence on alcohol and perhaps other substances, and will try to get his career back on track.

"Obviously I grew to have a great relationship with (Shanahan and Loggains), those guys, so you've got to figure out who's going to be in there, but like I said, I've met (offensive coordinator John DeFilippo) Flip. From what I've heard, they're going to hire Kevin (O'Connell) as the quarterbacks coach. It's someone I'm familiar with, and for me, there's no animosity from me towards him and he was here last year in training camp I think for a three or four day span where he was just kind of observing and stuff, and we had a great relationship then.

"So you'd want to be able to know those people. For me, I had a good chance to be in the building and work day in, day out with Kyle and Dowell and I have a lot of respect for those guys and for them helping me get in the position that I was last year.''


Brian Hoyer on Johnny Manziel entering rehab and will he compete with him again
Cleveland Browns quarterback Brian Hoyer, who will become a free agent in March, shares his thoughts on Johnny Manziel entering rehab and if he is willing to compete for the starting job with him again. Hoyer talked after signing autographs at The Great Big Home and Garden Show at the I-X Center.
Given the events of the past week, including Manziel checking himself into rehab, Josh Gordon being suspended for a year and Text-gate, is there too much turmoil here for Hoyer to want to return?

"The dust will all settle at some point and for me, free agency is still a month away,'' he said. "So a lot can happen from now and then, and from my standpoint, you just keep all options open.''

Hoyer re-iterated that he'd love to continue playing for his hometown team -- and raise his children here -- but that he can't base his decision on that.

"Would it be convenient for me to come back? Yeah,'' he said. "But I don't want to make one of the biggest decisions in my life based off of convenience. Obviously being from here, I was here last year, I love my teammates, I love the coaches, yeah, it's definitely up on the top of the list. At the same point, I want to make sure I make the best decision for me at this point in my career, and my family. I'm going to take my time and make the best decision possible.''

He stressed that he wants a chance to start, and indicated that the best chance for that might be elsewhere.

"For me, I've proven that I can win in this league as a starting quarterback,'' he said. "Now, did the season end the way the we wanted to? No, we fell off. there's a lot of things and a lot of reasons why that happened. I'm not going to shy away from my responsibility in that part. For me, I feel like 16 starts, I've shown that I can be a winning quarterback in this league. Especially at this point in my career, I want to go somewhere, whether it's here or wherever it might be, that I'm going to be able to have a chance to be on the field.''

Hoyer, who has supporters around the league, including Houston coach Bill O'Brien, who coached him in New England, is confident someone will give him a chance to start in 2015.

"Yeah, no doubt,'' he said. "For me, personally, I have all the confidence in the world in myself and after we beat Atlanta we were 7-4, if you would've told me the season would end the way it did, I would've said 'you're crazy' so did we have a few games, sure. And it's unfortunate that we weren't able to see it through and get it done, but as far as I'm concerned, I'm going to make the best decision for myself, for my career and at this point in my life. I've told you guys before, I'm from here, and would it be great to stay here? Sure, but if it's not the best place for me to be at this point in my career, then I'm going to have to make some tough decisions.''

One thing on the positive side of Hoyer's ledger is DeFilippo, with whom he met recently.

"I really liked him,'' said Hoyer. "High-energy, you can tell he's excited to be here. And from our time together I really came away impressed as far as the person that he is. So it'll be interesting to see how things play out, if I get a chance to work with him. I'm glad I took the time to go and meet up with him.''

The next steps, he said, are to meet with coach Mike Pettine again and then Farmer. If Hoyer is to return, he'll likely have to have some assurances that Farmer is in his corner.

"I know Ray had texted me about meeting,'' he said. "That hasn't gone anywhere to this point. I'm sure he has other things on his plate. But hopefully I get a chance to do that. I'd like to sit down and talk to him. And then as far as when you get to free agency, I've got to talk to (agent Joe Linta) about that. We haven't crossed that bridge yet on how that works.''

Hoyer, who wished Manziel all the best in his rehab and applauded him for taking such a big step, emphasized that it was a dream come true to play for his hometown team and mingling with the fans on Saturday re-inforced that.

"For me, my heart is here and regardless if I'm here or not, I want to see the Cleveland Browns do well,'' he said. "Seeing these people here today, they're so desperate to have a good team and some continuity and they deserve it. So whether I'm here or not and now that I've had a chance to play for this organization, it'll always be a special place in my heart and you just want to see them do well.''

He stopped short of saying he wants to test the free agent waters.

"I really don't know,'' he said. "First of all I'd have to be offered a contract from Cleveland at some point before then. ...All options are on the table and obviously Cleveland has a big place in my heart."

He said he wouldn't necessarily have to be re-signed by the Browns before March 10 to stay here, and that Manziel entering rehab won't be a huge factor for him.

"I'm going to look at it from my perspective and just how it affects my life,'' he said. "The stuff that's outside of that kind of is up to the other people who are involved in this situation. So that's not for me to decide. But for me, I'm going to make sure i do what's best for me and my family." Link

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I know we all read things the way we want to generally but it sure doesnt sound like there is much of chance of his return.

Brian Hoyer's best shot at starting next year is with us. If we will have him back he will sign.

I like Hoyer, but he has a tendency to say some odd things.

funny some one looking for a contract and had inside info last year would say that.

I won't. I've only gone off on Shanahan.

I would agree with that. Pettine seems to be in his corner and unless the Browns can find a similar FA QB for less $$, I think there is a good chance Hoyer would return and compete with Johnny for a starting spot. Houston might be another option based on the past relationship with the HC and the fact Mallet is a UFA.

If Hoyer is looking to be a starter, Cleveland is probably his best bet.

If I were Hoyer, I would more or less just go to the highest bidder.

I would think that Mallett re-signs with Houston. His situation is similar to Hoyer in that he is familiar with the coaching staff and personnel in Houston. I would guess that we re-sign Hoyer and that Houston re-signs Mallett.

Can Hoyer beat out Ryan Fitzpatrick? He won the competition against Manziel by default, so my guess is no.

I'm not sure what Mallett will do. Wasn't he there for only on year? Hoyer, however, spent significant time under O'Brien, no? There may be stronger ties there.

But in the end, I still think you're right. Mallet to Texans; Hoyer to Browns. Mallet is a few years younger than Hoyer and may still prove to be a franchise QB. Hoyer will never be that.

vers...for some reason, you fail to recognize that there is more than one story being told here...there is the obvious embellished story written by Canfora...then there is the story behind the story, which I find more interesting than the hatchet job Canfora delivered to Haslam and the Browns.

Canfora wrote this hatchet job "without one named source" and he actually thought he could hide behind his anonymous and un-named sources...and no one would figure it out...lol.

"La Canfora is close friends with former Browns CEO Joe Banner, whom Haslam fired last February." Banner now works as a consultant for the Falcons where Shanahan was just hired as OC..only days after Haslam allowed Shanahan to walk away from the last two years of his contract with the Browns.

How did Shankahan thank Haslam?... Shanky stabbed Haslam in the back, becoming one of Canfora's "un-named sources" for the hatchet job Canfora wrote about the Browns. If that doesn't make Shankahan a RAT, I don't know what does. You sure wouldn't want Shanky in the same foxhole to protect your back. He is a RAT, in capital letters.

Banner's only purpose in life as it relates to the NFL is to settle old scores. He did it to his life-long friend, Eagles owner Jeff Lurie and now he's working to settle scores with Haslam. Haslam does need to be careful because Banner is not only working for the Falcons but he is well connected inside NFL Hqtrs.

Canfora's yellow journalism is growing old as he hides behind his "un-named" sources, but some realize Canfora is only a tool to be used by various individuals,to help settle their old scores.

Got to love how Canfora did a 180 on his opinion of Shanahan when he was with the Redskins and now Shanny is one of Canfora's reliable, un-named sources...RATS LOVE RATS and these 3 deserve each other.

mac, for some reason, you can't comprehend that it doesn't matter one bit what Shanny and LaCanafora did or did not do.

They are NOT part of the Browns.

There are problems in Berea and blaming others for embellishing or speaking their mind is not going to change that.

Keep on fighting the good fight, mac. It's always someone else's fault. Just like it was w/Gordon. How did that turn out for you?

Way to honest, Brian. An arrogant, power-hungry, stubborn jerk like Farmer is not going to take kindly to that comment.

Someone obviously made a mistake. The idea now is to admit it, move on and don't make the same mistake again. There's enough work to be done with this team without all this nonsense and drama.

Are you kidding? Admit a mistake? Nah, let's blame LaCanafora and Shanny for everything.

I don't think the players are too concerned with what's going on in the FO. I think they are more concerned with their dealings with the coaching staff, how they are being taught, how they are treated, how fellow teammates are acting and hopefully working together to be a winning team.

That is a pretty good point, but man, even Hoyer admitted that he could tell the coaches were upset about what was going on w/the FO and coaching staff.

You don't think that eats at a team?

What was our record early on? How did we finish? Cancerous situations have a tendency of eating away at the body of the team.

Agreed. The FO's actions were affecting the coaching staff which in turn affected the players. It could be a big reason we lost 5 in a row down the stretch. That and some untimely injuries.

Yeah, the injuries were probably a huge reason why we lost so many at the end. I will say that inserting Manziel into the line-up affected the player's performance. I don't think they bought into it.

I will say this........some guys...like Rish, said that same thing at the time it happened. I kinda argued w/them. I was tired of all the Manziel hate and said that if the players laid down because of Manziel playing, they should be cut. I kinda still think that........but now, after the recent news and time to examine all the information...I have to say that guys like Rish were right, and I was probably wrong.

The first 10 or 11 games we looked like a football team. The last 5 games it all went to heck. We looked like we needed a psychiatrist.

The games Manziel started were alarming.

Hoyer's last couple of starts were really bad.

I will say that when Hoyer came back in for Manziel, the team seemed to pick it up.

And they played hard w/Connor Shaw at qb. He is just so limited in what he can do. But, I was at least proud of the effort.