DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Free Agency 2015 (II)

Seemed like we were linked to Cecil Shorts III well before free agency started. Guessing acquiring Hartline nixed that.

I couldn't root for Vick. I'd have to take a vacation from the Browns until he was gone. I know a lot will say he "paid his debt" when he did time, but imo you don't "rehabilitate" the kind of behavior he displayed.

still whining over shannahan or Teddy? lol sorry couldnt resist, I was worse when we fired chud last year and when we didnt draft Tannehill lol I know where you are coming from though, I was whining about it then and well i guess i am still whining about it today. lol

As much as I want to criticize Gilbert that video of Hartiline vs Skrine reminded me of the growing pains Skrine went through. I saw potential in him. He was fast, physical and he wanted to hit like butkus. He wasnt a good corner however lol.

Anyway I dont think Desir was hurt he just was unwilling to tackle and we hid him at the end of the roster. When he did play at the end of the year he was must more physical than he was at any time in his career. We will see.

I think Williams however is one of the better slot corners in the league. He struggled a bit in those first couple of games but man he was arguably the best player we had in the secondary the later half of the year.

I think the big hit we have taken on the team is in our depth. Losing Sheard really hurts especially with Mingo having shoulder issues. Those worry me aas much as a knee with a linebacker. Whether Gilbert can raise his level of play to that of skrine is a question but we are down a quality DB.

I am hearing Rubin may be going to the Bears. I want him back and i dont care if he doesnt have it anymore, he inspires those around him to hustle. But getting hughes for 3 more was big imho.

On offense, Johnny needs to play so we know what we have. He needs experience under center. The limited practice has made it where the #2 guy gets no reps with the first team.

Receiver, I am an SEC guy and enjoy taking shots at OSU players but Hartline was one of the biggest signing in recent memory for us. I think he is easily a 1000 yard receiver once again with decent QB play. Teams focused on him last year and the focus of the offense went towards other players.

I think Cooper may be the one that drops to us.

Love Gabriel and think he can be a stud in this league. Hawkins not as big on.

I think the real weapons for our passing game may be in Crowe and West. From everyone i talked to that went to camp, West had the best hands of anyone out there and Crowe showed some really nice hands in the few opportunities we gave him.

OL should be even better this year as they now have a full year in a similar scheme. retaining our OL coaches was big. Getting mack back is huge.

TE I am happy with Barnidge and Dray. If we add noone else i am fine with it but I think Maxx is a serious option at 19. I dont know about Clay, anytime i watched a Phins game last year they were talking about his knee and that worries me.

Mourg, love your opinions but I'm surprised sometimes how much we differ.

Big on Gabriel, but not Hawkins? Hawkins is one of the best FA signings this team has made in the last 10 years. Not to take anything away from Gabriel, who played well above expectations and who I am excited to see continue to grow, but he isn't as good as Hawkins. He actually has a long way to go to get there. If I had to choose between the two, it's Hawkins any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

And the next time Hartline has a 1000 yard season will be with someone who's playing Madden. I'm happy that we signed him, especially over Shorts, but we shouldn't expect anything more than solid #2 play out of him.

We all grade differently and it creates for good debate. I thought down the stretch Hawkins really disappointed and I was disappointed in his play. He dropped a lot of easy passes and just didnt appear to be the same player as early. he did have the concussion so that may have been part of it. He got laid out but only sat out one play but he was never really the same player so maybe i am a bit overcritical but dropping gimmies are big pet peeve of mine.

He had a thumb injury that was really bothering him late in the season.

thanks I did not know that. That would explain a lot cause he was body catching and man i hate that.

I really like and would love to land both Ridley and Crabtree...I know Crabtree wants to play and be a #1 target (he was disappointed in being #3 target in SF) I think he can be a good #1 in Cleveland maybe not a true elite #1 but good enough... Ridley is used to playing in a platoon and I would love him here...he's what 25 years old with 22 TDs while sharing a backfield with Blount, Vereen, Golden, White, Gray...

I still have some hope...land WR Crabtree, TE Gresham, RB Ridley, CB Tarell Brown...I'd be perfectly fine with those pickups...

Draft focus on QB, Dline, another OLB rusher, Oline help, PR, another ILB

thanks for doing that.

Lots of decent talent still available. I think this week we'll see some action from the Browns and at decent rates. I'm good with the patient approach, despite losing out on a couple guys I had wished we'd have signed.

Some guys I'd like to see us go after (not necessarily all, just a list of guys I like)
WR. Hakeem Nicks
TE. Charles Clay
TE. Tony Moeaki
OT. Jake Long
DE. Corey Wootton
DT. BJ Raji

I would love to see the Browns have 1 big splashy Free Agent. A real difference make. Greg Hardy would be a huge pick up.

Wouldn't mind any of them except isn't Moeaki always injured? Wootton had the injury bug as a bear, but can't recall him for the Vikings

No doubt on Moeaki, he has been. That just means we could likely get him on the cheap with potential incentives. If he could stay healthy, I still think he can be an above average TE.

I like Wootton because he's good against the run and we need that. He's not spectacular, but he's solid enough and also not expensive. I think his deal with MIN last year was 1.5m.

With Hicks, Moeaki, Long, and Wootton - they're all guys that have been on a couple teams and haven't quite hit it - 2-3 year deals at decent prices are ok gambles - if they live up to their potential, extend them and give them what they're worth. If they don't, they won't be much of a cap hit to release them.

That seems reasonable.

I think that we want a big receiver on the outside to go along with the other guys we already have, We stocked up on bigger guys last year as developmental guys, guys like Ronald Smith, at 6'5" and 220#, and also added Kevin Cone (6'2", 220#) and Phil Bates, (6'1" and 220#) after Austin was hurt and Gordon imploded.

Hartline is in that bigger, outside type receiver mold, at 6'2"and 200#, and Bowe would also be another guy in that bigger mold. (6'2" and 220#)

I really like both Gabriel and Hawkins. Both guys did really nice jobs last year. Both were surprisingly physical, and even blocked downfield nicely last year. They also ran really nice routes, and Gabriel was seemingly open constantly. I like both guys, and look forward to a 2nd year with each of them. If we add Bowe, then I suspect that we may also take a look for another receiver in the middle of the draft, or we may work on developing Smith for a 2nd year. I think that he has some solid physical talent, but he really didn't do anything last year.

Here is a scouting report on Smith, and he sounds like a raw talent who will need time to develop:

Rodney Smith Draft Profile – NFL.com
http://www.nfl.com/draft/2013/profiles/rodney-smith?id=2539674

OVERVIEW
There’s no doubting Smith cuts an imposing figure, with his 6-foot-6, 219-pound frame dwarfing most college cornerbacks at the line of scrimmage or downfield. But scouts have seen players like this before at Florida State, most notably Greg Carr, who has made an impact in the Canadian Football League after failing to stick on an NFL roster after going undrafted in 2009. Smith has superior quickness, strength, and hands to Carr, however.


Smith was a four-star recruit out of Miami’s Archbishop Carroll High School, catching 10 touchdown throws in a run-based offense and intercepting four passes as a senior. He eventually worked his way into the rotation at receiver late in his freshman year after spending time on special teams units, making his only catch (for seven yards) against Wake Forest. His role in the offense increased throughout his sophomore year, as well, as he earned eight starts and caught 31 passes for 448 yards and three scores, mostly in the second half of the season. As a starter for 12 of 13 games played in 2011, Smith led the team with 561 receiving yards while bringing in 36 passes and four touchdowns. In 14 games as a senior, Smith caught 38 passes for 524 yards and three touchdowns.

ANALYSIS

STRENGTHS Tall vertical threat who is a surprisingly smooth runner in his routes. Displays excellent agility for his size. Can challenges defenses vertically from the slot or down the sideline. Good concentration to use his height and vertical on jump balls, also to track passes over his shoulder down the sideline. Uses his length, quickness, and attitude to attack blocking targets in the run game and clear the way for fellow receivers downfield.

WEAKNESSES Relatively lean, and must prove he can fight veteran pro corners during the route and in jump ball situations. Height gives corners a big target to hit in press situations. Must show he can sink his hips to run tight routes and separate downfield. Does not get many opportunities to catch passes in Florida State’s offense, will need to show strong hands when regularly targeted. Adjusting to low throws might be an issue at his height.

NFL COMPARISON Michael Jenkins

BOTTOM LINE If you’re looking for height in your receiver, 6-foot-6 Smith has plenty. But he’s also a smooth athlete for his height, who tracks the football well deep. He's also a good blocker in the running game. However, he doesn't always play up to his size and can lose the physicality battle at the catch point.

I'd love to see us pick up Wisniewski from the Raiders if he's willing to possibly be a backup C/G for us.

There is only one creature in the world, that exists, that can do the things that you describe. It is a mythical beast called, "the giant fullback from Alabama."

Tramon Williams visiting Browns on Sunday http://wp.me/p14QSB-9JqB

I wouldn't mind giving Ridley a go (one cheap one year deal).

Williams was a better player than Skrine in 2014. Presumably he would have a little bit of drop off in 2015 because he is older, but he would probably still be as good or better than Skrine. Skrine has better long term upside because of his youth and his track record of improving.

Williams could also play on the outside with Williams inside. Allowing us not to rely on Gilbert.If we sign Williams to a cheap contract it will be an excellent move. On the off chance Gilbert gets his poop together we would have an excellent position group of Haden, Gilbert, Williams, and Williams.

I think I recall a monster game by Tramon Williams for the Packers in a playoff game in the last 3-4 years, but I can't remember what he did. Was it a Pick-6, a KO return for TD, or both?

I think Williams is looking for big money. Which may be why he hasn't been signed by someone yet

I don't know what he is looking for, but it is a good sign that we are having him in for a visit.

From Wikipedia:

From Nate Ulrich:

Wow, I thought he'd be looking for more around 7-8 year. I'd be more than happy to give him 3 years at 5m/year

Yeah, I agree. If we could swap out Buster for Williams and actually pay him less than we would Skrine... sign me up for that.

My remaining targets that I would want

OLB/DE Greg Hardy - yes I would def take a chance on him. Anywhere from a 1-3 year incentive based contract. Around 2 years 14-15 million with incentives to possible 17-18. Also he wouldn't count towards the compensation picks for next year since he was released.

RB - Stevan Ridley
FB - John Kuhn
WR - Crabtree
WR - Greg Jennings
WR - Stevie Johnson
WR - Jarrett Boykin - had a terrible year last year, but is still young and interested in seeing what he has to offer
TE - J. Gresham
TE - James Casey
OG - Rob Sims

DT - Vince Wilfork
DT - BJ Raji
CB - Tramon Williams
CB - Tarell Brown
S - Louis Delmas as a backup

Most of these players are just to fill the depth charts.

I would ask Hardy a couple of questions.
Do you know what you did was wrong?

Are you gonna do it again?

Are you willing to give back the majority of your bonus money if u get in trouble again?

Sign here please. and initial here. Welcome to the Browns.

Truthfully, we already have enough players on the team we are basically taking a "chance" and hoping things can turn around for them. Manziel, Gilbert, etc.

Signing Hardy would bring more dark light to this organization who has plenty of it already via Haslam and Pilot J ordeal, Textgate and Shanny leaving, Manziel and the bundle of things accompanying him, the failure of the other draft pick Justin Gilbert and of course, the Gordon suspension yet again and the list continues.

Stay away from the negative people, your chances on the one's you have taken haven't proved well.

JMO

I agree fully. If the questioning went to my liking, I would make sure he knows if he's a good little boy, he can make quite a bit more through incentives.

I do understand your point and the reasoning. Now I agree, he could mess up again, obviously no guarantee that he will be a wonderful citizen all of a sudden.

But one difference between him and Manziel/Gilbert is he's accomplished something in the NFL, whereas the other two have not and we're "hoping" they will become the players we drafted them to be.

You have a very valid point there, his resume is better. No doubt about it.

*If* something were to happen, I'd at least hope it would be a one-year, incentive laden contract.

5. “I know everyone says I’m stubborn or I’m going to be abstinent about this wide receiver position but I just think that, at the end of the day, an offensive line affects every single play of the game. A wide receiver may touch the ball 10 times if he’s having a great day so I just like the idea of let’s get the guys that affect the game all the time and let’s try and get those guys and make a difference for our football team

Just say no to....

domestic violence offenders, alcoholics and drug addicts.

This team has been called dysfunctional for a reason. Additional players with personal issue will only contribute to the drama.

Is throwing you girlfriend onto a pile of guns considered domestic violence? What if you've also had 15 sacks in an NFL season?

yea and what happend to the guy that the hc made a point of saying all year that he is a example of play like a brown? he is playing for the jets. gilbert or nothing this year.

Even though we've been searching for corners all throughout free agency so far?

Clueless.

We had Perrish Cox in for a visit and he ended up getting 3 years, $15 million.

There aren't too many old corners, which is what Williams is. My bet is that teams don't want to pay much guaranteed money to an older corner.

I just scrolled through the last few pages, can anyone who actually has been watching the dude play in the NFL give me a no BS assessment on Tramon Williams?

I know someone posted up a Wiki and some other minor this and thats, but supposedly now he's one the of the top free agents left at corner and in general. They're saying he rejected an offer and looking for 3-4 year at 5 million, which to me is reasonable if he really is better than Buster was (as someone said).

Yes

Therefore, pass.

searching for something that our hc really liked and we already had.