DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... MO Republicans Plan For Food stamps: "Ban sugary products, sea food, and steak!"

Well at least I lived long enough to see Swish called the "M" word!
Now I have seen him called everything.

But what this guy is describing would not fit in that 1-1.5% because what he's doing isn't fraud. Fraud would be those receiving food stamps who should not qualify in the first place or people selling their food stamps for cash, etc. This guy probably qualifies and is acting within the law.

His attitude.. I'm not going to change the way I live, it's free food, it's awesome.. that's pathetic.

I do not know how the final proposal will be worded but just "seafood" and "steak" is too broad. By that description you couldn't have fish sticks or flank steak. Though I do agree with the junk food, I don't 100% agree with soda. I hate to have to make all of these prescriptive restrictions because the intent is that you will use some common sense to get the nutrition you need while making the food stamps go as far as you can... while still allowing yourself a little snack treat once in a while. It's a shame we can't count on people using common sense.

Welfare is a necessary benefit, that has very good intentions.

But where it fails is that it is often enough of a subsidy that not-working is an "option" while on it, rather than a circumstance. Meaning, for some, they choose not to work, cause they can live, and live decently, on the welfare, rather than it being enough to give them the basics of survival, but having a job would still be the goal.

As with any program, especially those the government runs, there are people who will find a way to abuse it. Which labels all those which rely on it with a stereotype.

I think food stamps should be bare-bones. I'm talking oats, flour, apples, corn. Basic nutrition for survival.

It shouldn't be a profit program for Wal-Mart. Open the doors at the State Agencies and have them hand out the stuff (rural/logistical exemptions of course). Even further, open the program to every citizen. You, me, Romney, everyone. If you're willing to stand in line, it is your can of corn. No need for the Bureaucrats to monitor income, family size and poverty levels. No one gets extra bc they don't work, no one gets denied bc they do work. Open it equally to all Americans, no questions asked.

I would vote for that.

What is the flour for? Oh wait, you want me to actually have to cook this stuff and not just open the box and eat it? That hardly seems fair.

Razor, did you serve in the military? If so when and what branch of service?

Which is worse, welfare fraud by citizens or corporate welfare?

Whether it's citizens or corporations, anybody who breaks the law is worse. I can't really fault anybody for taking advantage of whatever they can within the law to better their circumstances. At that point it becomes about the legislators and us to make better laws if we don't like it.

Well, if you think about it, no one is breaking the law.

I tried to sign up for the military but I failed the physical because of my hearing problems and having flat feet. It was devastating for me not to join. Every single male in my family except me has served in the military and all were volunteers. These days the women in our family do too now that they are allowed.

I wanted to be a pilot but I was too tall. When I couldn't be a pilot my dad marched me down to the Marines recruiter. I had 6 reconstructive ear surgeries before I was 8 in both ears. My dad was pis$ed when they wouldn't let me serve because of my hearing.

I was just at WalMart today and some food stampers were in front of me discussing reform to soon sweep the nation,to the best of their ability. One woman stated..."they can suck my a**, as long as I can buy beer, I'm o.k.". Seems to be the general sentiment among some.

Lol that would be true of most people not on foodstamps too lol

I think they could easily set up a luxury food category and ban those from food stamps cards. I don't want to ban all sugar products. I mean what about the occasional birthday cake and icecream? Still products could easily feed info about sugar in a tracker and then limit the sugar allowance per family. Might slow down diabetes some amount the poor and young.

Not "most" .......I would buy the word "some" as stated in my post.

this may be the most insane thing I have ever read. Those "murdering" soldiers allow you to sit high and mighty behind your keyboard and dish out this crap you are trying to sell. If you dont want our soldiers, our HEROS, then go to a different country. Let me know when you find a better one, cause trust me you will not!

To the thread at hand....My wife is a manager at a Sheetz. She sees everyday people buying cases of Redbull and Rockstars on EBT, then selling the cards as well to others in line. Its not the same people over and over either, which tells me it happens more than people may want to think.

On a side note, I was laid off 3 years ago, when I factor in not having the same taxes, paying for healthcare, and such, I made MORE on unemployment than working 40+ hours a week. The average mother of two receives up to 35K a year in benefits. Thats a little insane.

There must be reforms in this country at all levels of government spending. We are still in an economic crisis whether they admit it or not. While it is easy to look at the welfare recipient in line at the grocery store, we need to look at all the ways our tax dollars are being spent.

Agree Von_doom. I am in the process of verifying that some Puerto Ricans in America who are unable to speak English are qualifying for and receiving disability. Is this a disability? It can be changed by learning the English language.

Anyone have a link? I am awaiting verification on mine prior to posting. There is and always has been iincredible wasteful government spending. However, this is over the top.

I'm certainly like you to the extent I don't agree with Kings point. But what I do understand is that who the heroes are and who the victims are, is certainly a matter of perspective. An example......

Let's say you were an Iraqi civilian. You had a wife, two daughters and three sons. While you despised Sadaam, you were not a part of his government and you know he was not tied into 9/11 nor attacked the U.S. The U.S. attacked your country. In the process, your wife, both your daughters and one of your sons was killed.

In that example, who would you see as the aggressor? Who would you consider your enemy to be? Who would you consider the murderers to be? How do you believe you would see your sons perspective moving forward in life? What would they believe and teach their children about the U.S.?

Many do not consider the perspective of the rest of the world. And that's their right. But I believe that reality dictates often the actions a government takes has long term ramifications sometimes even for generations. And sometimes if you're not very careful, acting swiftly without good judgement only serves to create more enemies and embolden those enemies.

How soon we forget.

How could the Iraqi people not know who the aggressor was?

Timeline of the Gulf War begins on August 2, 1990 and ends on February 28, 1991.

1990[edit]
May 28-30: Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein says that oil overproduction by Kuwait and United Arab Emirates was an "economic warfare" against Iraq.
July 15: Iraq accused Kuwait of stealing oil from the Rumaylah, Iraq's oil field near the Iraqi-Kuwaiti border and warns of military action.
July 22: Iraq begins deploying troops to the Iraqi-Kuwaiti border and building a massive military buildup.
August 2: About 100,000 Iraqi troops invaded Kuwait, initiating the Gulf War. The U.N. Security Council passed Resolution 661 imposing a trade embargo on Iraq in a 13-0 vote, with Cuba and Yemen abstaining.
August 7: The United States launched Operation Desert Shield. First U.S. troops arrived in Saudi Arabia.
August 8: Saddam Hussein proclaimed the annexation of Kuwait.
August 12: Naval blockade of Iraq begins.
August 28: Iraq declared Kuwait as its 19th province and renames Kuwait City as al-Kadhima.
September 14: United Kingdom and France announce the deployment of troops to Saudi Arabia.
November 29: The U.N. Security Council passed Resolution 678 setting a deadline for Iraq to withdraw from Kuwait before January 15, 1991, or face military action.
1991[edit]
January 9: Talks in Geneva, Switzerland, between U.S. Secretary of State James Baker and Iraq Foreign Minister Tariq Aziz ended with no progress.
January 12 : U.S. Congress passed a joint resolution authorizing the use of military force to drive Iraq out of Kuwait. The votes were 52-47 in the U.S. Senate and 250-183 in the U.S. House of Representatives. These were the closest margins in authorizing force by the Congress since the War of 1812.
January 15: First U.S. government statement of Operation Desert Storm made.
January 17: The air war commenced at 2:38 a.m. (local time) or January 16 at 6:38 p.m. EST due to an 8 hour time difference, with an U.S. Apache helicopter attack. U.S.-led Coalition warplanes attacked Baghdad, Kuwait, and other military targets in Iraq.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_the_Gulf_War

you realize puerto ricans are american citizens right?

what the hell people....i dunno about the disability thing, but they are americans. they speak spanish.

Gotta be some of the most cultural insensitive people i've ever met on these boards.

You do understand you are talking about a completely different war, right?

Sad thing is this is exactly what has happened. As evil as Sadaam was, he was the evil they knew. Once he was removed it created a power vacuum. People who hated Sadaam told me to my face they wished he was still in power. Markets weren't blowing up then.

Those who have been there and who have actually studied the area I believe know all to well that this power vacuum has created a lot of the situation we find ourselves in now. I understood when our government entered into this war, that without an iron fist ruling the region, the fighting among the Muslim factions would run rampant in a power struggle.

can we get back to the food stamp stuff instead of the war nonsense?

I doubt that any one of the legislators involved has ever tried to feed a family while on food stamps or other governmental assistance program.

As others have pointed out, with any system there will be fraud by some. It does not matter if it is the individual or corporate fraud.

Where we run amok is when we try to end fraud with solutions that are more expensive than the fraud that occurs. See the drug testing for Florida welfare eligibility.

I have seen information where the most "profitable" government employees are tax auditors. So in the past years we have reduced the number of auditors.

Wow. . .

I think we need to invest in Americans. No one should be on Welfare for more than it takes to get a degree or learn a trade. Make them have to do volunteer work to recieve benefits. Make them pick up trash, help kids/elderly. There is always something that needs to be done. Cut foreign aid, military spending and corporate welfare. How much cash would that free up?

I rarely agree with you, but I'm all for this.

Good job, y'all. Conductive discussion, despite a side tangent into attacking a servant to all of us as murderer..., is happening in this thread.

I'd argue that the whole "as long as I can buy beer" comment stems from a bit of disposable cash due to the low paying job they have in addition to any other service. Let's also dispel the notion about race and welfare. Swish came up with a fantastic statistic about it earlier this thread.

Some people, regardless of race or socioeconomics, will succumb to the vice of alcohol over anything else. Not every individual is using supplemental income to their government assistance to go out and get trashed. You can't buy alcohol with government assistance.

Disclaimer: Yes, there are shady individuals who won't follow the law. This doesn't mean all people who use welfare are going to get trashed on booze.

If you believe that the majority of welfare people get trashed on booze...well, let me give a similar situation. I tend to follow a liberal POV. A good portion of liberals are misguided about guns. A small minority believe that all those people at gun shows believe the south will rise again, are racists, and card carrying klan members. Obviously this isn't true.

So therefore, drop the hyperbole about everyone on welfare being alcoholics.

Considering corporations are "individuals" also, when a corporation does this it's considered good/creative business practice.

I disagree!

I think we agree more than rarely.

32 years working with families and witnessing the decay of values and morals speaks volumes. This first hand experience is greater than any "opinion" out there.

In many cases...note the word "many", it is operative, I witnessed families on welfare arrive at conferences stoned or drunk while their children went without soap, proper clothing and food.

I witnessed families accept food stamps for food while any money was spent on drugs and alcohol.

I witnessed welfare families accept free anti depression drugs intended for said use, only to crush them up and snort them for a high, in some cases, sharing with children and others.

I witnessed a young lady in kindergarten so scarred and damaged because her stoned father inserted a hot curling iron into her vagina. She was incontinent and will never have children.

I witnessed a young boy with burns up and down his arms because he had hidden his father's cigarettes in an effort to get him to stop smoking. His punishment : 8 burns up and down his arms.

I witnessed a sixth grader become a Mom because her welfare Mom permitted her own boyfriend to have sexual contact with her daughter. The school permitted her to leave at lunch to go home (in sixth grade) to breast feed her baby. I witnessed the same girls younger sister come to me in second grade to tell me she was experiencing the same horror. I was her trusted adult, I followed protocol and nothing was done for that child to keep her safe. I should have taken the hit and been arrested for kidnapping! She became a mother at a very young age as well.

I witnessed a mother force her young son to smoke marijuana to control his adhd and mellow his activity to the point that he vomited.

I witnessed a welfare Dad throw his young son through a window causing a fractured skull. Upon visiting this child in the hospital with his lamenting father by his bedside, my faith in the system was thoroughly shaken forever.

There are many, many more unfortunate circumstances I could highlight.

The system of welfare is broken. These are my experiences and they speak much louder than any opinion anyone, any where, at any time can offer.

Can these same situations occur in non welfare families, you betcha! However, 32 yars speaks volumes and the ratio would be something like 10:1 welfare vs. non welfare. Tells me something. This speaks to the culture that welfare CAN and does percipitate.

I totally and completely support drug testing for welfare qualification. Parents who cannot put the safety and security of their children first, after two attempts to remain clean with supportive measures , should be required to place their child for adoption. The foster system is broken as well. There are great foster parents out there. However, children need stability, nurturing, love and respect. Continuing to keep them in a broken system while the parent tries to get clean is pointless. Too often, the children are bounced from place to place and if/when the parent becomes clean, it is often far too late for the child.

My world is full of adoptive families, foster familes and respite families. We need them all. But, CHILDREN should come first. I have had children from all different types of circumstances living in my home as a member of my family....all colors, races and religions. I have had first hand experience with sickness that harms children in this system. I have cried with children who tasted what a "home" is and do not wish to return to their parent. Children who were drug kicking and screaming away from stability and love. It hurts!!!!!! It is wrong on any level. It takes way, way more than a sperm and an egg to be a parent. I have said that before.

It is easier to build a child than to repair an adult.

Just my experience with the title of this thread....my explanation of why I feel as I do. Don't need anybody's acceptance, debate or approval. It is what it is!

Some terrifying stories. Sad stuff.

Would you test for alcohol and tobacco as well? More recipients spend money on those addictions than illegal drugs. Alcoholics are more likely to be abusive/endangering than pot-smokers.

I don't agree with drug testing recipients or taking kids b/c of a drug test. There are addicts in every class of society, and every class gets some form of Gov't Assistance. I would expect equal treatment for all. Most Americans don't realize how many addicts there are in the suburbs and rural areas.

Then you are OK with child abuse, neglect, instability and the needs of parents before children? The foster care system stinks.

Yes, I would like to test for alcohol as well. When you've seen the damage to our greatest natural resource: our children, it is a very simple answer. I would offer more than one opportunity, but beyond that, there are people who can AND WILL love and nurture a child just because that is what every child needs and deserves out of life.

I keep hearing this, yet we have so many kids who end up not ever getting adopted. and i hear, and read about a TON of horror stories on how kids in foster car are mistreated.

Putting up kids for adoption, or in child protective custody, sounds good in theory.

But in the real world, i've seen it with my own eyes too....the idea is simply a fairy tale.

B

Additionally, I was sharing true, real lfe experience. That speaks to me louder than any statistic shared. So, your point about the possibility of this occuring in any class is class is noted. However, I would trust 32 years of cold, harsh experience over those statistics any day, any time.

Swish, the problem then is that children are left way too long in the abusive situation or system and become angry, aggressive and defiant. They have, for way too long, felt no one cares and create chaos. Unfortunately, at this point, many folks will not consider adoption. It must be done early and swiftly within the above discussed situation when parents fail to recover adequately to care for their children.

K.

I agree with you.

Here's my problem with you Cjrae.

you here how you're taking up for these kids, and you understand their problems and such, and how they grow up in broken homes with no direction and anger and resentment and you feel something needs to be done? I agree with all that.

but then you'll turn around in another thread and call those same kids lazy and entitled when they grow up.

/drops mic.

H

Maybe. If that is the way they are raised they most likely will be. If given a peek at a different type of life and appropriate role models things COULD be different for them. You just proved my point! That is my hope for all the lost souls suffering at the hands of abusive and neglectful parents.