DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Johnny Manziel...the return...

And you resorted to name-calling again.

They haven't fixed anything bro, they don't even think they botched it which they did. The handling of the QB is their big down fall and having said that they believe they have it right, and sadly they don't. It's not unique to this regime but its a story we have seen repeated over and over again. They just happen to be the next group of managers that doesn't know how to handle the QB situation, non the less there were NO changes if there were point them out.

It was actually just a continuation of your own admission.

They have made changes...

Jeremy Fowler, ESPN Cleveland Browns reporter
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CLEVELAND -- The Browns' revamped offensive coaching staff is complete as the team is hiring former New England Patriots quarterback Kevin O'Connell as quarterbacks coach and former Florida offensive coordinator Kurt Roper as a senior offensive assistant, according to a source with direct knowledge of the situation.

Fox Sports first reported the news.

O'Connell, 29, was a third-round pick in 2008 who eventually lost the backup Patriots job to Brian Hoyer, the Browns' starter for much of 2014 and a pending free agent. O'Connell was a private quarterbacks coach who worked extensively with Browns quarterback Johnny Manziel leading up to the draft in May.

Manziel struggled in his rookie year, completing 18 of 35 passes for 175 yards, two interceptions and a 42.0 rating.

The Browns feel O'Connell's work with Manziel doesn't hurt but didn't consider that relationship a huge selling point in the interview process, according to a source, believing O'Connell was the most qualified candidate regardless of who leads the offense.

Between O'Connell and 36-year-old offensive coordinator John DeFilippo, the Browns bypassed the retread route and are betting on up-and-coming coaches to fix the team's quarterback woes. Roper was Duke's offensive coordinator before taking the job at Florida, which fired coach Will Muschamp last year.

Wasn't a hard prediction to make. Look we used a first and a third round pick on Manziel. Unless Hoyer had been consistently stable behind center, Johnny was gonna get his shot. Hoyer was never their guy. The media portrayed him as the next Kurt Warner but he was never more than a backup getting away with some bad throws and it caught up with him. Even now the media are still crying about him.

Its also why I think the local media keeps talking about the Browns should or could trade up for mariotta. lets use 3 first for mariotta and then lets give him 2 or 3 games to prove his greatness!! Commonsense escapes the QB conversation with the Cleveland media.

This regime has done every single thing humanly possible to help Manziel become the QB they thought he would be when we drafted him. They found a veteran backup that is willing to be a teacher for Johnny. They Brought in Bowe and hartline and will add another receiver in the first or 2nd round. They brought in the coach that helped him prepare for the draft that had him throwing the ball better than ever. They bring in an OC that is a supposed QB guru.

Manziel locked himself away in rehab for 2 and a half months. You do not do that unless you are serious about getting your life on track. I think most of the team have a great deal of respect for the kid. Joe and Bryan were best friends and that is something those 2 are gonna need to work out but it can be done, if Johnny is getting it done.

We are putting Manziel in position to be the guy but make no bones about it, this regime expects to win now. O'connel and Flip are about to get the test of their careers. The Browns need Johnny Manziel the football player and no more Johnny Football the celebrity.

I dont know how this thing is gonna play out. I felt he was the 2nd best QB in last years loaded QB class. I had 6 QBs with a first round grade last year.

Johnny is never gonna be the guy that sees the field like the 6-5 guys but if he can master the playbook (which is what he struggled with last year) he can learn to better anticipate who will be open from what he can see on the field. It is how guys those guys 6-1 and under succeed. Its left up to him whether or not he is another bust or not at QB for the Browns. No Browns QB has ever been given as much as he has since Kosar was QB.

Again, we may take a QB in this draft but it will be 3rd or 4th. We will continue to bolster the offense and try to build a team where the QB is not the reason we are winning games but also not the reason we are losing games.

Well, anyone would struggle to master anything if they didn't put forth the effort... While I lost respect for him for wasting the season, oddly enough its the same reason I haven't written him off and for me its still a ??? as to whether or not the kid can be any good.

Thing is Devil, few rookies understand what it takes to make it at the next level. They get a year under their belt and they adapt to their situation. It is why the greatest progression any player will ever make is between their first and 2nd seasons.

Its why I chuckle when I hear people talk about how a rookie will be a future hall of famer after one year and another kid is a total bust after one year. We just dont know until we see whether or not they progress.

Only I believe we are under a completely different situation with JFF. As we saw in his play at the end of last season, last year was a lost season by JFF.

We now have a new OC and QB coach. To me, this is JFF's rookie season. He seemed to learn little to nothing last year and certainly didn't study.

To me, JFF's improvement from his first and second season will transfer to improvement between his second and third season...... IF he gets it at the pro level.

The problem with the Browns coaching staff changes they were one brought about as a result of the guy they had here last year begging on hands and knees to get out.

This staff from an offensive point of view isn't better then what we had here a year ago in fact its markedly worse. I worry they will be easily manipulated and once Farmer and Haslam work out their hand signals or messenger service they will once again be trying to play call and make personal decisions in game from the owners box, just like they did last year.

Morg this crew set Johnny up to fail its so plain.. They put him on the field when he wasn't ready, and clearly hadn't put in the work, and I don't believe that was a product of Pet, Shanahan, or Farmer for that matter. No one who knows spit about the development of a QB would have sent that kid out there to play, much less send him out there for a 2nd go. It was beyond stupid and exactly the wrong way to develop a QB.

Everyone from an organizational stand point had to know he was no where near ready, if they didn't we are in worse shape then I thought. They let him get away with being a slacker and they had to know he had substance abuse issues, again if they didn't we are in worse shape then I originally thought. They are as we speak leading JF to the edge of the cliff, any hope we had of developing him is quickly fading because it requires time, and effort on JF part which they never demanded from him last year all while talking about accountability, and the stated reason they cut loose of Chud.

JF has an uphill battle in front of him. Most folks say he created it for himself but I say it has far more to do with the FO setting him up to fail then it has to do with his substance abuse. They should have kicked him in the ass way back in camp last year while they were talking about holding everyone accountable would be my point.

Worse though I see no indication they get it now. Here we go Johnny Geronimo.

If you can't accept that they know there was a problem and are doing what they can to remedy it, then I really don't know what to tell you.

Dude the problem was them and is them, and that hasn't changed. The problem wasn't coaching it was the FO, seriously look at how the QB situation was handled look at how lost JF was and ask yourself should they have known did they know he wasn't ready. Now who forced JF onto the field, and make no mistake he was forced onto the coaches of that I have zero doubt, this came from Haslam it smells to much like him for it not to be, and if that continues we will kill any chance we have a developing a QB.

The coaching change was for all intense and purposes forced on them, it wasn't something they anticipated or wanted to do the guy quit on them because he viewed them as hopeless. Stop wishing it to be what you envision and look at it for what it is.

So what did they remedy really, I say nothing and I anticipate it will get worse and continue because it has right thru the off season.

I don't know how to help you. You will never see the light if you don't look for the switch...

Don't you mean I can only lead you to the kool ade I can't make you drink? Now we agree. lol

Keep slopping up the KA by all appearances your in a happy place, come Sept reality will set in and the KA will wear off.

Actually, I am. Certainly not completely satisfied, nor do I have blinders on, but we are on the upslope...

Good God. How can you prove they fixed the problem? Stop making crap up.

If NFL execs were interviewed, do you really think they would pick our current OC and QB coach over the guys we had last year?

It's not even a debate. Quit acting like the nonsense you are spreading is a fact.

Your response said this was to bbrowns32, but I think it was intended to BTTB.

These new quote controls are wacky.

your whole thing goes againts what farmer and the coaching staff say is a core value of what they are trying to build.

"My whole goal in this is to drive competition," he said. "I don't care if you have Brett Favre; you should try to get Aaron Rodgers. I know the quarterback is always the hot topic but (ultimately) you want a good-enough team that you're constantly bringing in players trying to beat established players out."

http://www.foxsports.com/ohio/story/clev...n-strife-012015

It's my opinion; where did I state that as a fact? Next season hasn't even started yet so my OPINION is as valid as yours. You are really pushing the envelop with your posts at times...

Pffftttt.............you're wrong. It wouldn't even be close. In case you did not get that.............IT WOULD NOT EVEN BE CLOSE!!!!!

Another poster who can't see the light...

or you are a poster who can not see reality. i think thats closer to the truth.

Oh I can see this is going to get ugly! And what does Vers say about piling on? Just bring it...

Wait! What?

Are you saying that NFL execs would prefer Flip and O'Connell over Shanny and Logains?

Seriously......are you saying that?

I am pretty sure pettine preferred Flip and O'Connell to Shanny and Loggains. Shanny was brought in by Banner not by Pettine. Same way Horton was brought in by Banner for Chud.

so none were brought in by farmer right?

Banner was still in charge when they were all hired.

Flip and O'Connell were hired by banner?

You're just trying to get my goat, but I have decided to respond. I said "we are on the upslope" and did not identify specifics rather making it general. But you cherry-pick what you want (or to use your term - put words in my mouth) to fit your agenda...err, the point you are trying to make. You're trying to pick a fight - just stop with your garbage...

Both are Pettine guys and he has soul responsibility in their hiring. Farmer doesnt hire coaches, he just tells them what plays to run lol.

When is the last negative comment you heard about Gilbert?

All I have seen is him working hard with Joe Haden ..... who looks like a good mentor for him at this point.

If he works as hard in training camp and beyond, then he'll almost certainly be successful, becauuse he is a very talented kid.

Lol I clicked on this thread with 32 unread posts expecting to see something about Manziel.

LOL

IMHO,Hoyer production started to slip once he was forced to feed the ball to Gordon.

A general change in game play set to maximize production/value from Gordon and Manziel.

This is FO blame, most probably farmer

Yea I still cant get over the fact they told him to throw to gordon who was triple covered instead of Gabriel who was wide open. Damn that Shanny and his sabatoge of Saint Hoyer.

Just wondering, why blame Farmer? Wouldn't a more likely candidate be either Shanny or Pettine?

Oo i misunderstood, Farmer texted Shanny and told him to tell Hoyer to throw it to Gordon when he was in triple coverage.

The job of a QB is to go through his progressions and throw it to the open man. If anyone "forced the ball to Gordon" it was Hoyer.

what people don't know is that textgate is just the tip of the iceberg....

soon it will be known that radiogate existed and has been glossed over by the nfl, fearing it may come to light that several teams will want to employ this.

It appears that Farmer actually had a radio connected directly to Hoyer and was telling him plays, over riding the plays already called by the OC, Shanahan.

At least that is what the tinhat people are saying...