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Tue May 1, 6:03 PM ET

WASHINGTON, D.C. -- All the fuming and fussing over the new book of former CIA chief George J. Tenet on the follies of the Bush administration and the Iraq war make it sound like Tenet's revelations are something new:

Look, look! The very man who oversaw American intelligence during this entire disastrous period of planning, plotting and going to a hypothetical war in that remote country worlds away has now come out to "reveal" how much of everything was false.

But in truth, the Tenet book, "At the Center of the Storm," is old stuff. It only confirms what culture-savvy journalists like Arnaud de Borchgrave of United Press International, Steve Chapman of the Chicago Tribune, Trudy Rubin of The Philadelphia Inquirer, Seymour Hersh of The New Yorker and, modestly, yours truly, were writing even a year before the war started.

Still, one has to say, Thanks, George! Your book will stand as a kind of final confirmation for all of us. As the neocons have momentarily paused in their passions to destroy our country, just about the only ones left to join the "mea culpa" club now are the president himself, Vice President Cheney and the disgraced (and disappeared!) Donald Rumsfeld. Let's look at the arguments?

The book's main point, repeated over and over by commentators since it leaked last week, is that an administration hotly eager for war with Iraq pushed the war without even bothering to conduct "a serious debate" about whether Saddam Hussein posed any "imminent threat" to America.

Nor, Tenet said, was there ever a significant discussion about "containing Iraq." No, from the day shortly after 9/11 when he ran into one of the sleaziest deal-makers of the neocons, Richard Perle, he says that Perle told him, "Iraq has to pay a price for what happened. They bear responsibility."

Yet Tenet is at least as clear as everyone, now even the president of the United States, that the intelligence showed "no evidence of Iraqi complicity" in the 9/11 attack.

(We were all saying that as early as the fall of 2002.)

Actually, Tenet says in the book that he doubts the idea of Saddam's supposed weapons of mass destruction constituted the real reason for going to war with Iraq. That was just "the public face that was put on it."

Rather, he went on, the real reason was that the administration wanted "democratic transformation" through "regime change in the Middle East to transform the entire area and especially to make it safe for Israel."

The Israel intention in the equation had always been the major goal of neoconservatives like Perle, Douglas Feith, Paul Wolfowitz, David Wurmser, Elliott Abrams and many others who had worked closely with the right wing of the right-wing Likud Party in Israel, which then came to connect in a once-in-a-lifetime way with the Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld mix of extraordinary hubris, arrogance and ambition for world hegemony.

(We were saying all that, too, from the very beginning.)

Intelligence was constantly stretched to build support for the war, Tenet writes, and the Cheney/Rumsfeld axis repeatedly inserted "crap" into public excuses for the war, while super neocon Douglas Feith, third at the Pentagon, ran his own intelligence system, often bypassing Tenet's supposedly premiere CIA.

(But then, we were saying that, too.)

What seems particularly to have irked -- indeed, enraged -- Tenet is the manner in which two words of his, spoken in the White House in an offhand manner at the height of the administration's euphoria about invading the world, became like a scarlet letter embroidered on his jacket.

Oh, poor "slam dunk!" Why, George, did you use those words? Now they haunt you. On "60 Minutes" Sunday, you seemed always close to tears, sometimes near to hysteria, as you tried to tell the world -- to assure it -- that you never meant to say that it was a slam dunk that Saddam had WMD, but only that his entire regime was evil and dangerous.

(Ditto, foreseen.)

But it is here that we finally reach the inner George Tenet, for it is here, with those ineloquent words, "slam dunk," that he reveals his true self. He speaks of honor. His Greek blood spills out and he challenges the bloodless men who started this war and threw him over, albeit with a Medal of Freedom on his chest, and who are now trying to blame it all on one silly phrase of his!

At the end of the day, he says, all a man has is his honor and his reputation, and they tried to take it from him, from this man with such a passionate nature. He seems to be crying out that they cannot take a man's honor and reputation.

In effect, we get the real insider's insider story, from a man less concerned about the horrors of the war (he approves of the torture of insurgents, which he says is not torture, and speaks not at all of the cultural inevitability of Iraqi society acting as it always has) than his own personal reputation. That's OK; he provides perhaps the final needed legitimacy for the rest of us who resisted too early.

Yet, there are three questions I would like to ask the director:

1. Why did it take you three years to speak out while so many were dying?

2. Where was the all-important element of "culture" in your intelligence analysis? Why didn't you warn them about how Iraqis behave and what we could expect from history?

3. When are you going to give back the Medal of Freedom?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ucgg/20070501/cm_ucgg/tenetconfirmswhatmanyalreadyknew


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Could Iraq be functioning simply as smoke and mirrors for Muslim extremists?


My idea is this. We went into Iraq after purported WMD's and captured a leader that we didn't like---he was executed.

What happened next---chaos. But, is this chaos something that we wanted in the first place?

In this current struggle for power in Iraq we have attracted the attention of Al-Qaida, fanatics and extremists of unspecified numbers. Now, these extremists are being drawn into a struggle against our military. In a way, was the war in Iraq just a way to engage the enemy on a more direct level, with our military.

Sure, we turned Iraq into a battlefield---all in an effort to keep from elsewhere. In a way we centralized the conflict somewhat.


just a thought.............


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Quote:

Sure, we turned Iraq into a battlefield---all in an effort to keep from elsewhere. In a way we centralized the conflict somewhat.




Tyler they are not an army that can be tied down in a field by engaging them. Troops in Iraq are not stopping 20 men from hijacking planes again.
The only thing going to Iraq did was soothe our wounded pride. Instead of preventing future attacks we are creating the next generation of attackers as we bomb their homes and occupy their lands.


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Everyday extremists and the like cross Iraqi borders to kill American troops. And basically, our military is there to engage them. Every suicide bomber, or al-qaida member that dies in Iraq is one less.

I think that by solidifying a military presence in the region. It provides our military with the opportunity to do what they are there to do----kill people who are out to endanger the American way of life.


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"...Instead of preventing future attacks we are creating the next generation of attackers as we bomb their homes and occupy their lands."

So Pit...before we were attacked on 9/11...were we bombing their homes and occuping their lands? Doesn't appear that these "unholy rollers" really needed a physical presence in their land as a reason to attack us.

To attempt to blame our intervention in Iraq as the reason for terrorism in this part of the world doesn't take much...other than a complete disregard to the activities of Muslim fundamentalism.

Tenet himself admits that all the top leaders really believed that Hussein had the makings of WMD in Iraq....proving it was another matter. Instead o0f Bush lied...how about they were all wrong and let Hussein fool them. Hussein also fooled the other nations leaders around him.


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Thanks Pit.. it's always good to see what those left of liberal are up to and writing about.....


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I didn't know Tenant was "left of liberal"?


I guess the man that appoints these guys should be more carefull huh?

Shooting the messenger instead of the guy who sent the message again? Not very creative for a Tuesday DC.


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I watched his interview on 60 Minutes. It was very interesting, and more than a little scary.

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Quote:

I didn't know Tenant was "left of liberal"?




No, Tenet is just left of center... the author is left of liberal.

Quote:

I guess the man that appoints these guys should be more carefull huh?



Yep, that's what you get when you try to be nice and keep hold overs from the previous libs...

Quote:

Shooting the messenger instead of the guy who sent the message again? Not very creative for a Tuesday DC.



Who Tenet? I'm not shooting Tenet... High ranking and fairly well respected man from all that I can tell.. Georgie Anne Geyer, on the other hand, I could do without.

Or are you just offended that I called somebody a liberal Pit?


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Quote:

I didn't know Tenant was "left of liberal"?
I guess the man that appoints these guys should be more carefull huh?






Tenet wasn't appointed by the Bush Admin, he was appointed by the Clinton Admin. Although that is inconsequential in this matter. I think ultimately what we have is a bunch of gov't officials who felt that while there were some holes in the intelligence, most of them believed that Saddam had WMDs. I firmly believe Tenet was among the group that did. Woodward's book pretty much kills any revisionist history that Tenet may try to write on that subject. At the end of the day, I think we had a group of officials that felt the removal of Saddam was best for the future of this nation. The multiple UN violations of the 1st GW cease fire and WMD line was the best ammo they had to use to build a case to accomplish that goal. While it turns out US and multiple other governments were inccorrect, I will always believe that they thought he did have illegal weapons in that country.

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That was my point Jules.
Thank God somebody understands that.

God knows both of the major partys have been fairly useless. But IMO,this goes far beyond that. And yes,it's more than a little scary.


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Offended? Nah

Amused? Yes.


You ignored the information in the article. Ignored addressing Tenants comments in order to attack the messenger. Which we both know is a veiled attempt to attack the credability of the contents of the article.

So no,I'm not offended by it. But I do get amazed that so many people use such an obvious and blatant attempt to discredit all the information contained in an article because of who wrote it.


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Quote:

You ignored the information in the article. Ignored addressing Tenants comments in order to attack the messenger. Which we both know is a veiled attempt to attack the credability of the contents of the article.

So no,I'm not offended by it. But I do get amazed that so many people use such an obvious and blatant attempt to discredit all the information contained in an article because of who wrote it.





Good. Because I get amazed that a well credentialed journalist repeatedly calls people neocons and right wingers and then expects her articles to be considered based on the facts...

I could write the greatest fact based article ever written on the life of Georgie Anne Geyer but every time I referred to her, instead of calling her "accomplished journalist," I referred to her as "a member of the liberal media establishment"... would you really focus on the facts of my article and consider it unbiased?

She is a very accomplished journalist, I'm just a schmoe with a computer, so if she's not above name-calling, then why should I be? Do you see why the animosity lives on and this debate will never rise above where it is right now? This woman is a Rhodes Scholar with about 4 earned degrees and 20 honorary degrees who speaks 5 languages and has traveled the world and reported on it.... so if she is not above name calling then shame on any of us for expecting the ordinary people of this country to be above it. If the "tone" of political debate is going to change, as most agree it should, then it's going to have to start with people like this, and evidently she just doesn't get that. So I will anxiously await her article during the next campaign on how the republicans resort to name calling...


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I like that concept, it works well when we refer to our opponents as the Stoolers, Ratbirds, and Bungles.... It seems to get the point across in those threads.


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Maybe she could call your friend Coulter and they could begin this change together.

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OMG....talk about a total FREAK!


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When is the last time I defended Ann Coulter? And she's NOT my friend.... you are my friend.


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Quote:

Everyday extremists and the like cross Iraqi borders to kill American troops. And basically, our military is there to engage them. Every suicide bomber, or al-qaida member that dies in Iraq is one less.




Tyler, I don't think you're strategic scenario is far off the mark...I think the Bush administration is thinking along your lines, although Isimply don't think it's a good one.Are extremists and the like crossing the Iraq border to fight us everyday? Yes. How many? The smallest estimates is less than a percent, the highest around 3-4.

The key follies of Bush in this war is his thinking without thinking. People can brush off the talk of 'exit strategy', 'we'll be greeted as liberators', 'Mission accomplished', but the truth is that Bush and Co.really have no idea what they are doing, and their simplistic thinking - such as the 'bring them to us' argument - buries them everytime. We can argue whether what they're trying to do is right...but they are clueless when it comes to fighting 'terrorism'.

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To attempt to blame our intervention in Iraq as the reason for terrorism




ARRRR, wrong again. No one blamed it as the reason for terrorism, its simply more fuel for future terrorism. It didnt create the problem, only perpetuate it.



Of course there were Jihadist before we attacked. There will always be Jihadists,there will always be war mongers no matter what their race or creed.
But bombing their homes and killing their families is doing nothing to stop the cycle of violence. And this is not exactly the first crusade against them.
Without even getting to the fact that Iraq has never attacked us, was never in a position to attack us. And was nearly as wary of the extremists as we are. Sadaam was not a religious zealot in case you forget, but we have now turned Iraq into a breeding ground for highly trained combat hardened Jihadist who now have a personal cause to hate us aside from the usual evil west propaganda.


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