DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Johnny Manziel...continued x2

And we don't have to worry about an OC that allowed his Offense to just collapse for the last half of the season either.

Sounds like we both won.

I like designed runs for the QB, rarely, as a surprise and when the game is on the line. Other times, you really shouldn't need them, IMHO.

I read the full article somewhere else. My take on it was far different from Mourg and Daman's.

My take is that when praising a qb, the thing you talk about is how quick he is and how he makes guys miss.

I heard nothing about his ability to read defenses or coverages. Nothing about throwing w/anticipation. Nothing about him making throws from the pocket. Nothing about him being a leader of men. Really, I heard nothing that would lend me to think that he has the skills needed to be a quality starter at QB in this league.

Fans would call Jay Cutler a wimp when he'd go down before a hit. So I'd expect Manziel knows he'd get that same treatment.

Yes, as long as he can read post-snap coverages.

Browns QB Johnny Manziel living with former high school coach

Another step in the changes Johnny Manziel has made this offseason: He is living in the Cleveland area with a former high school coach who had a tremendous influence on him.

That's the word from Cleveland Browns cornerback Joe Haden, who visited ESPN's First Take on Wednesday morning and revealed that Manziel was living with his former coach from Kerrville, Texas.

Haden didn't specify the name of the coach, but an athletic department official from Kerrville Tivy High School confirmed that it is Julius Scott, Kerrville's former offensive coordinator and a major influence on Manziel.

The Houston Chronicle said that Scott was the disciplinarian for Manziel and his high school team. Manziel told the Chronicle that Scott "had the single biggest impact on my development as a player." Manziel added he didn't get emotional after winning the Heisman Trophy as a freshman until he saw Scott.

"When I saw him, I just lost it," Manziel told the Chronicle. "I bawled my eyes out right there. I told him, 'I would never have been here without you.'"

Manziel spent 10 weeks in a treatment facility and left in April just before the Browns' offseason program began. Manziel told Haden he needed the time away, the Browns cornerback said.

"He's doing all the right steps," said Haden, who has become good friends with Manziel. The pair attended the Cavaliers' Game 3 win over the Warriors in the NBA Finals on Tuesday.

Manziel has not spoken to the media since he left the treatment facility. The Browns' final open offseason practice is set for Thursday, and a minicamp is scheduled for June 16-18.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/130527...gh-school-coach

interesting. wonder if the browns or johnny hired him to do that or just coincidence?

Useful information if only to show that Manziel is trying to stay on the right track What concerns me though (but maybe it is necessary at this point), is that he is being dependant on others as opposed to fighting this himself. What happens when it's only him? Having said that, so far, so good...

well i wasnt thinking of that really as much as i wonder if the guy was hired as a kinda private tutor to help with film study and such or he is just some one who has a job in the area and they are just splitting the rent or something like that.

Interesting question if only for the trivia...

think your wrong about that. alot of drug addicts go to a halfway house when they get out of rehab. to tell the truth i was surprised he didnt. you could be right. maybe the guy is a babysitter?

I think the big thing that separates Johnny from a jerk like Gordon is that at least JM is trying to get it right.

I don't know if he'll be able to stay clean or if he even has the right skill set to be an NFL QB, but at least he's trying to change.

I gotta give him credit for that and it makes me want him to succeed even more.

No, that's not what I was implying. I have a vaque awareness of the recovering process and wondering (out loud) if he will be able to address the demons on his own...

His teammate addressed the issue on First Take when asked about Manziel's support system in Cleveland.

BEREA, Ohio – As Johnny Manziel tries to build his future with the Browns, he's reaching into his past for help in doing it.

Teammate Joe Haden told ESPN's First Take on Wednesday that Manziel's former high school football coach is staying with the quarterback at his suburban dwelling on the West Side.

A Kerrville Tivy High School athletic department member said the coach is former Tivy offensive coordinator Julius Scott. Manziel has not spoken to the media since the Browns' off-season conditioning began in April, so he hasn't confirmed that it's indeed Scott.

His teammate addressed the issue on First Take when asked about Manziel's support system in Cleveland.

"He brought in his high school coach now to live with him so he's living with his high school coach," Haden revealed on First Take. "So he's doing all the right steps."

Manziel is trying to get his career back on track after a disappointing and controversial rookie season and a 10-week stint in rehab.

Scott has been a key figure in Manziel's life. The Tivy coaches merited mention in the quarterback's 2012 Heisman Trophy acceptance speech and the Texas A&M product told the Houston Chronicle:

"The guy that really brought it out in me was Julius Scott, my offensive coordinator at Tivy," he said. "He had the single biggest impact on my development as a player.

"After I won the Heisman, I was cool and calm and didn't lose my emotions until I got to the top floor and the Heisman suite. Coach Scott was there. When I saw him, I just lost it. I bawled my eyes out right there.

"I told him, 'I would never have been here without you.' His shirt was soaking wet when I pulled away."

Scott, who spent 10 years at Tivy, was a disciplinarian, especially with quarterbacks, according to the Chronicle report.

"This is the man who put his foot down and said, 'We're not going to be like every other team.'" Manziel said. "If you didn't practice, you didn't play. Whether it was me scoring eight touchdowns in a game, we were all held accountable. We were all held to the exact same standards. If I missed a practice, I didn't play."

The Browns and Manziel's handlers are trying to establish a support system for the quarterback. Donte Whitner said recently that Manziel's and LeBron James' business partner, Maverick Carter, is "taking big responsibilities in making sure that Johnny is doing all the right things."

Haden, who's a good friend of Manziel, told First Take that presumptive starting quarterback Josh McCown also is serving as a mentor to the second-year pro. The cornerback said former Browns quarterback Brian Hoyer was reluctant to bring Manziel "under (his) wing" because they were competing for the starter's job a season ago.

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/06/joe_haden_reveals_that_johnny.html

""He brought in his high school coach now to live with him so he's living with his high school coach," Haden revealed on First Take. "So he's doing all the right steps."

Vers and I both posted our belief that Hoyer and Manziel could not co-exist. One had to go and you know it wasn't going to be Manziel...

too bad we kept the one with the least upside.

We did? lol.

Flip was the QB coach in Oakland, not the OC. Greg Olson was the OC, and Al Saunders was the Senior Offensive Assistant. Flip coached and developed the QB. He did not call plays.

By what I have seen on TV and heard I believe AA has sponsors to call if the person is feeling weak, some people need more help than others and even if he doesn't pan out at QB I give him credit for getting help with his addiction.

At this point in time, that remains to be seen...

They do. Addiction is such a tough and devastating thing.

Let's pray that Johnny can get through this. Not too many people like the guy and most of us have been very critical of him, but man, the kid is trying and I think we should all at least come together and support the guy as he tries to straighten his life out.

Like I said earlier, you don't see Gordon making these types of moves to get his life together and he has multiple infractions and suspensions. Johnny has none of those, that we know of.......

I say we should at least support the kid, even if he isn't our QB of the future. His life is more important that the Browns.

Yes we should! Very well said, Vers...

The Browns coaching staff, especially Pettine, "openly" promoted the competition between Hoyer and Manziel. Hoyer gave them exactly what they asked for ..read...



Browns coach Mike Pettine says QB competition between Brian Hoyer and Johnny Manziel won’t be “warm and fuzzy”


Filed on May 19, 2014 by Scott Petrak

AKRON — The highly anticipated quarterback competition between incumbent Brian Hoyer and rookie first-round draft choice Johnny Manziel promises to be hotly contested.

Just like Browns coach Mike Pettine wants it.
“They’re ultra-competitors,” he said Monday. “We don’t want guys who are going to be warm and fuzzy. They’re fighting for a job. It’s somebody you’re going to be working with. It’s a unique situation where you’re competitive, you want that job.

“They’re going to be friendly to each other, but it’s not going to be this warm and fuzzy. That to me is how you want your quarterback to be. The Peyton Mannings and the Tom Bradys probably aren’t the warmest and the nicest to the guys who are coming in trying to take their jobs.”

Pettine vows it will be a fair fight. He met with coordinator Kyle Shanahan and quarterbacks coach Dowell Loggains on Monday to discuss a plan to ensure the playing field is level.

“You have to plan it very well,” Pettine said before speaking to a group of about 300 fans at the Akron Browns Backers banquet. “They’re going to get ahead and chart it, who’s getting reps with this offensive line, with these tight ends, with these receivers, just to make sure that we’re getting a level evaluation on it.”

The battle will continue through the offseason, into training camp and likely into the preseason. It will be the focus of the media and fans.

Pettine isn’t trying to deflect the attention. But he did add a touch of humor.

“I don’t know if they’re going to be sending each other Christmas cards anytime soon,” Pettine told a few reporters in the morning after appearing with Indians manager Terry Francona at a Positive Coaching Alliance breakfast at FirstEnergy Stadium. “But they both know they’re in it together and they’re going to compete. I think they both feel comfortable that, as a staff, the best quarterback that puts us in position to win games, we’re going to put him out there.”

Growing up in North Olmsted, Hoyer dreamed about being the Browns quarterback. When the dream was interrupted after three starts last year by a torn anterior cruciate ligament, he vowed to continue it this year.

That didn’t change with the addition of Manziel. In fact, Hoyer told general manager Ray Farmer and Pettine he welcomed the competition.

As the veteran, Hoyer opens in front. Pettine said before the draft he’d prefer not to start a rookie quarterback because most struggle and hurt the team’s chances to win.
“Right now, Brian Hoyer is the starter,” Pettine said. “It’s his job for somebody to take.”

That somebody would be Manziel, the former Heisman Trophy winner and No. 22 pick on May 8. He participated in rookie minicamp over the weekend and will join the veterans for organized team activities this week.

“It was a good start for him,” Pettine said of rookie camp. “We weren’t that concerned about the execution of plays. It was very difficult with a pieced-together offensive line and receiving corps, guys who were learning the offense, too. I thought he did a good job handling himself in the huddle and making the call and the pre-snap communication, knowing where to go with the ball.

“It was a good learning process for him. I think it was a positive thing.”

Manziel also impressed Pettine with his off-the-field demeanor — among teammates and in an interview with local reporters. As the Browns organization tries to get a handle on how it will deal with the newfound attention, Manziel already has a grip on his hype.

“He said all the right things,” Pettine said. “That’s one of the reasons we drafted him because we knew he could handle it. He knew he was going to have to take a step back. He was going to have to kind of check his ego at the door and earn that nickname (Johnny Football) again.

“He knows that he has to earn the trust and respect of his teammates, that they can look at him and know, ‘We understand you did it in college, let’s see you do it in the NFL.’ He’s going to get every opportunity to do that.”

Pettine said Manziel’s been “quiet, humble, fun to be around and very serious about football.” He thinks Manziel’s football IQ has been underrated.

“He’s well-prepped mentally for the NFL game,” Pettine said.

Manziel could get an early jump in the competition because the Browns are being careful with Hoyer’s surgically repaired right knee. They don’t want to expose him to inadvertent contact in 11-on-11 drills in the 10 OTA practices that precede a mandatory minicamp June 10-12. Hoyer wants the restrictions removed now, but that likely won’t happen until minicamp or training camp in July.

“We’re going to try to simulate 11-on-11 for him, have the D-linemen take a couple of steps and stop so he gets the feel of the huddle, calling it to all 11, running the play but not having the potential of bodies flying around him,” Pettine said.
link

Pet was saying a lot of stupid stuff when he first came in. I dont know if he liked to hear himself speak or was just not used to dealing with the press what but everytime he opened his mouth he made me think he was a bit retarded. I am a huge fan of the guy but he did nothing to impress with his poor selection of comments. Pet could learn from Belly sometimes lol

Browns QB coach Kevin O'Connell won't rule out Johnny Manziel starting: 'My thoughts on Johnny haven't changed'



By Mary Kay Cabot, Northeast Ohio Media Group
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on June 11, 2015 at 8:30 PM, updated June 11, 2015 at 8:36 PM

Berea, Ohio -- Browns new quarterbacks coach Kevin O'Connell knows Johnny Manziel well enough not to count him out even before training camp begins.

Asked if there's a chance Manziel can beat out favorite Josh McCown for the starting job, O'Connell said, "Yeah, I think right now coach (Mike) Pettine's been very clear that Josh is here for a reason, but we build everything around here on competition and that's how everybody gets better. And that's why it's important that this spring that we've been able to install our offense and give these guys the tools they need come the fall that we can have a competitive environment.''

O'Connell raved about Manziel after preparing him extensively for the pre-draft process last year as a private tutor, and feels the same way about him after working with him in the Browns offseason program the past six weeks.

"My thoughts on Johnny have not changed,'' O'Connell said. "I thought very highly of him when I got a chance to work with him before the draft. We spent a lot of time in the classroom obviously talking about the NFL game from a defensive perspective as well getting ready to play the hardest position there is really and how he would transition to that.

"We're still talking about a guy that's in his second year now. Having been through it, obviously, getting some starts last year will help him. But I can tell you from the first time I met Johnny until now, I still see the same competitive guy that comes into work every day to get better and that's all we can really ask of him right now and he's really responded to what we have asked of him."

Despite Manziel's shaky six starting quarters last year, O'Connell still believes he can success in the NFL. Plenty of folks believe otherwise, including some who coached Manziel last year.

"All of our quarterbacks we have in our quarterback room right now, they wouldn't be here if we didn't think that they could succeed at this level,'' said O'Connell. "I think it's a testament to those guys and how they're working right now, that we feel great about all of them. But at the same time, the competition will sort itself out.

"But as far as Johnny goes, he understands that he's earning the right to not only compete here but to play this position which is very difficult and it takes a commitment on a daily basis. He's done a tremendous job with that.''

In an interview before the 2014 draft with CBS Houston Radio, O'Connell praised Manziel.

"All the things that make (Tom) Brady and (Peyton) Manning special, Johnny Manziel is capable of doing those things," he said. "Now it is on him to continue to learn it and apply it to his game.

"Wherever Johnny goes I think he will be a great pro and I think he is going to work extremely hard to become the best possible player that he can be. I think the sky is the limit. The NFL has a funny way of allowing the cream to rise to the top no matter where you are picked.

"I think Johnny is immensely talented. I think he is incredibly talented. I think the next step for him comes from two things, learning the NFL game, learning how his offense can best suit him and how he can get the ball to the receivers around him. Number two, learning the pro game of how to take care of yourself. How you withstand the punishment to play 16 games and hopefully more if you make the playoffs."

At the time, O'Connell cautioned that Manziel would have to learn to operate from within the structure of the pocket.

"The best thing he is going to do is learn the game and learn the inside and outs of an NFL playbook and I think you will start seeing less and less of Johnny Football running around making crazy plays and more of the rhythm and timing and reading coverages and getting the ball out of his hand,'' said O'Connell. "Which will do two things: it will get the ball into his playmakers hands and let them make big time plays and that will keep him healthy."

After watching hours of film with Manziel, he noticed a special skill that will serve him well in the NFL.

"He's got a photographic memory," O'Connell said. "He can remember what he was thinking, why he made the decision he did and why a protection went a certain way it did. He just constantly wants to be learning and understanding the bigger picture."
O'Connell watched Manziel get frustrated with himself and pound the ball after a botched play Thursday in OTAs, but he doesn't necessarily believe that's a bad thing. Manziel heatedly discussed the miscue with Terrance West on the sidelines.

"He gets frustrated when things don't go exactly how he planned, or how he hoped they would go, but that's playing the position,'' said O'Connell. "All four of our guys have been tremendous overcoming any adversity on the field that they've found through the first nine OTAs and I think that will only help them come the fall.''

As for the differences between Manziel this season and last, O'Connell, hired in February, said, "I can't really speak too much to last year when he was with the Browns. I can tell you that he's the same competitive guy that wants to get better on a daily basis that he was when I worked with him before the draft. As far as what he's been like since we started the offseason program, we're throwing a lot at those guys and I think they've all responded really, really well.''

O'Connell, who was in partnership with quarterback guru George Whitfield Jr., the Massillon, Ohio native before coming here, dismissed the notion that he took the job because of Manziel.

"Why I took the job is I have a tremendous amount of respect for the head coach and the offensive coordinator (John DeFilippo) and I'm extremely passionate about being a football coach and growing in this role and trying to do whatever I can to help this team obviously win,'' he said. "My relationship with Johnny hopefully is a benefit to help me coach him to be the best possible player for the Cleveland Browns he can become.

"But the same thing goes for Josh McCown and Thad Lewis and Connor Shaw. I'm very lucky to have a group of guys working as hard as they are as I've transitioned into this role. They've been tremendous and I'm just absolutely excited to get to next week's minicamp and then on into training camp.' cleveland.com

Wow! Pet was all over that one.

I am rooting for Johnny, but comments like this one make me wonder about the coaches we have hired:

Did you happen to read that article about last year's competition?

Man, what are you getting so worked up about? Relax bro. All that rage is not good for you. I am saying that as a friend and I am not criticizing you. Relax tab. Y'all don't have to agree. It'll be okay.

is he not capable? they didn't see he IS, but that he's capable.

No, I don't think so. Not even close.

I always thought he brought special gifts to the field, but his gifts are so different than Manning's and Brady's. The comment made zero sense to me.

Manning was groomed his entire life to be an NFL QB. Brady was accurate and came from a prosystem. Thats the big difference right now. Johnny is playing catch up on the mental side of things.

There's nothing wrong with that. Any serious recovering substance abuser will tell you they need to be held accountable all the time. A young and rich guy like Manziel doesn't always wind up being accountable to anyone until it's too late. Whatever it takes to get him to the point where we can make a decision about his future with the team.

What is wrong with it? I think you're over analyzing. He is saying he is capable of doing. Key word is "capable." What is O'Connell referring to "special?"

Johnny had the "it" factor. It was stated over and over it would take Johnny time to learn pro football. It all boils down whether Johnny wants it bad enough.

I disagree and it boggles my mind that anyone will defend that statement. He said.......all the things that make Brady and Manning special....

I don't think JM:

--will ever be able to see over the top of the LOS.

--read defenses at the LOS like either guy.

--read coverages post-snap like either guy.

--stand in the pocket like those guys.

--throw as accurately.

--have the same arm strength.

--throw w/the same anticipation.

--be the leader that either guy is.

Look, if O'Connell would have said that JM is capable of being as successful in regards to winning that those guys are........I could buy into it, even though it is a bit of a stretch.

I could have bought in if he would have said that all the things that make/made Wilson, Tarkenton, Staubach, Cunningham special are things that JM is capable of.

But, the things that make Brady and Mannning special are not what makes JM special. I can't believe anyone is even attempting to debate this.

"Johnny had the "it" factor. It was stated over and over it would take Johnny time to learn pro football. It all boils down whether Johnny wants it bad enough."
========================================================

People may misinterpret my feelings about Manziel.

Nobody would be more happy to see him succeed.

However, he has not done one thing on the field up to this point in time to contribute to the team. All the talk that surrounds Manziel has been about his life outside of the field.

He has to prove he can play professional football.

It has nothing to do with "how bad he wants it".

If he wants it more than a fat kid wants cake he still has to show he can play at a NFL level.

That is a tall order. As we all know playing quarterback in the NFL requires multiple skills played under extreme duress.

When Manziel demonstrates he can do that; then I will applaud. Then I will talk about what he is doing and how he is contributing to the team.

As for now there is nothing to talk about.

I agree, if it was a matter of Manziel "wanting it bad enough" or "getting his head on straight", I would feel way better about the situation. But there are way deeper issues than that, and I just don't think he can overcome them. He's a long shot as an NFL quarterback and his selection in the first round was a head scratcher. I figured him for one of those QB's the media drools over but falls to the second or third round come draft day. If only Jerry Jones had pulled the trigger. Sigh.