DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Biggest problem with the offense?

Couldn't be that Pettine realizes one of his own shortcomings so is working to better understand the "other side of the ball". Couldn't be that he's striving to become a better HC. Couldn't be that he feels comfortable with Jim O'Niel and feels he can take this opportunity to become a more complete HC.

Couldn't be anything positive.

Why is every little thing met with suspicion and doubt?

J/C..

Reading through most of you guys posts makes me start re-evaluating my view of Pettine. This isn't about liking...disliking Pet, It's more about his capabilities to coach this team to the big game.

Until the end of this season, only then i feel I can justify the stance I have on him.. You guys really bring up points that make me kind of question what the team has in him.

Seeing Buffalo's D the other night started this process for me.. Many of you pointing out that when Pet was in Buffalo he had very good talent on his " D " . but yet failed in the run stop game.

Having been practicing with Buffalo two days prior to the Thursday night game and seeing some of the play made me wonder if.. WE just sat back and played down to be vanilla and rest some guys and not put others at risk for injury... The Coaches got to get a feel for the players during those two days of practice, they probably got to see what they needed to. So maybe a pre-season game win wasn't the big concern for them.

Now with the talk of Pet and Shanny again. I start wondering if it is really a good thing for Pet to get involved with the " O " and just how involved should he get... I saw the vid in another thread where Pet wanted Shanny to Run the ball... and Shanny looked at pet and gave him that look... Pet said okay do your thing.

It made me wonder just how much of that went on during the season.. Is it common for most HC's to do that ? Probably ... But are.. were the circumstances for it right ? and when is it ?

Once again I bought into accepting and liking Pet because I heard he's from a football family.. A knowledgeable father and one who won a lot.. and one who passed his knowledge onto his son.. Again.. this knowledge was all at the HS level.. Don't get me wrong.. I respect what the Pettines have accomplished... I just feel like Pet has a lot of learning to do in the NFL level.

I'am more than willing to give Pet all the time he needs to learn , grow and succeed in the NFL.. it's just this getting involved with the " O " that has me curious on if it is going to be a good thing or not. only time will tell.

I'm some what comparing this to choosing a book to read or even buying a car. What attracted me to it ? was it the fancy cover that drew my attention to it ? The fancy paint job and body style ?...Or was it the words in the reviews that sold me on it ?

All I know is I don't know what I have until I get inside of it.. Are the words written inside the book drawing me into a good story .. Or is it one of those books where I tell myself..."the cover was the best thing, sure was disappointed " Or did I say " damn that was a great read "

Same as that fancy car.. Did the Motor perform well and get me where i needed to be... or did it putter out and leave me stranded..

I guess what Im saying is ..what got me sold on Pet ? His looks ? his apparent knowledge of the game ? his abilities to Coach this team to a Super Bowl ? His words he used ? I just don/t know...

Many posts from different posters and every ones different views on different threads sure got me wondering what to expect... I do know what is said is nothing more than some ones review on a matter... But you all have brought up some very good points...

Pre-season is like a book cover...It's there to get your attention... get you to get interested.. but doesn't let you know whats really inside.... The Season is opening the book and reading it to the end... Hoping the story starts off good and carries through to the end.. Nothing worse than putting down a book and not wanting to pick it back up...

I'm anxious to begin this story and hope that when I read the words the end... I can tell myself.. "Damn that was exciting "

I really like Pettine so far. Not crazy about Farmer so far.

But both are very new at their respective positions. To me, they're both works in progress. So my opinions are based on small sample sizes which could change as they evolve.

I do find it concerning that it seems everyone of our top level coaches are new at their respective positions. For this to have any reasonable expectations of quick success, it's like expecting every rookie you draft to be great picks and turn out well in a single draft class.

That really decreases the odds when you expect a first time HC, first time GM, first time DC and first time OC to all pan out.

I've heard of the 30 point presentation. Has anyone seen this list? I thought it was leaked out a power point presentation was given. From there, media speculated what was on it. I'll admit I've never seen it. If posted and I missed, I'll shut up.

I don't think we should expect quick success.

And while I do think it's concerning that all the high level folks are first timers, we've also tried proven guys to help the HC that didn't work out either. Childress didn't make a difference. Turner and Horton didn't make a difference. Hell, our best season in 2007 was with a first time HC in his third season, a first time DC in his third season, and a first time OC in his first season. Not a lot of experience there.

But you know what happened? We got great QB play and the record reflected it.

This is going to be a rocky season unless Manziel really comes on. I think we should all expect that. I think we should all expect this to be a rocky season.

I believe it will be a tough season as well. As long as this regime shows steady progress heading in the right direction, I'm fine with that. Sometimes that isn't directly reflected on the W/L record.

As far as the "one season" you described, I believe a part of the reason was the team going all out buying up FA contracts to win before Al died.

And I believe we can both agree that we aren't looking for a "one hit wonder" type of season, but rather a strong team in the form of a dynasty being built. For the team and coaching staff to grow together to make us a force year in and year out.

biggest problem on offense is that it's trash.

well.... we are the browns thats why.....

... and in my opinion that is the basic rationale behind the rampant dogging on the team.

There is a lot of value in mindfully pointing out the problem issues with the team.

There is no value in mindlessly pointing out everything as a negative.

very simple and basic. he learned that you can trust no one last year. farmer hammer that home. so now he wants to be informed about everything. is that a good thing? could be but there is such a thing as spreading your self too thin too. just today i heard he yanked duke johnson out of practice over riding the OC.

The other side of the coin says that too many people view everything as positive and don't look at things realistically.

Could a former high school qb be overrating his own offensive knowledge? Could having a first time OC and QB coach be scary? Could moving away from your expertise and delving into something that you have no experience at in the NFL be dangerous?

Nah, it's all good say the "positive posters." "Nothing to worry about." "People who question some of these moves are simply negative and probably ignorant."

Yeah, right.

I like this post a lot Pit... You know why ? Because when we had what ?... 4 Ex HC's on this team ..what was that 2012 -13 ? can't remember.. I really thought all this coaching experience was going to put us in the running for a play-off birth... And instead what happens ?

I started to think bringing in young guys with new ideas would be the best thing for this team... I wasn't meaning every new season..But very much willing to give them ..what do most of you think # yrs ?

I like hearing all the discussions with the different assumptions and even some of the bickering is helpful and you learn some from it... if anything it opens your mind to accepting or realizing what lies a head for the season..Often I thought this is who or how it should be.. than some one brings up a point... and I'm like damn that's a really better way to go.

I just don't understand no matter who we put in as FO or Coaching staff we always seem to fail... Although we went 7-9 i have a hard time accepting the fact we were better...I think if we were really better... we would have made that play-off spot.. jmo

The season really just needs to get started so the many views from the different posters on here can start falling into place..

Honestly Pitt I tell myself I'm willing to give the staff time to jell... and really ... selfishly I don't want to.. but realizing I have to...Because it's only been a season...

I want to be in a way a homer... to be positive and hope for the best... then at times i just want to say... () and move on..

How much more slapping in the face and money out of my pocket going to the games can I take..And by the way... sitting with peen all season and tailgating with Columbus and every one else makes being a Browns fan the best thing in the world.

Pre-season sucks... some may love to see what other players have to offer or not have to offer.. Then we never know what the Coaching staff has to offer because the fear of it being gone at the season end is so realistic. So again here we are discussing.. if the coaches got the best out of the player..

I'm sorry guys... but for some reason ... this is a hard pre-season for me.... And I really appreciate every ones replies and your thoughts...Not just to me but to others whether or not we agree or not... whether you don't respect me or not... I just need all of you to help me get through this season...



Thank you !

ddubia's post was very balanced...

I'm starting to learn.... Thanks

Ray Farmer had all this money under the salary cap high draft picks
And the best he can do with skill positions is bring in Bowe Hartline Maule
And Ben Tate over 2 years.
West is headache and Crowell can only run the ball.
Oh and he landed the most coveted FA QB on the market
How many skill position players on the Browns could start for other AFC North teams?

What exactly is the problem with West ? Has anyone been able to actually pin point the problem ?

Montgomery called out both young backs to step up and be leaders.West seems to have this sense of entitlement to his position.

or a lack of giving a darn... that sucks hearing stuff like that.. if you want to be on a team sport than you must help every team member do their best...so you can win as a team..... smh

thanks for the info

I kinda wish they would have brought in Chris Johnson this season.

Chris Johnson could miss 1-2 weeks with hamstring injury

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/13492583/chris-johnson-arizona-cardinals-hamstring-injury

Going back to the injury thread... I believe the cheer leaders are the only ones not pulling their Hammys

I'd like to help them try

lol I bet you would

As soon as I read the words "pull" and "hammy"...
...I knew where this was- um... 'headed.'

A pulled Ham Sammich?

Yup... here we go-

straight to here:

There are fans who are "just fans". They may know little about football and nothing about the behind the scenes of FO operations or coaching philosophies but they are fans nonetheless. They're on a team message board and take great pride in hearing positive things about the team and, in turn, post positive things. Their comments and statements may not be particularly helpful in discussions. But at the same time they're pretty much uncritical enthusiasm and excitement and are harmless.

There are other fans, probably most, who do know something about football and who do understand the inner workings of coaching and FO types who see the whole picture to varying degrees. They are able to point out the positive and negatives from a more educated and experienced viewpoint. Their comments and statements may be right or wrong or simply an opinion. Either way their posts are food for thought and can often garner good discussions.

Then there are fans who simply throw out negative comments on each issue with no real thought behind it but rather think it cute to do so. Their comments add nothing to discussions. They are simply negative and probably ignorant.

All right...which one of you is "Elpresador" on YouTube???? That is some hilarious stuff. Loooool

Believing that a journeyman QB can get it done.

Did he walk out on the practice field fast enough for you? Did he yell to much or not enough at practice? Did he shake it one to many times after he peed?

Duke Johnson will change your mind.

You make it sound like he was in disagreement with the OC and so he pulled rank on him.

Pettine said they had him on a play count. Why set a count if you're only going to ignore it. Johnson reached his count so he was done for the day.

Never let facts get in the way of a good story...

it's very clear in the presser from yesterday. Pettine had him on a count, he reached that count, at some point, after sitting for a while, Flip wanted to insert him and Pettine said he used his "Executive Powers" (or something like that) and said no because Duke had been sitting too long.

Nothing else to it. In fact, it sounds smart to me.

you can babble any crap you want to but the fact is flip wanted him out there and pettine yanked him.

"“He was on a count. The last stretch of practice, we didn’t use him. On the last play, Flip (offensive coordinator John DeFilippo) wanted to use him and I used executive veto power and pulled Duke out of the huddle because he had sat for a little too long. He was right at his number.”"

http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/news/arti...b8-901897a4e35b

You are making much to much out of it.

Seems premature to dis a new OC and system after a two pre games. Think Pett said it was vanilla for the OC to keep it under wraps as long as possible. Have seen some interesting back action and some misdirection and unusual corner blocking, just a few flashes. Are they effective or merely weird? Not sure. But they are a departure from what we have seen last year, and as wrinkles, I noticed them because they are different.

The notion that a franchise QB makes all issues go away is hard to swallow. It will make us better, but it isn't the result of a single player IMO. Not directed at anyone in particular. I am also waiting on the Pigskin Messiah to walk over Lake Erie and into the Dawg Pound. Film at 11!

But I am willing to risk it, because it is a necessary solution long term for us.

Fail to see anything wrong in that. Try again

True. For the sake of ONE play, no need to make this into something it's not...