DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Terrance West traded to Titans

I just did mention H and H and let them have it too. I was wrong about them.... ALL of those wasted picks.

I STILL don't get what happened to T-Rich. EVERYONE thought he was a great back. He played very well his rookie year considering... almost 1000 yards. Over 10 touchdowns. Then BAM suckage. It's like his talent just vanished. It's weird. But it's reality. He's done. Heckert and Holmgren were every bit as bad if not worse than all the other bums that have come and gone.

Mangini..... The 99 draft killed us. Traded down again and again. We did get Mack eventually. But whiffed on 3 second rounders and the rest of the draft....

Etc. Etc. It's a horror show. Every bit the "Factory of Sadness"

Sorry, I'm starting to lose track of who drafted whom.

My point was that Banner traded someone for less than they were drafted for..

Pretty much as anyone who wasnt trading Hershal Walker has done..

Banner's draft wasn't very good. I do think that that was the worst draft class in years. Who made it big in the first round after Mingo?

You might be able to name a few, but do you seriously want me to counter w/the names of guys who made it big after TRich? After Gilbert? Nah..........no one wants that, because it ain't close. So, let's cut the crap.......okay?

I liked the McFadden pick, but you are right, it was a bad pick. Freaking third time I have had to admit it tonight. Funny how other people never admit when they are wrong, though. Whatever, I was wrong and so was Banner.

But, he made wise moves by trading picks in that putrid draft for higher picks in the following year's strong draft. That cannot be denied.

He traded TRich for a first.

He brought in Hoyer. Many don't like Hoyer, but he is the only qb in our return that has a winning record. He was 10 and 6 as a starter while all others during the same time period were 1 and 15. That is freaking amazing. I know people don't want to deal w/that stat, but it is the most important stat of all and it is very telling. Bringing in Hoyer was a good move.

Banner was the one who started the earning your keep thing. He wanted Little cut. He had his coaches have after practice drills in order to allow the bottom of the roster guys prove themselves.

He was not an attractive person. He was not a smooth talker. He was the smartest guy in the room. And I don't find the latter as a negative. I have enough confidence in myself to respect the "smartest guy in the room." Not intimidating at all. I like to learn from smart people rather than be dragged down by idiots........

Yes and no. He traded him for a first round pick. No one knew at the time where that pick would be. Eventually, it ended up as a lower pick. Though still in the first round. I HATED the trade at the time. I thought T-Rich was going to be a real player for us. How little I knew..... I was NO fan of Banner and Lombardi. Stil not. But in this particular case, in hindsight, it was an EXCELLENT trade. Can't fault the guy for that one. Now the Mingo selection and the bum corner who's name I can't even remember in the 2nd? That I can blame him for.

That's fair. I will let it go.

I will only say that I was totally against drafting TRich at 4...........nevermind giving up picks to move up to 3!!! People can back me up on that one.

I wanted us to trade down. It was a very deep draft w/the real value from about 7 through 30. The latter rounds through 4 were strong. Very strong. I had such visions of success for us. We were in perfect position to accomplish so much.

TRich never had good instincts. He had terrible vision. I was a RB in HS and college. I know. I repeated it ad nauseum. Got called the usual names by tab and the rest of the crew. But, I knew he was bad. I will say I didn't think he was that bad............sheesh, even I overestimated him. I do think he has some off the field issues.

I really wish we would have given Banner a chance. I know most of you hated the guy. He looks like a troll. He has a bad personality. But, the guy is smart. Made some good moves. He wasn't trying for a flash in the pan style.............he was setting the table for the long term.

It's depressing........

Clarify what you mean by Banner trading someone for less than what they were drafted for?

Are you talking about TRich?

Yeah, the idiots H and H traded up to number 3 for him. But he was cut by the Colts and by the Raiders. Two teams who are desperately in need of a RB. TRich is w/out a job right now...............and you are going to diss Banner? Really?

There's a difference between BEING the smartest guy in the room and THINKING you're the smartest guy in the room. Banner was a legend in his own mind. Ego was his sin. He really thought he was something....

McFadden was the guys name.... thanks that was going to bug me

Christ, I was just thinking.... Add in Heckerts last draft and we have had SEVEN first round draft picks the last four years. We have ONE starter playing Sunday from that group. It doesn't get any worse..... How the hell are we supposed to start winning if we can't draft better than that? Now I'm depressed! Time to start drinking and stop thinking! Peace

I'm not dissing anyone..

I'm simply pointing out that Banner traded a player we invested a Top 5 pick and multiple lower round picks, for a pick everyone knew would be in the 20s..

And yes, in hindsight, it was a great deal..

But you sit there and blast Farmer for trading a guy we used lower round picks on..

My overall point was, 9 times out of 10, you are going to get less than you paid for the player..

West wasnt as good as advertised and appeared to have a bad attitude, and we got something for him instead of cutting him..

I am not saying I am right, but I do think Banner was indeed the smartest guy in the room. I did not care if he was likable.

I just wanted a guy who could bring us a winner.

I absolutely loved when he fleeced the Colts, Steelers, and that other team that escapes me now.

I am trying to be patient w/you............but Farmer drafted West.

In fact, Farmer used a 3rd round pick on West. He also gave up a 4th and 6th to move up to draft West. He got a 7th in return.

Banner did not draft TRich. The idiots before him traded draft picks to move up one spot from 4th to 3rd to draft him. He sucked. Banner got a first round pick for a guy who is now out of football.

I fail to see your reasoning. Or perhaps, you fail to see mine????

The Browns!

What? He traded a 5th round pick for a 4th round pick to another team. It wasn't the Browns. Man, you have issues.

I'm pretty sure it was Indy.

He did that and the Pitt trade in the same draft if I do recall correctly.

I think you are right................I was going to say that, but it was hard to believe we fleeced them twice w/in less than a year.

Terrance West traded to the Titans because of immaturity and inconsistency | cleveland.com
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/09/terrance_west_traded_to_the_ti.html#incart_river

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- Former Browns running back Terrance West went south -- literally -- because of his inconsistency on the field and immaturity off of it.

The Browns were so willing to go in another direction with their 2014 third-round pick out of Towson that they shipped him to the Titans Sunday for a conditional lowly seventh-round pick -- even with eventual starter Duke Johnson in the concussion protocol.

The Browns tried to trade West on Saturday, but couldn't execute a deal with the Cowboys and perhaps another team or two. Northeast Ohio Media Group first reported that West wasn't safe heading into the final cuts.

If the Titans hadn't taken him off their hands, the Browns likely would've cut him. Remember, not only did they spend a third-round pick on him last year, they shipped a fourth- and sixth-round picks to the 49ers to move up and grab him at No. 94, presumably before his hometown Ravens did so at 99.

West, the Browns leading rusher last season with 673 yards, came into the season on shaky ground because of maturity issues and because he wasn't well-liked by some in Berea.

West had already been benched twice last season for not having good practice weeks and for not exhibiting the professionalism the Browns were seeking.

They gave him a chance to redeem himself this preseason, but didn't see enough to keep him around.

The telltale signs were there. Asked a couple of weeks ago if West had grown up, coach Mike Pettine said, "I think he's taken a step. I think there's still room for improvement but I think Terrance is headed in the right direction on that front."

The writing was on the wall again during the dress rehearsal game in Tampa Bay Aug. 29 when Pettine started Johnson ahead of West and Isaiah Crowell despite the fact Johnson had missed most of the preseason with a hamstring injury.

The heralded rookie left that game with a concussion and his status for Sunday's opener against the Jets is uncertain. But that didn't stop the Browns from unloading West for almost nothing just seven days before the big game.

For his part, West is open to the change of scenery, and it might do him some good. He wore out his welcome here, but he might be successful in Tennessee, where he'll compete with several backs for playing time.

"Can't wait to get to Nashville,'' West proclaimed in Instagram. "Everything I got, you will get.''

The Browns, meanwhile, will likely start Crowell Sunday against the Jets if Johnson's not ready, despite the fact he averaged only 2.8 yards on his 17 carries in preseason, with a long gain of 13.

A running back corps that looked deep and explosive in the offseason is suddenly thin and tenuous. The Browns signed third-year back Shaun Draughn to the practice squad Sunday after he had been cut Saturday in the final trim to 53. If Johnson isn't ready this week, Draughn will most likely be activated. The problem is, he suffered a thumb injury in the Orange and Browns scrimmage and is wearing a cast on his left hand.

Draughn played on offense for the first time in Chicago, but struggled behind the third- and fourth-team offensive line, carrying the ball eight times for only 11 yards (1.4-yard average) and catching one pass for minus 6 yards. Still, Draughn can fulfill some of Johnson's third-down duties if the rookie isn't cleared.

The Browns will also continue to look for help in the backfield. Last week, Pettine declined to rule out former Ravens back Ray Rice when acknowledging he might need to add to the pile because of Johnson's concussion. It's unknown if the Browns would sign him, but word out of Baltimore is that Rice and Wilbert Montgomery might not necessarily embrace the chance to work together again.

The Broncos also on Sunday waived running back Montee Ball, their second-round pick in 2013 who had spent much of the preseason as their No. 2 back. Other backs hit the streets Saturday and Sunday, and the Browns will remain on the lookout.

They'll do so, however, without general manager Ray Farmer, who begins his four-game suspension for impermissible in-game texting at 12:01 Monday morning.

In addition to needing a running back, the Browns are down to only two quarterbacks in starter Josh McCown and backup Johnny Manziel, who's suffering from tendinitis in his elbow and might not be ready for the Jets game. The Browns also have Terrelle Pryor, who narrowly made the team as a receiver, but played quarterback for three seasons in Oakland, including two with current Browns offensive coordinator John DeFilippo as his quarterbacks coach.

If the Browns need another backup for the Jets game, they might be able to re-sign Thad Lewis, who was cut Saturday. Third-teamer Pat Devlin might also resurface on the practice squad, which has two openings after the Browns signed eight to it on Sunday.

The biggest indication that West was in trouble came Thursday night in Chicago, when Pettine started him against the Bears and gave him the bulk of carries while Crowell got the night off with most of the rest of the veterans.

The next day, when Pettine was asked if West was in good standing with the team coming out of the preseason, he indicated that perhaps he wasn't.

"Terrance has had his – it's been well documented – ups and downs,'' said Pettine. "He flashes at times just brilliance and then other times where he gets a minus on the grade sheet, and that's always been some of the issues that we've had with him.

"We know he can do it. It just has to be on a more consistent basis. That's one of the reasons why we felt like he needed to get a good amount of work (Thursday) night."

The trade is an indictment of Farmer's inaugural 2014 draft. The Browns went into it with 10 draft picks, including three in the first 35 -- and emerged with only two starters in left guard Joel Bitinio, a second-round pick, and linebacker Chris Kirksey, a third-rounder. Their two first-rounders, Justin Gilbert and Manziel -- both of whom the Browns traded up for -- are not currently starting and the jury is still out on both.

If they don't pan out, the 2014 draft will have gone south, just like West.

I would love to see the Browns get Montee Ball, the 2013 second round pick of the Broncos. Last year he had an appendectomy and a groin issue.. one problem leading to the other. He is young.. now healthy.. and does not have the maturity problems of West. He might be worth a shot.

And if West was the only headcase we drafted last year, we might chalk it up to a single mistake in an otherwise helathy draft. Unfortunately, Johnny is a headcase and seemingly a benchwarmer. Dilbert is a headcase and West was such a headcase they had to get rid of him now.... That's THREE serious problems we drafted last year. It's like Farmer was TRYING to draft nutballs. What are the odds of drafting three serious problems like that in one draft? So either he was looking to draft problems or he didn't do his homework on the guys he drafted. Either way it's not looking good.

How big and how fast? I'm up for some help at RB. As long as it isn't Ray Rice or someone like him. Otherwise, if he's got some pep in his step and some fire in his belly, bring him in!

Soo....what are the odds he burns us in the second game vs Titans?

I bet our guys hate him as much as he hates the Browns now ... so he'll probably average his average

thats why i say maybe pettine is part of the problem.

j/c:

Nice!! Another Joe Banner thread!

In trading West, it can't help but be considered a failed draft pick wherever third round picks are concerned. There is no way around that. It must say a lot about the FO's view of West to trade him while having Johnson injured and Droughns just off a casted hand.

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Stories emerge about Terrance West, part of Browns bad draft record
Posted by Darin Gantt on September 7, 2015, 6:23 AM EDT
Indianapolis Colts v Cleveland Browns Getty Images

In the wake of the Browns trading running back Terrance West to the Titans for a sack of beans, comes the predictable story of what a bad teammate, guy and running back West was.

Via Mary Kay Cabot of the Cleveland Plain Dealer, the Browns had grown weary of West’s “inconsistency on the field and immaturity off of it.”

(Of course, the same could be said of the Browns themselves, but we’ll get there in a minute.)

West led them in rushing last year (allowing them to chase off a productive but grumbly veteran in Ben Tate), but that never translated into this year, when West had to play most of the preseason finale with the scrubs. But this story doesn’t center on football, rather the kind of ex post facto character assassination common with failed picks.

West is described as having “maturity issues,” and “wasn’t well-liked by some in Berea” and “not exhibiting the professionalism the Browns were seeking.”

Yes, because the high standard the Browns have set can not be sullied in any way.

It’s worth noting here that they seemed OK with West a year ago, when they traded up to take him in the third round of the 2014 draft. They sent a fourth- and a sixth-rounder to the 49ers, so they could move up to 94 to take the Towson State star, ostensibly so the Ravens wouldn’t at 99.

Of their 10 picks in the 2014 draft, they have two starters (left guard Joel Bitinio and linebacker Chris Kirksey, second and third-rounders). They haven’t gotten much from the guys they moved up to get in the first round, cornerback Justin Gilbert and quarterback Johnny Manziel.

Of course, this is also the same team that just used a fourth-round pick this year on wide receiver Vince Mayle, who was so bad in the preseason that not only was he cut, but he wasn’t invited back to the practice squad.

So maybe instead of texting his coaches during games in the future, maybe suspended General Manager Ray Farmer could solicit texts from Mel Kiper, Jr. and Mike Mayock on draft day

I sure get tired of reading articles like this about the Browns !

me too ... we're the continued laughing stock

just a poor cycle since 1999 and there's only one way out: find our own Andrew Luck QB, which is nearly impossible.

we have just enough talent to stay between picks 6-12 each year.

No Kidding !

West was not that good - has a bad attitude or is immature depending on how you want to look at it - flashed some, but danced more.

Kudos to Farmer for owning his mistake and letting the guy go. Of course it adds fuel to the Farmer haters - but lets be honest - in the last 15 years how many times have we seem the Browns hold on to draft picks 'just because' ... fastest way to fixing a problem and putting it right is admitting you have a problem. While there are some big ??? on Farmer's drafts - [1] It's still too early to know what we have (people saying Cameron is bust after 4 preseason games and him on a team with one of the best OL's in the NFL are simply mind boggling) [2] I am really very happy to see Farmer make tough decisions that potentially put him in a bad light.

Yeah, this speaks to just how great Farmer is.

"It’s worth noting here that they seemed OK with West a year ago"


Obviously the author didn't follow the Browns last year. They clearly had issues with his work ethic all last season.

I could have sworn West got more carries than any other back last year????

Because Shanahan liked him a lot.

Yeah... drained a high rounder on him and after a year - willing to take a conditional 7th? Ouch... just ouch.

So Crow and <insert name here> will be in charge on what's likely to be the most IMPORTANT aspect for our offense?

I don't even know what RB's are out there, and i'm not going to shift through 11+ pages to see if it's been discussed...

RB possibilities: Ray Rice, Jonas Gray, Ahmad Bradshaw, and maybe Pierre Thomas. Oh yeah, Edwin Baker the Touchdown Maker is also available.

Thank you Dave.

Of the list, wish it could've been Fred Jackson haha...

Gun to the head, forced to choose - I'd go with Pierre Thomas. I liked Baker, but it's my understanding the staff wants a vet (they have a vet in likely every position group here outside of RB) - so yeah... Pierre then Bradshaw.

I think the plan is for Duke to be the man.

Considering how he can only travel east and west, I don't see how he'll get that far south to TN anyway.

I would agree with that.

The Browns can ill afford to be whiffing on mid RD picks in the present when past regimes were drafting failures like Owen Marecic for example.
the Browns need to on as many drafts as possible in order to close the gap with the rest of the AFC North.
Farmer is a poor talent evalulator of talent.
His 1st RD picks from last season can't even crack the starting lineup.
Vince Mayle is working at In and Out Burger today.
meanwhile teams like the Bengals and Steelers are finding solid contributors in the mid RDs as we speak.
Farmer is on par with the past Browns GMs
Poor and in over his head.

I agree with all of this - and imo the roster is stronger now than ever, which is better than a weaker roster and having first round players of the caliber of Mingo, Phil Taylor, Weedon, Trich, Quinn or Wimbley .... all of whom have been "better" than Gilbert and JM have indicated so far ... but none of whom made much difference and the other additions/subtractions didn't make the team actually very good. . .

There are some concerns ... Are we lacking depth at QB RB and WR? Yes. Were the last 2 drafts chock full of WR talent? Yes - but it seems there was a plan to build the defense - and obviously the plan was for Johnny to progress... he still might although I don't know what his odds are - 15-30%? Anyway - the plan seems to have been to build a top 10 - top 5 defense first and with any draft - every drat pick - its a crap shoot. If people are honest with themselves - they have ALL pimped a first round selection that was a bust, either on the Browns or on another team.