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| by WSU Willie |
| WSU Willie |
I have too many memories of Browns teams flipping defensive schemes and/or drafting players who played a different position in college than they were asked to play for the Browns. I remember gaining the belief that 3-4 DEs/DTs were quite different from 4-3 DEs/DTs...to the point of not being interchangeable. That belief is being challenged and I seem to see and read that the chasm between Dlinemen skillset in the different "schemes" and where they line up has become more of a small crack than a chasm.
The best example I can give on this change is in the number of times (relatively recently) that we read about a guy (say a DE) who "can move inside on passing downs". I understand why it's done...no issue there. But I find it interesting that the various "lines" are becoming blurred regarding how/where they line up. We have a couple DEs on the roster today who are 250-260lb guys...almost more like 3-4 OLBs...we also have some tall, lean (looking) DEs in the 270+ range. We have several LBs who weigh less than our backup QB. It's a passing league...I get that...I just find it interesting that these players have now (suddenly?) become so "versatile".
My purpose for this post though is to look at the DTs we have on the roster or have recently picked/signed and to learn about what roles they play...especially given the above ^ two paragraphs:
Prior to the draft, our heaviest DT was Elliott at just over 300lbs. I recollect him as being more of a pass-rush-DT (I'll use the term 3T from here on out in this regard) who doesn't get much - if any - pressure. Day, Togiai, & Bryan (pre-draft guys) are similar in size. I'm pegging Day as more of a NT than a 3T, Bryan reads as a 3T and I have no idea on Togiai AND we continually read about DEs who can "slide inside on passing downs".
We go and draft Winfrey who reads like a 3T - who was asked to play too much NT last year. We pick a couple longer/leaner DEs and then (2) UDFAs who are both clearly NT types. Prior to the end of the draft, we could field a basketball team of DTs with nothing but non-NTs.
Are the (2) UDFAs really the only true NTs on the roster? What is/was Togiai? How does Elliott fit? Does anyone recollect seeing Bryan play - college or pro?
My apologies for taking so long to get to the true point here...it just seemed necessary to frame the DTs before getting to the point.
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| by guard dawg |
| guard dawg |
Just my random thoughts...
Winfrey is not nearly as effective at the 1-tech as he is as a penetrating 3-tech. Multiple draft analysts made this observation pre-draft.
The team needs a true 2-gap run defending DT. Glenn Logan has some ability to play this style of DL. The other guy from Illinois supposedly is a more effective pass rusher from the nose. We might need both of them.
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| by Ballpeen |
| Ballpeen |
Judging by last year's starters, the draft and this year's likely starters, it would appear as though we will stick with the bigger DE's and guys on the edge who can play the run really well and use penetrating DT's on the inside.
A slight shift from the traditional norm, but considering the number of teams (including Cleveland) that rely on the inside/outside zone running scheme, having more mobile guys across the board does actually fit as a resolution/answer.
I'd feel alot better about the DT group if Malik McDowell hadn't lost it.
I assume Sheldon Day will likely stick again as the "beef", Taven Bryan and Winfrey are straight penetrators, Togiai will hopefully step up on year 2. Elliott may have a fight for a spot if they don't roll with 5 DT's (and considering the number of time we moved the bigger DE's inside on 3rd downs, it's quite likely we may just keep 4 DT's).
Hard to see moving on from a guy before year 3 though. Training camp should be interesting.
Maybe we roll with 5 LBers in this 2 LB defense to free up the 5th DT spot.
DE: Garrett, Wright*
DT: Bryan, Winfrey*
DT: Day, Togiai, Elliott
DE: Clowney, Winovich, Weaver
OLB: JOK, TakiTaki, Fields
ILB: Walker, Phillips
Something like that-ish. Assuming Isaiah Thomas goes to the practice squad. I am hoping that Glan Logan can kick Elliott or Togiai to the curb. Of those two, we have seen Elliott and he is pretty weak. Of the two, I would give Togiai another year to see if he can be any better, if not, kick him to the curb next year. I am old school and feel at least one of your DT's needs to be a guy who can eat two blockers in the run game.
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| by Pdawg |
| Pdawg |
Judging by last year's starters, the draft and this year's likely starters, it would appear as though we will stick with the bigger DE's and guys on the edge who can play the run really well and use penetrating DT's on the inside.
A slight shift from the traditional norm, but considering the number of teams (including Cleveland) that rely on the inside/outside zone running scheme, having more mobile guys across the board does actually fit as a resolution/answer.
I'd feel alot better about the DT group if Malik McDowell hadn't lost it.
I assume Sheldon Day will likely stick again as the "beef", Taven Bryan and Winfrey are straight penetrators, Togiai will hopefully step up on year 2. Elliott may have a fight for a spot if they don't roll with 5 DT's (and considering the number of time we moved the bigger DE's inside on 3rd downs, it's quite likely we may just keep 4 DT's).
Hard to see moving on from a guy before year 3 though. Training camp should be interesting.
Maybe we roll with 5 LBers in this 2 LB defense to free up the 5th DT spot.
DE: Garrett, Wright*
DT: Bryan, Winfrey*
DT: Day, Togiai, Elliott
DE: Clowney, Winovich, Weaver
OLB: JOK, TakiTaki, Fields
ILB: Walker, Phillips
Something like that-ish. Assuming Isaiah Thomas goes to the practice squad. I am hoping that Glan Logan can kick Elliott or Togiai to the curb. Of those two, we have seen Elliott and he is pretty weak. Of the two, I would give Togiai another year to see if he can be any better, if not, kick him to the curb next year. I am old school and feel at least one of your DT's needs to be a guy who can eat two blockers in the run game. Problem is we don't have those big run stuffers on the roster. As far as NTs go only Elliot is significantly over 300. I have read he is 315. I like you hope that either Logan or Perry can eat blockers. Logan has the better frame to add weight of those two. From the best info I can find our mini camp DTs were Elliot and Bryan. Elliot had a PFF overall grade of 41.6. Bryan was 56.4.
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