At least from what has been posted Odell's rehab is on schedule. We see him running etc.
The question now is:
What can we really expect from Odell?
He came to the Browns with all the promise that hope can bring. The results were mixed. Freddie was no help. Baker was not so good. And injuries has been a part of Odell's career.
No one doubts his talent. He is an exceptional talent. By most accounts he is a good teammate. I have not heard it said that he is lazy or doesn't work hard.
Baker showed great improvement as the season went on. I think it is safe to assume that Baker starting a second year in the same system with the same coaching staff. Should continue to improve.
So, a healthy Odell with Baker in the same offense.
What are legitimate expectations for this pass/catch combination?
For me Odell has to play a full season. Talent is great but you have to be on the field available to play.
Odell is a number one receiver.
However, in their first go around Baker and Odell were not insync. That can no longer be in question. They must make that happen. At the same time we have a diverse offensive scheme that is based upon establishing the run. Then going play action. Odell needs to fit in. It can not be. Is Odell open or not throw him the ball.
Odell has accept what targets he gets. The offense will not about Odell's numbers. It will be under Stefanski how do we win?
If Odell has a good season( not necessarily great). I expect the Browns will as well.
Baker is a progression quarterback. He excels at reading the offense and throwing to who is open. Even back in college, in his final year, he had 5 different receivers with at least 400 yards-
Marquise Brown - 1095 CeeDee Lamb - 807 Dimitri Flowers - 464 Jeff Badet - 400 Mark Andrews - 958
Look at all of the times Josh Allen just fed Stefon Diggs last year. Or the times that Pat Mahomes fed Tyreek Hill. Or Aaron Rogers fed Davante Adams. Baker isn't like this. The Cardinals v Bills game last year, Kyler Murray had one play left. He throws a bomb to his #1 guy, DeAndre Hopkins, to make the winning play. The Browns v Bengals game last year, Baker had one play left. He didn't throw to his #1 guy (Odell was injured at this point, so it would have been Landry). He throws to DPJ, a rookie 6th round pick, for the winning play.
Baker doesn't need great receivers, he makes any receivers he has great. That's why Odell has never been the best fit in my opinion.
I love him for being able to take the top off the defense, draw extra coverage, and opening up the field for the rest of our guys. But as long as Odell wants to be a superstar receiver, he isn't going to work in Cleveland.
I think for Odell to work on the Browns, he has to let Baker do what he does best. And that means accepting the targets you're given each game, even if it's only 5 instead of the 10-12 that he wants.
The question of Odell staying healthy is up in the air, but that's not really in his control. What's in his control is fully adopting a team-first attitude. I think he's capable of having that, but there's been moments in these past seasons where he did not have that at all.
Disclaimer: I still love Odell. I have his Jersey. I don't want him to be traded. But just analyzing Baker's style, he's never seemed like the absolute best fit in Cleveland. But I still hope he has a monster year and I think it all starts with his attitude.
Quick name a player from LSU. ... Who started all 16 NFL games in the same year. uhh?
More seriously am I allowed to discuss that earlier, revisiting reports of 2019 games, I ran across the summary that included Jarvis Landrys' unsportsmanlike cost the Browns 1 point, after a missed longer extra point, vs. the Bills a week before the Myles and Mason Rudolph bull crud incident.
And reading it I instantly remembered the Unsportsmanlike penalty on JL in the playoff game or qualifier, this past year and sticking up for him. And what this means if it costs a game. Ehh forget it. Just Win Baby!
While I don't think it's ever fortunate when a player gets hurt, I do believe the time Baker had with the other receivers sans Odell did Baker a world of good. Perhaps because of some combination of mandate, Odell's high profile, high price, and extreme talent or perhaps because of them all, Baker had a tendency to "seek him out" sometimes holding the ball longer than time allowed and causing trouble for himself, or attempting to force it to Odell to the detriment of a possible completed pass to another receiver who was actually open.
Perhaps in part due to Odell's absence (and perhaps not) we were able to watch Baker grow right before our eyes last season. When the complaint (legitimate) was that he wasn't going through his progressions, the next week he would go through his progressions. When it appeared he had no touch because he overthrew a wide open receiver, the next week he came back and threw a beautiful touch pass or two for a first down or a score. He demonstrated again and again he could learn from mistakes and adapt to situations, and while I do give a lot of credit to coaching, it clearly demonstrated he puts in the work.
So regarding Odell, I am looking to see an exceptional WR on a great WR corp, get fed when open, and turn in some great numbers on a playoff bound team.
Man I'm excited. This is what we've waited for for decades. We have the coach, we have the GM, we have the staff, the QB and the roster to go all the way.
Your post makes it sound as if Odel is the problem. As if he's demanding the ball at the expense of a balanced passing attack. If that is what you are implying, I disagree strongly. Baker and Odel need to 1, develop chemistry, and 2, they need to reach a clear understanding about Odel's role within the offense. That requires communication between the players, the OC, the Passing Game Coordinator, and possibly the head coach.
Baker forced the ball to Odel to some extent before OBJ was injured. That wasn't all on the receiver.
Some might see this as special consideration for Odel that is unwarranted. I see it as an investment in the success of a major offensive asset so that the team maximizes its opportuniy to win.
It all comes down to if both Beckham and Mayfield can actually get on the same page.
He says that this is the first time he's actually healthy. THe past 4 years he's been nursing some lingering something. He's been out enough that it comes down to staying healthy.
At the very least it's an audition for a job somewhere else. I honestly feel though that he's going to do what he can to contribute wherever.
With the addition of Felton and Anthony Schwartz... I have a feeling that Stefanski is doing what he can to take heat off of Odell here. You have some guy who can fly waaay down field and keep the safeties honest... it creates space so that Odell can work one on one with corners.
I have a feeling that Odell will start to find himself a bit more open this year.
Great video and I’m glad for him to be recovered so quickly. He works his butt off by all accounts. I truly hope we can figure out a way to work him into the offense more seamlessly
He has had great flashes. Everybody knows his name.
Except now no analyist mentions his name when they dicuss best receiver.
Odell has not had that great year.
He looks ready to roll from the video.
I for one really want to see what this guy can do with Baker when they are insync.
Baker grew a bunch last year. He is way more comfortable in the offense and in the pocket.
I expect Baker to read open better from Odell.
What I believe makes Odell so good is his ability to separate. He has that incredible athletic ability to breakdown a route and get that step. His footwork and short space quickness is something of beauty to watch.
The big deal is stay on the field.
He needs to finish this season healthy.
If he can do that. We will see what we had hoped when he was signed.
I guess my perspective on OBJ is that while I believe he's fully capable of being 'Great' - I just want to see him and Baker on the same page, same play book, spend reps together to learn what each does when I play breaks down and what the tendencies are so they can react quicker to every situation .... Healthy and 17 games? That'd be really exciting. I don't care about the stats - I care about the ability to influence the team positively and the opposing defense negatively and contribute to the W's
Through his first three seasons OBJ had the second most receiving yards of any player ever besides Randy Moss. He was the best receiver in the league. We have likely seen OBJ's peak, that doesn't mean he isn't good anymore.
I love that he is a worker, he trains on his own and trains hard. I wish he would see the value of training with Baker. He has always worked the offseason on his own, shows up for camp ready to go, but has not worked any timing with the QB.
If he gels with Baker, things could get scary. The weapons this team has on offense, someone will always be open. If Odell, uses his skill at getting open, he will get plenty of touches.
I look at this all differently in that I sorta blame Bake for OBJ's failures here.
The best way to use OBJ is to make the weapons around OBJ more lethal and to get the ball to them more often when you have defenses adjusting to the other weapons because they are taking their defense apart OBJ becomes the kill shot.
In that regard and this is sorta off topic I look for DN to have a monster year and his success will lead to OBJ becoming lethal. His targets may be down a bit but his successes will be monstrous. We need what he brings to the table, what we don't need is a QB that doesn't understand that there will be times when defenses will focus on OBJ and if there is anything nearly any defense can do is take away a player. In most of the games OBJ played for us defenses tried to do 2 things stop Chub and take away OBJ.
By expanding and utilizing the other weapons Bake uses, OBJ becomes lethal the kill shot. That is the key for Bake, look elsewhere and when they fall asleep hit them over the head with OBJ.
The threat of OBJ can cause more problems then OBJ will ever cause by actually catching the ball or being targeted.
The way I view it, the offseason is for getting the body healthy and ready. It would be good to see him do *some* work with Baker and the other WR's, but this year I don't see much point because his main goal right now is proper recovery from the injury. Because of that injury, there just might not be ample time to work on real timing and stuff until we get to camp.
First off, I read 'DN' and could only think 'Dennis Northcutt', lol. It took me almost a full minute to realize you were talking about Njoku.
Second, I agree with your second paragraph on how best to utilize OBJ. I feel like that's how Stefanski was trying to approach it, but I think Baker was still getting comfortable in the offense and was defaulting to the "OBJ read" too quickly as he would feel the pressure. If teams were still focused on taking him away, then it was a lost play. OBJ having more drops than is typical didn't help, either. Heck, it seemed like both he and Landry were dropping a bunch.... or was that the Freddie year? Damn, my memory is going now, but I thought it was in early 2020 that we were seeing a lot of balls doink off their hands, which was totally uncharacteristic of them.
Anyway, back to your point - Baker needs to become the chessmaster out there. Obviously, the WRs need to do their part, and the plays called need to play into it, but Baker needs to be the one pulling a defenses strings out there. If he spends all of his time looking only to OBJ, he will only serve to get OBJ shut down.
I look at this all differently in that I sorta blame Bake for OBJ's failures here.
The best way to use OBJ is to make the weapons around OBJ more lethal and to get the ball to them more often when you have defenses adjusting to the other weapons because they are taking their defense apart OBJ becomes the kill shot.
In that regard and this is sorta off topic I look for DN to have a monster year and his success will lead to OBJ becoming lethal. His targets may be down a bit but his successes will be monstrous. We need what he brings to the table, what we don't need is a QB that doesn't understand that there will be times when defenses will focus on OBJ and if there is anything nearly any defense can do is take away a player. In most of the games OBJ played for us defenses tried to do 2 things stop Chub and take away OBJ.
By expanding and utilizing the other weapons Bake uses, OBJ becomes lethal the kill shot. That is the key for Bake, look elsewhere and when they fall asleep hit them over the head with OBJ.
The threat of OBJ can cause more problems then OBJ will ever cause by actually catching the ball or being targeted.
BTTB knows a lot and more football than me, I think, usually, I gain insight and enjoy learning because he's right on; For his other 2 Thousand 100 plus times I've read him in 25+ years, and I'm serious about that.
But this post, aside from the italicized line above I think is completely opposite reality? I'm looking for a nice way to say loopy.
Is Baker to blame for Odells injury? Is (Northcutt; Oh he means Njoku), a real offensive powerhouse when his game is One vs. One compared to OBJs'? Is a Quarterback supposed to not try to get the ball to his #1 simply because defenses will focus on him? " The threat of him will cause more problems than him ever actually catching the ball?" Oh my gosh,
And Baker, did better when OBJ was out, and OBJ, was he doing better with the Giants?
Does anyone think he'd have a better year if Daniel freaking what's his name it's not worth remembering anyway Giants loser QB were throwing the ball 15 yards off target on a deep ball because he's inaccurate as a passer to OBJ anyway?
Browns WR Odell Beckham Jr. Releases Hype Video By Wendi Oliveros May 31, 2021 @WendiOliveros1
Cleveland Browns wide receiver Odell Beckham Jr. (13) on the field prior to the National Football League game between the Pittsburgh Steelers and Cleveland Browns on November 14, 2019, at FirstEnergy Stadium in Cleveland, OH. (Photo by Frank Jansky/Icon Sportswire)
There is plenty of hype around the 2021 Cleveland Browns roster.
With so many superstars, it is hard to focus on who will bring the most excitement to the field when the season starts.
In the offseason, we continue to watch the players prepare and collectively get excited about their return.
Though OBJ is a polarizing figure whom some fans think is essential to the team’s success while others disagree, everyone hopes to see him healthy and ready to go in September.
It looks like that will be the case given the recent video he released on Instagram.
OBJ Is Here To Stay
Despite the rumors that have persisted pretty much since he arrived in Cleveland a few years ago about his pending trade, it appears OBJ is here to stay in 2021.
GM Andrew Berry and Coach Kevin Stefanski have never wavered from their belief that a healthy OBJ is an asset to the Browns offense.
In the months since he suffered the ACL injury, both have been asked repeatedly about OBJ; the message has been consistent.
Fresh off the Browns loss to the Chiefs in the divisional playoff round, Stefanski was asked about OBJ.
He said:
“I texted with him this morning. I know he’s working really hard to get better in his rehab. I’m excited to get him back here. I know it was not easy for him being away from his teammates, especially as these games got bigger and into the playoffs. I know he definitely wanted to be a part of it.”
Keeping OBJ Healthy Is A Priority
OBJ’s video shows him demonstrating his impressive speed, agility, and ball handling skills.
If anything has hampered his career with the Browns, it has been persistent and nagging injuries.
Going out with the ACL injury in October had to be devastating for a competitor like him.
Then, he had to watch the Browns go on a tear and get themselves into the playoffs.
Whatever questions fans have about OBJ and his future in Cleveland could be easily answered this year if he has a career best season that helps lead the Browns into the playoffs.
I just noticed your post and while I won't spend much time on critiquing the things you say I will let you're words be just that yours!
I think you miss a lot in not realizing the potential of Njoku and what it is he can do. #1 he is as athletic a TE as can be found in the NFL. He is also our highest graded TE when it comes to blocking. I like the Browns am very intrigued with his abilities. He has a down side or has shown a down side in the past, with emphasis on the past. I don't think he was always the hard worker he should have been coming out, and he has had health issues.
But last season he made huge strides as I mentioned he grades out as our best blocking TE, that was always a criticism as you may have recalled. But last season he caught everything near him and made some incredible catches as well and made huge strides in becoming a complete TE.
But let's go to why I think Njoku can make OBJ more lethal. Odd reference and I concur but follow along.
With LBers not able to keep up with Njoku and corners to small to handle Njoku who I might add regularly steam rolls LBers that leaves safeties to deal with Njoku and that is where he draws coverages away from OBJ and allows Bake the luxury of getting OBJ the ball in open space, space that would normally be occupied with safeties with deep coverages on OBJ.
The key early is establishing Njoku as elite and make no mistake Njoku is a player with elite skills for a TE. You think a bit it will come to you. My bet is that Njoku if he can manage to stay healthy explodes this year he has put the work in taken to coaching and has finally accepted the idea that he has to work hard at his craft and hone and polish his skill set. I think he made huge strides in doing that last year.
I am going to get really bold here I bet the Browns let Hooper go either thru cutting him or trading him after this season. And yes they will resign Njoku that is if he can stay healthy.
If you look at what has made KC's offense so explosive it has been a 2 man show one playing off the other Hill and Kelce and not really much of anything else.
Looking at the minicamp photos, and also from Jarvis' softball game, and i noticed something. Odell is smiling a lot. Maybe it is just me, but ever since he joined the team, he always appeared somber to me. In pressers, he always looked bothered and defensive. Now it seems like every picture I see, he has a big smile on. This could be a good sign.
Thanks for posting. Very interesting and enlightening. I forget which games they were - but during the "Bad Baker" spell last year we played in 2 games with 70 mph wind and rain and a 3rd in a downpour (going from memory). Exciting times with offseason prep and the talent we have ... and a little continuity !
What about Jarvis Landry, OBJ and future of the receivers? Terry Pluto’s Pregame Scribbles Updated: Jan. 09, 2022, 5:27 a.m. | Published: Jan. 09, 2022, 5:27 a.m.
Cleveland Browns wide receiver Jarvis Landry runs out of the tunnel to the field through the smoke and pyrotechnics before the Denver game. Joshua Gunter, cleveland.com
By Terry Pluto, cleveland.com CLEVELAND, Ohio – Scribbles in my notebook as the Browns end their season with a game against Cincinnati.
1. The Bengals are 10-6, winners of the AFC North and will host a playoff game. The Browns are 7-9 and I’m scribbling about Jarvis Landry probably playing his last game with Cleveland.
2. Before the Browns traded for Odell Beckham Jr. and after former Browns GM John Dorsey obtained OBJ, I insisted Jarvis Landry was the best receiver on the team. This season, Landry has been hit with knee problems and then COVID. He missed five games. Before 2021, Landry had missed only one game (COVID list, 2020) in his first seven seasons.
3. Landry is still the team’s leading receiver with 46 catches, an average of 10.8 yards per reception. He never had fewer than 72 catches before 2021. So it was a bad year for him, a bad year for QB Baker Mayfield and a bad year for the entire passing game.
4. Landry is only 29. He has one year ($16.6 million in 2022) left on his contract. But it’s not guaranteed. The Browns can (and will) cut him, because that move will count only $1.5 million on their 2022 salary cap. It’s possible the Browns could try to bring him back at a far more modest salary, but it’s highly unlikely to happen.
5. My feeling is Landry and Beckham Jr. both went into this season knowing it likely was their final year in Cleveland. Landry hurt his knee early in the second game of the season. He missed the next four games. He probably came back too soon, because Landry loathes missing any games. Landry dropped two passes and had three fumbles this season.
6. Landry knows he needs a fresh start with a new team. Assuming his knee can gain strength in the offseason, Landry could make a very good (and possibly cheap) addition to a good team looking for a veteran slot receiver.
7. OBJ missed 10 games last season due to ACL knee surgery. When he came back in 2021, it was rocky between the veteran receiver and Mayfield. OBJ kept asking to be traded. He was shipped to the Rams. In seven games since the deal, he’s caught 25 passes for an 11.5 average.
8. Where OBJ has made a mark is five catches for TDs, usually in tight red-zone situations. He is recreating himself as a tough, short yardage receiver with the Rams. In his last three games, he’s caught 10 passes for 83 yards. Two for TDs. He’s not a major deep threat or their key receiver, but he has helped them. OBJ is a free agent after the season.
9. There probably are only two receivers on the Browns roster now likely to be with the team next season – Donovan Peoples-Jones and rookie Anthony Schwartz. Rashard Higgins has been with team since 2016, but I hear he probably won’t be back. Higgins has caught 24 passes for an 11.5 average this season.
10. Higgins has played 49 percent of the snaps on offense this season. So he’s been out there, but often seems invisible. For the most part, the Browns haven’t been able to do much with their receivers. Peoples-Jones leads all receivers with 62 percent of snaps played. He has 31 catches for an 18.0 average and 3 TDs.
11. Browns receivers have caught only six TD passes. OBJ has five since joining the Rams. The Browns not only need to add talent with the expected departures of Landry and Higgins, they must reconsider exactly how receivers fit into the offense. If the tight ends were piling up big numbers, then it would be a different story. The Browns have 19 TD passes this season, ranked No. 24 in the NFL.
12. A year ago, they had 27 TD passes. Browns receivers caught 12 of them a year ago, double the total of 2021. The Browns are a team with Nick Chubb and Kareem Hunt, so they should run the ball a lot. D’Ernest Johnson also is a productive running back. But the passing attack fell apart in 2021. That has to be addressed.
13. Coach Kevin Stefanski insists his relationship with Mayfield hasn’t changed. Mayfield took cleveland.com’s Mary Kay Cabot to task for insisting there was some strain between the coach and QB. Common sense says when a team has a rough season like 2021 where the passing game is a mess, there will be some conflict between the coach and QB. Doesn’t mean the relationship is doomed to long-term failure. But it probably needs some work.
14. If Mayfield believes the Cleveland media is tough, he ought to check out New York and some of the other big markets. That is a much different level of attention and criticism. For the most part, the Cleveland media has been fair to him – although he has another opinion as he called Cabot’s story “clickbait.”
15. On the national level, ESPN Paul Finebaum said: “I got into it with (Mayfield) in college. He came after me on Twitter. And I thought he was a punk then and nothing has changed. He is a poor man’s Johnny Manziel. I think Cleveland ought to get rid of him. I don’t know if it’s possible, but I think the Browns are wasting their time with this guy.”
16. That’s a cheap shot by Finebaum, given Browns fans had a close-up look at the Manziel calamity in Cleveland. Mayfield should just cool it, get his shoulder surgery and work at coming back strong in 2022.
17. At this point, I’m ready for the season to end. It’s been months of frustration. Not the 1-15 and 0-16 frustration, but the frustration from knowing the Browns have the talent to be where the Bengals are today: 10-6 and in the playoffs.
OBJ being the third option in LA and calling that "reinventing himself" is a bit of a stretch.
If you think he's going to sign back up for 3.3 receptions for less than 30 yards per game (even with the TDs), I think you're kidding yourself because that would mean he's kicked his diva habits.
14. If Mayfield believes the Cleveland media is tough, he ought to check out New York and some of the other big markets. That is a much different level of attention and criticism. For the most part, the Cleveland media has been fair to him – although he has another opinion as he called Cabot’s story “clickbait.”
So Cleveland media is telling us that Cleveland media is fair...
He just woke up and the video was posted, lol. Just had the Biggie video parody ready to post to IG!
Brad Stainbrook @BrownsByBrad
OBJ on leaving #Browns: “One of the biggest regrets that I have is about the way that things ended. There really was no closure..It just happened so abrupt. A lot of things were out of my control. By the time I woke up, the video was already posted. It was just unfortunate.”
Brad Stainbrook @BrownsByBrad Former #Browns WR Odell Beckham Jr. says he still hasn’t spoken with QB Baker Mayfield since being released
These types of "outside of football" stuff is hard to figure out because they are personal.
So, what we get as fans is "he said this and he said that."
From Baker's side? Damn I don't think it feels so good to get a knife in the back. It is not like has not reached out to Odell in the off season. We all have seen the videos of vacations and workouts.
Then Odell's father goes public and trashes Baker. Meanwhile he is playing very hurt?
There can be issue with Baker's performance. People can say dump him or keep him. But nobody can say Baker has not tried. That he doesn't give effort. Baker has matured. He has taken the heat. I don't think inside he feels very good about how the whole deal went down.
Odell? He could be a villain in this. Or, maybe not. I don't know. I dislike his entire time with the Browns.
I can only go by what takes place on the field. And he didn't do much at all for the team.
And that is what creates all the talk. Did OBJ try or not? At least for us. Around the league and with other fans it points the finger at something other than OBJ.
One thing I have learned about this team and fans since our return, we have become pretty good at pointing fingers in all sorts of directions. It's kind of like Hue Jackson. He points his finger in every direction, except one.
Odell's history has always been about performance and injury.
He was hurt and missed games.
He is popular with teammates. Apparently helpful with younger players. And considered a good teammate.
What got to me was he didn't start the first game. He said he was not ready. Meanwhile the whole off season was about how good he looked. Workout videos etc. He was left to do everything at his pace. Practice etc. Then he doesn't play??
When his father trashed Baker. I thought that was crude and rude. And I don't buy. He didn't have a part in that.
Now he is on another team. So honestly I don't give a damn about him one way or the other.
but you're not in the locker room. you aren't standing on the sidelines or playing. the players dont care what bone, swish, or anyone else has to say about the inside, but they care about how you label them.
clearly from the PLAYERS perspective, OBJ getting released had a huge negative effect on the team. so while its a fair perspective to view baker as getting backstabbed, clearly there's other perspectives in that locker room that suggest otherwise.
but if we can't retain players due to that situation, then its fair to ask the bpro-baker crowd who did the actual back stabbing. because clearly the players dont think obj did anything wrong. clearly they loved him, and he clearly showed up and played.
the reason i side with OBJ and the players is because on this board specifically, it seems like Baker is the only one afforded the injury excuse. this board trashed OBJ while he was ALSO playing injured. trashed jarvis when he was ALSO playing injured. obj could've easily sat on the bench and not played at all, but he came back - even with a shoulder injury - and played.
yet somehow, baker is praised for playing injured while OBJ is trashed for doing the same thing. by the way, obj has still been playing injured on the Rams. yet all of a sudden he's productive.
posters need to remember that players routinely get drafted/traded to teams they DONT want to play for. where it wasn't their first choice. that doesn't mean they dont bust their ass and try on gameday. and yet thats the very thing thats been implied on this board. OBJ was set up to be the scapegoat the moment he got to cleveland. its like posters forgot he put up over 1k yards WHILE injured that 2019 season.
so i dont know why people are confused as to why the players in that locker room had such a negative reaction to OBJ leaving. the dude came here, try to buy in, played injured, and yet was blamed by fans for everything, while baker was praised for playing injured and running his mouth. so if you're a browns player, and you see a talent like OBJ gutting it out while injured, getting open, only to be blamed by fans and the media, how are you really gonna feel?
imagine playing the MOST dependent position in football, where you're production is purely based on whether or not the QB throws you the ball, and yet you're being blamed by fans and the media as if you're the QB and baker is the WR.
i want out of that hell hole too. and OBJ's teammates saw that. thats why they are all rooting for him when he went to the Rams and gets to play in the SB.
i asked this before and didn't get a response.
so DT, ask yourselves this honestly. if the PLAYERS - from their perspective, not yours - had to vote on who stayed and who got cut between OBJ and Baker, who would they choose?
so DT, ask yourselves this honestly. if the PLAYERS - from their perspective, not yours - had to vote on who stayed and who got cut between OBJ and Baker, who would they choose?
Ummm, three players would choose OBJ, everyone else in the building would choose Baker.
Please point out the last time anyone said any player was a "bad teammate".
Not saying OBJ was, but everyone hangs this medal around his neck that he was a good teammate. In my personal experience, I don't think I've ever heard anyone call any player a bad teammate... in any sport. Just wondering if anyone can remind me of all the player proclaimed bad teammates out there.
We know you think Baker is a bum and the route of all the Browns offensive issues - but painting this narrative that the players are all on OBJ's side (and therefore think Baker is the issue in that dynamic) is pure fantasy. It's absolutely more than feasible for players to voice support for OBJ while they think he also did Baker and Cleveland wrong. Framing this like the players are all with OBJ is a massive assumption based on your pre-disposition to Baker rather than any evidence. There might be some on OPBJ's side - idk - but I would absolutely bet there's as many or more that are not.
The fact that OBJ admits he has never reached out to Baker since the debacle - speaks absolute volumes to his lack of character and manhood. I don't care if he had called and said - "sorry man we weren't on the same page and I felt staying was killing my career." Whatever the hell ever he has to say - be nice, be brutal ... I don't care, just be a man and take ownership and communicate with the individual you gave a massive media black eye to.
Whatever the history is here and with Baker - it is going to be interesting to see what he gets paid. Is he going to get paid as a #1 - his role here? Is he going to get paid as an elite #2? We'll find out soon.
How do you know what the take was by "all" the players? Some came do his defense as a good teammate. Players including Jarvis and Keenum came to Bakers defense.
Like I said. I don't know. Baker is praised? He has taken more heat than just about any player.
Did Baker answer after being trashed by Odell's father? He said he had conversations with him before and frankly he was disappointed.
Berry made the call. He released Odell.
I have no idea how the players would vote or even if they would. I was not in the locker room.
I for sure have heard Myles, Bitonio, Chubb, and others support Baker.
I will leave it at this. Odell did not work out in Cleveland. I don't know if anyone is to blame. It does not matter anymore. He was released.
The fact that OBJ admits he has never reached out to Baker since the debacle - speaks absolute volumes to his lack of character and manhood.
Would you say the same thing about Mayfield since it appears he hasn't reached out to OBJ either? Or do you have a double standard that expects more from one of them than the other? It was OBJ who was cut and sent packing. Not the other way around. I think this is a perfect example of the double standard Swish was pointing out.
Did Baker answer after being trashed by Odell's father? He said he had conversations with him before and frankly he was disappointed.
Is that what we call factual video evidence provided that shows OBJ being open so much and not being targeted? You call that "trashing Baker"?
Let's be honest here for just a minute. This fan base had been trashing OBJ for a very long time. We are both fathers. Are you telling me that if you had evidence your child was being falsely accused of something that wasn't their fault, are you telling me you wouldn't stand up and defend your child? I mean really? Orange colored Browns fan glasses seem to often time color the lopsided opinions we see here. No decent parent would not come to the defense of their child if they felt their child was falsely blamed of something that could severely damage their career. I know I would and I believe if you thouight about it from the perspective of a parent instead of a Browns fan you would too.
And no, my child wouldn't have to put me up to it or be some behind the scenes plan between me and my child.
And still we hear it even after OBJ is gone. After it being proven that OBJ was open a lot, even after it being shown that we had the second most open WR's in the NFL on pass plays, we keep hearing how OBJ couldn't cut it as the #1 WR. Evidence and proof seem to mean nothing here.
Look Baker was injured and I understand a lot of the issues on O this year were because of that. In 2019 OBJ did pretty well here with over 1000 yards receiving. In 2020 he was plagued by injuries and only started 7 games because of it. This year Baker was injured and none of our WR's were productive. As a result fans found a fall guy.
The fact that OBJ admits he has never reached out to Baker since the debacle - speaks absolute volumes to his lack of character and manhood.
Would you say the same thing about Mayfield since it appears he hasn't reached out to OBJ either? Or do you have a double standard that expects more from one of them than the other? It was OBJ who was cut and sent packing. Not the other way around. I think this is a perfect example of the double standard Swish was pointing out.
The reason your post was laughed at by Mike Tyson ... you frame this post like OBJ was wronged and done an injustice. If your going to play these moronic games I'll stop replying to you. Everything about this post is so flat wrong. Baker was the one made to look bad in what OBJ and his father did. OBJ orchestrated his release from the Browns - he was not "Sent Packing" .... Baker stood in a press conference and said he didn't wish ill on OBJ but he'd appreciate a conversation. So damn right I don't expect Baker to have to reach out. It's on OBJ to do that.
If you can't see that, or you want to invent some alternative narrative - any football take you make it totally dead to me.
Can you explain anything OBJ did or said to diss Baker? Can you name one reason why it was OBJ who owed Baker a phone call? If Baker would have appreciated a conversation, why didn't he simply call him? No, instead he stood in a press conference it made it sound like OBJ owed him some kind of explanation for something his father forwarded that he saw on Twitter. And then you talk about OBJ's character and manhood? Baker sounded like a snowflake to me.
According to many on this board OBJ never wanted to be here. So now you blame him for "orchestrating his departure" in year three? You keep claiming it was "OBJ and his father" when there isn't a shread of evidence that OBJ had a thing to do with it. Like I said, if an entire fan base was giving my kid $#!+ when he was getting open all the time, I'd defend him too. And I wouldn't need his influence to do it. You're writing checks your ass can't cash.
The Browns did cut OBJ. Sorry facts aren't convenient for you.
The very definition of gaslighting. Pffft.
Did or did not the Browns cut OBJ? In fact they did and you accuse me of doing the gaslighting? It's not my fault you want to rewrite things as you see fit. Would you like for me to give you several sources that document that? No, you would rather act like that's not what happened. Once again, facts aren't convenient for you.
OBJ sucked here. He is a has-been. He's not on the team. Never liked him, and I can't stand his ass now. And get real irritated at people talking him up. He's a punk.
OBJ sucked here. He is a has-been. He's not on the team. Never liked him, and I can't stand his ass now. And get real irritated at people talking him up. He's a punk.
thats fine. i wish he was still on the team. him and jarvis was the best duo Baker will ever have at his disposal. so i like to imagine a scenario where we actually had a QB who could take advantage of having such weapons.
oh well, like most things with our favorite team, we can only imagine.
I pretty much agree with everything you just said except for one. When you think your children are being treated unfairly you will defend them no matter how old they are. There's no age limit to parenthood.
The Browns did cut OBJ. Sorry facts aren't convenient for you.
The very definition of gaslighting. Pffft.
Did or did not the Browns cut OBJ? In fact they did and you accuse me of doing the gaslighting? It's not my fault you want to rewrite things as you see fit. Would you like for me to give you several sources that document that? No, you would rather act like that's not what happened. Once again, facts aren't convenient for you.
No o e said OBJ wasn't cut. That's just you gaslighting and debating like a 6 year old. I spelled that out but like always you ignore it when your post is demonstrated to be flat wrong. Let's see where you move the goal posts to now....
So it was the fact I said he was "shipped out of town"? Is that it? Because it's a simple matter of cause and effect. When you're cut, you pack and leave town to play in a new destination. That seems to be what set you off according to your comments.
Yet we see who it is that has decided to resort to childish insults. You're the one who got triggered here and decided to make an issue out of my post. It's posted for everyone to see. I didn't start this back and forth. But nice try.
Of course he asked to be traded. Players do that all the time. There was zero chemistry building between he and Baker. It was greatly hurting his value and his future earnings. That's not some conspiracy or plot against the Browns. Yet that doesn't change the fact it was the Browns who made the decision to cut him. Everyone can dance around the why's of how they arrived at that decision but it was their decision to make. Saying the browns cut OBJ is a fact that can not be denied.
In fact, the team leader in TD's among all WR's was DPJ with 3. Baker's injury made sure that all the WR's looked like hot garbage this year, not just OBJ.
His injury? What an odd thing to say. He played the last six games in a row with the Browns before leaving to L.A.
Yet again with the spin? The goalposts changing???
YOU said the Browns cut him, which they did. You ignore the WHY of it. All because you have this incessant need to be "right".
If a guy asks to be traded 2-3 times, and plays like he doesn't want to be where he is, you do him the favor of what he asked. Pretty damn simple, isn't it? Oh, not for you.
So you're trying to say teams trade or cut every player who doesn't want to be there? I'm not changing anything. The Browns cut OBJ. You're the one trying to make it sound like they had no choice. They're the ONLY one who had a choice. That's not spin. That's a fact. Trying to frame it a certain way is what spin is. Unless you are saying the Browns didn't cut OBJ, saying the Browns cut OBJ is 100% factual no matter how you spin it.
You are impossible. You get a thought in your head, and you run with it until you change.
OBJ didn't want to be here. Period. He played like it here. Period. He got what he wanted. Period. YOU say the Browns cut him loose and act as if he didn't demand it.
Then explain to me what part of this is "moving the goal posts" or "spin".
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Of course he asked to be traded. Players do that all the time. There was zero chemistry building between he and Baker. It was greatly hurting his value and his future earnings. That's not some conspiracy or plot against the Browns. Yet that doesn't change the fact it was the Browns who made the decision to cut him. Everyone can dance around the why's of how they arrived at that decision but it was their decision to make. Saying the browns cut OBJ is a fact that can not be denied.
I actually agreed with you that he wanted to be traded. Oh the shame! Are you saying a chemistry was developed between he and Baker? Are you saying it didn't hurt his value or that his value hasn't increased since he left? Are you saying it wasn't the Browns decision to cut him?
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In fact, the team leader in TD's among all WR's was DPJ with 3. Baker's injury made sure that all the WR's looked like hot garbage this year, not just OBJ.
What part of this is spin or moving the goal posts? Are you trying to say our WR's produced well this season? Are you saying Baker's injury didn't have a huge impact in that?
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His injury? What an odd thing to say. He played the last six games in a row with the Browns before leaving to L.A.
This again is 100% factual.
Kyler Murray ‘frustrated’ with Arizona Cardinals, seen as ‘self-centered and immature’
Yet we see who it is that has decided to resort to childish insults. You're the one who got triggered here and decided to make an issue out of my post. It's posted for everyone to see. I didn't start this back and forth. But nice try.
Nope. You pulled your pants down and showed the world your ass on this. You wrote a post claiming Baker had as much onus to reach out to OBJ as the other way round. You tried to phrase this like OBJ was run out of town.
That's you in a nut shell. You write the preposterous. Get out of here with your fake BS childish Schtick.
No. They don't have to trade him and certainly won't cut him... but at least there are options since HE has value.
A diva WR who's been crying for two years, doesn't want to play with the team, tells other players not to join the team, has nagging injuries (besides the annual major injuries), forgets how to catch footballs -- and gets so fed up with his unfair, sad story that he has HIS DADDY call out his QB on social media -- little to no value.
You cut that cancer as fast as you can... because at that point, you WANT to, not because you have to.
Another comment on this thread somewhere was how 'Daddy' was acting to protect his child - and that as parents we would always interfere to help our kids.
I couldn't disagree more. When your kid is an adult. With a career. Co-workers, peers, seniors above them .... in what world does any parent actually think that (allegedly) going behind their kids back to publicly humiliate the team/company/colleagues and producing a social media hit piece to "protect their kid" would be anything except a monumental embarrassment to the kid. I mean that's just in general - then you add in a famous athlete level type kid? And I don't believe that any parent would do anything publicly without the express consent of their world famous athlete child .... to think otherwise is moronic.
Another comment on this thread somewhere was how 'Daddy' was acting to protect his child - and that as parents we would always interfere to help our kids.
I couldn't disagree more. When your kid is an adult. With a career. Co-workers, peers, seniors above them .... in what world does any parent actually think that (allegedly) going behind their kids back to publicly humiliate the team/company/colleagues and producing a social media hit piece to "protect their kid" would be anything except a monumental embarrassment to the kid. I mean that's just in general - then you add in a famous athlete level type kid? And I don't believe that any parent would do anything publicly without the express consent of their world famous athlete child .... to think otherwise is moronic.
you would've been mad had anybody from his camp went on social media with the clip. family does this around the league and such as well. look at jackson mahomes.
lets not pretend Baker's wife hasn't fired off rounds on social media. dont sit there and say she's always went through baker before hopping on social. sometimes it happens. and at the end of the day it doesn't even matter.
its not like his teammates haven't been watching the film during the week seeing the same crap passes from the QB. lets be clear here: OBJ left, and Baker arguably got worse. a lot of people were hoping Baker would go on a run like he did last season when OBJ got injured. the exact opposite happened.
parents/family members lashing out on social happens enough that it doesn't always need to be some deep state plot.
WHY DIDNT OBJ WANT TO BE IN CLEVELAND IN THE 1st PLACE? Is it because it lacks the glitz and glamour of the bigger Markets.....the weather....The lack of nightlife? Not sold on the front office or the QB?
WHY DIDNT OBJ WANT TO BE IN CLEVELAND IN THE 1st PLACE? Is it because it lacks the glitz and glamour of the bigger Markets.....the weather....The lack of nightlife? Not sold on the front office or the QB?
I think yes to everything you said except for the last one.
A lot of people from Cleveland stay there because it's where they grew up. It's home.
OBJ never once said that he wanted to be in Cleveland or that he was excited to be a Brown. He said he wanted to win, but he never said he wanted the Browns to win. He was a selfish malcontent here and pouted 'til he got his way.
Nope. There are lots of videos and takes showing Baker missing receivers. None of them made me mad. Other than thinking it was cheap and classless I wasnt mad his daddy posted this one. as for the deep state stuff? Maybe.... If OBJ hadn't literally been trying to get out of Cleveland since the day he arrived.
Baker's wife posts stuff on social media.... And she gets slaughtered for it. So that's a good comparison. It deserves slaughtering.
I don’t like it, but Odell won. He spent two and a half years here that derailed a potential Hall of Fame career because the quarterback could not find him on the field. He forced his way out, found a QB who knew how to get him the ball, and now he has a ring. He can make a good case the problem was never him. We’re talking about rebuilding our WR room with a top draft pick and maybe a big free agent, but you have to wonder if Baker will find “chemistry” with whomever we bring in. I know we all hope so.
How do you know what the take was by "all" the players? Some came do his defense as a good teammate. Players including Jarvis and Keenum came to Bakers defense.
Like I said. I don't know. Baker is praised? He has taken more heat than just about any player.
Did Baker answer after being trashed by Odell's father? He said he had conversations with him before and frankly he was disappointed.
Berry made the call. He released Odell.
I have no idea how the players would vote or even if they would. I was not in the locker room.
I for sure have heard Myles, Bitonio, Chubb, and others support Baker.
I will leave it at this. Odell did not work out in Cleveland. I don't know if anyone is to blame. It does not matter anymore. He was released.
Interesting take.. I was under the impression it was the opposite.
At least Jarvis and Myles came and supported OBJ.
So far I didn't see anyone coming on the defense of Baker, I actually think that its going to be a problem if this guys come in next year and see Baker still there...
Why do you think Chubb and Myles have Baker's back... the guy has multiple times implied he was the one who changed the culture of the team, the one that took them to the playoffs... Imagine how does that sit with the guys that actually did it.
The Cardinals better hurry up and either trade of cut Kyler Murray. I mean they have no choice, right?
If Kyler ever starts free lancing with his throws he will be cut just like OBJ was. If Kyler throws the ball where he wants instead of where the receivers are supposed to be all the time, and his Daddy posts a video of Cardinal players missing blocks, or being covered on plays he would be dropped like a hot potato.
I saw that too. Newsome has said a whole bunch of similar stuff. Higgins and Njoku throw love his way all the time.
I'll just say I don't get it, and I'll leave it at that. The guy took a giant stinky dump on the team this year with the stone hands that magically went away when he went to LA, and the business decisions that gave way to unselfish play when he became a team's 2nd+ passing option. Dude's (allegedly) when crapping on the team since day 1.
But the thing I understand even less is fans like Pit that try to defend his every move on here. Dude took a giant dump on your team and you're defending their every move. I read a couple of Pit's posts on this thread and they sound like Collinsworth last night.
But the thing I understand even less is fans like Pit that try to defend his every move on here. Dude took a giant dump on your team and you're defending their every move. I read a couple of Pit's posts on this thread and they sound like Collinsworth last night.
You're starting to sound like those who are only willing to look at one side of the coin. Football isn't your career. Anyone willing to look at it from that perspective may have the ability to be more objective. But let's not do that.
Yes, parents will defend their children when they feel they are being falsely blamed. Would all go as far as OBJ's dad did? Most likely not. But many certainly would. When you feel your child, no matter their age is being unfairly attacked, you kick into defense mode. I would hope that if I were in those shoes I would have handled the situation better. But in today's society where people post first and think later, it's certainly no surprise OBJ's dad reacted as he did. And people make up this was some kind of conspiracy between the two. Heck, his dad didn't even create the Tweet, he simply forwarded it. The fact is, no matter how hard some try to deny it, there was never a chemistry built between Baker and OBJ. And as I've stated the most TD's caught by any WR on the Browns last season was 3. I guess that's OBJ's fault too? All of our WR's were dropping the ball. Even Higgins who was once a security blanket for Baker. Landry's production also hit the skids. Now who do all of these WR's depend on for their production? It's not OBJ. But let's single him out and ignore everyone else.
But yeah, let's ignore all of that and focus on one guy. I guess if OBJ took a giant dump on this team so did every WR on the roster. If I were OBJ I would have wanted out of this mess too. As much as you wish to deny it, OBJ's value was taking a giant hit the longer he played here. An NFL career only lasts so long. But let's ignore all of that and make OBJ the fall guy. Everyone looks for a sacrificial lamb. It looks like you have joined the crowd that found one.
But the thing I understand even less is fans like Pit that try to defend his every move on here. Dude took a giant dump on your team and you're defending their every move. I read a couple of Pit's posts on this thread and they sound like Collinsworth last night.
You're starting to sound like those who are only willing to look at one side of the coin. Football isn't your career. Anyone willing to look at it from that perspective may have the ability to be more objective. But let's not do that.
Yes, parents will defend their children when they feel they are being falsely blamed. Would all go as far as OBJ's dad did? Most likely not. But many certainly would. When you feel your child, no matter their age is being unfairly attacked, you kick into defense mode. I would hope that if I were in those shoes I would have handled the situation better. But in today's society where people post first and think later, it's certainly no surprise OBJ's dad reacted as he did. And people make up this was some kind of conspiracy between the two. Heck, his dad didn't even create the Tweet, he simply forwarded it. The fact is, no matter how hard some try to deny it, there was never a chemistry built between Baker and OBJ. And as I've stated the most TD's caught by any WR on the Browns last season was 3. I guess that's OBJ's fault too? All of our WR's were dropping the ball. Even Higgins who was once a security blanket for Baker. Landry's production also hit the skids. Now who do all of these WR's depend on for their production? It's not OBJ. But let's single him out and ignore everyone else.
But yeah, let's ignore all of that and focus on one guy. I guess if OBJ took a giant dump on this team so did every WR on the roster. If I were OBJ I would have wanted out of this mess too. As much as you wish to deny it, OBJ's value was taking a giant hit the longer he played here. An NFL career only lasts so long. But let's ignore all of that and make OBJ the fall guy. Everyone looks for a sacrificial lamb. It looks like you have joined the crowd that found one.
Let’s also be sure to ignore the comment Von Miller made about Odell telling him not to come to Cleveland even before the 2021 season began? Also Odell was dropping passes from the backup QB as well. Shall we ignore that? Stack that on top of Odell refusing to show up after he was traded to “get his head right”. Essentially missing any chance to gel with the team. I realize there wasn’t much time with the Covid protocols but is it really so shocking they weren’t on the same page? This is a bunch of BS blown up by the media and Odell’s camp making it appear he was trying but the results said differently.
It seems you pay attention to what you want to and ignore the rest. Did you ever notice when everyone outside of Cleveland disagrees with the bulk of our fan base people blame on "the media" or "Odell's camp". They never consider that those who are not Browns fans have the ability to be more objective.
I'm going walk back that last paragraph (half step). I was annoyed about the talking heads rewriting history during the telecast. I singled you out because, for all your accusation of focusing on certain portions of the OBJ situation and ignoring others, you're doing the same (IMO). That said, today has taken a turn for the weird and now that I care far less about the Superbowl last night, that last part of that last post of mine sounds really childish.
I said before I don't understand the situation and don't understand our players' reactions to it. Here is what I do know.
-OBJ has wanted out at least since end of last season (playoff win and offense going on a tear), if not since (allegedly) the offseason he was traded here -OBJ had a bad issue with dropping easy passes until he arrived in LA -Talk of OBJ's injuries magically went away once he got to LA (was on injury report 1st week, then got rest w/o injury designation the next week and then never appears again) -He may not have been behind the video, but he also never said one single peep about it afterwards. He still hasn't talked to Baker, and never addressed anything. He's had plenty of opportunity to say something about the video and his exit. He's chosen not to.
You have to admit... that's a LOT of smoke... even when you take out the unconfirmed and made up Twitter stuff. Still a ton of smoke (too much, IMO).
So yeah... this time without the drama and finger-pointing and anger and stuff... I don't understand how you want to defend the guy on this board all day.
-OBJ has wanted out at least since end of last season (playoff win and offense going on a tear), if not since (allegedly) the offseason he was traded here
True. I'm not quite sure how that makes him a bad guy.
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-OBJ had a bad issue with dropping easy passes until he arrived in LA
True. So did every other WR on the Browns roster. Something isn't right with the entire WR unit. Even the once sure handed Higgins wasn't reliable. Some people wish to isolate the issue to OBJ when in fact it was systemic. Often times we've seen a change of scenery for players do them a world of good. Anyone who watched this season knows both Landry and Higgins were not themselves either. Neither was OBJ. We need to figure out why this was happening across the board instead of playing the blame game. OBJ is gone and this happened the entire season even after he was gone.
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-Talk of OBJ's injuries magically went away once he got to LA (was on injury report 1st week, then got rest w/o injury designation the next week and then never appears again)
The coaches make the injury list, not the players. The impact of that was zero. He started and played all of his last six games here and what was written on the injury report by the coaching staff had no impact on that.
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-He may not have been behind the video, but he also never said one single peep about it afterwards. He still hasn't talked to Baker, and never addressed anything. He's had plenty of opportunity to say something about the video and his exit. He's chosen not to.
So now you think OBJ should speak out against his dad? He is playing for his third NFL team. He has one dad. This is ridiculous. Baker said he would like to talk to OBJ. Baker has a phone. Connecting dots is one thing. Creating dots to connect is another.
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You have to admit... that's a LOT of smoke... even when you take out the unconfirmed and made up Twitter stuff. Still a ton of smoke (too much, IMO).
So yeah... this time without the drama and finger-pointing and anger and stuff... I don't understand how you want to defend the guy on this board all day.
Damp leaves create smoke. Points you consider something of importance are actually nothing more than damp leaves which one could use their imagination to try and paint a certain picture.
I mean do you really think, "yeah but he didn't call Baker" and "Yeah but he didn't diss his dad" are anything of substance? Or, "yeah but the Rams coaching staff decided not to list OBJ on their injury list", when OBJ was starting every game during that time means anything? Really?
Even the once sure handed Higgins wasn't reliable.
Higgens was toast once other teams realized he could only get open in zone. When they covered him man to man he couldn't get open. The Browns new this a few years ago, but the general public has no, zero, zilch idea. Ahhh life in the NFL.
Even the once sure handed Higgins wasn't reliable.
Higgens was toast once other teams realized he could only get open in zone. When they covered him man to man he couldn't get open. The Browns new this a few years ago, but the general public has no, zero, zilch idea. Ahhh life in the NFL.
I never, ever, would have noticed this.
Which this begs the question: how could you force a defense to go into Zone?
Like, is this something we could have worked with?
Which this begs the question: how could you force a defense to go into Zone?
Like, is this something we could have worked with?
You need to ask somebody who is way smarter than me about the x's and o's of the game for that answer. I was just reporting info that was given to me.
My guess is if the other team's players can consistently beat your players 1 on 1, a zone will at least provide some help, especially deep, preventing gash plays. It also makes it easier to defend a running QB. Players in a zone don't usually turn their back on the QB to run with a player. Generally, they "slide" inside their zone assignment and don't leave until they see the ball released before releasing to chase the ball.
I think defenses use zone D to compensate for a perceived "weak link" in their pass coverage. Sometimes its because a DB is not starter quality and lacks man skills, or it might be because of mismatches due to a WR or TE being such superior ability. Sometimes defenses deploy a disguised zone to confuse an inexperienced or recognition-deficient QB. Ideally though, I would think teams prefer to play man D.
if we can find a way to keep jarvis, i think Baker needs a different weapon on the other side. he has good TEs, but he really needs a big body WR to throw to. it makes me so mad at this dude, cause i swear we would all be having a totally different convo if it was Josh Gordon/Landry instead of OBJ/Landry. or at least if Calloway kept his head on straight.
It rarely goes how we fans want it to go or think it should - especially when it is "so obvious" ... Last year through a total curve ball we both (and others) got exactly what we wanted in JOK ... but a round later than we all expected !
So it would be no surprise if we don't get one of those 3 guys - Wilson, London, Burk in round one when so many would agree they are impact players at position of need. It seems most likely 2 of them will be there when we draft, possibly all 3. Which, as I said, means we probably won't get one of them. My preference at this point is Wilson then Burks then London.
I was going to write a post suggesting we need that draft board/thread opened up so we can start posting comments and player lists and tape. . . . what are we? 6 weeks out? I think it's time.
London is also one of the youngest players in the draft. He checks a lot of the boxes that Andrew Berry usually looks at. Do we know if he is testing at the combine?
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