DTR or Walker?
To me, I'd stay with Walker with hopes that he's a bit more comfortable with another tough start under his belt.
I don't dislike the idea of sprinkling in some DTR in spots like we did last week though
Future backup yeah, but he’s not future anything close to the starter and I don’t think that’s how they see him. That being said, I trust him more than Walker
I’m done seeing what Walker can do. I’d start DTR
I want to win so I would start Walker.
With how the trade deadline went, I say roll with DTR. Walker is a known quantity, and he's gotta be cooked in terms of his confidence. You can't really cut him because if DTR duplicates his performance from the Ravens game... yikes.
Get the young guys as much playing time as possible.
Roll with DTR. Unless the Cards start Murray, Browns should win this one at home even w/o good QB play. Good opportunity to allow DTR to get his feet wet again.
There's only one way DTR duplicates his performance from the Ravens game and that's if Stefanski hangs him out to dry with his play calling.
There's a lot to like. Five year starter at a big school. Accurate. Strong arm. Mobile. Confident. Is there really that much difference between him and a Willis, Levis, Richardson, Howell, Corral, Ridder, Hooker, Bennett? All of those guys went higher than DTR. They do all suck, but that puts some odds on our side...someone from that group has to rise up out of the ashes; why not DTR?
And besides, he might have been higher than all of those guys on the Browns board. It's just a matter of perspective. Would people change their opinion if the Browns drafted him at the end of the second round?
If Stefanski could just make the game a little simple for him and get him going, I think we are going to like the results. He needs help from his coach. Stefanski has proven he only calls games one way - like he has Mahomes back there. If he could just find the mental aptitude for once to dial it back, we might have something.
I do think the staff really, really likes him. I think they believe they did him a disservice against the Ravens and feared they would ruin him which is why Walker started the last three. I know Walker was bad, but even in light of that, and with no QB move today, they would not make a move to DTR if he wasn't ready just because Walker was bad.
I am the first member of the DTR fan club. I don't mind sinking with this ship if it comes to that. If he isn't good, I was wrong. But people are getting too caught up in where he was drafted and not the player himself. Not every successful player in the NFL has to come from the first round.
We'll see how it goes. There will be people on here who wish for him to fail just to stick it to me, but that's ok. I got broad shoulders. If he plays poorly, I will say so. But I like what I have seen from him. Just get him going a little bit.
I do think this would be a good game to see what he's got.. at minimum I don't think he'd play worse than Walker, he's a bit taller atleast and he def has a stronger arm and he made good decisions in the preseason regardless of who he was playing.. Stefanski put him in a buzz saw against the ravens in probably one of the dumbest moves I've seen any nfl coach make.. walker was on the team at that point and had game experience.. and then bench DTR and make him inactive because he played like 99.99999999 percent of people thought he would against the ravens. Im sure that did wonders for his confidence, but then again it wouldnt be a browns season without stefanski screwing up handling the QB's. This would be a decent game to help him get a little confidence back. Run heavy game plan and let him get comfortable, not taking your first snap and running a go route.
No question about it....start DTR. And hope that KS game plans to DTR's (and the team's) strengths.
I would be interested in seeing DTR perform with a full week of practice geared towards him and hopefully a more stable environment (and against a worse team obviously)
PJ or DTR is not a choice that should be.
It is a mistake to have to make this choice.
However, IMO I would choose DTR. PJ is careless with the ball. He has more experience. But, he does not protect the ball.
Even when he decides to run. I have to close my eyes because of how he holds the ball. Nine turnovers in three games and it could have easily been way more.
DTR is a better athlete and thrower of the ball. He was doomed in the Ravens game. Not prepared to face a division team that knows the Browns.
DTR needs to be prepared as best as he can be. Still his lack of experience will be a problem. Do the best you can to prepare him.
And then hope for the best.
my dad made that same point on one of Walker's runs last Sunday (I think he even fumbled it right at the end of the run too) ... the fact that he's SO careless even as a runner
People sure seem to think some fifth round rookie is the better option. I mean if risking destroying his confidence and hindering his development is the goal those who support starting him are after, they may be right
Really without being at practice and watching them both. I don't know.
PJ is a disaster. He can throw. He cannot see what is in front of him. He has gotten his chance. I cannot promote a guy who is reckless with the ball.
DTR apparently won the backup job. He gets one start. Hell if DW would have started against the Ravens. I would say we were the underdog.
I would rather look at DTR and see how it goes with him in practice. If he looks shaky. Then roll with PJ.
If he seems to have a better grip on playing. At this point after seeing PJ. I would give DTR a shot.
Nobody goes full speed at practice. Nobody wants to injure their own players. I don't have any idea what "better grip on playing" you saw in that Baltimore game. He's a kid with some underdeveloped yet a physically gifted skill set that needs some time to be coached up. Getting him shell shocked now could only serve to delay that process. That's a pretty big risk just to "see what he has".
In a situation like this. Practice is all you have.
PJ's completion percentage is 49%. He is terrible.
The question is who will give you a better chance to win?
This is week 8 for the Browns. DTR is on the roster and has been there all year. He should not be on the roster if he is not ready.
This is not about his development. This is next man up.
Risk? They are both a risk.
Nobody goes full speed at practice. Nobody wants to injure their own players. I don't have any idea what "better grip on playing" you saw in that Baltimore game. He's a kid with some underdeveloped yet a physically gifted skill set that needs some time to be coached up. Getting him shell shocked now could only serve to delay that process. That's a pretty big risk just to "see what he has".
Is it really a big risk? He went 7Ws-13Ls his first two seasons at UCLA. There were some ugly looking stat lines in there. He went 9-4 last season and completed over 60% of his passes in every game. (not saying 60% is great, but to never go lower is something.)
Unfortunately, people tend to learn the most from adversity. DTR has been through it before. How he responded behind closed doors is a factor.
Hopefully, he and Tillman have been tearing it up in practice, and that contributed to the DPJ move.
I'm ready to give him another shot. Walker's played like a (bad) rookie. DTR's mobility gives some added wiggle room.
Stefanski is in the best position to make that decision as he has the best view of his QBs in practice.
You play the QB who gives your team the best chance to win the game...keeping in mind, the Cardinals are just as capable of beating the Browns as any other NFL team.
Don't play games with the back-up QB position attempting to get your #3 QB some experience because the Browns are playing a one win team.
I would start PJ knowing DTR could be needed in case of injury.
Number one goal for the Browns...win the damn game..!
Hopefully if you get your wish he doesn't get crushed and further detract from his development. Being what you describe as not that great at UCLA for a lot of his time there doesn't bode well for starting in the NFL this early in your career.
So far it appears Stefanski doesn't have a clue which QB is better. First it was DTR, then it was P.J. Will he now go back to DTR? I guess when your choices are between cow manure and hog manure it doesn't really make much difference does it? It would however be nice if he could make his mind up one way or the other. You're never going to develop any chemistry on O if you keep playing musical chairs at the QB position.
PJ will be starting if Watson can’t play.
Watson will be practicing on a limited basis today. Both things came from Stefanski’s press conference
He’ll be starting… for the Vikings.
All I can do is hope DW plays.
The coin flip between PJ and DTR is heads I lose; tails I lose.
All I can do is hope DW plays.
The coin flip between PJ and DTR is heads I lose; tails I lose.
it would be nice for him to get his sea legs back in Arizona before back to back games with Baltimore and Pittsburgh.
I'm more worried about his sea arm. I understand what you're saying but trying to rush him back and see a repeat of him going back on the bench isn't a good option either. Hopefully if the decision is to start him he will be healthy and ready to go. Not a bowl in a China shop who will have to leave the field after first contact.
I'd start whomever is least likely to turn the ball over. Period.
If our offense can cease spotting our opponents 7 to 14 points per game, we'd be winning a lot more games.
It seems like Walker this week and Watson next ... not ideal to play the Ravens without having played in 6 weeks lol but I digress
Both suck. It doesn't matter.
My goodness
This is a thread I was hoping wouldn't have to be posted
2023 with a up and down Watson was my hopes
Myself the 2017 blunder for AJ McCarron to this day is my favorite QB whatever
Couch was a good QB with a really bad O line
All the choices from there were
Well
Hell
I don't want to bring up all the missed draft picks or FA signings
The horrible coaching the circumstances the team has had since 99
I would again talking about starting bad back ups
I say get the rookies feet a little more turf time
Walker is like York, just thinking okay missing
This just happens way to much in Cleveland
You name DTR the back up who loses one game against a divisinional rivarly then sit him for
A QB with not much more NFL experience who locks down on recievers if he even sees them
This game should be a rookie vs rookie QB
Let the Defense win this game
I was at the Baltimore game, and DTR looked shellshocked from the beginning. He does not have a strong arm, he struggled to throw the ball downfield. His long ball looked like a bad punt. Walker is just horrible. He is constantly not looking at open guys over the middle. He throws as many turnovers as completions it seems. Either way, 30 years and counting, and still no QB. The defense that everyone was gushing over, forgot how to stop the run, and tackle. The loss to Seattle, IMO, is at their feet.
Put Watson on the field. What is the use of saving him. He has played just as bad as Walker, except one game. Him not playing is just putting him a position to claim he is "rusty". I have been in his corner, but it is time for him to do something, anything for this team.
Actually, I am just tired of everything about this team. There is always something that derails them, and when there isn't either the offense or defense lays an egg. If they win, it will mean nothing, because the two division games coming up will absolutely be losses. I'm not even mad at the coaching, it just appears that after all these years, my buddy was right. The Browns will never be good, it is part of the script.
Almost feels like strarting a $230 mil vet over
Two backups who want to start
The other guy well
DTR must be pure trash if the great offensive mind that is Ski made PJ starter again this week. We all know DW will be another healthy scratch come Sunday. I don’t even know if I want to watch PJ lay eggs again. Maybe something more exciting like a knitting competition will be on…
If only we had a fighter who would suit up even if his shoulder needed amputated because he wants to bring a title to town. A real gutsy guy with lots of moxie… Oh, right… been there, done that, and SKI treated him like trash.
If only we had a fighter who would suit up even if his shoulder needed amputated because he wants to bring a title to town. A real gutsy guy with lots of moxie… Oh, right… been there, done that, and SKI treated him like trash.
Your heart still yearns for Faker "Chuck it up and Pray"-field? His ego wrote checks his body couldn't cash. I don't want a "reality TV" QB, the time we had with Baker was more than enough for me.
Ski treated him like a responsible adult when he should have treated him like a spoiled juvenile. Baker seemed to think he was way better than he actually is/was. Unfortunately, there's more to the QB job than waking up feeling dangerous.
(This may be rather harsh, but I figured I'd see if unnecessary slander was somehow cathartic as it seems so popular recently.)
If you think Baker was the answer. You are sadly mistaken.
Nobody is forcing you to watch. Don't.
Nobody is forcing you to watch. Don't.
We all suffer. Some are just more vocal about it. But the entire Baker thing is just sad to see posted here. I mean right now he would be the best backup the Browns would have on the roster if he was here so there's that I suppose.
I honestly think Baker would be the perfect backup.
Not for the Browns because of the baggage. But for any other team.
I like Baker. Always have. I wanted him to be the man in Cleveland real bad. It is a bummer it did not happen.
The trade for DW was a risk worth taking at the time. It still could prove to be worth it.
He will never be my favorite player. I accept that. I have worked with people I did not care for. I just did my job and accepted that as well.
I want to win as fast as possible. I don't want another rebuild and quarterback search. I want to stay the course.
I think that it will give the Browns the best chance to win soon.
Any change from that will be years of waiting inside another dark tunnel with no light at the end.
Why would or should Baker be a backup? He's a middle of the pack starter in the NFL at the present time. He's currently ranked #16 by NFL.com
NFL QB Index, Week 8: Patrick Mahomes vaults back to No. 1; Kirk Cousins closing in on top five
https://www.nfl.com/news/nfl-qb-index-week-8-2023-nfl-seasonRisks are only worth taking if they pan out. Risks either fail or they succeed. That's the only real world measurable to determine whether they were worth taking. The jury is still out on that one.
For me there's a huge cavern between understanding why someone took a risk and whether that risks turns out to be one that was worth taking. I understand why they took the risk. Whether it's one that was worth taking remains to be seen.
I don't see making any wholesale changes much like yourself. But really, what difference would it make how we feel about it? They married watson with that contract. It is what it is. We have no choice if we plan to continue following this team except to sit back and watch it all play out. All we can do is hope this movie has a happy ending. So far the plot line reads more like a tragedy.
The scenario I see that may most likely play out is the this FO uses Stefanski as a scapegoat to excuse the watson failure over the first two seasons. Let's hope that doesn't happen. But somebody will be forced to take the blame for it. And we should both know by now if they can make someone else take the blame for it, they will.
The best possible hope I have to avoid that is for watson to return as the starter and ball out. Something I feel pretty sure the vast majority of us hope for.
Nobody is forcing you to watch. Don't.
I’ll root for and watch however the hell I want there, bone. AND idgaf how you do your fandom, I’ll do mine my way, thank you very much. DW and Ski are the issues I have, and yes, I damn sure think we’d have been better off sticking with Baker. Couldn’t have been much worse.
IMHO, we’ll continue to suck until Ski and DW are gone, period. And probably after that for a while longer because we just can’t get right in Cleveland.
Who Would You Start?
Myles Garrett.
I would start Jacoby Brissett aka Jakey Brisket, because I wouldn't have been dumb enough not to keep a quality backup on the roster in the first place.
Ok Ok, enough smugness, out of what we have I'd start PJ Walker, but I would alter the playbook to suit his strengths like we did for 2 quarters against the Seahawks when we did well.
I'm not sure this is the right question to be asking. The correct question IMO, is what playcalling do you want? Again IMO.. that answer is Run the Ball Kevin! Screens, quick strikes, target Njoku For Gawds sakes Stefanski help out the QB.. either one.
Not that our votes mean anything but I would vote to sit him and start PJ and whole lot of running game and defensive swarming. Even if we lose this game (a very real possibility) the two games after this one are pretty much critical. We need to take one of them and do our absolute most to take both. We need to be as set up for success in those two games as humanly possible. Unless DW is 100%, sit him.
Watson looks to be on track to start
keep him upright and let's have him be smart
Hope he’s 100%. Truth is it seems ski takes him at his word and his word is, er, sketchy at times.
That's my biggest concern with all of this. We saw what happened the last time he was supposed to be "ready". The first time he was hit he crumbled like a rag doll. I'm not predicting that is what will happen this time, but everyone who has had a rotator cuff injury knows that if you rush it there will be setbacks. I'm just hoping that he isn't rushing back like last time and we continue to see a rinse and repeat continue because he isn't being given sufficient time to recover. It appears we will find out soon enough.
Over/Under on how many snaps he will actually take and of those how many off target passes there will be?
DW has to get back his throwing motion so it may take 3 or 4 possessions to work this out. There's also the possibility of a little rust!
Maybe DW should try Instaflex to help loosen things up!!
I think we have to stick with Watson tomorrow just so he can get into a rhythm .. if he's deemed healthy enough then we gotta go with it
I think we have to stick with Watson tomorrow just so he can get into a rhythm .. if he's deemed healthy enough then we gotta go with it
You mean like he was deemed healthy enough the last time when he got taken out of the game the fist time he was hit? Hopefully he's deemed to be healthier than that.
Hopefully he's deemed to be healthier than that.
If we get a 3 TD or more (lol...) lead in the 2nd half, I'd put DTR in there to 'rest' DW....
If a frog had wings he wouldn't bump his ass every time he landed after he jumped.
I'd start PJ Walker until Watson became completely ready to play again,
I'm pretty sure Walker gives you a better chance to win, until one of the other two can outplay him.
And, Can Watson do that yet? ... Not sure.
and
DTR? Come on, how could you ruin his confidence more than what you did in the Baltimore game?
If you were going to go with DTR... this week... you're best bet is to announce that, the SECOND the previous game ends.
These .. obvious.. nuances are Not NEW, b/c football hasn't changed That much in all these years. < analyze that, analytics dummies.
I think the tomorrow's Watson same as the usual Watson...BAD
I think we have to stick with Watson tomorrow just so he can get into a rhythm .. if he's deemed healthy enough then we gotta go with it
You mean like he was deemed healthy enough the last time when he got taken out of the game the fist time he was hit? Hopefully he's deemed to be healthier than that.
yes of course
If a frog had wings he wouldn't bump his ass every time he landed after he jumped.
Son of a gun....the frog just grew a pair. (I simply had the wrong QB)....lol).