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Originally Posted By: willitevachange
Originally Posted By: rastanplan
Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
I didn't comment on Ben/Mason.

I think the Steelers made a move to acquire a player that is a proven commodity and almost assuredly better than the first round pick they gave up to get him.

Like I said before, think of some of the Brown's first rounders. Gilber, Manziel, TRich, Weeden, Njoku, Peppers, Mingo, Phil Taylor, Big Money, Leon, etc. A couple of those guys are decent, but most sucked and I would not take any of them over Fitz.



Is it the same Fitz, are you sure we are talking about the same guy?

He sucked in Miami has a CB, was moved to safety/hibrid to try to get something out of him, and he requested a move...

He is far from having proved he is a stud, I would put in the Gilbert,Peppers level, lots of potential and lots of question marks.
I really don't think you watch too much of him.

btw, does baker still have a noddle arm?


Actually I did follow Miami, and I did follow Fitz, but apparently not many in this forums did.

Fitz did nothing special last year, quite the contrary. You can say that if anything he proved his critics right...

CFR says he was a very good slot CB, no he wasn't very good, and for sure he wasn't good enough to play CB,like I said so to start. Also no may teams in the NFL even use slot CB's or star players, that why most of the elite start players in Saban's scheme fail when they reach the NFL.

I stated he was a hibrid/star Niquel who couldn't play CB, and that's what he did in Miami, proving me right. So I am/was right, and most of you wrong. Al least so far.

I also never stated Baker had a noodle harm, I always stated he didn't have an elite arm, which, by my standards he doesn't. When I say Elite arm I say a Arm on the top 5 QB's in the league,not that he can out throw me for a long margin.

And not to be picky, but last games and some games and throws last year he kind of proves me right. Like it was stated before, its not the question of making the occasional throw, its about consistency, like you see when you watch the elite arm QB's in this league.

I like Baker, and think he is a good QB, and yes I admit I was wrong about Rosen, which was my major beef with picking Baker.
I have no problems admitting when I'm wrong, contrary to the majority of posters on this forum. But I never criticize Baker because I liked Rosen, I criticized the pick, not the player. Had some issues with the accuracy in college and how much it was a product of the scheme he played, but overall all this concerns went away. Providing he is in the right scheme he will perform at a high level.

Regarding Fitz, yes I always thought he was way over rated.

Last edited by rastanplan; 09/19/19 07:09 AM.
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Not offended, but a little irritated. If I'm being honest, irritation had a little to do with work and not completely your post. Normally I type out those snarky messages and then close the window, but instead I hit send.

I'll own that one. My bad.


There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.

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It's okay. I can see how my post was offensive. I didn't intend it to be, but I can see how it came across that way. We're good.

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Originally Posted By: rastanplan
CFR says he was a very good slot CB, no he wasn't very good, and for sure he wasn't good enough to play CB,like I said so to start. Also no may teams in the NFL even use slot CB's or star players, that why most of the elite start players in Saban's scheme fail when they reach the NFL.


Quote:
Among the 34 defensive players with 200 or more coverage snaps in the slot last season, he ranked first in completion percentage allowed (51.3%), first in passer rating allowed (53.4) and tied for ninth in coverage grade (76.7).


https://www.pff.com/news/pro-miami-doesnt-need-to-get-creative-with-minkah-fitzpatricks-usage

I know PFF isn't gospel but I trust it over rastanplan.

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Originally Posted By: cfrs15
Originally Posted By: rastanplan
CFR says he was a very good slot CB, no he wasn't very good, and for sure he wasn't good enough to play CB,like I said so to start. Also no may teams in the NFL even use slot CB's or star players, that why most of the elite start players in Saban's scheme fail when they reach the NFL.


Quote:
Among the 34 defensive players with 200 or more coverage snaps in the slot last season, he ranked first in completion percentage allowed (51.3%), first in passer rating allowed (53.4) and tied for ninth in coverage grade (76.7).


https://www.pff.com/news/pro-miami-doesnt-need-to-get-creative-with-minkah-fitzpatricks-usage

I know PFF isn't gospel but I trust it over rastanplan.
Agreed. As well as he def. said baker had a noodle arm.

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Quote:
although I continue to consider that he does not have the arm to make all NFL throws, specially to his left side, outside the numbers.


rofl rofl

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This is off topic, but Baker definitely has a PLUS arm.

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Originally Posted By: willitevachange
Originally Posted By: cfrs15
Originally Posted By: rastanplan
CFR says he was a very good slot CB, no he wasn't very good, and for sure he wasn't good enough to play CB,like I said so to start. Also no may teams in the NFL even use slot CB's or star players, that why most of the elite start players in Saban's scheme fail when they reach the NFL.


Quote:
Among the 34 defensive players with 200 or more coverage snaps in the slot last season, he ranked first in completion percentage allowed (51.3%), first in passer rating allowed (53.4) and tied for ninth in coverage grade (76.7).


https://www.pff.com/news/pro-miami-doesnt-need-to-get-creative-with-minkah-fitzpatricks-usage

I know PFF isn't gospel but I trust it over rastanplan.
Agreed. As well as he def. said baker had a noodle arm.


I just want to point to the fact that defensive players who cover the slot, aren't called slot CB's... actually its usually a position the NFL does not use in a normal formation.

In conclusion I was pointing to the fact that the mere suggestion that Fitz was a Slot CB automatically disqualifies him from being good, it simply means that he was worst than the 2 CBs and possibly the safeties in the Miami team. Hardly a good thing. PFF grade was average.

And if you remember my posts in the Fitz thread last year, you should recall what my position was... that he wasn't a CB, never played CB in college, the closer position he played in college was Strong Safety.


And I repeat, I stated that Baker does not have an elite arm.. and I also explained that my elite definition implies him being one of the top arms in starting QB's, which IMHO he is not.


Last edited by rastanplan; 09/19/19 01:12 PM.
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I trust the evaluation of the Steelers.

They would not trade a first without in depth knowledge.

The last time they traded a first rounder was in the sixties.

I respect their ability to find players who fit their schemes.

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Originally Posted By: bonefish

I trust the evaluation of the Steelers.

They would not trade a first without in depth knowledge.

The last time they traded a first rounder was in the sixties.

I respect their ability to find players who fit their schemes.


I never disqualify the possibility of being wrong, specially in this type of things.

For sure there were players I though were bad and turned our good, and players I though were good that turned out to be busts, Rosen for example, and Richardson.

Usually it does not take that much time to see... and in the case on Minkah, like it was the case for Jabrill, I just don't see it.

But again,I could be wrong and both end up in the hall of fame.

I actually like being wrong in the players I think are bad... don't which the kids bad, believe me, if they are good, then great for all.

Last edited by rastanplan; 09/19/19 01:29 PM.
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Originally Posted By: rastanplan
Originally Posted By: willitevachange
Originally Posted By: cfrs15
Originally Posted By: rastanplan
CFR says he was a very good slot CB, no he wasn't very good, and for sure he wasn't good enough to play CB,like I said so to start. Also no may teams in the NFL even use slot CB's or star players, that why most of the elite start players in Saban's scheme fail when they reach the NFL.


Quote:
Among the 34 defensive players with 200 or more coverage snaps in the slot last season, he ranked first in completion percentage allowed (51.3%), first in passer rating allowed (53.4) and tied for ninth in coverage grade (76.7).


https://www.pff.com/news/pro-miami-doesnt-need-to-get-creative-with-minkah-fitzpatricks-usage

I know PFF isn't gospel but I trust it over rastanplan.
Agreed. As well as he def. said baker had a noodle arm.


I just want to point to the fact that defensive players who cover the slot, aren't called slot CB's... actually its usually a position the NFL does not use in a normal formation.


Teams in the NFL runs defensive plays out of the nickel something like 70% of the time.

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Originally Posted By: cfrs15
Originally Posted By: rastanplan
Originally Posted By: willitevachange
Originally Posted By: cfrs15
Originally Posted By: rastanplan
CFR says he was a very good slot CB, no he wasn't very good, and for sure he wasn't good enough to play CB,like I said so to start. Also no may teams in the NFL even use slot CB's or star players, that why most of the elite start players in Saban's scheme fail when they reach the NFL.


Quote:
Among the 34 defensive players with 200 or more coverage snaps in the slot last season, he ranked first in completion percentage allowed (51.3%), first in passer rating allowed (53.4) and tied for ninth in coverage grade (76.7).


https://www.pff.com/news/pro-miami-doesnt-need-to-get-creative-with-minkah-fitzpatricks-usage

I know PFF isn't gospel but I trust it over rastanplan.
Agreed. As well as he def. said baker had a noodle arm.


I just want to point to the fact that defensive players who cover the slot, aren't called slot CB's... actually its usually a position the NFL does not use in a normal formation.


Teams in the NFL runs defensive plays out of the nickel something like 70% of the time.


Who does? Who is the best known nickle in the NFL, for example?

And even if that was true, that wouldn't explain why Fitz asked to be traded because he had no fixed position on Miami, because if they were playing 70% of the snaps out of the nickle then for sure he would be in there playing nickle...

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Originally Posted By: rastanplan
Originally Posted By: cfrs15
Originally Posted By: rastanplan
Originally Posted By: willitevachange
Originally Posted By: cfrs15
Originally Posted By: rastanplan
CFR says he was a very good slot CB, no he wasn't very good, and for sure he wasn't good enough to play CB,like I said so to start. Also no may teams in the NFL even use slot CB's or star players, that why most of the elite start players in Saban's scheme fail when they reach the NFL.


Quote:
Among the 34 defensive players with 200 or more coverage snaps in the slot last season, he ranked first in completion percentage allowed (51.3%), first in passer rating allowed (53.4) and tied for ninth in coverage grade (76.7).


https://www.pff.com/news/pro-miami-doesnt-need-to-get-creative-with-minkah-fitzpatricks-usage

I know PFF isn't gospel but I trust it over rastanplan.
Agreed. As well as he def. said baker had a noodle arm.


I just want to point to the fact that defensive players who cover the slot, aren't called slot CB's... actually its usually a position the NFL does not use in a normal formation.


Teams in the NFL runs defensive plays out of the nickel something like 70% of the time.


Who does?



Oh. . .

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