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Is Cleveland Browns cornerback Joe Haden overrated? by Chris Fedor, Northeast Ohio Media Group September 15, 2015 at 11:32 AM (There's a video in there I don't know how to share) CLEVELAND, Ohio -- While numerous players struggled on Sunday for the Browns, cornerback Joe Haden was the primary target of criticism. He was burned repeatedly by the bigger, more physical Brandon Marshall, who finished with six catches for 62 yards, including a leaping touchdown grab over Haden in the third quarter. On the day, the Browns secondary, which has spent the off-season making bold proclamations, allowed 179 yards through the air and two TD's. Is Haden, a two-time Pro Bowl cornerback, overrated or did he just have a bad day? Michael Reghi, Bud Shaw and I debated that as part of our Monday morning Browns show. Check out the video above. We'll have more videos coming today at cleveland.com/browns.
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When it rains for Joe, it pours. I feel like he really has a hard time overcoming adversity and showing up in the clutch. Great guy, and he's solid most of the time. Probably not a better guy in the league at covering AJ Green, but when it's all on the line, he's not my guy.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
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As of this very moment in the season, Joe is getting a C- and IMO, that's with lots of generosity...
Jimmy O'Neil needs to go away from the game plan when it's not working. Whoever was on Marshall, should have had help at times. We switched up people covering him, all with the same result. Sometimes you can't just go majority man press, especially when you're being torched. Gotta make adjustments, I didn't see any but I killed the game middle of the third.
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Haden is a little overrated. He also had a bad day.
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I say he's overrated.
But that doesn't mean BAD.
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He's always been grabby, usually been overrated, played out of his mind last year, got beat like a drum on Sunday. He's athletic, has skill, competitive fire and a decent work ethic. I expect him to bounce back after he completes the next few weeks of training camp. 
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I think Haden is one of the top 7 CBs in the league he just had an unlucky day going up against one of the league's better WRs. A couple of those catches Haden actually had good coverage on but Marshall just made very good catches, plus that out of bounds catch Marshall made should have been ruled incomplete.
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He's better against bigger WRs (usually) because he can get away with pushing and grabbing easier..
He gets beat by the smaller guys, like an Antonio Brown, because he doesn't have great speed..
He's very good.
He's also really good at giving up one big play late in the 4th quarter of a close game, usually because he gets caught looking in the backfield and thinks he's faster than he is..
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Joe always seems to have at least 1 game every year that he doesn't do so well. I'm hoping he'll bounce back.
"Hey, I'm a reasonable guy. But I've just experienced some very unreasonable things."
-Jack Burton
-It looks like the Harvard Boys know what they are doing after all.
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Some of those passes where just perfectly placed, that I'm not sure any CB would be able to defend, especially against someone like Brandon Marshal.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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I can't blame any cb when there is no pass rush. If a QB has time to throw the ball, they will beat any CB even all pro CBs.
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~ Legend
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While we're on this topic I found this article interesting. http://www.scout.com/nfl/jets/story/1584848-jets-buster-skrine-compares-revis-joe-hadenAfter playing with both players, what does Buster Skrine think of Darrelle Revis and Joe Haden
FLORHAM PARK: It hasn't been hard for Jets cornerback Buster Skrine to find someone to go to for advice during his NFL career.
When he was first drafted in 2011 by the Cleveland Browns, Skrine could just turn around in the meeting room and pick the brain of two-time Pro Bowler Joe Haden. For the last five months, or, at least since he signed with the Jets as a free agent, he's been able to play sponge to four-time first-team All-Pro Darrelle Revis.
Skrine has watched each in practice, studied what makes each great. And while he's spent a bit more time with Haden, he's got a pretty good knowledge of each player's game.
So, when asked to compare the two on Tuesday, he offered his take:
"I feel like, Revis is like the super technician," Skrine said in a 1-on-1 interview. "He's great, but his technique is something else. Joe, Joe's more super athletic, so he relies on that a little bit more."
During his eight-year NFL career, Revis has been selected to six Pro Bowls, in addition to his All-Pro honors, and was the Defensive Player of the Year in 2009. He's intercepted 26 passes, forced six fumbles and even has two quarterback sacks. While the interception average per year is a bit lower than some, it would undoubtedly be among the league's highest if quarterbacks would, well, throw his way. Nicknamed 'Revis Island' by former Jets coach Rex Ryan, Revis was thrown at a marginally-low 152 times from 2010-2011. Last year as a member of the New England Patriots, quarterbacks tested No. 24 just 85 times. To put that number in perceptive, Haden was thrown at 113 times. Skrine? 123.
While Haden may be tested more, he's also made his share of big plays. In his four-year career, the former first-round pick has intercepted 16 passes and defended 87 more. Aside from his two Pro Bowl honors, he was second-team All-Pro in 2013.
"They're both really great football players," Skrine said. "Sometimes, you have fast guys, and others that are slow. But with both of them, they're both football players. You gotta respect that about them."
Connor Hughes is the New York Jets beat writer for The Journal Inquirer and Scout.com. He can be reached on Twitter (@Connor_J_Hughes), or via email (connor_j_hughes@yahoo.com)
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Some of those passes where just perfectly placed, that I'm not sure any CB would be able to defend, especially against someone like Brandon Marshal. Yeah this is not spoken on too much, but Ryan delivered up some very crisp passes. Hard enough dealing with someone bigger than you height wise, but you factor in well placed balls and it gets outta hand. This is why I would've liked to have seen some safety help on Marshall against the Jets.
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FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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joe seems to have a few REALLY bad games each year. It seems like he's either very good or below average. I think he's a very emotional player and confidence is a big key to his success
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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As I said in a different thread, I don't think he had a good game... I think it was very noticeable because our whole defense couldn't stop the Jets and we needed somebody to make a play... hoping Joe would but he didn't...
As far as him getting torched or beat like a drum... 21 guys had the same or more catches than Marshall... 35 guys had the same or more yards... and a dozen guys had more receiving touchdowns....
If we played the Steelers and Antonio Brown had 6 catches for 65 yards and TD and we won, people would be saying it was a pretty respectable effort by Haden...
yebat' Putin
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That's why I say Revis is the best. He really doesn't even look all that athletic ... he actually looks a little puffy ... but he's a super technician. He plays man to man better than anyone I've seen in a long time.
I think when Joe is good Joe, he's the second best corner in the league. But I agree with D4Life, Joe's confidence seems to wane. When he's going good, he's great. When he starts getting beat a little, the wheels fall off.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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Mr. Overreactive Fan would say things like "overrated" I like to think he just had a bad game. Last year he started slow but ended as one of the best in the NFL. Lets not go crazy and try to convince ourselves that Joe isn't one of the best when he actually is.
Here's the flip side on the subject: Maybe, just maybe, Brandon Marshall had a great game!
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Here's the flip side on the subject: Maybe, just maybe, Brandon Marshall had a great game! And I know I've never seen Fitzpatrick throw the ball that consistently well in the times I've watched him.
yebat' Putin
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Here's the flip side on the subject: Maybe, just maybe, Brandon Marshall had a great game! And I know I've never seen Fitzpatrick throw the ball that consistently well in the times I've watched him. I think Fitzy surprised a lot of us on Sunday. I would have rather them played Geno over him. Dang you Enemkpali!
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I can't blame any cb when there is no pass rush. If a QB has time to throw the ball, they will beat any CB even all pro CBs. I agree with this 100%. You can't give a QB all day in the pocket and blame the CB's Marshall had 26 receiving yards in the first half.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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All Pro
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...said he was overrated for years, even when he is able to mask his stimulant use.
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I think Haden is in a league of his own when compared to our other 1st round corner Justin Gilbert...Haden is far from our problem...Blame goes to our coaching and management and constantly putting an inferior product together (drafting, assembly of coordinators/coaches, Free agency, GMs, switching of schemes yearly, etc)
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I posted it on Facebook last year, and I posted it again Sunday.
Joe Haden is the single most overrated player in the entire National Football League.
That's not to say he's terrible, he's an average corner, but not worth they hype he gets, at all.
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Pro-Bowl Caliber ... Everyone can have a bad game, if he picks Mariota a couple times this week you will all love him again 
John 3:16 Jesus said "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."
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He's been to two Pro Bowls in four seasons, so his peers think he's pretty damn good.hes one of the best corners in football.
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
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"I feel like, Revis is like the super technician," Skrine said in a 1-on-1 interview. "He's great, but his technique is something else. Joe, Joe's more super athletic, so he relies on that a little bit more." That's it in a nutshell.
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I posted it on Facebook last year, and I posted it again Sunday.
Joe Haden is the single most overrated player in the entire National Football League.
That's not to say he's terrible, he's an average corner, but not worth they hype he gets, at all. This is not true. That distinction belongs to Patrick Peterson. If you want to put Haden second, I'm fine with that, but the love that Peterson gets is baffling.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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Rated "Highly".
Not part of the problem, he's part of our solution. With the dearth of good top quality defensive back play since the return I got no issues with Joe getting high praise.
We got quite a few other folks to fix before we get to the likes of Haden. I'm glad he's a Brown.
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At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
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Top 5 CB that had a bad game sunday.. I wouldn't read much more that that into it.
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
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He's always had detractors here. To see his worth, and to hear them really bleat, ask this: if the Browns let him go, how would you feel to see him line up for one of our divisional rivals? People lost their minds when Big Phil visited the Steelers......
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I posted it on Facebook last year, and I posted it again Sunday.
Joe Haden is the single most overrated player in the entire National Football League.
That's not to say he's terrible, he's an average corner, but not worth they hype he gets, at all. Don't care where you posted it, it's wrong
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Wow...tough crowd.
1. Marshall is one of the most athletic WRs out there.
2. Joe Haden has done well in the past with Tall WRs.
3. Haden had been nursing a Hammy for most of Camp/Preseason.
4. As Skrine noted Haden's primary asset is his Athletic ability. I thought he didn't quite have the same Explosive vertical leap I've seen from him in the past.
5. I don't unerstand some writer's/fans definition of Burned. Cromartie was burned by Benjamin...that is my definition of burnt. Haden was there with his man but when it came time to leap and explode he was beat every most times by Marshall...and not by much. It was a match up that normally Haden does well with. Sunday he just seemed to be a dollar short. But I didn't see a wide open burnt. I saw a fade route with a well place ball and one of the most athletic explosive WR go up and get it.
6. Before anyone excuses me of being an apologist. I am very real with what I see. I don't mess with that its not opinion it is what I SEE. Point Blank Haden was in position to battle. He lost just about every Battle this week.
7. Either he has reached a stage in career where he just doesn't have it physically...or he was just a little shy of 100% health and the hammy is all about explosion/vertical leap. I think its the latter. Some of you guys are to quick to throw a player a good player Under the Bus.
jmho
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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1. Marshall is one of the most athletic WRs out there. who was mccown throwing to at the bears in 2013? hmm.....
being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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Hey I agreed with Pit who convinced me earlier in the year we needed some size for the Red Zone.
But personally I have always been wowed by Marshall - I think he is the best and he seems to have gotten his head together which was the only negative in the past. Shame we had too many head case problems to risk another.
He was one WR when guys would say got to get that guy...I would not have minded one bit. Go look at his career. In my eyes he is tops.
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Some of you guys are to quick to throw a player a good player Under the Bus.jmho Getting somewhat off-topic here, but Mitchell Schwartz draws more than his fair share of criticism as well. But that is the subject for another thread...
Last edited by bbrowns32; 09/16/15 08:10 AM.
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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The thing with Marshall isn't just his 6-4 height or his leaping ability, he has to have the longest arms in the league. His arms look 4ft long. On any given fade pattern in the end zone, if the pass is well thrown, he is going to beat most CBs 10 times out of 10 - not just Joe Haden. Which may be why Joe had such trouble with Marshall, but always seems to handle AJ Green - the two receivers are very comparable; their respective QBs are the difference. I know Fitzpatrick isn't highly regarded by a lot of posters, but he threw some beautiful balls last Sunday, right where they needed to be thrown. You couldn't say the same about Andy Dalton the times we faced him.
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As I said in a different thread, I don't think he had a good game... I think it was very noticeable because our whole defense couldn't stop the Jets and we needed somebody to make a play... hoping Joe would but he didn't...
As far as him getting torched or beat like a drum... 21 guys had the same or more catches than Marshall... 35 guys had the same or more yards... and a dozen guys had more receiving touchdowns....
If we played the Steelers and Antonio Brown had 6 catches for 65 yards and TD and we won, people would be saying it was a pretty respectable effort by Haden... this. Marshall is no bum. /thread
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I see a pattern with Joe, to me, it seems, and I may be mistaken, but it seems every season his first game or two are not so great. He starts the year slow. He takes some flack and then lights it up. Like was posted earlier, Its hard enough covering a player like Marshall, but add in some of those perfectly placed passes and it doesnt matter who the CB is.
I think this coming sunday Joe will look a lot better. He is so competitive, I am sure he is pretty ticked that he got beaten so soundly. I would not say he is overrated, he is deserving of the term lock down corner. He usually shuts down the opposing teams best receiver, even if they are named Green or megatron.
just my two cents worth
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum How do YOU rate Joe Haden?
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