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Wish list for next HC
Gruden
Cowher
Billick
Mariucci
Gruden, Cowher and Billick all have rings. I like that. Mariucci had a pretty decent run in San Francisco. No one could have won in Detroit with Matt Millen as the GM. Ouch. Farmer won't draft any WR's and Millen couldn't draft anything else.... lol All would be serious upgrades over what we have now. There is no salary cap on Coaches. Jimmy is swimming in it even after the scandal. Time to BUY us a name coach.
By the way, the 1-7 Lions beat the Packers AT Lambeau Field for the first time since 91. They can do that as bad as they are and we play like we did today.... truly pathetic. I don't think it will be any of those. They have been out of the league for a while. If they were going to come back they would have by now. They probably know they don't have the drive needed to give up their life to be a head coach.
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bro if they announce o neill as the interim coach....lol...oh man. It's the Browns brother.... if we fire Pettine of COURSE they will make O'neil interim.  What else would this pathetic excuse for a franchise do? I wish we could forfeit the rest of the season and start cleaning house right NOW. Every game my anger grows. Then I see the Paul Brown "Football Life" episode and it makes it even worse. We USED to be the ELITE. We used to have a head coach that not only knew the game but created modern football. Teams still run Paul Brown plays today. Now, we're stuck with this.....
#BlackLivesMatter #StopAsianHate
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100% agree! I'm never at the mindset to fire a coach.. I was upset with the firing of Chud. . I want continuity.. But Pettine and Farmer are bad.. To put it mildly
The Views Expressed By Me Are Not Necessarily The Views That You Will Agree With, I'm In My Own Little World But They Know Me Here.
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Wish list for next HC
Gruden
Cowher
Billick
Mariucci
Gruden, Cowher and Billick all have rings. I like that. Mariucci had a pretty decent run in San Francisco. No one could have won in Detroit with Matt Millen as the GM. Ouch. Farmer won't draft any WR's and Millen couldn't draft anything else.... lol All would be serious upgrades over what we have now. There is no salary cap on Coaches. Jimmy is swimming in it even after the scandal. Time to BUY us a name coach.
By the way, the 1-7 Lions beat the Packers AT Lambeau Field for the first time since 91. They can do that as bad as they are and we play like we did today.... truly pathetic. I don't think it will be any of those. They have been out of the league for a while. If they were going to come back they would have by now. They probably know they don't have the drive needed to give up their life to be a head coach. Yeah, but zeros can be highly motivating. What's the top NFL head coach salary right now? Nine, maybe ten million per season? Offer fifteen to start. There is no salary cap on Coaches. Or GM's for that matter.
#BlackLivesMatter #StopAsianHate
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No big name coach will come here. It will be another roll of the dice, see whose left after everyone else hires the guys that we can pretend we have a shot at, and then 2 years later we'll do it again.
#gmstrong
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With Chud, Turner and Horton I think we did have it right and threw it out the window after one year, fastest ever. JMHO
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Legend
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I'm also on board with firing Jim O' Neil, this defense has been awful. I don't really understand how you take a step backwards in your second year despite adding more than you lost talent wise.
I'm 110% against firing Mike Pettine though. Mike Pettine is solely responsible for continuing to allow Jim O'Neil run the defense. He should have relieved O'Neil of his duties weeks ago, but he is far too weak to do so. This speaks volumes about Pettine's leadership and willingness to win. He's a nice guy. He should take O'Neil and go back to coaching high school kids where the stakes aren't so high.
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No big name coach will come here. It will be another roll of the dice, see whose left after everyone else hires the guys that we can pretend we have a shot at, and then 2 years later we'll do it again. Well we have to try. Every time we go looking we set our sights LOW. Time to think big. Buy our way to a decent team. I'd like to see Pettine gone now because we could start our coaching search immediately. Same with Farmer. We could start our GM search right now. Not like we missed Farmer while he was suspended. Beat the others to the punch....
#BlackLivesMatter #StopAsianHate
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I understand your pain.. I just feel the end of the season is a better time for change
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Why would anyone be against firing Pettine? What has he shown? Nothing that I can see. He can't motivate the team, he isn't a good tactician, he's not a good teacher, his talent development is atrocious, his supposed defensive acumen is pathetic.... I just don't get why anyone would want to keep Pettine. Baffles me. I want a great coach. I'd settle for a good one. Pettine is neither.
#BlackLivesMatter #StopAsianHate
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Why would anyone be against firing Pettine? I can answer that. I don't want to argue about it, but I can answer it. I do believe in continuity. I believe that replacing the GM does not affect continuity as much as replacing the coaching staff. I believe that Farmer has sucked so bad that almost no one would have succeeded due to his poor talent evaluation.
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Legend
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I don't know how anyone could put a team out there that just constantly gets so many flags as us.
We are a joke, I don't even care if anyone gets fired. We are a joke.
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I really wanted to fight for giving a coach time to coach the team up BUT this team under pettine has become so bad I can't even stomach watching it anymore. I mean our defense is absolutely putrid. At least in the past the players would fight harder. These guys have already given up and are just riding the season out.
You can't fix stupid but you can destroy ignorance. When you destroy ignorance you remove the justifications for evil. If you want to destroy evil then educate our people. Hate is a tool of the stupid to deal with what they can't understand.
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I really wanted to fight for giving a coach time to coach the team up BUT this team under pettine has become so bad I can't even stomach watching it anymore. I mean our defense is absolutely putrid. At least in the past the players would fight harder. These guys have already given up and are just riding the season out. It's weird..you have DB's playing hard but just seem over matched - how many sidle line throws did we see today with good separation? I watch out LB's and they always seem to come up and fake blitz - then pull back into coveage. Problem is by the time they get back, Ben hit the receiver/TE behind their position...I'm no guru on schemes but the 4/3 just does not seem to be what they guys are good at? We get derailed by the worse timed penalties - more than I have ever seen. We constantly give teams more opportunities to score more points. Lord it seems like we have 1/2 our team in concussion protocol or just healthy inactive.. If we blow up anything, how about our entire D playbook and schemes?
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." [Mark Twain]
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With Chud, Turner and Horton I think we did have it right and threw it out the window after one year, fastest ever. JMHO I agree completely. That was an amazing coaching staff. Too bad Weeden ruined it for us and Banner thought we could do better.
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1st String
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Yeah as really the chances are running slim for the coaches and staff.
May Flowers and Spring Weather!
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2nd String
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It's all coming together (long term). We'll finish the year with maybe 3-4 wins and then this staff is gone. I'm thinking our new President of Football Operations will be ..... Peyton Manning. I would get behind that. Peyton has to hang them up after this year (is age has him playing below avg ball now) but that guy will want to still be heavily in the action.
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Why would anyone be against firing Pettine? I can answer that. I don't want to argue about it, but I can answer it. I do believe in continuity. I believe that replacing the GM does not affect continuity as much as replacing the coaching staff. I believe that Farmer has sucked so bad that almost no one would have succeeded due to his poor talent evaluation. Vers, I can buy into that, Farmer certainly has not given the coaches much to work with. Serious question to anyone, would the stipulation of retaining a coach hinder the hiring of a GM? I think it would, but maybe I'm wrong. Look at where we stand right now, at the end of week 10: - Worst record in the entire league (the other 2-win teams are 2-7, we are alone at 2-8, our .200 Mendoza-line winning percentage is the worst) - Already guaranteed to not have a winning season. We will need to end on a 6-0 tear to avoid a losing season - After tonight, we will most likely already be mathematically eliminated from winning our division. I know that realistically that ship sailed weeks ago, but not even the homerest of the homers can argue the math. To anyone who thinks Farmer should be retained, I ask why? And if it is just for the sake of continuity, then explain that to me - why is continuing this the best option?
How does a league celebrating its 100th season only recognize the 53 most recent championships?
#gmstrong
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Its very important NOT to over react. Its also important to assess what has failed why it has failed and without correcting those things we seal our fate in repeating those very same mistakes in the future.
IMO the heart of the problem is Haslam himself you cannot run a organization via consensus its a failed policy and won't work.
I knew this was coming, I honestly did, and while I think there is plenty of blame to go around starting at the very top firings outside of Text will only get us more of the same.
Just like it always HAS.... Learn from the past folks nothing good will follow firings as painful as that is.
BTTB
AKA Upbeat Dawg
Can't believe I am in a group that is comprised of the best NOT just fans but people on the planet.
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Legend
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Trade the Browns to Toronto for their CFL team.
A life is not important except in the impact it has on other lives.
– Jackie Robinson
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Pettine...he's not a good teacher, his talent development is atrocious... And who is responsible for that? Pettine, or his co-ordinators/assistant coaches? That is assuming that the raw talent is there to start with...which I do believe is the case.
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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J/C
If Pettine was fired before their next game, who would replace him? One of the coordinators? It'd be swapping trash with trash. Making a coaching change right now would be pointless, might as well just let these guys finish the season out and collect as many losses as possible in order to get a better draft pick.
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J/C
If Pettine was fired before their next game, who would replace him? One of the coordinators? It'd be swapping trash with trash. Making a coaching change right now would be pointless, might as well just let these guys finish the season out and collect as many losses as possible in order to get a better draft pick. I agree. The only way they should be fired is if JH has competant proven folks lined up to replace them. If not just let them go through the learning process. We cannot keep replacing everyone every 2 years.
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None of those guys will make a difference. Our talent sucks. And that sums it up. We are in a mismatch at nearly every position. It's hard to coach wins when you have nearly every player on the field getting beat on nearly every play.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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That is assuming that the raw talent is there to start with...which I do believe is the case. I think it's hard for most fans to evaluate talent. There are a lot of things going on and they happen really fast. With that said, a few things are actually obvious. For example: --When you see Desir, Gaines, and Williams all getting beat by a huge margin on simple fly routes [that's a pattern that has the WR go straight down the sideline w/no moves, fakes, etc]how can you blame the coaches for not developing the talent? All three guys were overmatched athletically. --When you see Erving getting knocked into the backfield on multiple plays, how do you blame the coaching staff for that? It's not scheme. It isn't technique. He's weak and got mauled by physically superior players. --It's kinda hard to blame the coaches for not playing Duke at times, because he gets lit-up when he has to try and pick-up a blitz. That is part of the position. He tries hard, but he gets steamrolled by defenders. That isn't coaching. It's guys who are physically/athletically inferior. And you don't even have to be a keen talent evaluator to see that.
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By the way, the 1-7 Lions beat the Packers AT Lambeau Field for the first time since 91. They can do that as bad as they are and we play like we did today.... truly pathetic.
That means that if the season ended today, we'd have the #1 overall pick. #winning
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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j/c:
I still don't think it is a good idea for Jimmy Haslem to fire anyone.
One regime gets one year.
The other regime gets two.
Who of significance would consider coming to Cleveland on that sample size? Coupled with all the other time periods we've given people, there is no security.
Maybe having a #1 pick could entice someone but, hell, I don't know.
Tackles are tackles.
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Don't worry about that Memp. Browns or not, there are plenty of coaches who would jump in a hurry to get a NFL head coaching job....be it a first timer, or a retread seeking a second chance.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Don't worry about that Memp. Browns or not, there are plenty of coaches who would jump in a hurry to get a NFL head coaching job....be it a first timer, or a retread seeking a second chance. Everytime we are looking for a coach someone says this, yet we dont really see it.
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5 first round picks, all busts. Manziel is in year two and I don't think I saw one...not one snap under center.
Definitely not the coaching.
Last edited by BpG; 11/16/15 10:02 AM.
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Is it just me or is everyone else tired of hearing the Post Game Pressers. I haven't been able to watch/listen to one for several weeks now.
Just more of the same stuff over and over again.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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I said this about a month ago in another thread. Still holds true for me.
A Pettine press conference is like watching a Sominex commercial, safe and restful sleep, sleep, sleep...
#GMSTRONG
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--When you see Desir, Gaines, and Williams all getting beat by a huge margin on simple fly routes [that's a pattern that has the WR go straight down the sideline w/no moves, fakes, etc]how can you blame the coaches for not developing the talent? All three guys were overmatched athletically. To some extent, I agree with you, but when you have one of the most athletic corners in the game and can't or won't coach him up to utilize those skills, then why are you there? Honestly Gilbert is perfect for guys like Martavis Bryant, yet he was inactive because they wanted to get a look at Gaines. Now, Gaines did strip that ball, which was a heck of a play... but I honestly don't think the fly pattern would have been pitch and catch if Gilbert was out there. See: last week v Marvin Jones. Gilbert was beat and he still ran him down. He got his hands on Jones as the ball was coming, but he also turned his head an made a play on the ball which is why they didn't throw the flag. Point is, there's plenty of blame to go around. GM, players, coaches, scheme... it's all trash right now.
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I think this just proves it's the coaching. It's their job to put the players into the right postions. It's scheme, and these players have looked better when they played before. When almost every player regresses from one yr. to the next, it's gotta be the coaching. Their just not fitting the players where they need to be. Their forcing them to work at other areas because of injury or ineffectivness. That much seems clear to me.
Dawginit since Jan. 24, 2000 Member #180
You can't fix yesterday but you can learn for tomorrow
#GMSTRONG
I want to do it as a Cleveland Brown because that's who I am.”
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That is assuming that the raw talent is there to start with...which I do believe is the case. I think it's hard for most fans to evaluate talent. There are a lot of things going on and they happen really fast. With that said, a few things are actually obvious. For example: --When you see Desir, Gaines, and Williams all getting beat by a huge margin on simple fly routes [that's a pattern that has the WR go straight down the sideline w/no moves, fakes, etc]how can you blame the coaches for not developing the talent? All three guys were overmatched athletically. --When you see Erving getting knocked into the backfield on multiple plays, how do you blame the coaching staff for that? It's not scheme. It isn't technique. He's weak and got mauled by physically superior players. --It's kinda hard to blame the coaches for not playing Duke at times, because he gets lit-up when he has to try and pick-up a blitz. That is part of the position. He tries hard, but he gets steamrolled by defenders. That isn't coaching. It's guys who are physically/athletically inferior. And you don't even have to be a keen talent evaluator to see that. I was generalizing from an overall talent perspective. We have elite level talent at very few positions. However, overall, I think our talent is adequate - it, in many cases, is simply inexperienced. We are not capable of winning playing with the experience level in many of our starters and backups.
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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Point is, there's plenty of blame to go around. GM, players, coaches, scheme... it's all trash right now. I agree w/that. I am just posting in that style because there seems to be so much blame being put on the coaching staff. Changing coaches is not going to make the "talent" on this team look good. I've been saying it for awhile now, you simply cannot afford to make so many terrible personnel decisions. With that said..........I would have no problem if we brought in a Saban and all these guys were shown the door. I just don't wanna replace Pet w/yet another question mark coach. That will not do anything except to set us back even further.
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Manziel is in year two and I don't think I saw one...not one snap under center.
Yes there were. Not many, but they were there.
Tackles are tackles.
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After watching this mess snow ball game after game, it's starting to smack of "lets tank for a #1 overall draft pick". I know that sounds way out there, but how else could this all fall off so quickly? We have a good young core of players who just started falling off a cliff. Thats coaching. I think JH wants a top 2 pick, if it's for a QB or someone else I don't know, but JM looked pretty good and will only get better, so maybe it's for a trade down for a haul of picks. It's a hot mess right now and I don't see what retaining Pet will do, he has lost the vets and the Rooks.
Dawginit since Jan. 24, 2000 Member #180
You can't fix yesterday but you can learn for tomorrow
#GMSTRONG
I want to do it as a Cleveland Brown because that's who I am.”
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B Point is, there's plenty of blame to go around. GM, players, coaches, scheme... it's all trash right now. I agree w/that. I am just posting in that style because there seems to be so much blame being put on the coaching staff. Changing coaches is not going to make the "talent" on this team look good. I've been saying it for awhile now, you simply cannot afford to make so many terrible personnel decisions. With that said..........I would have no problem if we brought in a Saban and all these guys were shown the door. I just don't wanna replace Pet w/yet another question mark coach. That will not do anything except to set us back even further. Absolutely agree Vers. That's what I was saying in the game thread yesterday. Recycling coaches like changing underwear hasn't worked well for us in the past. We need a tried and proven coach who doesn't care what anyone thinks. He needs to demand beaucop bucks, tell everyone (including Haslam) to get out of his way and git r done. We need someone who sees this position as a challenge, not dollar signs. With that said, who would ever choose to inherit this hot mess?
#gmstrong
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum It's Time to Fire Pettine and
Farmer.
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