DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Johnny Manziel discussion continued

We may not have much choice...

We have a choice. I just hope we don't make a rash choice or one that is fueled by public perception. Once again............Johnny's sins are many, but they do NOT rival the sins of Gordon, and the latter is still on the roster.

He's gone. Why "sorry, Memphis"?

Vers, you're still trying to make a correlation that just isn't quite there. Gordon's a dummy, no doubt.

-But Gordon's antics haven't set the franchise back nearly as much as Manziel's

-Gordon also has at least one phenomenally productive season under his belt.

I don't think it should garuntee him a roster spot, but I think a half a look come preseason is justified.

You might not think there is a correlation, but I do. You can dismiss my opinion all you want. That's fine. But there is no doubt in my mind that people are being hypocritical.

I also want to reiterate that the Browns should not be swayed by the media and public thrashing of Manziel. I don't think any of this year's collegiate QBs have the upside of JM. Spending the second overall pick on a question mark when your team is so devoid of impact players is a huge gamble, especially considering that the OL is going to digress.

I hope that all the cooks in the kitchen take the time to see what is best for the menu before they bow to an emotional public and throw out the main course and replace it w/an expensive new dish.

The big difference between Gordon and Manziel is that the former actually was very good on the field, breaking several WR records and the latter was a no2 QB in every sense of the word. Both are self destructive, so it's not like they're rapist or hurting others as so many in the NFL do. Also QB is more of a leadership position than WR last I looked.

Considering all of this, what's to lose to take another look at Gordon? If the Browns were done with him, wouldn't he be cut already? Be prepared to see flash Gordon in TC....and Manziel in some crappy Hollywood rehab TV reality show. The reason for both is TALENT, something some of you still struggle to admit.

I can handle that answer. It's honest.

What galled me was the moral outrage that so many posters have been exhibiting.

Moral outrage? I really dont think anyone cares if he drinks. Its the way he is going about it, and basically spitting in the face of the team as well as re-hab.

One thought on a potential rookie QB playing behind less of a line than the Browns currently have is this: With Davis under contract, the Browns could go with McCown, Davis, rookie on the depth chart until said rookie works his way up to the #2 or #1 job. He wouldn't necessarily have to be thrown behind that line. Perhaps he sits for a year, learns the NFL game, and the Browns continue to build the line/team for his year 2.

Then again, it's the Browns, so he'll probably be in due to injury by the half way point!

#1 pretty sure that you are not allowed to cut a player under suspension...

#2 how do you cut a nfl player that isn't in the nfl?

So you guys already heard the story too (snickers)!

One more time:

'Report: Johnny Manziel Wore Blonde Wig, Fake Mustache Out In Las Vegas'

http://www.yardbarker.com/nfl/articles/r...1_8626_20139661

If this story is true, this kid is kinda crazy, but maybe it's in a kinda fun way?

Perhaps he's trying to one day replace Charlie Sheen in the National Enquirer?

Moral outrage, are you kidding me? As a season ticket holder, to raise my ticket prices while paying for Manziel to be an idiot in a blond wig in Vegas and Bowe to make 9 mil riding the pine, I am disgusted. This has nothing to do with moral outrage. Perhaps ethical outrage when talking about the dollars.....morality, with this team, seems to be a non factor.

The alleged photo of Manziel in Vegas.

yep... that's him... would know those eyes anywhere...

Vers - I haven't given deep thought yet to your arguments so I don't have a firm opinion yet, though I might after I complete this post.

My issue with your arguments isn't so much with what you are saying but how you are presenting them. You combine multiple controversial issues and combine them into one. For example, whether we keep Manziel or not has nothing to do with the quality of the Qb's in this years class. Manziel needs to be evaluated on his own. Then if we decide to move on from Manziel then we evaluate the the quality of the Qb's in the draft and decide if one if worth drafting or not. The way you are presenting your case makes it seem as if you are saying there are no good ab'a in this draft so we should keep Manziel.

As for Manziel vs Gordon, each case should be taken and evaluated individually. The difference between the 2 that I see are level of remorse. Manziel is being disruptive to the organization, he has reportedly shown up to the practice facility "dishelveled and inebriated". How many times has this happened? I don't know. None of us fans do but the organization sure does. Manziel shows absolutely zero remorse. Gordon has messed up multiple times but seems remorseful. He has issues but is trying. Is my perception accurate? I don't know. But to me that is the difference between Manziel and Gordon. Regardless, if either of these guys has continued problems then they need to be off this team. The only question is at what point. And that needs to be individualized.

JMO

So, it's okay that Gordon was kicked out of two colleges and lied about it? It's okay has failed numerous drug tests in the NFL and been suspended twice? That he was caught w/pot in his car and got a DUI while suspended? Lied about the cough medicine? Posted picks of him w/a pipe, giving a gang sign, and having a pill bottle? Posted pics and a vid of him partying in Miami while under suspension?

Nope, not ok. (I think that is why he is suspended)

That's a photo shop of an old Manziel photo. The new one hasn't come out yet although I'm sure it will today at some point.

I can't think of a guy who has been this drastic of a screw up.

Yep. This. Gordon got a year suspension for drinking after the season was over on an airplane with his teammates and the WR coach.

Manziel was just drinking in Vegas the night before a game and didn't show up for the morning concussion evaluation, again violating the team rules.

I agreed with the point of view that Vers holds about Gordon vs. Manziel at the beginning of the season, but Manziel has become outright offensive towards the team. i think if you list Gordon's transgressions with the team vs Manziel's side by side... at this point Manziel's are probably worse.

I am not saying that we have to keep Manziel because the qbs are terrible, but I think the Browns better weigh their options carefully and not be forced to draft a qb who doesn't really deserve such a high pick, especially because the team lacks play makers at other positions. We did not lose games this year just because of poor qb play.

Remorse? Gordon quit on the team last year. He has been late to meetings throughout his career. He brooded when he came back. He lied at least twice about what happened. He got a DUI while suspended. He had pot in his car while suspended. That's not remorse, Jester.

I am not saying that we should cut Gordon. I am saying that the Browns better not be swayed by public perception when evaluating the situation.

If the story from the weekend is true, there is no defence for Johnny's actions.
None.

Manziel's actions in and of themselves warrant him being dispatched IMO. Hopefully the Browns can get something for him.

The people in Berea are the only ones who can make this decision based on facts that can be verified. Not what the fans think, what players think or what ESPN thinks.

ALL other teams would be wise to wait the Browns out. The Browns would be smart to take the first offer they can get for this loser once the trading season is open.

Get rid of this distraction. It's time to move forward.

i dont understand why Vers thinks somehow people are giving Gordon a pass.

we've already exhausted something like two different threads in the past that gordon is a bum right now. yet the dude thinks if we aren't talking about a guy that didn't play one snap of the season that means we gave him a pass?

classic case of a guy reading what he wants to read, and ignoring everything else.

two destructive players, nobody is giving either of them a pass.

but at least gordon proved he's not only a pro bowler, but all pro #1 WR when on the field., and THAT's the reason why people hope he comes back with his head finally on straight. Gordon hasn't brought anywhere near the level of embarrassment manziel has.

Manziel is a modern day Joe Willy Namath. He is ours and we have to learn to accept his off the field antics. Just win Johnny, just win.

thats the problem, 40.

namath won games and a SB.

manziel hasn't even sniffed 5 wins.

hell, weeden has won more games than him.

mccoy too.