DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Hue Jackson

Reading through this and a couple of other threads is rough. People completely ignore comments from professionals. They ignore pictures, OL rankings, videos. They ignore scouting reports. They just stick w/a baseless opinion. The lack of accountability is at an all-time low right now.

And therein lies my point

Does your right foot start forward or does your left foot start forward?

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/11/02/switching-sides/

What are his lift numbers in comparison to his peers? I don't know. Do you? Which of us is making something up?

Bitonio seemed to imply that the two of them have been doing the same things in the weight room.

What are the exact quotes from those people? That he's weak or a generic he needs to improve his strength that one could apply to basically any lineman?

Yes, I do know about OL play. I coached them.

Now, I get the feeling that you are just asking questions that you don't want the answers to.........AGAIN.....and are simply trying to dismiss my takes and convince others you know what you are talking about.....AGAIN.

For example, I posted comments from Joe T, Dieken, and Bentley. You and tab both ignored them. And you co me back w/some crap about how you don't get "why" posters question Erving's strength. Heck, I even posted a scouting report that questioned his strength and technique. Again, you both ignored it.

Truthfully, I think you are full of crap. I don't think you want to be educated. I think you...and your .....ooopps....tab..have a need to be perceived as being right.

So again, please don't ask me questions that you don't want to hear the answers to.

tab and Grimm aside................if ANYONE wants to know some basic fundamental and universal steps of offensive linemen.......just ask. I will do my best to explain.

For example, he was talking about right foot/left foot. He must have googled something real quick, but here is JUST one example.

Let's say you are going to run a 32 Iso against a 4-3. The center is going to move straight ahead and make sure the guy who is shaded on his left side does not cross his face. The left side of the line is going to angle block to their right. The RG is going to gap block to his left. And this is the ONE step I will concentrate on in this example.

In this case, his gap block to the left mandates that he steps w/his left foot first at a 45 degree angle to the LOS. He is doing this as he comes out of a tunnel rather than standing straight up. For those of you who actually read the scouting report, you may remember that Erving was accused of standing up too quickly. Anyway, the RG is going to throw his right elbow up....we call this a wing, and clip the DT that is on his right side, and then continue to the second level and keeping that wing up, and placing his face mask in the left armpit of the Mike, he shields him off to the offensive left side, which allows a one-cut from the RB off the centers butt and staying to the RGs right side.

Does it always work out that way. Hell no! However, that is the way it is drawn up and practiced.

I will gladly provide more examples, such as trap blocking, base blocking, pulling, etc if anyone is interested. But again, I get the feeling this is more about agenda than learning, so I ain't holding my breath.

Where? How did they do (team and individual)? How often did you switch them from the left to right side?



Maybe I know what I'm talking about. I even provided a link. Did you look at it? It's not just random quotes. It's a full write up with logical explanations.



Quotes without context don't prove anything. I read the quotes. I understand questioning it. I just don't like when people pose it as a fact that he is lacking strength. It's an opinion that gets repeated over and over until posters believe it. Apparently we're only allowed to do that about negative things.



Truthfully, I think you can't handle being wrong. It happens. I'm not trying to attack you. I'm trying to get to the right information. (Sometimes it does head towards attacking because you can drive me crazy. I'm trying to avoid that. I may be the "chillest" person in a hundred mile radius, but you can push my buttons like nobody's business. I think it's because you remind me of my childhood memories of my father.)

How about this..........let's ignore one another? I think you are full of crap. I think you can't stand being questioned. I think you make things up to further your agenda. I think that you do not like to learn. I think you are a young kid who mistakenly believes he knows more about life than his elders.

You think the same things about me except for the last one.

I'm cool w/us ignoring one another.

Actually, I was reading Geoff Schwartz' twitter the other day to see if I could find out more about the Mitchell Schwartz contract fiasco, and he talked about the difficulty of changing positions in his feed. It was fresh in my mind, so when people intimated that it didn't matter, my brain shouted, "Wait a minute!"

I'm a football junkie. I played football, not collegiately. I went the military route because 9/11 happened when I was making my college plans. I turned down full ride scholarships. I'm not some random neophyte. I played some O-line early on before switching over primarily to defense (end/olb) and rocking Derrick Thomas' #58.

I have coaching manuals, too. I read a lot. People that know me in real life seem to think I'm pretty bright intellectually. (I think they're crazy.) I was Valedictorian in high school, and I just got home from an academic achievement banquet where I was honored for being on the President's List. (I can send pics if you really want to go there.) If coaching paid better, that's probably what I would be doing. It is probably what I will do in my free time once I have my post military employment sorted out.

I don't mind when you point out where I'm wrong, which has happened a time or two when my opinions didn't pan out due to factors I hadn't considered. What irritates me is when you act like you are the authority on everything, and every one else is a bumbling idiot. It just isn't so. You may have some knowledge, I'm not denying that, but you're not infallible. No one knows everything.

I've tried ignoring you, but when I do that I miss out on about 50% of the posts on this board that are actually thought provoking. If you could stick to facts and football, things would be great. Somehow things always tend to get personal around you. It drives me crazy.

....how old do you think I am?

Let's get something straight right off the bat. You came after me first. I did not say a word to you until you started w/your BS.

I made a comment about Erving maybe having problems at center due to his lack of strength and technique. tab asked for a link.

I provided several links. I asked if he wanted more. He responded that one video didn't prove squat, threw some more shots at me, and moved on. I said that I provided more links. Pit backed me up. tab comes back and says he doesn't read my posts anymore because I insult him. Meanwhile, he replied to that one and replied to me on another thread AFTER that post. He then replied when I made a snarky comment about ddub still buying his crap. He doesn't read my comments anymore?

You jump in and say how you don't get how posters keep saying Erving has strength issues. I provided evidence. It wasn't just me who said it. The guy ends up on his tail over and over again. I see it. Professionals see it. The camera sees it. Yet, you act like I am nuts for saying it. Never once did you mention the article I posted.

And then you have the freaking nerve to say I don't like being wrong. Where the hell did you prove me wrong. Look Grimm, NO ONE admits they are wrong more than me. I'm secure enough to do so and I'm sorry if that makes you insecure in yourself.

You ask me about footwork. I reply. You ignore and hurl more of your BS insults.

Btw------------I do think you are intelligent. I think you are well spoken. I think you take the time to research. You have a lot of good qualities. However, I think the things you accuse me of are more about you, than me.

I have been on the minority side of the debates ever since I have been on here. I don't give a rat's ass if you---or anyone--agrees w/me. That has been proven.

I speak to of what I know and what I believe. I try to add balance to the discussions. That bothers some people. It apparently bothers you. You may be smart, but you don't seem secure enough to handle opposing opinions.

I will stick by EVERYTHING I said about Erving.

Summary:

He is not strong enough yet.

His technique is poor.

That combination is deadly.

He has good enthusiasm.

He is not a bust.

He needs to improve.

I hope he is working hard this off season to improve his deficiencies.

How the hell were the articles I posted personal? It was you and tab who made it personal.

You guys attack and then cry you are victims.

20s.

The articles were fine. The commentary got personal at times. I'm trying to play peacemaker and keep things on football (my last couple posts did go off on a bit of a tangent.) I even backed you against eotab recently.



I wish. Uncle Sam got most of those.


I'm really not even arguing that Erving is strong. I'm just saying those pictures don't tell me much of anything about strength. With terrible form, it is impossible to tell. He did drive his man back at times. Not often, because his form was generally terrible, but this tells me he has at least some baseline strength. I feel the quotes are reflective of his play on the field rather than his physical ability.

Without actually being at the rack with him when he lifts, I don't feel comfortable presenting lack of strength as a fact. It definitely hasn't been translating to the field very well. I think those are two different things. It seems like an opinion has been repeated over and over until it has become fact to me.

As far as footwork, I think having one foot or the other forward at the start matters. I used to be a sprinter in high school. I always started with the same foot forward in the blocks. Trying to improve my times, I decided to switch it up. It completely buggered me up. Playing at the NFL level on the O-Line, I can't help but believe that reps and muscle memory matter even more.

Look man..............you wanna talk football w/me like this and we'll be cool. Otherwise, we really should ignore each other. I'm sick of the fighting.

The strength think is not just my opinion. It was in the scouting report. I can provide more if you insist on acting like I am making it up??????????

I was a sprinter. Track footwork and OL footwork are not correlated. Now, you will probably say I am making that up. I did provide one example for you. Are you ignoring it? I can provide another. Even more, if you so wish. I will be glad to share.

It just gets frustrating when people ask questions and then disregard answers.

And I don't think I know everything. I bow down to guys like steve in the draft. I ask questions. I like to learn.

I sure as hell am not a financial expert. A romance expert. A political expert. A religious expert. I listen and learn.

I know football. I played it. I coached it. I scouted it. For some freaking reason, most posters on this board don't want to learn from what I know.

For example............who questions Clem about music? I sure as hell don't. You wanna know why.........he has more experience at it. He is a professional. He gets paid for it. Why not respect that? Yet, so many of you just wanna blow off what I do know. That's wrong.

And I want to make it clear that there is a difference between knowledge and opinion. For example, my thoughts on who to draft are purely opinion. I like a few of the qbs, but I think they are risky. That's opinion. Not fact.

However, when I watch a guy like Erving.....I see strength and technique as issues. Those aren't opinions. They are real. There was an argument on here recently about the importance of the OL. I said that pressure on a qb is huge. If the OL gives the qb a pocket, he has a much better chance of succeeding. Others acted like it was all about he qb. Yeah.........then NE played Denver and then Carolina played Denver. No apologies. No lightbulbs going off. Just move on to the next attack.

Again.............I do think you are intelligent. I got a kick out of how you corrected me on the peer thing. That was funny. You formulate good sentences. Very well-spoken. You impressed me right off the bat. You just seem to set in your ways. You seemingly ignore evidence if it contradicts your opinion. You have potential........

............and if you want me to explain some other techniques of the footwork involved in certain OL play, I will be happy to explain.

The scouting report is largely opinion to me. Some end up being right. Some don't. Erving put up 30 reps on the bench press at the combine. That's a solid number for as long as his arms are. That was a top performer at the combine.

NFL.com Combine Profile for Cameron Erving

That's the only fact as far as strength that I have to go by.

Play-strength would seem to be lacking, but that hasn't been what people are saying. It may be what some posters mean, but I don't think that is true for most of them.

Track footwork and OL footwork are different, but the muscle memory aspect seems relevant to me. Did you really read the pro football focus article I linked earlier?

Link

Geoff Schwartz and Andrew Whitworth are NFL lineman who are quoted saying it matters.

You talked about o line technique, but not specifically switching sides on the line. The basic techniques are the same in words. Bio-mechanically doing it on the left side is different than doing it on the right. You probably write with your right hand. Now try writing with your left hand. It's the same action, but one way is probably a lot easier. That's the way you're used to doing it.

I agree that pressure affects QBs. I don't think anyone can rationally deny that. cfrs posted that tweet showing the change in completion percentages when under duress. The differences were pretty stark. I think some people are just willing to wait and see if having an o line coach for a whole season and a nice offensive play caller can offset some of the drop off from losing Mack and Schwartz.

You know how in sports psychology they have athletes mentally visualize plays where they are successful in hopes of that confidence carrying over onto the field? I try to do that with my fandom/posting.

I played a lot of positions on offense and mostly LB on defense. I played every position on the o-line except center. Mostly LT on the line though. Just the stance is hard to get used to when switching sides. Then you have to actually think backwards as far as your assignment on every blocking play as well. (A read like "On, Over, Inside" is actually the mirror image of what you are used to. That doesn't seem like a big deal, but it is when you have practiced it one way so often that you don't think about it.) It was the reverse plays as a guard where I made mental mistakes though. Normally you pull right on an even number play and left on an odd number play. This is the same for both guards if your job is to pull on that play. On a reverse though, you pull the opposite of the play number. This is again always the same for both guards as well, but something about thinking backwards while playing on the other side made me forget that a lot. Fortunately, we hardly ever ran reverse plays and the mistakes were in practice. Also kick stepping on the other side of the ball is like learning it all over again. You don't have any muscle memory and have to think about it all the time. That is probably the hardest thing to get used to and if you do get used to it, you run into the same problem when you switch back again.

All that being said, given enough time, switching sides isn't something that's a huge deal. You eventually get used to it. Switching skill sets however from a guard to a tackle is not something every player can do, no matter how much time that you give them. I couldn't imagine learning all of those positions in my rookie year. What I had to learn was probably 1/10th of what the guys in the NFL have to learn and that isn't even thinking about learning to make the line calls as a Center on top of that.

So yeah, maybe all of that is floating through his brain and he is not thinking about fundamentals, but he really needs to lower his pad level. I think at least that part of him was flawed going in. It's really hard for me to comment on his strength because that's hard to tell with such bad technique. I will say that a few players are strong enough to get away with bad technique occasionally and I'm quite sure that he isn't one of those players.

When I played football my Senior year, it was at OLB and LT mostly. I was 160 lbs and probably the smallest LT in our league. I don't think I was All League at LT, but I was better than average. I was strong for my size (I was split option Army and just finished Basic training that summer. I was 135 pounds when I went in and put on #25 lbs of muscle in 8 weeks in Basic Training), but still probably the weakest LT out there. It really helped that I was a wrestler and understood leverage. Yes, he probably needs to get stronger, but he needs to fix his pad level first because even stronger than he is now, he won't be strong enough to play at that pad level.

Not directed at you but to all members of this board. Using your quote because it succinctly expresses my feelings.

When we talk football it is fun and interesting and educational.

When we bicker it is annoying and frustrating and people want to leave the board.

I have a couple suggestions for how to handle this:

1, when posting non football comments, envision how you would feel if that poster was replying in that manner to you.

2, when something can be taken 2 separate ways, assume the good way.

3, when someone makes a disparaging remark toward you, ignore it. You don't have to put the poster on ignore. You'll miss too many good posts that way. Just ignore the comment. When someone says something, we don't always have to reply to it. We can read it say "Eh" and forget about it. Just like in a football game. After the play, one guy gives a little extra push. If ignored things move on. If retaliation ensues then things escalate.

just my 1.5 cents

I clicked on here, read your post and then the one right after it.

You gotta admit that the coincidental irony is pretty darn funny.

It's more the juxtaposition than irony, but it is somewhat amusing. Irony is one of those words that doesn't mean what a lot of people think it does.

Anyway, on football, how do you rationalize Erving's combine numbers with the narrative on his strength? Can you see where my hesitation to support that "fact" is coming from?

First of all, tab asked the refs to remove my post because it was ridiculous. I gave several examples of why I had formulated my opinion. It's amazing how these things get turned around.

I think I have already answered your question.

I provided quotes from Bentley, Dieken, and Joe T. I posted this weakness from an online scouting report:



I posted it for a reason. I agree w/it. This time read it carefully enough and you will see how it answers the combine numbers' question.

Combine poor technique w/not ideal strength and one can easily understand what Bentley, Dieken, and Joe T were talking about. The same things I have been talking about, btw.

Then, factor in just how many times Erving was blown-up last year and I don't see how my opinion was so freaking absurd.

It's not absurd. I'm not saying that at all. I'm just saying it is opinion rather than fact.

I gave the bench press number to show that it's not necessarily clean cut.

You understand football and the difference between weight room strength and play strength. I don't think everyone on here does. I'm trying to highlight that distinction.

I think a lot of people correlate strength with bench press, but that doesn't seem to be Erving's problem.

He may have non-ideal leg strength, but they don't test leg strength in a public forum. I'm not sure how much technique plays into the appearance of his weak play strength in his legs. It looks like it is a factor.

You've danced around the edges of my questions without really addressing the heart of what I'm trying to get at. I'm not trying to argue about what you seem to think I'm arguing about.

I've told you I'm something of a perfectionist, and I'm looking at the specificity of words. I see how people could take your words and interpret them as something you're not necessarily saying. I'm trying to provide clarity.

Some people seem to think Erving is spending his time eating dough nuts rather than lifting weights, and I don't believe that to be the case. My opinion is He's not weak, it just has not translated onto the field.

Browns notebook: Joel Bitonio says Cameron Erving built to play center, wants to prove ‘he was a first-round draft pick for a reason’

By Nate Ulrich
Beacon Journal sports writer


BEREA: The Browns desperately need Cameron Erving to improve from his rookie season if they’re going to rely on him to fill the shoes of three-time Pro Bowl center Alex Mack.

The good news is left guard Joel Bitonio seems optimistic about Erving, the 19th overall pick in last year’s draft who played center and left tackle at Florida State.

“I think he’s built to play center,” Bitonio said Wednesday, “and I think he can really perform there if he needs to. ... He’s a competitive kid, and he wants to come in here and prove that he was a first-round draft pick for a reason.”

Unless the Browns draft a center later this month or switch another player’s position, they’ll count on Erving to replace Mack, who joined the Atlanta Falcons last month in free agency.

Erving started four games at guard last season because of injuries to Bitonio and right guard John Greco, but he struggled mightily. Opponents often overpowered him, prompting Erving to admit he needed to become stronger this offseason.

The Browns reported Monday for the start of their voluntary offseason conditioning program, and Bitonio said Erving returned in good shape.

“He set his mind this offseason to come and make those changes and really try and fight and prove himself this year,” Bitonio said. “... He seems like he is strong. He is running well. We were doing a lot of competition running today, and me and him were together on that.”

Browns coach Hue Jackson has been impressed with Erving thus far.

“I think he is excited about working,” Jackson said. “I think he is committed to what he needs to do to continue to get better.”

http://www.ohio.com/sports/browns/browns...reason-1.674406

mac posted earlier (either in this thread or another) about Erving having some back injury issues at some point this year. I know when I only have a strain it's hard to do anything with proper form/posture. It's not unreasonable to think that threw him off a bit.

Cleveland Browns
Harkins: Browns have more than a quarterback whisperer in Hue Jackson

By Bob Harkins

If you read enough about Hue Jackson you start to get the impression he is like Yoda — spreading wisdom throughout the galaxy, engendering loyalty from his young Padawans and building an army of young quarterback Jedis along the way.

But is this the case? Is Jackson really a quarterback whisperer? It’s an important question, because for the Cleveland Browns there is no more pressing issue than the quarterback position.

Whether it’s someone already on the roster like Josh McCown — who wisely said on Tuesday that he is willing to help Jackson by mentoring a young quarterback – or someone plucked from the draft like Jared Goff or Carson Wentz, or a free agent like Brock Osweiler, the Browns desperately need a signal caller.

One thing we know is that it won’t be Johnny Manziel.

In examining the evidence about Jackson’s ability to mentor and develop quarterbacks, the name that comes up most often is Joe Flacco. The Baltimore Ravens drafted Flacco in 2008, the same year they hired Jackson as their quarterbacks coach.

Flacco was installed as a starter immediately as a rookie and developed quickly, going 20-12 in two seasons under Jackson, and winning three playoff games in two seasons.

Ravens coach John Harbaugh has credited Jackson for his work with Flacco, and also said this: “I think it’s a great hire by the Browns. (He is) creative and hard-nosed at the same time. He’s going to have those guys fired up and they’re going to love playing for him.”

In his most recent job, as offensive coordinator of the Cincinnati Bengals, Jackson earned credit for his work with Andy Dalton, poking and prodding the quarterback to be more active at holding his teammate accountable, but also to loosen up and enjoy playing the game. The result was a career-high passer rating of 106.2 in 2015.

“I would say there’s a lot of guys around here playing their best,” Bengals veteran Andrew Whitworth said. “It’s from Hue doing that. Week in and week out, as I always say, the greatest thing you can mark out of a coach is consistency.”

The quarterback Jackson has influenced the most, though, might be Carson Palmer, a guy he coached at USC and in Oakland, and who he worked closely with as receivers coach in Cincinnati from 2004-06.

Palmer said Jackson helped him develop “a ton” as a player and added this: “(The Browns are) not only getting an amazing football mind but a tremendous person.”

And former Bengals receiver Chad Johnson went even further: “Hue Jackson is a gem. He was a gem for me and I am speaking gem, g-e-m. … With Hue coming on board (in Cleveland), being able to get the maximum amount of potential out of each player is what I know is going to happen because he was able to do it with me. I am sure he will be able to do it with them.”

Hue Jackson has put in his time, working his way up through the ranks to earn this opportunity in Cleveland. Whether or not he is able to turn the Browns around remains to be seen, but the more you hear his former players and associates talk about him, the more you begin to realize that his abilities go well beyond developing quarterbacks. He’s adept at developing and getting the most out of football players, period, and you couldn’t ask much more from a head coach.

j/c

John Clayton says Hue Jackson has two years in Cleveland

John Clayton of ESPN was a guest on 710 AM ESPN Seattle earlier this week and Cleveland Browns quarterback Robert Griffin III and head coach Hue Jackson were popular topics. Clayton said that he likes Griffin but does not think he will turn around the organization because of a lack of talent. He is also an advocate of Jackson. He does not see the partnership working out, however.

"I've always been a big proponent of Hue Jackson. I've always liked him. Of the the times that I've talked to him, he's been very gracious to me; given me a lot of good background, a lot of good information. He's a very bright coach and he's very good with quarterbacks but the problem is, I know him too well. He had two people that he was calling constantly and advising him. I got to those two people too late because Hue had just come off the San Francisco interview, he had an interview scheduled with the New York Giants. They were sitting down and now they were talking about the team," Clayton said.

"The advisor said 'oh, yeah. Take the job.' You trade [offensive tackle] Joe Thomas. You do this, you do that. You take a quarterback at No. 2. I said to both guys 'are you giving this guy a death wish? What are you doing?' This is going to be a disaster. He is going to get fired in two years. I put together a list of coaches that are going to possibly get fired next year, the guys on the hot seat. It's usually six to eight guys for next year. He is already No. 1 for the 2018 season. Think about what he is going in to. They only have about four good players on that team now because they let about four go this year."

The four good players that Clayton referenced were offensive tackle Joe Thomas, cornerback Joe Haden, tight end Gary Barnidge and offensive guard Joel Bitonio.

Why does the analyst feel so strongly about Jackson's demise?

"They don't have a running back. RGIII is a work in progress trying to see if he can get there. The wide receiving corp is all small and brittle. The linebacking corp has been chopped up. It's going to take whoever is coaching four years just to get the roster to a respectable level. He is not going to be around for four years," Clayton finished.

If anyone is curious to know Clayton's list of coaches on the hot seat, it was Jacksonville Jaguars head coach Gus Bradley, San Diego Chargers head coach Mike McCoy, Tennessee Titans head coach Mike Mularkey and Los Angeles Rams head coach Jeff Fisher. Other possibilities include Indianapolis Colts head coach Chuck Pagano, Buffalo Bills head coach Rex Ryan and Detroit Lions head coach Jim Caldwell.

Jackson has not coached a game with the Browns but one national analyst feels that he is already on the hot seat.

http://cle.247sports.com/Article/Clayton...Browns-44737626

Clayton is a legend in the business, but he has certainly lost his fastball. There are many more people I trust over him. With that said, history shows that Haslam has an itchy trigger finger. That's what Clayton is banking on.

Hue Jackson has the Browns believing

The Cleveland Browns, though incomplete, are already starting to believe in their ability to have a solid 2016 season.

BEREA, OHIO—When the assorted pieces that currently make up the Browns roster joined together for their first set of offseason team workouts in Berea, Hue Jackson was happy with what he saw.


Though his team is very much in the middle stages of a massive rebuild, Jackson's eyes darted around the team’s facility and he saw a foundation for the future.

He watched as Gary Barnidge, Joel Bitonio and Joe Haden went to work.

He looked on at a quarterback room full of potential leaders like Robert Griffin III and Josh McCown.

He saw the makings of a strong core of defensive play-callers, including DeMario Davis and Christian Kirksey.

As he watched his team, it was easy for him to forget the negative voices that have already trashed the Browns for the upcoming season.

He doesn’t listen to those voices and there’s only one expectation that matters: his own.

“I have said it from the day I sat up here before: I expect to win,” Jackson said. “I expect to win, our players expect to win, and we understand that in order for that to happen, we have to work to win. That is all we are about right now.”

Just as Jackson believes in the abilities of his team— a team that, again, has plenty of pieces to add to the puzzle before the 2016 season kicks off— so too do the players that are already a part of the plans.

“People outside of our building are not going to have expectations for us, we feed on that. We love that,” Barnidge said. “We are going to go out there and just show what we can do, and we are looking forward to the future. That’s all we can do.”

Barnidge isn't alone in his thoughts.

Bitonio too believes in the Browns, even as the number of new faces grows.

“I think there are more new faces this year than I saw last year, but I think with the guys that we have in here and the way we are working and the way things are being set up, we are going to work our tails off,” Bitonio said. “We’re going to have as much chance to win a game as the next team.”

That last statement by Bitonio has been heavily contested by many media outlets and analysts, who seem to believe the Browns are set for a tough time next season.

Even if they are, with so much turnover from the old regime to the new group, Jackson is thrilled to be a part of this organization.

He still has no plans to listen to the many dissenting voices.

He has far too much else with which to concern himself as the rebuild continues.

“There’s no better group that I have ever been around than the guys I am working with each and every day. I feel very blessed and fortunate to be in this situation regardless of what the outside people think,” Jackson said. “We will let everyone else talk about all the other things that are going on. We are only interested in working and getting better.”

http://www.scout.com/nfl/browns/story/1659245-jackson-has-the-browns-believing

To add to that: The Brown's roster was already near the bottom of the league before the "new" guys took over. That roster has been significantly weakened. It's going to be hard to win games.

People are going to preach patience all off-season, just like they did last of-season. However, two more years of losing 12 to 16 games isn't going to sit well w/anyone. The uproar will be deafening and that is when your point about Haslam's history will probably rear its ugly head once again.

I actually feel sorry for Hue. Haslam and his crew have placed him in a dreadful situation.

Not saying he isn't good or doesn't have insight, I just don't remember him for anything significant. To me, it's like the difference between a columnist and a beat writer, where the beat writer is around the team more than the columnist. I see Clayton as the columnist. I hope he is wrong.

I only know him for two things:

1. Being a Steelers homer, and

2. This:

One can discredit the messenger, but I wonder if anyone who actually thinks about what Hue is walking into, would try to dismiss the message?

Here we go again....

wonder what people will say if we win 6 games this year???

I'll be wondering why six of our opponents didn't show up for their games.

I am sure you will

We are unsettled at Q.B. and he went along with a bust of a Q.B. that is injury prone and was cut from a 4 an 12 team and he is supposedly known as a QB GURU OOOOKAY. Again I hope im wrong but seems like the same old shite IMO

File this under Hue OR the Front Office? Or maybe just bored writers that can predict the future? Beats me.

Report suggests Hue Jackson is a bad fit for Browns’ analytics staff

Posted by Michael David Smith on April 11, 2016, 12:18 PM EDT

The new front office executives hired by the Browns this offseason come from an analytics background, led by new chief strategy officer Paul DePodesta, who was an important figure in Moneyball and a longtime baseball analytics guru.

But the Browns’ new head coach does not come from an analytics background, and a new ESPN Magazine profile of DePodesta suggests that coach Hue Jackson is likely to clash with the analytics people in Cleveland. The profile quotes a former NFL executive describing Jackson as “a very bad fit” for the approach DePodesta wants to take.

That executive also said Jackson’s coaching staff will not be on board with the analytics department’s decision making, and predicted that there will be fireworks in the draft room.

“It’s not just Hue Jackson,” the former executive said. “When data overrides gut, the majority of his coaching staff will all be there screaming, ‘What the f— are these computer guys doing? They don’t understand football, they don’t understand the locker room. They’re killing us.'”

For his part, Jackson has said there’s a process and a plan in Cleveland and he’s on board with it. But if the Browns struggle this season, questions will surely be raised about whether the analytics approach is in fundamental conflict with Jackson’s traditional football approach.

I would think if that was the case, then Hue wouldn't have taken the job.

I don't know about that. Haslam is great at marketing and selling goods. Have you seen the new jersey?

Think about that for a moment. Hue being told he would have to accept the numbers group and play nice whether he liked it or not. He would be in NYG talking about how nice it was to be a Giant. No, I think Hue really liked the set up we have with Sashi & Co. He would of had to really....Other wise why take the job? If he knew he would be butting heads(like this so-called story suggests) then it's a no brainer...Off to NYG