DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2016 NFL Season 2016 NFL Draft Trading the #2 pick

Jack is not a pass rusher. His sack count is irrelevant.

He's a very good player. He reminds me of Barr, his former teammate at UCLA. Awesome talents. Very valuable. Guys you should draft in 9--18 range or so. Not at 2.

You need true impact players at 2. If one isn't available, trade down.

Now, I am not saying I am right. It's just my opinion.

I think he is Luke Kuechly. If I am right, then he is worth the #2 pick.

Barr was a crazy athlete and plays all over for the Vikings as well. I believe he only played end/outside linebacker for two years (ever). He was a converted full back.

Jack is also a crazy athlete in that he was a great running back. . . but also played linebacker at the same time (he is also a bit smaller).

(I am not disagreeing with you, just pointing out that both are crazy athletes.)

It's cool if we disagree. I have zero problems w/that. I am not even saying I am right. I am sure you watched more of both Jack and Barr than I have.

We're just conversing. It's cool.

Look, I know I have been on this honesty kick lately. But, it's only because the lies have been so obvious. Opinions are cool. I like a wide range of opinions. If we are open minded, it makes us think. Which in turn, helps us learn.

I'm not against opinions and I welcome disagreements. I am just tired of certain posters [and you are not one of them] who deliberately try and deceive others.

You know............I was just thinking of how so many of our posters don't like learning. For instance, I was pretty amazed when I found out the percentage of how often teams lined up in the nickel. I was a bit surprised that the AFC North passes the ball more than most divisions. I found it interesting. No one else did. Facts ruin arguments, I guess.

I like to learn and if you can provide honest opinions and factual information that disagrees w/my takes..........please do so.

For example............you were dead nuts on about Hue's comment and the future.

I've seen a few people say (mostly as it relates to QBs) "But can he pkay in the AFC NORTH?!"

I assume, they mean weather, because the AFCN hasn't been a ground and pound, 3 yards and a cloud of dust division for like 5-10 years..

Palmer/Johnson started it, Roethlisberger has turned the Steelers into more of a passing team than Tommy (fricken) Maddox did, and Flacco is still arguing that chicks ONLY dig the long ball..

Heck you could even sprinkle in DA in 07..

We have only been trying to get a QB since Bernie. Now we have a chance and some on here are talking Tunsil, Jack, Ramsey. GMAFB. No wonder we are a bunch of losers. Any crappy team ( Browns ) that trades down a pick that high is stupid. We might fill some holes but any player that is halfway decent leaves after his 1st contract because the Browns suck so bad. We are like a college team. Four years and move on.

[img:center]https://jackiesheartwhispers.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/fresh-air.jpg?w=640&h=427[/img]

I've been saying this for years.

ditto. i hate when experts say "he'll fit in the AFC North" as if teams still play like it's the 1960s ... the AFCN is just as much of a passing division as the others

Preach it!! It's actually hilarious.

Now we're hearing Philly wants to come up to 2 for Elliot ahead of Dallas. THAT would be stupid on Philly's part.

This could be Browns smoke as to indicate we're not liking either QB, thus making teams think twice about moving to #1. No need to. Then comes San Diego.

Keep smokin' Browns. Then take Wentz at 2.

There's no better way to electrify fans than to get your Face of the Franchise right from the start.

Haslam knows it. Tried it with Manziel. Huey knows it. Just DO IT!

I think Cook is more likely to be able to start right away than any of them.

He may have a lower ceiling, but those usually come with higher floors..

I think people look at Cousins and Hoyer the same way people looked at Derek Carrs brother..

BINGO

Cook is really a Dalton clone. Pretty good arm, good accuracy deep then he has to many what the hell was he thinking throws as his mechanics and accuracy go out the window.

Starting to think the only way we have a shot at Lynch is top 10 pick, dont think he even makes it to the Rams at 15.

If the QB the Browns want is off the board, trade down.

Someone is going to covet the QB the Browns don't covet and there will be a bidding war. It won't be Tennessee, but it will be a bidding war that the Browns stand to come out strong with.

What about this scenario? The Browns trade up to #1 with the Rams taking the Browns #2 pick and a 3rd round pick. We can then pick Wentz and the Rams can get Goff who I think, but am not positive is who they want. This ensures we get who we want and gives the Rams a pick back to replace one that they lost. I know, I'm reading this and I have so many ways to debunk this trade I don't know why I'm going to post it anyway.

I agree, trading down for more picks would be a disaster. What good are more picks if you don't make the right choices with those extra picks? I say stay at 2 and take care of their biggest need. Take Jared Goff.

I hope the Rams stay at 1 and take Wentz. According to NFL scouts, Goff is the best QB in this draft.

I think taking Goff would be an unmitigated disaster. Just my opinion, not really knocking yours. If someone else is willing to pay the premium to move up for him, I grab the picks fast.

I really want Doctson. He reminds me of Cris Carter on the field.

Unfortunately, I think that's a tallest midget situation. I'm hoping all the our FO loving them talk is us trying to drive up the price of the pick.

I don't think QB is our biggest need. Our receivers were bad last year, and then we lost Benjamin. Barnidge and Duke are our leading returning pass catchers by every metric.

I haven't said this in a few weeks, but I seriously want Treadwell, I just haven't seen any indication the Browns are trying to get him. I would love it if they traded down and drafted him.

Totally agree. Trading down has got us nowhere but being even better losers. And please no DB or OL at 2...please!

gut feeling:

1. Rams take Goff
2. Browns trade with SF/Phi for extra picks
3. Browns trade back again and/or select an OT/Elliott

I didn't know where else to stick this, but there are some pretty good nuggets in Peter King's MMQB column:







http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2016/04/17/jj-watt-houston-texans-injury-nfl-future-retirement-peter-king

From reading this it looks like if the Rams take Wentz, we stay at two and pick Goff. If the Rams take Goff we trade down with one of several teams who want Wentz.

That NYJ package looks very enticing (pick #20, Wilkerson, and more).

What good is staying at #2 if we don't make the right choices with draft picks? Or are we magically better when picking in our original spot?

The "and more" would have to be significant, involving minimally another 1st next year, and a 2nd this year IMO. This would be as big a jump up as the Titans-Rams trade...

What I think is the Rams like one of the two QB's. They had to move to #1 to get one of them because I doubt we would move down to their position.

At this point, I don't think the Rams know who they are going to pick.

The thing is, QB IS your biggest need if you don't have a serious long-term solution at that position.


There's certainly different ways of getting the QB, but without a high level of QB play, you're relying on the rest of your team being very very good.



Now, if you don't think Goff or Wentz is the answer, that's one thing. But if you do, you almost have to pick them. I understand that the Broncos won the Superbowl with an incredible defense (and without much help from Peyton), but that's not an easy team to build with all those guys playing at such high levels right at the right time

I believe that is a fair statement. As there is no guarantee of success with RGIII, I think we almost have to take a QB at #2. That would certainly be the conservative option.

if we can't get Goff and SF/PHI/DAL offers us any combination of GOOD picks, I'd take it and run

j/c

Let the speculation continue.....


JASON LA CANFORA
CBS Sports NFL Insider
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Draft: Even after blockbuster deal, Titans trying to trade into the top 10

The Browns want Jared Goff, and, I have yet to talk to an executive who does not believe that is who the Rams are taking. While the talk prior to the Rams making that huge move was that they preferred Carson Wentz, no one is buying that they jumped up half a draft round to select a quarterback who played low-level college football and may need to sit for a few years while the Rams try to make a dent in the Los Angeles market.

Maybe there is actually some ruse going on, but just as other teams were never buying that the Rams were going to go with Case Keenum as their quarterback, they aren't buying for one minute that Jeff Fisher doesn't already know who he is picking; and they believe strongly it is the California kid who played in the Pac-12 who is more pro ready from Day One than Wentz.

Browns coaches, for their part, believe the gulf between Goff and Wentz is fairly wide, and thus taking Wentz at No. 2 is a tough sell. And while Joey Bosa and DeForrest Buckner would be under consideration for the selection, the opportunity to drop down, land more picks, and not have to pass on a passer appeals to the Browns as well. And for an alleged forward-thinking, analytics-driven front office that prizes the cheap commodity that draft picks are, trading down would make plenty of sense and would take them off the hook of picking at 2 and would give them something they could sell to the fans if their quarterback is indeed going to be gone.


(As several execs pointed out to me, the true forward-thinking moves the Browns should have already made is dealing left tackle Joe Thomas by now, which would have given them more ammo to move up to the first pick to get the QB they wanted, or being positioned to take Tunsil at 2).

Now, the Rams will do their best to complicate things by propagating this charade that they have no idea who they are going to pick, and, oh the drama and intrigue! Which is exactly what the NFL office would want them to do as it attempts to land a bigger TV audience at the spot. With the Rams wanting to host future drafts, combines and everything else at the new stadium they are building, they need to stay in the good graces of Park Avenue at any price.

So I get it, and other teams see it for what it is, and it may mean the Browns make some contingency deals in place assuming Goff is announced first overall, but if they are diligent in their work finding a trade partner shouldn't be impossible even under these circumstances.

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Ardent we pretty well positioned to take Tunsil at 2 WITHOUT dealing Joe Thomas?

Yeah, I think it should read "As many execs that want Joe Thomas pointed out to me...."

To me, there is no doubt that they favor one over the other, and by a good margin. And now he is theirs, whoever it is.

If they would be just as happy with Wentz or Goff, then they could have moved into our slot for less, and know they would get one of them.

How do you know they didn't try?

Regardless of what Sashi & Co. have said, who's with me in thinking there's a GOOD chance we trade Joe Thomas at some point in the first round?