DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2017 NFL Season 2017 NFL Draft Who should we draft in 2017?

You just had to do that, didn't you....

Sorry but I heard the same rational around here for wanting Ryan mallet and Matt Cassel.

I'm good on patriot QB's.

I rather we draft the guy than hope we can magically get one from another team.

As a matter of fact, since this thread is about the draft, I rather draft chad Kelly in the second before I touch jimmy G.

Okay..........so don't educate yourself.

Just make evaluations based off of people who come from the same background.

Brilliant!

I would agree that Allen is by far the best 3-4 DT.
I would agree that the are significantly more decent to good outside rushers.

What I would arguments would be:

1, Allen is a very good DT but not a Suh. Maybe not even a Marcel Darius. But Garrett is potentially a generational talent. Potentially better than Von Miller, potentially Lawrence Taylor good.

2, Even though there are several good outside rushers, there is no guarantee that we will be able to get one with a later pick.

3, Besides DT and Edge rusher, we need a FS, Cb, a Qb, RT, C
Upgrades at Rb,ILB and Cb 2 would be welcome as well.

Not counting the upgrades, that leaves 7 positions of need and only 4 picks in the 1st 2 rounds. 5 if you want to count the 3rd pick. So we cannot fill all those positions in this draft. Perhaps we sign a veteran center in free agency. Still leaves more needs than picks.

Well, 3 or 4 years ago Jimmy G was suppose to be that guy we drafted to turn it around.

I haven't watched Miles in detail. But right now I would go with Allen and try to pick up another edge rusher like Tim Williams later.

For me Allen is good match of BPA to an area of need.

Plug him into the DL and it proviides the missing interior push/rush to help the edge rushers get home.

Some people wanted him around here.

I didn't, and still don't.

If we want to get the guy, we need to draft him. Their coordinators trying to be head coaches end up sucking, and so do their QB's, trying to be starters on other teams.

I'm good. Draft one.

Okay. That's fine.

I would go w/Garrett because I want impact players that can change the way teams game plan against us.

I doubt we trade for Jimmy G. Not because he is a Patriots QB but because of his size. I don't think he will match up physically with the analytics.

I don't think Romo will either but because of age and injury history.

I think we are more likely to go McCarren if Hue really likes him or a guy like Hundley.

Don't we all? Just plug in Allen name for Garrett and the same applies for me.

i want an impact interior dl that will change the way offense game plan

Nah, it really doesn't work that way.

Edge rushers have way more impact plays than interior defensive linemen.

Lol, thanks. I guess that settles it then.

I love your sarcasm, but I wonder what NFL execs would say? I wonder who gets drafted higher..........edge rushers or interior lineman?

You bruise too easily, ed. Hell, you got upset because I asked you questions on the Wentz thread. I didn't even dispute you. Just asked you freaking questions.

Man up, bro!

I don't know, I mean, Allen is a great player. But the kid from MSU is also going to be very good. And while this edge rusher draft class is deep, Myles is a one in a decade like prospect to get a shot at. He's got moves on top of moves on top of moves with all the athletic ability to match. I firmly believe that he will be as big a force as Von Miller, maybe even bigger.

Lol, exactly right!

I think he's just poking fun at your thought that you can just draft archetypes. That it's not a case by case basis.

I mean, if the 2011 draft happens again, who is getting picked first? JJ Watt or Von Miller?

Ahhhh..........never mind.

That's exactly what Jonathan Allen does...

Wanna make another wager, CHS?

That Allen is a better player than Garrett? If so, no. I've already stated my opinion that they will both be game changers. I mean, I've called them future all pros, and considering the season's still going, that's some very high praise. Like probably the highest I could go.

I don't want to call you out or anything, but have you watched Allen play? He plays a 3-4 DE and he's a beauty to watch. I can see the Suh comparisons with him more than JJ. But Suh just had some video game type strength in college. I don't think Allen has that per se but I think he's much quicker than Suh was. Again, both game changing players. The only thing that makes Allen a higher ranking for me is supply. If the 3-4 DE and 3-4 LB class talent was switched, I'd want Garrett.

I try to avoid the prediction aspect of draft eval. I don't know what either player is gonna become. I know they're both good prospects.

There are several ways to build a good defense. But no matter how a defense is built its gonna need good players at every level.

Right now, looking at the Browns defense I think there is less talent along the entire DL then there is with the edge rusher group.

I also think there is more depth this draft with edge rushers then with interior DL that can penetrate and disrupt like Allen.

The Browns current situation on defense reminds me of the 2012-2013 Redskins. We had 1 good pass rusher in Orkapo and passed on a interior DL (JJ Watt) to take another edge rusher in Kerrigan. 2013 Rak and Ryan combined for ~20 sacks but the defense was terrible because we had no interior push/pass rush.

So for me, with both prospect being close Miles/Allen I would go with Allen because he's rated highly and fits an area that I think the team sorely lacks. And I think there is a better chance of landing an edge rushing prospect that grades out closer to Miles then there is to land an interior DL prospect close to Allen.

And that's absolutely fair. And if the Browns took Allen over Garrett, I wouldn't even be upset. Allen is going to be a great player, a rare athlete for his position.

I disagree with there being more talent at EDGE than at DL, though. I think it's one of our weakest spots, to be honest with you, Ed. I feel like we need that alpha male to lead the pack.

I generally also like to shy away from comparisons. I was strictly talking impact. Garrett is going to lead a defense to greatness one day, of that I have no doubt. Allen will be a very good player, not sure if he's the type of player who will destroy a game plan, though.

But what do I know?

No, I say that Garrett will be picked before Allen.

You wanna act like I don't know what I am talking about, just like you did when you said there was no way that the Browns would finish below Philly.

So, put your money where your mouth is.

I'll extend that wager to you too, ed.

And did you forget about Dez Bryant?

Jesus Christ, man. Get a grip. I told you I wasn't trying to be rude. No need to fly off the handle. You simply said that JJ Watt wasn't an interior D-linemen but played as a 3-4 DE and I informed you that was the exact position that Allen plays. There's no need to have such a reaction for such a light comment. I mean, do you want to talk football here or try to make pointless bets?

I would bet you, but I currently have an ongoing bet with my TV that if the Browns pick a QB 1st, instead of these two great prospects, I will throw a brick through it. I really cannot engage in any more bets as I fear I have a gambling addiction.

I am not flying off the handle at all. Not sure what you are talking about.

I say that an edge rusher like Garrett is more important than an interior guy like Allen. If they have similar grades, I think Garrett will be picked first.

I also believe that Garrett will be picked before Allen. I'm not upset. But if you wanna run your mouth, I'll gladly school you once again.

Lol, I know right what do any of us know really?

I like them both, both are great prospects....and for me I only go as far as talking about them as prospects. i don't have any clue what they'll become and try to avoid that prediction aspect...but that's whole 'nother tangent.


Here's my view of the front:

Edge: Ogbah, Nassib, Collins, Holmes, Cam Johnson, Lemonier (sp)?

5-tech DE and 43 3-tech DT:......a bunch of guys that don't provide interior push or penetration and Ogbah playing out of position

We still have Dez Bryant and interior push is not nearly as important as collapsing a pocket.

I better edit this, before another know-it-all [hi CHS] misinterprets. I am talking about interior push from your d-line. Interior pressure from blitz packages is huge, but it often is more successful because of outside pressure.

I really wish those who like to act like know it alls on here would watch more games and take notes rather than just talking and/or reporting stats.

I don't care who is picked first. I care about how the Browns attack their weaknesses through the draft. Talk football or kick rocks.

Back to football PFF put out their 2016 All Americans. Probably some names to keep in mind during the offseason, since we're pretty big into metrics and stats in the college game.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/college...ampaign=college

I am talking football. I am saying that Garrett will be picked before Allen. I am saying that edge rushers are more important than interior linemen.

What the hell do you call that? Talking politics?

I think Nassib looks promising. Hard to say with his broken hand during most of the season. But he gave Erek Flowers, who isn't good, fits against the Giants. Not that it mattered. Either way, I'm not sure if he can hold contain in the future though. Allen would be a great partner on the end.

Ok man, that's cool. But no one is saying that's not the case. Literally no one is disagreeing with you.

Put down the pipe!

Your Picks:
Round 1 Pick 1: Jonathan Allen, DE/DT, Alabama (A+)
Round 1 Pick 11: Charles Harris, DE, Missouri (B-)
Round 2 Pick 1: Desmond King, CB, Iowa (A)
Round 2 Pick 14: DeShone Kizer, QB, Notre Dame (A)
Round 3 Pick 1: Corey Davis, WR, Western Michigan (A+)
Round 4 Pick 1: Eddie Jackson, SS, Alabama (A-)
Round 5 Pick 30: Will Holden, OT, Vanderbilt (F)
Round 6 Pick 1: Dominick Sanders, FS, Georgia (C-)

Our fan base isn't patient enough to value Allen. We want sacks. I dont think Allen will get that, although he will get close a lot!

Stick to BPA.

Garrett.

Your Picks:
Round 1 Pick 1: Jonathan Allen, DE/DT, Alabama (A+)
Round 1 Pick 11: Jamal Adams, SS, LSU (A)
Round 2 Pick 1: Pat Elflein, C/OG, Ohio State (B+)
Round 2 Pick 14: Taco Charlton, DE, Michigan (A)
Round 3 Pick 1: O.J. Howard, TE, Alabama (A+)
Round 4 Pick 1: Brandon Facyson, CB, Virginia Tech (B)
Round 5 Pick 30: Ryan Switzer, WR, North Carolina (A+)
Round 6 Pick 1: Dominick Sanders, FS, Georgia (C-)

Some other guys:

Solomon Thomas
Taco Charlton
Chris Wormley
Tanoh Kpassagnon (small school kid from Nova I like)

Round 1 Pick 1: Jonathan Allen, DE/DT, Alabama (A+)
Round 1 Pick 11: Derek Barnett, DE, Tennessee (A+)
Round 2 Pick 1: Adoree' Jackson, CB, Southern California (B+)
Round 2 Pick 14: Marcus Maye, FS, Florida (B-)
Round 3 Pick 1: Gareon Conley, CB, Ohio State (B+)
Round 4 Pick 1: Davis Webb, QB, California (A+)
Round 5 Pick 30: Malachi Dupre, WR, LSU (A+)
Round 6 Pick 1: Julie'n Davenport, OT, Bucknell (B-)

I think the links should be included. Just to ensure posters aren't copying and pasting picks from various drafts. Not that I don't trust some of you. LOL