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jc

This was the lead to a cbssports.com mock draft

The New England Patriots are having quite the offseason. They’ve acquired a premium free agent cornerback in Stephon Gilmore, they’ve traded for a premium wide receiver in Brandin Cooks, and they’ve traded for an upside-filled pass rusher in Kony Ealy. Not to mention they also just brought back long-time linebacker Dont’a Hightower, the unsung hero of New England’s most recent two Super Bowl victories.

Bill Belichick is, once again, in a very good spot for the immediate future. But because of these moves, the Patriots also find themselves without a draft pick in the first two rounds of the 2017 NFL Draft. That’s not a huge deal; New England’s been there before and has a knack for uncovering talent in unexpected places. But this year’s first round features tons of defensive talent, a pool one would expect the Patriots to dabble in.

But the lack of draft picks, coupled with a ton of defensive talent, is exactly why it makes too much sense for the Patriots not to trade Jimmy Garoppolo.
The Patriots have repeatedly leaked the fact they do not plan to trade Garoppolo this offseason. But the reality is if the Browns go the Patriots and drop an offer they can’t refuse, New England isn’t walking away. For instance, there are a pair of first-round picks this year that say the Patriots won’t hold onto Garoppolo.

We’re not going that far down the rabbit hole, though. No. 1 and No. 12 overall for a guy with 94 career passes? No freaking chance. But there’s a deal to be made. Let’s try and make it and then see how the draft plays out after that.

Browns send:
2017 1st round pick (No. 12 overall)
2017 2nd round pick (No. 33 overall)
2017 2nd round pick (No. 52 overall)
2018 2nd round pick (TBD, Cleveland’s original)

Patriots send:
QB Jimmy Garoppolo

For a minute I thought about including another first-round pick or having the Patriots send a third-round pick back. But New England isn’t giving up any picks in this deal. And I don’t think the Browns want to risk sacrificing the No. 1 overall selection in 2018, a very reasonable situation if they are once again terrible in 2017. That deal is basically three-first round picks, with Cleveland’s No. 12 being the prize jewel and two of the other second-round picks coming (likely) in the early 30’s.

And it’s a reasonable deal. The value of those picks adds up to 52.2 AV value in Chase Stuart’s draft value chart and 2,710 points in the Jimmy Johnson traditional trade value chart. That’s the equivalent of the 1st and 14th overall picks (Stuart chart) and the slightly more than the 2nd overall pick (Johnson chart).


http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/2017-n...-for-garoppolo/



I think that is a lot to give.
I find it hard to believe that the Patriots would turn that offer down if indeed we do offer that
I don't think we will though

If we send a 1st and 3 2nds, they had better be right, and he better be a surefire franchise guy, because if they're wrong, they're gone. That's a lot to give up for a QB, unless he is a top 10, franchise quality guy.

I am more concerned about Garoppolo as I looked at both him and Kessler. Each guy started out well. Kesler actually looked pretty good in 2 of his 1st 3 games. Then he got banged around, hurt, had tape, and his play suffered.

We never got to see how Garappolo would look in extended play. We never got to see how defenses would attack him when they had some tape. He then got hurt in very limited exposure. These are all concerns, at least to me.

You remind me of mac. Once you make your mind up to something, you are completely blind and unreasonable.

And it’s a reasonable deal.



They should put this guy away in a loony bin...yeah we were put here to give the PATS what they want and need yeah okay. In case you missed it this is what he is suggesting we should give the Pats
Cause THEY NEED PICKS DESPERATELY...yeah ok

2017 1st round pick (No. 12 overall)
2017 2nd round pick (No. 33 overall)
2017 2nd round pick (No. 52 overall)
2018 2nd round pick (TBD, Cleveland’s original)

A first and three 2nd rounders. Hahahahahaha. When hell freezes over.

I saw this also .... Proof that the Pats are trading. . . . Maybe.

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2017/03/16/bi...draft-prospect/

Belief persists that Patriots plan to keep Garoppolo beyond 2017


Posted by Mike Florio on March 16, 2017, 6:03 PM EDT


The Browns reportedly will make a run at Patriots quarterback Jimmy Garoppolo. (The fallback may be Kirk Cousins.) The Patriots, based on who you believe, will listen — or they won’t. Their standoffishness comes either from an effort to maximize the trade offer or from a genuine desire to keep Garoppolo around.


As one high level employee of an AFC team recently told PFT, there’s a persistent belief within league circles that the Patriots truly want to keep Garoppolo.


First, Father Time eventually is going to whack Tom Brady over the head with whatever Father Time’s weapon of choice is (scythe, staff, hourglass, big-ass Flava Flav necklace clock). Notwithstanding the avacado ice cream, it can come very, very quickly for Brady. (Just ask Peyton Manning.) If it comes this year, the Patriots will have Garoppolo under contract for the balance of 2017 and, via the availability of the franchise tag, beyond.


Second, and as Scott Zolak from the Patriots Radio Network suggested on PFT Live in the aftermath of Super Bowl LI, the thinking is that Brady’s magic number is three more years with a caveat — if he wins one more Super Bowl, he may very well walk away. If that happens this year, the Patriots need to have Garoppolo around.


Third, Jacoby Brissett may not be the answer. There’s a feeling that the Patriots drafted Brissett at the very strong urging of his mentor, Bill Parcells, and that coach Bill Belichick has decided after a year of working with Brissett that he won’t become a true franchise quaterback.


So this isn’t about trying to get Garoppolo to make an open-ended commitment to continue to be the No. 2 while no one knows when No. 1 will choose to leave due to age or injury. It’s about the Patriots keeping Garoppolo around as insurance against Brady leaving because he’s walking off with Lombardi No. 6 or because, despite his best efforts and electrolytes, he can no longer get it done.


The Patriots won’t trade Brady instead of Garoppolo. Belichick’s habit of dumping a guy one year too early instead of one year too late has exceptions, rare as they may be. Brady, regarded as the fifth son of owner Robert Kraft, will be one of those exceptions. So Brady stays as long as he wants, especially since Belichick realizes Brady wouldn’t allow himself to keep playing once it becomes clear that he no longer can do it.


The key will be Brady’s legs. Though he’s not regarded as a fast guy (he had a nifty scramble in Super Bowl LI), the moment he can no longer slide and step and dart with authority in the pocket, that’s that.


The Patriots, if they truly believe Garoppolo is capable of carrying the mantle, have every reason to keep him around until they know how it plays out for Brady. Some think that will include using the franchise tag in 2018 — not as a precursor to a trade but as a device for ensuring that, if Brady makes it through 2017 and returns for 2018, the Patriots can preserve the ability to have Garropolo available.


Of course, there’s also a possibility that Garoppolo will chooses to sign a Band-Aid contract that pays him a fair rate to continue to wait, and that gives him a lot more if he plays. Given that Garoppolo is represented by the same firm that has signed off on Brady’s string of below-market deals, it’s impossible to rule out Garoppolo taking less to remain with an organization that constantly contends.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...o-beyond-2017/

A number 12 and 3 2nds.. Ok .. I'll play the other angle. We all view picks as if we hit big time on all of these 4 picks.
( We have yet to even be decent with our picks) If we look at our history.. would u give up our last 1st round selection and our last 3 2nd rd guys for Jimmy ? Lets believe that Jimmy WILL be our franchise guy long term and he's the answer ( no reason to even consider if we don't) Would you trade those last 4 players we took with those precious picks for a starting QB ? Umm ?

Man, there are so many different perspectives on this story. One of the biggest and most intriguing in years.

I see what you're getting at. If we suck at drafting as much as we do, why do we cling to our drafts picks over trading them for a sure thing, right?

Especially our second-rounders... how many of those have we hit on in the past?

I get that argument, but it still doesn't sit right with me. Just like the Julio Jones trade, you don't judge that trade back based on the players you end up selecting with the acquired picks. You judge the trade based on the trade itself.

I see what you are saying and I agree.

However, can you really place a value on a true franchise qb? I don't think you can and the talk of it being too expensive is kind of lame.

Thus, the real discussion is whether or not one believes if Jimmy G is that guy or not. I can accept arguments on both sides. Obviously, I think he is that guy, but that doesn't mean I am correct.

I do wish that people would argue w/logic rather than blurting out stupid crap like he is gonna suck because Cassell and Hoyer sucked. Btw-------both are better than any qb on our current roster, but that is a different debate. The other one that galls me is "he sucks because he is a backup."

Again, it all comes down to whether people think he is a franchise qb or not. If you think he is.......you give up what it takes. If you don't think he is....you don't make the trade.

That is the real decision that the Browns face.

Jimmy Garoppolo - QB - Patriots

Profootballtalk reports there's a "persistent belief within league circles" that the Patriots "truly" want to keep Jimmy Garoppolo.

The idea being, despite Tom Brady's continued elite play, he turns 40 in August, and could have his Peyton Manning decline at any given moment. It's a valid concern for the Patriots, but by keeping Garoppolo for 2017, they would be forced to give him the franchise tag if they wanted him for 2018. That would be untenable if Brady remains under contract, as he's insisted he will.

Source: Profootballtalk on NBCSports.com Mar 16 - 6:08 PM

Isn't that from the same report that was just posted by Grateful Dawg?

The Jimmy G saga has perked up this board the way this past presidential race perked up Facebook

I like Jimmy G., and would love to have him on the team. I would wait until the last minute and offer them a pair of twos. Keeping 1 and 12 AND getting a quarterback would be the perfect scenario.

j/c:

I'd give them..
2017- 1st Rd. #12
2017- 4th Rd. #108
2018- 2nd Rd.(tbd-cle pk.) And i wouldn't give a penny more.Unless they wanted cam erving to assure them they have received two first rounders for a unproven qb. It would be the biggest gamble and imho a mistake two give up much more then that.

I wouldn't even give them that. A 2nd rd. this year and a 2nd rd. next year. that's it. We still have a lot of holes to fill. I think those 2 2nd's are fair compensation for a back-up qb that does not have much playing time.

That's what im hearing from alot of browns fans too. The 2nd this year and a 2nd next year tops. It is definitely the popular choice amongst the browns fans. But im fairly positive that two number 2nds in different years wouldn't get the deal done at all. It ultimately will come down to "how much are we willing to gamble if we really want Him". We have the picks to get him? But whats the fair value?? No one knows IMO. Two number twos sound fair to me.

That is probably too much too.

Im just waiting for the day that jimmy H or sashi B goes up to the podium and says on live air.. "We finally got our guy. (Like Obama's speech when they found bin laden) So sick of waiting, some days i feel like trading whatever it takes if you know for sure hes the one.

If a QB is being traded, then no one knows for sure. QBs that are franchise guys don't get traded.

I would agree with that statement about 95% of the time, but i know theirs that 5% where a franchise guy has been traded in the past? Alex smith? Probably others? But I definitely understand your point and agree with that logic most of the time.
Smith was a different kind of trade as he was already mostly proven, so maybe theres only that 1%, lol.

With this analytic approach the Browns are bringing to the front office these days, Would it really hurt to hire a well known pyschic(Sofia brown?) To predict the future's of any potential trade targets and or potential draft picks. That pyschic I'm thinking of on the montell Williams show was always spot on. I don't think this would be a bad idea to look into, Im saying this with a straight face. Wouldn't hurt anymore then our scouts past predictions on drafts, etc.

Short of trading the #1 over all They can trade every other single pick to get Jimmy G. We get Jimmy as our QB and we have our franchise QB. Period.

if it takes 2 firsts then make it #12 and next years first. It's time to get our QB and there is no guarantee next year that we can move up to get who we want.Hell even if it takes 2 2nd rounders and 2 firsts then just do it and get our QB of the future.

If we land Jimmy G. and Garrett then next years first will be a lot further down in the draft than #12 from this year so it won't hurt that much anyways.

Not sure if you're right but I get what you're saying. I'd trade 12 for sure right now, if they wanted a couple 2'nd rounders also then yeah ok no prob. Hate to give em up but time to roll the dice

Forget to add that I agree trading next year's first along with 12, is worthy of consideration at least.

Not even close to 5%. We can argue over whether Alex Smith is a "franchise QB," but he was traded for two second round picks and his track record was much better than Garoppolo.

The main trade I think of in recent history when it comes to big time QBs being traded is Jay Cutler going from the Broncos to the Bears. The Broncos got Kyle Orton, two first round picks, and a third round pick for Cutler and a fifth round pick. Cutler was going into his age 26 season and had just made the Pro Bowl (4526 yards, 25 TDs, 18 INTs, with a 62% completion rate, these numbers were very good for a QB in 2008).

Garoppolo has proven nothing and has one year left on his contract. New England would be lucky to get a second round pick for him. If his value to the Patriots exceeds that pick, they should not trade him. And it seems like having a reliable backup for an old [GOAT] QB is very valuable.

There were very similar rumors about Ryan Mallett being traded when he was with the Patriots. Teams had "offered" second round picks (http://www.patspulpit.com/2014/3/8/54850...or-ryan-mallett). They held on to Mallett and ended up trading him for a conditional seventh round pick instead of cutting him (after they drafted Garoppolo).

I think Garoppolo is better than Mallett. I don't know. No one knows. I wouldn't give up anything of value for a guy we know almost nothing about.

All of this is so over the top that it seems like you are joking. I know you are in love with Garoppolo, but how many actual starters in the NFL would you even give up two firsts and two seconds for?

This is getting out of control.

I swear belicheck and co prolly get there updated value of JG on this board, lmao. Im all for making something happen but we do have to be realistic, I totally agree. So belicheck if your reading all this, We wouldn't give you more then a 3rd round and a conditional pick later. We were just fooling around about all these 1st and 2nds, right dawgs?

I know you are joking, but I don't think we've offered them anything, let alone a first round pick.

Thank God we have the great cfrs here to tell us that the rest of the NFL world is nuts and are overvaluing the worth of Jimmy G and to clue us in that he isn't worth very much.

Personally, I like Jimmy G's skill set. I think he is a way better prospect than any qb in the draft. I think he can be a franchise qb.

In addition to thinking that he is a really good option for the Browns, I would love for the Browns to get Jimmy G just to shut up the arrogant opinions of some who pretend to know what Jimmy G's value is and the absurd opinions of some who think you can't be good if you are a backup qb.

Some of these haters are beyond ridiculous.

I truly believe that his value has been hyped up alittle to high IMHO. But Belicheck is a master at that. I do believe he has more potential then any qb in this draft as well and can possibly be a franchise qb in the right system?? Im all for this year's #12 and our next year second rd. Also a later 4th or 5th round this year too. But im not a scout or a Gm so i have no idea what anyone would offer. I do no that mary Kay garbage hinted that our two first rounders this year might be the asking price for him. Which I would rather take my chances on a drafted qb or kessler if thats the real asking price and secure Garrett and move on.

Ain't this fun!

Me thinks Schefter is FOS.

Schefter reaks so bad that i can smell him from northeast ohio. Hes pushing up garrapolo's value as well with his b.s.

j/c

I would rather use the #12 on Jimmy than #33 on a QB in this draft.

What's wrong w/me is reading the ridiculous crap you post.

You bring up Bill B, Brady, and Bernie in a Jimmy G thread, but you are not comparing them.

Right...

Your kidding right? For a franchise QB you would easily pay 2 firsts or more. Well at least many NFL teams would. There are not a lot of franchise QBs in the league right now and many of those are getting pretty old and ready to retire soon.

Matt Ryan
Aaron Rodgers
Kirk Cousins
Andrew Luck
Derek Carr
Russell Wilson

This is the very short list of people UNDER the age of 33 that are worth 2 first rounders. There are some great QB who are just old right now like Tom and Drew but they are not worth the trade because they won't be doing it too much longer.

There is just a HUGE shortage on quality QBs right now. Over half of the NFL does not have a franchise caliber QB which is why it's the same teams going over and over again to the deep playoffs and Superbowl.

Jimmy G. has the skill set of a franchise level QB. You're not going to nickel and dime the Patriots for him. They don't have a problem with franchising him to keep him around while they see if Tom last long term or not. He is going to be a top tier NFL QB. I KNOW that because of his skill set. I don't care about what college he played for or how much NFL exp he has. He has the skill set. Period.

Short of giving up Garrett he is worth whatever it takes to pry him away from the Patriots. The sooner the better so we can get him in and learning Hue's offense.