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2 things Rish:
1, if he was cut primarily because he won't be on the roster next year, it says the FO knows what I think we all know. We aren't going to make the playoffs this year. So they continue with their plan.
Break the team down to it's core (last year) build the foundation (this year), finish the construction (next year - .500 being competitive for the playoffs) then paint and furnish the following year (playoffs).
2, perhaps Greco isn't as recovered from the injury as we all think. Honestly, I was surprised he made it back to participate in the pre-season. I thought he would be a PUP guy. Perhaps the injury still nags at him and he is unable to do what he needs to do. We all say he is one of our top 6 o-linemen. but we are looking at past years. How much has anyone really paid attention to his play this preseason? I haven't. I haven't had opportunity to watch much of the pre-season this year but I did read that he played pretty poorly against Chicago. If that is true, then perhaps he hasn't played well all spring training and in camp. That would be another reason for his cut.
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Cutting one of your best offensive linemen is stupid. There was no respect intended. We have a business lawyer making football decisions. I Greco is 32, coming off major foot surgery, and not going to start. That's why he was cut. I personally would have kept him, but I see why they did it. Just started scrolling on this thread. Heavy he was cut.
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Right now, the starters are Thomas, Zeiter,Tretter,Bitonio, and Coleman.
I believe the remaining OL players are Drango,Fabiano.Reiter,Sturup, Johnson, and Martin....maybe Martin is already gone.
Any thoughts who stays?
Also, another thought on Greco. He was a pretty decent player, but mostly avarage in NFL terms. How many other avrage, vet, versitile linemen are going to get cut today? Could be we just want to swith one for the other to save some money? Could be we want to sign a new guy to a 3 year deal rather than wait to cut Greco next year (or let him walk) or sign him to a even bigger deal.
I believe we will bring in another vet lineman once the waiver process kicks in.
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The way I see the Greco cut is...
Would you travel across the country (let's say 16 states) without a proven dedicated spare tire? I sure as hell wouldn't...So the Browns are risking that all of their tires will hold up and protect their new shiny Camaro SS (Kizer)
One blowout to any tire (we lose say Bitinio or any lineman for that matter to IR) we are screwed...our shiny new car (Kizer) then hits and rolls (T-Suggs or someone delivers a blow) Well with our Camaro SS sidelined for a multitude of weeks...
The Browns roll out their 2004 Hyundai Elantra (Cody Kessler) Have fun haha But once your spare tire gets punctured (Lis franc injury), How long do you wait to replace it? Sure you try to patch it, but if it's still showing a slow leak (taking longer to recover after games/practice), do you get an affordable new replacement or risk the spare being flat when you need it? The tread is well worn and the warranty is long expired. Plus, you've upgraded your normal tires with the intent of doing more off-roading (Ground and Pound/Using Crow/Power). I'm kind of ambivalent to the move. We might have gotten one more year out of Greco. He was a good guy and has been reliable and versatile. But, he wasn't slated to start, and we seem to have younger, at least passable alternatives as backups. We're due some luck with injuries, aren't we? I am quite perplexed by the Greco cut as well...and see both of the spare tire analogies. What leaves me scratching my head though is why was Greco the 1st Backup after Bitonio got dinged? Drango was our primary LG last year and I don't remember ever seeing him with the 1's this year. I don't remember ANY other backup G's playing with the 1's either...only Greco. I know Bitonio will be back opening day and all...but one would think that the 1st sub in would be a guy who would make the team. Odd. WSU... It was odd seeing Greco out there often and alot mostly at LG...I dont recall seeing him at RG, but cant be positive... I'm sure the FO wanted to see him and see his injury form...I do remember either preseason game 2 or 3 a play asked him to stretch, and he failed to get there...missed the block as the defender came in hard...I do believe our RB was tackled for a loss...But odd to see him so much and playing deep or deeper into meaningless games at LG I think we can all agree Greco would be better in upcoming weeks as he can regain his health and more movement...I just think if one of our guys got hurt...Let's just say week 6...I feel Greco would come and we wouldn't miss a beat...Now with the other guys...I could see this porous offense, taking a step or two back and us fearing every snap. The guy was a bargain signing and did all you can ask for, with a ton of starting experience...and at bare minimum was solid-good...our backups are clearly poor-solid at best, with minimal or no starting experience.
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j/c
The squeeze is on. Grecco, BO, & Haden (regardless of what you think of the moves) are casualties of the tough decision making process to get the roster to 53. Right now we're at 61. We have to lose 8. I can come up with five I'm okay with and three I'm not sure about. Then there is the real possibility we'll tweak after that. We're going to lose players that many will believe we should've kept. Without knowing everything involved in the process, and without the ability to see into the future, we'll have to wait and see how well these decisions turn out. I'm curious who we lose next:
QBs are set unless they dump Kessler and bring on someone else.
DeShone Kizer
Cody Kessler
Kevin Hogan
Will they keep 4 RBs? If not, Magee is gone. He's could also be gone if they keep 4 and sign someone else
Isaiah Crowell
Duke Johnson
Matthew Dayes
Terrence Magee
Danny Vitale (IR? Keep? Cut?)
I consider Britt & Higgins on the bubble. Payton may be too. They're probably more likely to keep Britt. The FO will take a serious look at available WRs.
Kenny Britt
Corey Coleman
Ricardo Louis
Rannell Hall
Jordan Leslie
Jordan Payton
Rashard Higgins
Will they keep 4 TE's? If so, they may also look at cut players.
David Njoku
Seth DeValve
Randall Telfer
J.P. Holtz
Eleven linemen. Someone will probably go, and someone could get replaced.
Joe Thomas
Joel Bitonio
J.C. Tretter
Kevin Zeitler
Shon Coleman
Spencer Drango
Rod Johnson IR?
Marcus Martin
Anthony Fabiano
Austin Reiter
Zach Sterup
10 DL. Someone will probably go.
Myles Garrett
Danny Shelton
Emmanuel Ogbah
Carl Nassib
Trevon Coley
Larry Ogunjobi
Jamie Meder
Nate Orchard
Tyrone Holmes
Caleb Brantley
Glad Alexander is still here. Will he stick?
Joe Schobert
Kenneth Olugbode
Dominique Alexander
Ditto Burgess. King?
Jamie Collins
Christian Kirksey
James Burgess
Deon King
Who do they lose here?
Jabrill Peppers
Derrick Kindred
Calvin Pryor
Ibraheim Campbell
Kai Nacua PS?
Same here. Who goes? And will they be looking on the waiver wire?
Jamar Taylor
Jason McCourty
Briean Boddy-Calhoun
Darius Hillary
Marcus Burley
Najee Murray
ST is set.
Zane Gonzalez
Britton Colquitt
Charley Hughlett
The cut's get tougher, and could get deeper if they see guys the want to go after once the cutdown hits.
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As I said ealier, you are assuming other teams don't let go a few vet linemen who are as good as Greco. We will find out by 4pm. We may not look at a 10 year vet like Greco, but I have a feeling we will kick the tires, to stick with the tire theme, of a few 4-5 year vet linemen over the next few days as we start signing some of these players.
I like Greco, but he is replaceable.
Who knows when waiver claims must be in?
Last edited by Ballpeen; 09/02/17 09:49 AM.
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As I said ealier, you are assuming other teams don't let go a few vet linemen who are as good as Greco. We will find out by 4pm. We may not look at a 10 year vet like Greco, but I have a feeling we will kick the tires, to stick with the tire theme, of a few 4-5 year vet linemen over the next few days as we start signing some of these players.
I like Greco, but he is replaceable.
Who knows when waiver claims must be in?
Yeah we def. need to improve that area...and I pray that we do. Hopefully we will add a viable starter or a good back-up to add to the mix.
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it's tough to cut one of those 10 DL left .. I'd hate letting Holmes go ... or Brantley for that matter
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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I'd also rather cut Britt, but that's just me
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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As I said ealier, you are assuming other teams don't let go a few vet linemen who are as good as Greco. We will find out by 4pm. We may not look at a 10 year vet like Greco, but I have a feeling we will kick the tires, to stick with the tire theme, of a few 4-5 year vet linemen over the next few days as we start signing some of these players.
I like Greco, but he is replaceable.
Who knows when waiver claims must be in?
Yeah we def. need to improve that area...and I pray that we do. Hopefully we will add a viable starter or a good back-up to add to the mix. I don't like losing Greco because I think he's a good interior guy. However, we appear to have several other younger, promising (I hope) interior guys in Drango, Martin, Reiter, & Fabiano. I'm more worried about the backup T's...and that's whether Johnson starts the year or not. Maybe Greco - who is a G who can also play C - ultimately lost his spot to Drango - who is a G who can also play T?
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As I said ealier, you are assuming other teams don't let go a few vet linemen who are as good as Greco. We will find out by 4pm. We may not look at a 10 year vet like Greco, but I have a feeling we will kick the tires, to stick with the tire theme, of a few 4-5 year vet linemen over the next few days as we start signing some of these players.
I like Greco, but he is replaceable.
Who knows when waiver claims must be in?
Yeah we def. need to improve that area...and I pray that we do. Hopefully we will add a viable starter or a good back-up to add to the mix. I don't like losing Greco because I think he's a good interior guy. However, we appear to have several other younger, promising (I hope) interior guys in Drango, Martin, Reiter, & Fabiano. I'm more worried about the backup T's...and that's whether Johnson starts the year or not. Maybe Greco - who is a G who can also play C - ultimately lost his spot to Drango - who is a G who can also play T? I wish I had your faith in our young guys. Drango has looked bad to me. Martin is an unknown to me too. I will say that Reiter, in a short time, looked good though.
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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All Pro
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j/c
The squeeze is on. Grecco, BO, & Haden (regardless of what you think of the moves) are casualties of the tough decision making process to get the roster to 53. Right now we're at 61. We have to lose 8. I can come up with five I'm okay with and three I'm not sure about. Then there is the real possibility we'll tweak after that. We're going to lose players that many will believe we should've kept. Without knowing everything involved in the process, and without the ability to see into the future, we'll have to wait and see how well these decisions turn out. I'm curious who we lose next:
QBs are set unless they dump Kessler and bring on someone else.
DeShone Kizer
Cody Kessler
Kevin Hogan
Will they keep 4 RBs? If not, Magee is gone. He's could also be gone if they keep 4 and sign someone else
Isaiah Crowell
Duke Johnson
Matthew Dayes
Terrence Magee
Danny Vitale (IR? Keep? Cut?)
I consider Britt & Higgins on the bubble. Payton may be too. They're probably more likely to keep Britt. The FO will take a serious look at available WRs.
Kenny Britt
Corey Coleman
Ricardo Louis
Rannell Hall
Jordan Leslie
Jordan Payton
Rashard Higgins
Will they keep 4 TE's? If so, they may also look at cut players.
David Njoku
Seth DeValve
Randall Telfer
J.P. Holtz
Eleven linemen. Someone will probably go, and someone could get replaced.
Joe Thomas
Joel Bitonio
J.C. Tretter
Kevin Zeitler
Shon Coleman
Spencer Drango
Rod Johnson IR?
Marcus Martin
Anthony Fabiano
Austin Reiter
Zach Sterup
10 DL. Someone will probably go.
Myles Garrett
Danny Shelton
Emmanuel Ogbah
Carl Nassib
Trevon Coley
Larry Ogunjobi
Jamie Meder
Nate Orchard
Tyrone Holmes
Caleb Brantley
Glad Alexander is still here. Will he stick?
Joe Schobert
Kenneth Olugbode
Dominique Alexander
Ditto Burgess. King?
Jamie Collins
Christian Kirksey
James Burgess
Deon King
Who do they lose here?
Jabrill Peppers
Derrick Kindred
Calvin Pryor
Ibraheim Campbell
Kai Nacua PS?
Same here. Who goes? And will they be looking on the waiver wire?
Jamar Taylor
Jason McCourty
Briean Boddy-Calhoun
Darius Hillary
Marcus Burley
Najee Murray
ST is set.
Zane Gonzalez
Britton Colquitt
Charley Hughlett
The cut's get tougher, and could get deeper if they see guys the want to go after once the cutdown hits. Good analysis CalDawg
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Browns prepare for jam packed weekend in hopes of shoring up roster
CHICAGO, Illinois -- The Browns will have a busy weekend ahead, busier than normal thanks the NFL's decision to do away with the initial cut down to 75 players. Instead, the initial and only cut down of the roster is due Saturday by 4 p.m. "We haven't had this before," Executive Vice President of Football Operations Sashi Brown said on Thursday night prior to the Browns' preseason finale against the Bears. "I think there's a lot more names to cull through. In addition you're going to have some veterans that aren't subject to waivers that will come out. It will be an interesting 48 hours. It's jam packed." The Browns are expected to be active after the initial roster cut considering they sit atop the league in waiver priority. There are obvious areas of the team that could benefit from a surprise release or two. Brown, unsurprisingly, didn't want to get into specifics on Thursday night as to where the team might look. "It depends on the quality of the players that are available to us," Brown said. Regarding whether he would add a quarterback: "I would never rule out anything. You never know what's going to happen. I've been around long enough to know that." What about cornerback, now that Joe Haden is gone? Feel like you need to add one? "No, not necessarily. We do think we'll explore opportunities to do that, but we don't necessarily feel panicked at that position." Link
"I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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Thanks Dawg 
"I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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I would like to see us place Johnson on the IR. He has athletic potential but right now isn't very good. A year off to heal then develop would do him good. It also opens of a roster spot for a higher quality backup at T. Hopefully a young vet with some potential.
Don't blame the clown for acting like a clown.
Ask yourself why you keep going to the circus.
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Age is a key factor in roster choices.
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As I said ealier, you are assuming other teams don't let go a few vet linemen who are as good as Greco. We will find out by 4pm. We may not look at a 10 year vet like Greco, but I have a feeling we will kick the tires, to stick with the tire theme, of a few 4-5 year vet linemen over the next few days as we start signing some of these players.
I like Greco, but he is replaceable.
Who knows when waiver claims must be in?
Yeah we def. need to improve that area...and I pray that we do. Hopefully we will add a viable starter or a good back-up to add to the mix. I don't like losing Greco because I think he's a good interior guy. However, we appear to have several other younger, promising (I hope) interior guys in Drango, Martin, Reiter, & Fabiano. I'm more worried about the backup T's...and that's whether Johnson starts the year or not. Maybe Greco - who is a G who can also play C - ultimately lost his spot to Drango - who is a G who can also play T? I wish I had your faith in our young guys. Drango has looked bad to me. Martin is an unknown to me too. I will say that Reiter, in a short time, looked good though. I've got more 'hope' than 'faith' at the moment.
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I would like to see us place Johnson on the IR. He has athletic potential but right now isn't very good. A year off to heal then develop would do him good. It also opens of a roster spot for a higher quality backup at T. Hopefully a young vet with some potential. I agree and think that's what will happen. Getting non-vested guys through to IR without another team snatching them up is tricky though.
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2 things Rish:
1, if he was cut primarily because he won't be on the roster next year, it says the FO knows what I think we all know. We aren't going to make the playoffs this year. So they continue with their plan.
Break the team down to it's core (last year) build the foundation (this year), finish the construction (next year - .500 being competitive for the playoffs) then paint and furnish the following year (playoffs).
2, perhaps Greco isn't as recovered from the injury as we all think. Honestly, I was surprised he made it back to participate in the pre-season. I thought he would be a PUP guy. Perhaps the injury still nags at him and he is unable to do what he needs to do. We all say he is one of our top 6 o-linemen. but we are looking at past years. How much has anyone really paid attention to his play this preseason? I haven't. I haven't had opportunity to watch much of the pre-season this year but I did read that he played pretty poorly against Chicago. If that is true, then perhaps he hasn't played well all spring training and in camp. That would be another reason for his cut.
The coaching staff is on the field with the players everyday, seeing them compared to others at that position. Greco, Haden, and Bryant were all, at one point, our best options for their role. That the team has moved on from them suggests to me that things have changed with each of them that we, the fans, haven't had the chance to see clearly. At least not as clearly as those seeing them everyday side by side with their in-team competition.
1. #GMstrong
2. "I'm just trying to be the best Nick I can be." ~ Nick Chubb
3. Forgive me Elf, I didn’t have faith. ~ Tulsa
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Age is a key factor in roster choices.
Age, contract, performance, system compatibility, general compatibility, experience, health and competition are all key factors. Not sure I understand the point you're making, bone.
"I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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Of course you do.
Go bash Trump. You are out of your element here. Stop. Just stop. No bashing, but aren't you Mr. Let's all get along? Unless you are wearing an Indians hat with Chief Wahoo on it. lol Sorry Vers, couldn't resist it.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Jordan Leslie‏Verified account @Jles9 Follow More Never a good feeling getting released, but everything happens for a reason. Just have to continue out working everyone... https://twitter.com/Jles9/status/904043585913442305
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dang. that's one that i thought might stick
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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2 things Rish:
1, if he was cut primarily because he won't be on the roster next year, it says the FO knows what I think we all know. We aren't going to make the playoffs this year. So they continue with their plan. You know, I'm not going to dismiss the part about the possibility that Grecco may not be recovered from his injury. But to me, the part I quoted makes zero sense to me. Unless I'm missing something here, the job of a HC and the FO is to assemble the best roster of the players they have to give your team the best chance to win football games. I don't believe that past injuries always predict future injuries but let's take a look at the facts. Botonio hasn't managed to stay healthy at G. We signed Tretter at C who had had an injury history. With those facts at hand, I don't see how anyone can promote throwing away the best back up interior line talent we have on the team. We may not make the playoffs but that's no excuse cut your best back up interior OL player. As much poor play and injuries as we've had along the OL, at what point to people not understand the importance of it?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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dang. that's one that i thought might stick I'm surprised it wasn't Payton first.
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dang. that's one that i thought might stick I suspect that he'll be a PS addition.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I don't see how he was one of the ones who got released. I mean he actually made some fantastic catches and got open.
You can't fix stupid but you can destroy ignorance. When you destroy ignorance you remove the justifications for evil. If you want to destroy evil then educate our people. Hate is a tool of the stupid to deal with what they can't understand.
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Wasn't Jordan Payton already cut? I swear I thought I saw his name on the list already
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dang. that's one that i thought might stick I suspect that he'll be a PS addition. Agreed...I hope he sticks to our PS
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,711 Likes: 29 |
I don't see how he was one of the ones who got released. I mean he actually made some fantastic catches and got open. Yeah the others were invisible...outside of Corey Coleman, Hall, Leslie...probably because he wasn't a draft pick is why I assume he didn't stick
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Joined: May 2008
Posts: 8,660 Likes: 87
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 8,660 Likes: 87 |
dang. that's one that i thought might stick I suspect that he'll be a PS addition. If he passes waivers...he will be on our PS again.
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Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 Likes: 906
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 Likes: 906 |
Agreed. It's becoming a trend w/this FO.
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 22,528 Likes: 176
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 22,528 Likes: 176 |
not sure I understand what this FO is doing, cutting Greco and the 2nd most productive wr in preseason. Wr i can see since we got coates, but you can't tell me greco is worse than drango, sterup, johnson, reiter
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday. -John Wayne
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Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 3,565 Likes: 123
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 3,565 Likes: 123 |
not sure I understand what this FO is doing, cutting Greco and the 2nd most productive wr in preseason. Wr i can see since we got coates, but you can't tell me greco is worse than drango, sterup, johnson, reiter I have liked quite a few moves the FO has made this year except for cutting Gary Barniedge, Joe Haden, and John Greco. Someone needs to tell the FO that they are 50 million under the cap.
Romans 10:9 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and believe in thy heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 38,564 Likes: 814
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 38,564 Likes: 814 |
Anybody know if we are done cutting. I thought we were.
Seems that Leslie got the axe once we traded for Coates.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356 |
I think that we still have 5 or 6 cuts to go.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 38,564 Likes: 814
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 38,564 Likes: 814 |
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356 |
It seems that any player who is put on IR, who can return at mid-season, has to 1st be on the roster @53.
Rod Johnson is evidently (reportedly) going to be one of these players, so who knows what the OL will look like when it all washes out.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,428 Likes: 15
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,428 Likes: 15 |
I think this FO is going to fall in LOCK step with those that have preceded them . " Basically , their the smartest tack in the pack " !
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,124 Likes: 222
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,124 Likes: 222 |
It seems that any player who is put on IR, who can return at mid-season, has to 1st be on the roster @53.
Rod Johnson is evidently (reportedly) going to be one of these players, so who knows what the OL will look like when it all washes out. A non-vested player has to be waived/injured before he can go to the IR (before the 53 is "set"). As waived, he can be claimed by any other team. Once he "makes" the 53, I believe we can IR him without being required to waive/injured him first.
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